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Thread: Assistance needed for descr_strat & export_vnvs

  1. #1
    FoggyFogFiggy's Avatar Modding Staff
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    Icon4 Assistance needed for descr_strat & export_vnvs

    Hi Seether and Gig'!

    I'd like some clarification about some things that are hard to understand, for me.

    Code:
    character	J-0202-GuanYu, named character, male,  age 32, x 146, y 132, portrait A448,  label GuanYu_1, hero_ability The_Flower_of_Chivalry, battle_model GuanYu_generaltraits GuanYu 1 , JbAAAA0100 1 , Lz-0202-0 1 , Jn1001 6 , Jn2000 6 , Jn3000 8 , Jn4001 1 , Jn5000 9 , JnA1000 3 , JnA2000 3 , JnA3000 3 , JnA4000 3 , JnA5000 3 , JnA6000 2 , JnA7000 7 , JnA8000 9 , JnA9000 2 , Jnxg2000 3 , G2220JnShu-A 1 , G2210JnShu-A 1 , GuanYu1100 1 , GuanYu1200 1 , GuanYu1300 1 , C3070JnBJ-A 1 , C3100JnPX-A 1 , C3160JnAY-A 1 , Jn-catholic 4
    ^
    This!

    Most of it is Chinese to me.

    GuanYu 1 > Don't know what it does actually. Maybe the model? The hidden trait Seether wrote about in another of my thread? Even though I understand it has something to do with the model, I don't get the connection. Hidden trait + Guan Yu 1 = unique model of Guan Yu? I'd like to understand.

    JbAAAA0100 1 > That's a trait, but there's is no trait by that name in export_vnvs.txt. So I have absolutely no clue as of what it is and what it does and what it is needed for. I still wonder after all these years playing this mod, why on earth choose such terms instead of simple yet obvious words, like "guanyusword" or something. ^^

    Lz-0202-0 1 > Biography

    Jn1001 6 > Strength of the character, yet the number is always wrong. Guan Yu has like 13 or 14 strength. Also, Jn1001 is listed in export_vnvs.txt as Strength: 0, but when I put let's say "Jn1001 5" for Guan Ping (who has Jn1001 1), it erase almost entirely the traits of the character. So I'm a lot. In export_vnvs.txt there's 15 traits regarding strength (why, I don't know), but when changing the value of one of those trait, the same thing as Guan Ping happens.

    Jn2000 6 > It doesn't even exist in export_vnvs.txt. So don't know what it is. I thought initually it was something about acumen since the trait is Jn2001.

    Jn3000 > Doesn't exist either, it starts at Jn3001 and it is leadership.

    So on and so on. So I'd really love for one of you guys help me out understand how this mod works, and explain those traits and those I haven't even talk about yet.

    Here's Zuo Ci :

    Code:
    character	J-3001-ZuoCi, named character, male, age 69, x 147, y 109, portrait A472 ;, battle_model Ls_zuoci_general - model does not exist
    traits ZuoCi_general 1 , JbAAAA0100 1 , Lz-3001-0 1 , Jn1000 2 , Jn2001 2 , Jn3001 2 , Jn4001 2 , Jn5001 2 , JnA1000 4 , JnA2000 4 , JnA3000 4 , JnA4000 4 , JnA5000 4 , JnA6000 4 , JnA7000 9 , JnA8000 9 , JnA9000 1 , Jnxg6000 2 , A1050JnJM-A 3 , A1070JnFS-A 3 , B2150JnJY-A 3 , B2160JnDC-A 3
    ancillaries 6shu-921
    army
    unit		JiangJun_YongLiang_Aa	exp 4 armour 0 weapon_lvl 0
    How am I suppose to lower this character loyalty?

    Anyway, getting late, would much appreciate any help from you guys! Goodnight!

  2. #2
    Seether's Avatar RoTK Workhorse
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    Default Re: Assistance needed for descr_strat & export_vnvs

    Quote Originally Posted by FoggyFogFiggy View Post
    GuanYu 1 > Don't know what it does actually. Maybe the model? The hidden trait Seether wrote about in another of my thread? Even though I understand it has something to do with the model, I don't get the connection. Hidden trait + Guan Yu 1 = unique model of Guan Yu? I'd like to understand.
    As I said in the other thread, you have to compare the trait level in EDCT to the corresponding model in descr_character.txt.
    EDCT entry (level 3):
    Code:
    Trait GuanYu
        Characters family
        Hidden
        AntiTraits Factionleader, Factionheir
    
        Level GuanYu
            Description none_desc
            EffectsDescription none_desc
            Threshold 36
    
        Effect Level 3
    descr_character entry (level 3 for Liu Clan gives the GuanYu strat model):
    Code:
    faction			france
    dictionary		15
    strat_model		majors_general			; 0 = named character
    strat_model		han_FH					; 1 = heir
    strat_model		han_FL					; 2 = faction leader
    strat_model		GuanYu					; 3
    strat_model		ZhangFei				; 4
    strat_model		HuangZhong				; 5
    strat_model		WeiYan					; 6
    strat_model		ZhaoYun					; 7
    strat_model		KongMing				; 8
    strat_model		MaChao					; 9
    strat_model		LiuBei					; 10
    battle_model	major_gen
    battle_equip	gladius, chainmail shirt helmet and rectangular shield
    JbAAAA0100 1 > That's a trait, but there's is no trait by that name in export_vnvs.txt. So I have absolutely no clue as of what it is and what it does and what it is needed for. I still wonder after all these years playing this mod, why on earth choose such terms instead of simple yet obvious words, like "guanyusword" or something. ^^
    It is a trait used to identify named characters when coming of age, being adopted, etc., so they can receive the rest of their traits. Without it they will not get their full line of required traits.

    Lz-0202-0 1 > Biography
    First level of the biography, yes.

    Jn1001 6 > Strength of the character, yet the number is always wrong. Guan Yu has like 13 or 14 strength. Also, Jn1001 is listed in export_vnvs.txt as Strength: 0, but when I put let's say "Jn1001 5" for Guan Ping (who has Jn1001 1), it erase almost entirely the traits of the character. So I'm a lot. In export_vnvs.txt there's 15 traits regarding strength (why, I don't know), but when changing the value of one of those trait, the same thing as Guan Ping happens.

    Jn2000 6 > It doesn't even exist in export_vnvs.txt. So don't know what it is. I thought initually it was something about acumen since the trait is Jn2001.

    Jn3000 > Doesn't exist either, it starts at Jn3001 and it is leadership.
    No, they do exist. Every trait listed and used has to exist or you will get crashes.

    You are not looking at the entirety of the trait lines or the export_vnvs entries correctly. You have to be careful when reading the trait entries in EDCT and their corresponding entries in export_vnvs. As an example, you are incorrect to think Jn1001 = Jn1001 1... As it is actually Jn1001 = Jn1000 1. Jn1001 1 is 10 Strength, while Jn1000 1 is 0 Strength.

    As can only have a maximum of 10 levels per trait, traits that effectively have greater than 10 levels have to be split amongst two connected traits. Jn1000 & Jn1001 are both for Strength - Jn1000 is for 0-9 Strength, while Jn1001 is for 10+ Strength. So Jn1000 6 is 5 Strength, while Jn1001 3 is 12 Strength. Jn2000 & Jn2001 are for Acumen, Jn3000 & Jn3001 are for Leadership, etc.

    You messed up with Guan Ping, as you can't have two of the same traits (in this case Strength) or it will messed up every trait a character has listed after that point. So, for Guan Ping's strength, you either have Jn1000 # (for 0-9) or Jn1001 # (for 10+), but cannot have both.

    Here's Zuo Ci :

    Code:
    character	J-3001-ZuoCi, named character, male, age 69, x 147, y 109, portrait A472 ;, battle_model Ls_zuoci_general - model does not exist
    traits ZuoCi_general 1 , JbAAAA0100 1 , Lz-3001-0 1 , Jn1000 2 , Jn2001 2 , Jn3001 2 , Jn4001 2 , Jn5001 2 , JnA1000 4 , JnA2000 4 , JnA3000 4 , JnA4000 4 , JnA5000 4 , JnA6000 4 , JnA7000 9 , JnA8000 9 , JnA9000 1 , Jnxg6000 2 , A1050JnJM-A 3 , A1070JnFS-A 3 , B2150JnJY-A 3 , B2160JnDC-A 3
    ancillaries 6shu-921
    army
    unit		JiangJun_YongLiang_Aa	exp 4 armour 0 weapon_lvl 0
    How am I suppose to lower this character loyalty?
    Fealty is Jn8000, so lower that to lower his loyalty.
    Last edited by Seether; June 29, 2019 at 10:49 PM.
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  3. #3
    FoggyFogFiggy's Avatar Modding Staff
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    Default Re: Assistance needed for descr_strat & export_vnvs

    It is a trait used to identify named characters when coming of age, being adopted, etc., so they can receive the rest of their traits. Without it they will not get their full line of required traits.
    But every characters have this trait? And it still doesn't explain the role of this trait, totally, how it fonction. Is there a comparison that can be made with Stainless Steel of vanilla M2?

    No, they do exist. Every trait listed and used has to exist or you will get crashes.
    https://zupimages.net/up/19/26/vvlb.png

    As it is actually Jn1001 = Jn1000 1.
    Well, this I don't understand. Damn I wish I could speak french! xD The trait in export_vnvs,txt is listed as Jn1001 (Jn1002 = Strength 1, Jn1003 = Strength 2, Jn1004 = Strength 4, etc), not Jn1000, so how come in descr_strat it reads it as Jn1000 + the level number? Because Jn1000 does not exist in export_vnvs.txt. Not in my 3.5 version of RoTK. And if there's 15 entries for strength, why do we need to put a level number in descr_strat? Would it not suffice to put, let say, Jn1009 to have a strength of 8? Otherwise do we not need only two entries for strength, since one can only goes to 10? So we would have in descr_strat Jn1000 + the level (1 to 10) or Jn1001 + level (1 to 5 (which would give 11 to 15 in strength)).

    Fealty is Jn8000, so lower that to lower his loyalty.
    Thanks, my bad, that one was easy, I'm tired lol.

    Thanks for your time!

  4. #4
    Seether's Avatar RoTK Workhorse
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    Default Re: Assistance needed for descr_strat & export_vnvs

    Quote Originally Posted by FoggyFogFiggy View Post
    But every characters have this trait? And it still doesn't explain the role of this trait, totally, how it fonction. Is there a comparison that can be made with Stainless Steel of vanilla M2?
    What I wrote before is the explanation of its function. There isn't a comparison, as far as I'm aware.

    Well, this I don't understand. Damn I wish I could speak french! xD The trait in export_vnvs,txt is listed as Jn1001 (Jn1002 = Strength 1, Jn1003 = Strength 2, Jn1004 = Strength 4, etc), not Jn1000, so how come in descr_strat it reads it as Jn1000 + the level number? Because Jn1000 does not exist in export_vnvs.txt. Not in my 3.5 version of RoTK. And if there's 15 entries for strength, why do we need to put a level number in descr_strat? Would it not suffice to put, let say, Jn1009 to have a strength of 8? Otherwise do we not need only two entries for strength, since one can only goes to 10? So we would have in descr_strat Jn1000 + the level (1 to 10) or Jn1001 + level (1 to 5 (which would give 11 to 15 in strength)).
    Because the trait's name in EDCT is what is read and used by the game in regard to mechanics, not it's text name in export_vnvs (that is what is displayed in-game for you to read).
    Trait Jn1000
    Characters family
    NoGoingBackLevel 1
    Level Jn1001
    Description Jn1001_desc
    EffectsDescription Jn1001_effects_desc
    ; GainMessage Jn1001_gain_desc
    Threshold 1000
    The bold is the trait's name - that is why you see Jn1000 1, Jn1000 2, Jn1000 3, etc. in descr_strat, as it is the actual trait (Jn1000) plus the level (1, 2, 3, etc.). The underlined is the level of the trait, which is just a reference for the text entries (Description & EffectsDescription) below it (which you can then find in export_vnvs). Only trait levels, not the base trait itself, will have text entries in export_vnvs - you will not find Jn1000 in export_vnvs as it is not a level, it is the base trait. Think of it as equating to the GoodCommander trait in vanilla. The game only recognizes GoodCommander 1, GoodCommander 2, etc., in descr_strat and scripts, as that is the name of the trait and the level it is at. What you see in text is Aspiring Commander, Legendary Commander, etc., and can find the text entries in export_vnvs, as well as levels in EDCT, as Aspiring_Commander, Legendary_Commander, etc. You don't put Legendary_Commander 1 in descr_strat, you put GoodCommander 5.

    It's just the way the traits were written in the original RTW mod and, years ago, it took me time to figure them out as well. Keep in mind that what is labeled in descr_strat will not always be exactly the same as what is labeled in export_vnvs. You will have to cross-reference between descr_strat, export_vnvs and EDCT if you are unsure of exactly what trait and level you are dealing with. If you see “Jn1001 5” in descr_strat and don’t know what that means, you will have to search “Trait Jn1001” in EDCT, find the fifth level underneath (to see it’s mechanics and text references - in this case Jn1015), then look at export_vnvs to find those text references - in this case Jn1015 is Strength: 14). Keeping them in order, when you do character trait lines for descr_strat or scripts, will help to understand them better. Also understanding that Jn2000 and Jn2001 are the same trait, but reference to different level ranges of the trait, will help as well.

    We already do have the 1-10 levels, as I said before. What you are forgetting is the displayed level of "0". So while Jn1000 1 , Jn2000 1, Jn3000 1, etc. are all the first level of their respective traits, they display as "0" in-game. Jn1000 2, Jn2000 2, Jn3000 2, etc. all display as "1" and are the second level of their respective traits.

    As I explained above, be aware that Jn2000, by itself, is not a trait level - Jn2000 is the trait. Trait levels are what have entries in export_vnvs and are listed as levels in EDCT.
    Last edited by Seether; June 30, 2019 at 06:32 AM.
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  5. #5
    FoggyFogFiggy's Avatar Modding Staff
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    Default Re: Assistance needed for descr_strat & export_vnvs

    Okay great, that makes more sense to me now! Thanks Seether!

    What I wrote before is the explanation of its function. There isn't a comparison, as far as I'm aware.
    Lastly, by curiosity, does that mean if I remove that trait lets say to Guan Yu nothing will happen? Since there's no comparison to this in other mods and they play just fine? Cause Guan Yu, Liu Bei, Lu Bu etc have already came of age. Or is it necessary for further traits and FEAT? And if this trait does grant further traits and FEAT, are they random?

    Thanks again!

  6. #6
    Seether's Avatar RoTK Workhorse
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    Default Re: Assistance needed for descr_strat & export_vnvs

    I forgot to mention it specifically but, along the same lines as triggers for giving traits for coming of age, adoption, etc., it also is involved with the triggers for advancing traits and feats on existing characters. So if you remove that trait, either most or all of the traits a character has will not improve or trigger for them. It is integral to the trait system, so I would highly recommend not removing it.
    Member of the Imperial House of Hader - Under the Benevolent Patronage of y2day
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  7. #7
    FoggyFogFiggy's Avatar Modding Staff
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    Default Re: Assistance needed for descr_strat & export_vnvs

    Oh ok thanks!

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