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Thread: Should male and female sports be combined?

  1. #21
    Himster's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: Should male and female sports be combined?

    This solution would only satisfy the two extremes: The misogynists will feel vindicated when biological differences are demonstrated, which naturally favours masculine body-types in fields of physical activity. The extreme zealot leftists will be somewhat/temporarily mollified by expanding
    the breadth
    and enforcing their unending holy-quota-crusade.

    But, given the way things are going, it has all the signs of being inevitable. The combined force of ends-justifying-means, "good"-intentioned zealotry and spite is so overwhelming that nothing can stop it. The self-evident lack of logic, in the move, is ephemeral compared to its inexorable nature.
    The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are so certain of themselves, but wiser people are full of doubts.
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  2. #22
    Aexodus's Avatar Persuasion>Coercion
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    Default Re: Should male and female sports be combined?

    The trans woman who had that court case in Switzerland recently would have caused sports to be either mixed or for there to be a third gender-neutral category, can’t remember which. If she won, which she didn’t.
    Patronised by Pontifex Maximus

    Quote Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun View Post
    Nope. There is nothing to suggest dramatically that his heart is giving out. His heart attack is a testament to how well he can recover from something like that.

  3. #23

    Default Re: Should male and female sports be combined?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ludicus View Post
    In the US ?
    But, it seems that...There's no 'pay gap' in professional football - spiked

    --

    I understand where you're coming from...

    You're comparing the world cup to domestic leagues. The women are talking about how much the domestic league rakes in from sponsorships, marketing, etc. Women's soccer generates more money in that regard.

  4. #24
    Muizer's Avatar member 3519
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    Default Re: Should male and female sports be combined?

    The argument against equal pay seems to be 1) women aren't as good as men at sports and/or 2) the women's game does not generate the same amount of revenue and/or 3) there's no demand for women's sports.
    Yet the organisation decided to have the games played in stadiums women's games never fill and networks decided to broadcast to an audience that never watched in numbers before. The women's football world cup demonstrates that sometimes you have to 'fake it til you make it'. To not wait passively for a development to happen naturally, but to create an example that will convince people something is actually possible, with the effect being that it actually becomes natural. There's no doubt it's been effective. Equal pay is only a logical extension of this development. IMHO the only reason to object to it is if you do not want women's sports to grow. TBH the passive aggressive tone of the OP and some who agree with it points in that direction. It's conservatism, nothing else. Let's be clear about that.
    Last edited by Muizer; August 09, 2019 at 05:13 AM.
    "Lay these words to heart, Lucilius, that you may scorn the pleasure which comes from the applause of the majority. Many men praise you; but have you any reason for being pleased with yourself, if you are a person whom the many can understand?" - Lucius Annaeus Seneca -

  5. #25
    Cookiegod's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: Should male and female sports be combined?

    Quote Originally Posted by Muizer View Post
    The argument against equal pay seems to be 1) women aren't as good as men at sports and/or 2) the women's game does not generate the same amount of revenue and/or 3) there's no demand for women's sports.
    Yet the organisation decided to have the games played in stadiums women's games never fill and networks decided to broadcast to an audience that never watched in numbers before. The women's football world cup demonstrates that sometimes you have to 'fake it til you make it'. To not wait passively for a development to happen naturally, but to create an example that will convince people something is actually possible, with the effect being that it actually becomes natural. There's no doubt it's been effective. Equal pay is only a logical extension of this development. IMHO the only reason to object to it is if you do not want women's sports to grow. TBH the passive aggressive tone of the OP and some who agree with it points in that direction. It's conservatism, nothing else. Let's be clear about that.
    Women's games don't generate the same amount of revenue because there's not much of a demand for women's sports.
    There's little demand for women's sports because they get outcompeted even by 14 year old boys.

    Quote Originally Posted by Forbes
    The men still pull the World Cup money wagon. The men's World Cup in Russia generated over $6 billion in revenue, with the participating teams sharing $400 million, less than 7% of revenue. Meanwhile, the Women's World Cup is expected to earn $131 million for the full four-year cycle 2019-22 and dole out $30 million to the participating teams.
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/mikeoza.../#4ad0c5ff6da4
    So 400 million out of 6 billion is less than 6.67% of the total revenue. The women, on the other hand, received 22.9%.

    The 400 million the men received is, however, still more than thrice the total revenue from women's soccer. So the demand for equal pay in absolute numbers you support is simply unattainable except through pressuring FIFA into paying the male players less - not by paying the female players more. And then you'll have the problem with male players not really having an incentive to do that anymore, given that they earn much more through their clubs regardless.

    I think when confronted with such an impossible demand (pay 400 million out of 131 revenue) the choice for FIFA and the various national federations would be an exceptionally easy one:
    Simply closing down the female competition all together and just focus on the one that makes them shekels.

    But back to the first numbers. The women actually earn a share of revenue that's roughly 3 times that of the men. To have equal pay relative to revenue, you'd have to either pay the men 1.374 billion, or you'd have to pay the women a fraction of what they get now: 8.73 million $ instead of the current 30.

    So Muizer, my question to you and everyone else would now be which of the 4 choices laid out to you you'd prefer:

    a) Equal pay in absolute numbers the only realistic way possible:
    Pay the men less and ruin the competition, because the best players simply stay out of it because it ain't worthwhile no more. That money would btw. go to the greedy FIFA execs, not to women's football. Just to remind you to be realistic. -> Either the male competitions would be ruined, or, which is far more likely, they'd decide that female sports is too toxic to deal with.

    b) Equal pay in relative numbers and pay the men more: 1374 million US$ instead of the current 400.

    c) Equal pay in relative numbers and pay the women less (29% of what they earn now)

    d) Or, I don't know... Maybe keep half baked politics out of sports and let sports be sports and let the women negotiate their own deals without screaming oppression by the patriarchy all the time, even though the majority of the infrastructure they're using is financed by the other sex.
    "Something funny."
    - not me.







    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    No one cares what Derc has to say.

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