John Cleese: London doesn't feel like an English city anymore. Legitimate to prefer some cultures over others

[Jansenfinn]

It's just one of those ''not in my backyard''ism posts. It's what Woke liberals do all the time. They demand praise for the beautiful multicultural society they are building and their 'vibrant and diverse' neighbourhoods.... yet their actual neighbourhoods have zero minorities whatsoever, except for the usual hard-working Asians. Even less refugees. We had recently an Italian journalist famous for his advocacy for refugees saying that ''we can't welcome them in the wealthy areas of Rome (where he lives) because it'd drop property value'.

I'm not even a liberal dude. I grew up in a diverse neighborhood, I know what I'm talking about. You on the other hand? Probably not. Imagine even spending time in a neighborhood with less than 90% of the ethnic majority's population... Oh god the horror.

[Heathen Hammer]

Err what? Cali is cool I would rather be there than in SE Idaho. I mean sure the traffic is bad in say LA and the coolest places face a shortage of affordable housing but the reason why those places are demonstrably not s-holes.

Yeah, Cali is cool, as in post-apocalypse kind of cool where streets are covered with excrement, immense poverty and medieval diseases caused by utter failure of local government. But sure, it is a great place to live if you are part of a rich minority, segregated from all that in a gated neighbourhood.

He's calling it a shite-hole because it has a diverse population. It's pretty obvious. If you've ever been to London and any third world city you would know it's definitely not a shite-hole. But hey, whatever pushes your agenda right?

London's rising crime rates beg to differ.

[Bob69Joe]

https://politicalscience.ku.dk/staff...coming_ASR.pdf

"In this paper we argue that residential exposure to ethnic diversity reduces social trust. Previous within-country analyses of the relationship between contextual ethnic diversity and trust have been conducted at higher levels of aggregation, concealing substantial variation in actual exposure to ethnic diversity. In contrast, we analyze how ethnic diversity of the immediate micro-context –where interethnic exposure is inevitable – affects trust. We do this using Danish survey data linked with register-based data, which enables us to obtain precise measures of the ethnic diversity of each individual’s residential surroundings. We focus on contextual diversity within a radius of 80 meters of a given individual, but compare the effect in the micro-context to the impact of diversity in more aggregate contexts. The results show that ethnic diversity in the micro-context affects trust negatively, while the effect vanishes in larger contextual units. This supports the conjecture that interethnic exposure underlies the negative relationship between ethnic diversity in residential contexts and social trust."

The case that people come to a nation solely to make it more diverse must be not true, it seems absurd, that people would have an ideological purpose above anything else just to increase diversity and then demand equality. What's more likely is that Europe and America have just enough organization to have outpaced other regions of the world and those people abroad desire such organized living so come there, yet seeing themselves not of the majority or having the ways of organization of the majority demand at first equality and then seeing that they have no option to assimilate will put their methods first and above the successful organization of the majority. Welcome Tower of Babel.

[The spartan]

London's rising crime rates beg to differ.

It's lower than it was in the 90s. You know, back when it was more racially homogeneous? Huh, weird.

[Basil II the B.S]

I'm not even a liberal dude. I grew up in a diverse neighborhood, I know what I'm talking about. You on the other hand? Probably not. Imagine even spending time in a neighborhood with less than 90% of the ethnic majority's population... Oh god the horror.

I don't need your ''personal experience'' when I have studies backing my argument.

Bob69Joe posted one, but there are plenty.

https://academic.oup.com/esr/article/32/1/54/2404332

https://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.u...cial-cohesion/

The latter has multiple links. We could go on all day, your model of society isn't working for anyone. I'm right, White Liberals are destroying society.

[Muizer]

Feel free to discuss whether Cleese is right in his advocacy for preservation of diverse national identities, or we should wipe them all out to make room for a grey new world.

What does it matter what Cleese thinks? He has no particular authority on the subject nor does he speak in a capacity where such authority might be expected or needed. Without that, it's just celebrity gossip. At best his comments are anecdotal evidence of how a person whose actions in younger years were ground breaking can in old age end up complaining about how the world has left him behind. Sad. But not as sad as young people who are scared of change, right, Basil?

[Basil II the B.S]

If we shouldn't be afraid of change, then I guess we can ignore climate change too?

[Bob69Joe]

https://www.thenation.com/article/ob...against-libya/
"Change" 2008. American people are atomized individuals and none are really unafraid enough to just say so. Short of religious intervention in the lives of millions to accept not-knowing, I guess America and Europe might well continue on their path of dissolution of all traditions. Europeans had more integrity before 1789. Everything afterward became an excuse for the need of equality among individuals - class, then race, and now a dozen small subjects - until there will be no more unity left to stop an invasion from the East, Russia, China, India, a whopping 4 billion people to overrun those dastardly conservatives.

[Muizer]

Change is inevitable, Basil. Not being afraid of it means daring to take charge of it and trying to hold on to the past is trying to hold on to something forged by people who didn't.

[conon394]

Yeah, Cali is cool, as in post-apocalypse kind of cool where streets are covered with excrement, immense poverty and medieval diseases caused by utter failure of local government. But sure, it is a great place to live if you are part of a rich minority, segregated from all that in a gated neighbourhood.

OK you do realize streets full of at least people peeing in them has sort of been par for the course since Sargon's day. Immense poverty - not sure what to say. You realize the the current US second gilded age kinda means the wealth and income gap is a thing everywhere in the USa so you really can't pick out California. 'Medieval diseases' ??? Which ones. If you mean anti vax types they are common in Canada and Europe as well.

[Bob69Joe]

I'm hoping this will not detract too much from the topic, but this rendition of the Marche Henri song is sublime.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4h5M78YVN8M

Air and hymn:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZHIl5MX7Bc

Culture isn't a thing that stagnates in the past. It is either cultivated or destroyed.

[Heathen Hammer]

OK you do realize streets full of at least people peeing in them has sort of been par for the course since Sargon's day. Immense poverty - not sure what to say. You realize the the current US second gilded age kinda means the wealth and income gap is a thing everywhere in the USa so you really can't pick out California. 'Medieval diseases' ??? Which ones. If you mean anti vax types they are common in Canada and Europe as well.

As I said, I'm not arguing that life in California isn't pretty great if you are a billionaire or Democrat apparatchik, living in gated white-only neighborhood, where armed guards don't let any plebians in. For the latter, however, life isn't as glamorous: streets being covered with literal crap and needles, and good chances of catching typhoid or some other crazy medieval disease, mainly due to above-mentioned feudal Democrats are pretty terrible at actual governing, hence the current state of sanitation, but sure blame imaginary "anti-vaxers".

Change is inevitable, Basil. Not being afraid of it means daring to take charge of it and trying to hold on to the past is trying to hold on to something forged by people who didn't.

Its the elites that cling to obsolete structures and ideas, like globalism and central banking, they are main obstacle between West and real progress.

[conon394]

As I said, I'm not arguing that life in California isn't pretty great if you are a billionaire or Democrat apparatchik, living in gated white-only neighborhood, where armed guards don't let any plebians in. For the latter, however, life isn't as glamorous: streets being covered with literal crap and needles, and good chances of catching typhoid or some other crazy medieval disease, mainly due to above-mentioned feudal Democrats are pretty terrible at actual governing, hence the current state of sanitation, but sure blame imaginary "anti-vaxers".

I really not sure what world you live in. You know my Uncle and his wife are lefty liberals and live in a moderate sized house in Santa Clara. Visited recently. Did notice armed men or needles or crap in the street or gates. Not back in the 80 s either when I when to hang with a family friend in Santa Cruz. And again my wife just took our son on a whirlwind college tour of the Cali universities (and his two close friends whose parent are not really clued in on how to get into college) . Can't say that crap or needles or gated communities really came up. Imaginary Anti vaxers what the f. They are and are impacting herd immunity. Otherwise blme republican governance and relentless tax cuts and non investment in public infrastructure.

[Infidel144]

Santa Clara... You mean the county with one of the highest median household incomes in the nation?

As for the feces problem, Heathen Hammer is likely referring to the most well known San Francisco problem:
see e.g.
People are pooping more than ever on the streets of San Francisco
https://www.sfgate.com/technology/bu...s-13778680.php
while for medieval diseases, see e.g.:
Medieval Diseases Are Infecting California’s Homeless
Typhus, tuberculosis, and other illnesses are spreading quickly through camps and shelters.
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/a...meless/584380/

What are the 'relentless tax cuts' that have been happening in California? And do you realize that except for a couple year period in the 90's that Democrats have controlled the legislature for going on five decades...

[Basil II the B.S]

Change is inevitable, Basil. Not being afraid of it means daring to take charge of it and trying to hold on to the past is trying to hold on to something forged by people who didn't.

Some changes are good and I welcome them. Some changes are bad and I don't want them. If we should welcome all change, then let's scrap all environmental policies and welcome climate change. Regardless, I believe most of Western Europe, UK included, needs a leadership change. The liberal vermins that have ruled for the past 30 years have done poorly. Time for a change. We need people like Orban, Salvini, Baudet. Do you welcome that?

[mongrel]

What does it matter what Cleese thinks? He has no particular authority on the subject nor does he speak in a capacity where such authority might be expected or needed. Without that, it's just celebrity gossip. At best his comments are anecdotal evidence of how a person whose actions in younger years were ground breaking can in old age end up complaining about how the world has left him behind. Sad. But not as sad as young people who are scared of change, right, Basil?

Indeed. The primary reason why he's leaving is to minimise exposure to tax, having squandered much of his fortune on alimony.

[Papay]

Some changes are good and I welcome them. Some changes are bad and I don't want them. If we should welcome all change, then let's scrap all environmental policies and welcome climate change. Regardless, I believe most of Western Europe, UK included, needs a leadership change. The liberal vermins that have ruled for the past 30 years have done poorly. Time for a change. We need people like Orban, Salvini, Baudet. Do you welcome that?

The only way to stop millions of non europeans who visit the coninent as immigrants, tourists, students, businessmen, is to turn Europe into a s..hole. Perhaps this is what you want, i honestly dont know

[Basil II the B.S]

Isn't that what they are doing anyway, thanks to liberal immigration policies?

[Mithradates]

The only way to stop millions of non europeans who visit the coninent as immigrants, tourists, students, businessmen, is to turn Europe into a s..hole. Perhaps this is what you want, i honestly dont know

More like, "The only way to stop millions of non europeans to want to visit the coninent as immigrants, tourists, students, businessmen, is to turn Europe into a s..hole."

Different story.

[Heathen Hammer]

I really not sure what world you live in. You know my Uncle and his wife are lefty liberals and live in a moderate sized house in Santa Clara. Visited recently. Did notice armed men or needles or crap in the street or gates. Not back in the 80 s either when I when to hang with a family friend in Santa Cruz. And again my wife just took our son on a whirlwind college tour of the Cali universities (and his two close friends whose parent are not really clued in on how to get into college) . Can't say that crap or needles or gated communities really came up. Imaginary Anti vaxers what the f. They are and are impacting herd immunity. Otherwise blme republican governance and relentless tax cuts and non investment in public infrastructure.

So basically your counter-argument to California being an s-hole is that you have relatives (who happen to live in a rich community) there who say it is not? You do realize that anecdotal claims aren't legitimate arguments, right? The fact is that sanitary conditions are on some kind of medieval level there, all thanks to "progressive" Democrat governance. California is 100% controlled by Democrats, and it is being run to the ground.

The only way to stop millions of non europeans who visit the coninent as immigrants, tourists, students, businessmen, is to turn Europe into a s..hole. Perhaps this is what you want, i honestly dont know

Nah, they can just cut migration by 90%, cut all the welfare for migrants, tax businesses that hire immigrants and tax the out of religious institutions like mosques.