Portland: Journalist injured during riot between Antifa and Proud Boys.

[Basil II the B.S]

SPLC isn't an extremist group, just a fraud:
https://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na...322-story.html

[Vanoi]

Really doubt some misconduct and allegations of work place discrimination make the organization a fraud.

I get why you don't like them. They tend to label groups you like as extremeists.

[Heathen Hammer]

SPLC isnt an extremeist group. The Proud Boys are though.

How are Proud Boys "extremist"? We know that groups like KKK, SPLC, antifa or ISIS are called that way based on their ideology, however trying to label PB as "extremism" is just labeling them with buzzword for sake of doing that, since their ideology seems to be rather centrist.

[Vanoi]

How are Proud Boys "extremist"?

Their violent behavior is well known as well as their ideology. The FBI labeled them as an extremeist group for having ties to white nationalism.

https://amp.theguardian.com/world/20...onalism-report

We know that groups like KKK, SPLC, antifa or ISIS are called that way based on their ideology, however trying to label PB as "extremism" is just labeling them with buzzword for sake of doing that, since their ideology seems to be rather centrist.

What extremeist ideology is the SPLC?

[athanaric]

I get why you don't like them. They tend to label groups you like as extremeists.

They also tend to label Muslims as "anti-Muslim extremists". And lose a lot of money in court for that. A shining beacon of competence and honesty, they are...

[Vanoi]

They also tend to label Muslims as "anti-Muslim extremists". And lose a lot of money in court for that. A shining beacon of competence and honesty, they are...

They only did that to one guy and later dropped their claim and apologized. But do continue to exaggerate.

[Infidel144]

@Infidel yes thats what i meant.

Excellent,
BWB, when you said:
"If I punch you and you punch me back, we are both involved in violence, but only one of has done anything wrong."
And Mithradates when you said:
"I dont think that you have a duty to retreat in Oregon."
You were both correct.

Both sides took it way too far for it to be self defense.

How did Andy Ngo take it to far for self defense? He did not strike anyone and attempted to retreat.

[Vanoi]

How did Andy Ngo take it to far for self defense? He did not strike anyone and attempted to retreat.

Was reffering to the protesters not Andy Ngo.

[Infidel144]

Their violent behavior is well known as well as their ideology. The FBI labeled them as an extremeist group for having ties to white nationalism.

https://amp.theguardian.com/world/20...onalism-report

According to Think Progress the:
"FBI does U-turn on Proud Boys ‘extremist’ label"
"The FBI is backtracking on labeling the Proud Boys an “extremist” group, just days after law enforcement documents seemed to indicate that the agency planned to give the group that designation."
https://thinkprogress.org/fbi-walks-...c052e60f9/amp/

edit:
Think Progress took this from The Oregonian:
"Head of Oregon’s FBI: Bureau doesn’t designate Proud Boys as extremist group
The FBI has not designated the Proud Boys, whose members routinely appear at right-wing protests in downtown Portland, as an extremist group, Oregon’s top FBI agent said Tuesday.


The FBI never intended to do so when it briefed Clark County law enforcement leaders recently about regional threats, Special Agent in Charge Renn Cannon said during a wide-ranging meeting with media at the bureau’s Portland headquarters."
https://www.oregonlive.com/crime/201...ist-group.html

@BWB Couple months should be fine. Your ti.e limit that started days ago before this argument is too short. But i understand why you made it so short. Too afraid to lose the bet?

Did you accept BWB's bet?

[Basil II the B.S]

Really doubt some misconduct and allegations of work place discrimination make the organization a fraud.

I get why you don't like them. They tend to label groups you like as extremeists.

They have labeled non-extremist groups as extremist in the past and eventually retracted in more than one occasion, let's go with ''honest mistake''.

But a self-proclaimed anti-discrimination organization that discriminates within its ranks is a joke. It betrays its sole reason of existence. It's no different from a police station that organizes robberies. The fact that one ''misconduct'' remains undisclosed, probably because it's sexual harassment and we don't even know how far it went, closes the chapter.

Want to elevate yourself as a moral arbiter? Great, here's your requirement: clean slate. Don't have it? You are done.

[Vanoi]

According to Think Progress the:
"FBI does U-turn on Proud Boys ‘extremist’ label"
"The FBI is backtracking on labeling the Proud Boys an “extremist” group, just days after law enforcement documents seemed to indicate that the agency planned to give the group that designation."
https://thinkprogress.org/fbi-walks-...c052e60f9/amp/

From your article:

On Tuesday, however, the FBI Special Agent in Charge of the Oregon field office directly contradicted the sheriff department memo.

Agent Renn Cannon said the FBI did not mean to designate the whole group, rather to characterize the potential threat from individuals within that group, OregonLive first reported.

“I can see where Clark County representatives came to that conclusion. That was not our intention. That’s not what we do,” Agent Cannon said. “We will not open a case if someone belongs to antifa or even the Proud Boys.”

The distinction, then, is more a technical one for the FBI, which is seeking to clarify that it won’t investigate an extremist group unless they advocate for something which can be described as a federal offense.

So the FBI didn't deny the original claim of their ties to white nationalists nor the engagement in violent acts and confirm members are a potential threat.

I still feel confident in calling them extremeists.

Did you accept BWB's bet?

Sure as long as the time limit is a couple months.

They have labeled non-extremist groups as extremist in the past and eventually retracted in more than one occasion, let's go with ''honest mistake''.

Which ones?

[Infidel144]

From your article:

So the FBI didn't deny the original claim of their ties to white nationalists nor the engagement in violent acts and confirm members are a potential threat.

I still feel confident in calling them extremeists.

Your claim:
"The FBI labeled them as an extremeist group for having ties to white nationalism"

The FBI via The Oregonian linked above:
"The FBI has not designated the Proud Boys, whose members routinely appear at right-wing protests in downtown Portland, as an extremist group, Oregon’s top FBI agent said Tuesday.

The FBI never intended to do so when it briefed Clark County law enforcement leaders recently about regional threats, Special Agent in Charge Renn Cannon said during a wide-ranging meeting with media at the bureau’s Portland headquarters."

You: 'The FBI did this.'
The FBI: 'No, we did not.'

Sure as long as the time limit is a couple months.

To be clear, BWB's bet was regarding the three already arrested pictured in post 45:
"If they are Proud Boys, I will log out of TWC and never return, If they are Antifa, you log out for good."

[Vanoi]

Your claim:
"The FBI labeled them as an extremeist group for having ties to white nationalism"
The FBI via The Oregonian linked above:
"The FBI has not designated the Proud Boys, whose members routinely appear at right-wing protests in downtown Portland, as an extremist group, Oregon’s top FBI agent said Tuesday.


The FBI never intended to do so when it briefed Clark County law enforcement leaders recently about regional threats, Special Agent in Charge Renn Cannon said during a wide-ranging meeting with media at the bureau’s Portland headquarters."

You: 'The FBI did this.'
The FBI: 'No, we did not.'

Did you just read what you posted? It says right in the last paragraph that the FBI didn't "intend" to label them as extremeists. Meaning they did lable them as such then backtracked.

To be clear, BWB's bet was regarding the three already arrested pictured in post 45:
"If they are Proud Boys, I will log out of TWC and never return, If they are Antifa, you log out for good."

Yep and i replied with a new a bet and BWB seemed keen on accepting.

[Infidel144]

Did you just read what you posted? It says right in the last paragraph that the FBI didn't "intend" to label them as extremeists. Meaning they did lable them as such then backtracked.

It says "The FBI never intended to do so".
FBI:
"“I can see where Clark County representatives came to that conclusion. That was not our intention. That’s not what we do, Cannon said’"
Meaning the FBI did not label them as as such. The CC representatives mis-understood.

Do you retract your assertion that: "The FBI labeled them as an extremeist group for having ties to white nationalism"?

Yep and i replied with a new a bet and BWB seemed keen on accepting.

I did not ask about your bet. I asked about BWB's bet.

[Vanoi]

It says "The FBI never intended to do so".
FBI:
"“I can see where Clark County representatives came to that conclusion. That was not our intention. That’s not what we do, Cannon said’"
Meaning the FBI did not label them as as such. The CC representatives mis-understood.

Do you retract your assertion that: "The FBI labeled them as an extremeist group for having ties to white nationalism"

Nope. The FBI did label them as such and backtracked. Its why the FBI keeps saying it wasn't their intention to do so.

I did not ask about your bet. I asked about BWB's bet.

We changed the original bet so no? Its why we have a new bet going?

[athanaric]

They only did that to one guy and later dropped their claim and apologized. But do continue to exaggerate.

That case is perfectly in line with their MO and their general level of honesty. They make a lot of money presenting themselves as an impartial research institution when in fact they're just another think tank pushing an agenda.

[Vanoi]

That case is perfectly in line with their MO and their general level of honesty. They make a lot of money presenting themselves as an impartial research institution when in fact they're just another think tank pushing an agenda.

You know they aren't a research institution right? They are a legal advocacy organization.

Shows how much you actually know about them.

[Infidel144]

Nope. The FBI did label them as such and backtracked. Its why the FBI keeps saying it wasn't their intention to do so.

No. The Clark County people misunderstood what was being said, "came to that conclusion". It is why the FBI said "That’s not what we do".

Can you quote the FBI directly labeling them as such?

We changed the original bet so no? Its why we have a new bet going?

You are trying to change the bet.
So you are not going to accept BWB's bet. "Too afraid to lose the bet?"

[Basil II the B.S]

Which ones?

Maajid Nawaz and his Quilliam organization is a notable example, because he sued the out of them and won. Ben Carson is another case.

[Vanoi]

No. The Clark County people misunderstood what was being said, "came to that conclusion". It is why the FBI said "That’s not what we do".

And who told the Clark County people that the Proud Boys were extremeists? The Clark Country sherrif didn't come up with this announcement on their.

And your articles clearly states the FBI did not intend to label them as extremeists.

You are trying to change the bet.

It already changed. BWB agreed to my bet. Do you want me to quote his reply for you?

Maajid Nawaz and his Quilliam organization is a notable example, because he sued the out of them and won. Ben Carson is another case.

We already disccused Maajid above and the SPLC apologized anyways. Ben Carson is a person,not a group. Which other groups did they claim were extremeists but were not?