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Thread: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

  1. #221
    Aexodus's Avatar Persuasion>Coercion
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    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    Quote Originally Posted by sumskilz View Post
    Rather than hearsay, I've linked a massive quantity of evidence and quoted the experts who've studied the problem.

    What is the point of deliberately misrepresenting what I said, and ascribing a false meaning to it, when everyone can read what I actually said? It's hardly controversial to suggest that violence is worse than mean words. Harassment and vandalism are crimes everywhere, but still lesser crimes than violent attacks.

    Again, if we all accept that antisemitism among Germans is bad, how does that make it okay that it's even more prevalent among immigrants?

    No, I'm not. Only the very most recently discussed studies have low n, and it's clear that you do not understand what "representative" means in a scientific context. A representative sample is a subset of a population that accurately reflects the demographic characteristics of the larger group. The n=85 study used a representative sample. Unless you can identify an error in the calculation of the margin of error of n=85 in this context, then your unsupported criticism can be dismissed as scientifically ignorant.

    If you can pick 68 refugees at random and 85 refugees at random, and in both cases antisemitism was prevalent and a desire to commit genocide against Jews was present, that's a reasonable indicator of a problem. In fact, even taking into consideration the margin of error, it's an indicator of thousands to tens of thousands having "genocidal aspirations".
    Funny. I did say in the OP that Islamic anti-semitism is usually more violent.

    However, it seems Islamist anti-semitism takes the form of physical attacks and political demonstrations against Israel that come from anti-jewish motivation.
    And now we know.

    Quote Originally Posted by Carmen Sylva View Post
    I have studied criminology and have two examinas in jurisprudence.

    I know exactly what a representative study is and what not.

    And your "experts" are rather unknown in criminology.

    Sorry, perhaps you can make some AFD voters happy here with you evil muslim bashing, but for me the discussion is over now.

    I don't let me manipulated by you in an anti muslim and anti arabian sentiment because it favours pro Trump or pro Netanjahu policy.
    Actually I would easily imagine the above mindset is unfortunately commom among criminologists in Germany. No wonder they can’t face statistics they don’t like, and just categorise everything as right wing.
    Last edited by Aexodus; June 25, 2019 at 01:38 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun View Post
    Nope. There is nothing to suggest dramatically that his heart is giving out. His heart attack is a testament to how well he can recover from something like that.

  2. #222

    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    Quote Originally Posted by Carmen Sylva View Post
    Those number of 16 is in no case representative or a good sample.
    You still appear to show no comprehension of what a "representative sample" means. The representative sample size is 553. What you're referring to as a sample is in fact data in the survey.

    If the sample size actually was 16, then we could still say with 95% confidence that 57-100% of violent attacks were believed to have been committed by Muslims, so even in that hypothetical case, it wouldn't help your argument much.
    Quote Originally Posted by Enros View Post
    You don't seem to be familiar with how the burden of proof works in when discussing social justice. It's not like science where it lies on the one making the claim. If someone claims to be oppressed, they don't have to prove it.


  3. #223
    Aexodus's Avatar Persuasion>Coercion
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    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    Sorry where does 553 come from.
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    Quote Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun View Post
    Nope. There is nothing to suggest dramatically that his heart is giving out. His heart attack is a testament to how well he can recover from something like that.

  4. #224

    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aexodus View Post
    Sorry where does 553 come from.
    The survey was of a representative sample of 553 German Jews, of which roughly 3% reported being the victim of a violent antisemitic attack within the last 12 months. About 500 is a pretty typical size for national level surveys. In larger countries like the US, about 1000 is typically used. But in this case, it’s a representative sample only German Jews, who are about 118,000 in total. You can’t claim that a representative sample is not a representative sample because only 3% gave a specific answer. It’s like claiming that an exit poll of American voters in 2016 is not a representative sample because only 1% said they voted for Gary Johnson, when in fact every representative poll of American voters will get roughly the same result.
    Quote Originally Posted by Enros View Post
    You don't seem to be familiar with how the burden of proof works in when discussing social justice. It's not like science where it lies on the one making the claim. If someone claims to be oppressed, they don't have to prove it.


  5. #225
    Centenarius
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    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    Well, a sample of 1.000 is also standard in Germany.

  6. #226

    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    Quote Originally Posted by Morifea View Post
    Well, a sample of 1.000 is also standard in Germany.
    That would be 1.000 for 82.000.000. The survey in question was 553 for 118.000 (numbers written as in German).
    Quote Originally Posted by Enros View Post
    You don't seem to be familiar with how the burden of proof works in when discussing social justice. It's not like science where it lies on the one making the claim. If someone claims to be oppressed, they don't have to prove it.


  7. #227

    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    Quote Originally Posted by sumskilz View Post
    Two of the authors are obviously from Muslim cultural backgrounds, if not observant Muslims themselves. The study was funded by the University of Indiana. The AJC just published the preliminary results. Amazing I know, that a Jewish advocacy group would be interested in antisemitism. I guess it was only a matter of time before the Zionist conspiracy claims came out.
    Well, there is that Pillar of the Left: 'Who is saying something is always more important than What is being said.'

  8. #228

    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    In Germany, the police can even classify your actions as "right wing crimes", if you were a left winger, who wants to tarnish the reputations of AfD-members by drawing swastikas on the walls of their houses.

  9. #229
    Papay's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    Yesterday someone(whose name was not made public and only called "unbalanced individual")shot and wounded an imam and a worshiper in Brest. And of course this is not an isolated event because dozens of mosques have been set on fire all over Europe in the last months. Why do i believe that many people here on these forums will blame muslims for these incidents?

  10. #230

    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    Quote Originally Posted by Papay View Post
    Yesterday someone(whose name was not made public and only called "unbalanced individual")shot and wounded an imam and a worshiper in Brest. And of course this is not an isolated event because dozens of mosques have been set on fire all over Europe in the last months. Why do i believe that many people here on these forums will blame muslims for these incidents?
    Good question. You know there's a Personal Help and Advice sub-forum if you really think you need help sorting out why you believe the things you believe.

    An additional question you might want to explore is why you feel a compulsion to change the topic of existing threads rather than simply creating a new thread in which the issues you prefer to discuss will be on-topic.
    Quote Originally Posted by Enros View Post
    You don't seem to be familiar with how the burden of proof works in when discussing social justice. It's not like science where it lies on the one making the claim. If someone claims to be oppressed, they don't have to prove it.


  11. #231
    Papay's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    Quote Originally Posted by sumskilz View Post
    Good question. You know there's a Personal Help and Advice sub-forum if you really think you need help sorting out why you believe the things you believe.

    An additional question you might want to explore is why you feel a compulsion to change the topic of existing threads rather than simply creating a new thread in which the issues you prefer to discuss will be on-topic.
    Its not change in topic. People like Aexodus blame muslims for antisemitism while completely ignoring not only far right attacks against Jews but also far right attacks against muslims. Many people on these forums love to cherry pick facts to promote their agenda and their beliefs. Who cares if terrorism in not a muslim privilege? Who cares if common crime is not a muslim privilege? Who cares if islamic religion is not the only one religion that has many awkward elements that could be considered not compatible with modern democracy? All these people cherry-pick events and then say "voila muslims...told you so". I prefer to see the big picture

  12. #232
    Aexodus's Avatar Persuasion>Coercion
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    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    The idea I ignore attacks on Muslims is blatantly false.

    https://www.twcenter.net/forums/show...Uighur-Muslims

    And address the post not the poster.
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    Quote Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun View Post
    Nope. There is nothing to suggest dramatically that his heart is giving out. His heart attack is a testament to how well he can recover from something like that.

  13. #233

    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    A Palestinian man allegedly murdered a German real estate investor in November because he was a “Jew” who “destroyed his country,” according to shocking testimony during a Wednesday court appearance in the southern state of Baden-Württemberg.
    https://www.jpost.com/Middle-East/Pa...country-593831

  14. #234
    Mithradates's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    Quote Originally Posted by Papay View Post
    Yesterday someone(whose name was not made public and only called "unbalanced individual")shot and wounded an imam and a worshiper in Brest. And of course this is not an isolated event because dozens of mosques have been set on fire all over Europe in the last months. Why do i believe that many people here on these forums will blame muslims for these incidents?
    His name was Karl Foyer, he had severe paranoia. He left a letter where he explained that hooded men kidnaped him and threatened to kill his family if he wont kill the imam between 15 and 30 june. Also they implanted a chip in his arm to track him or something. He even said in the letter that he is deeply sorry for the relatives of Rachid El Jay, but he has no choice but to kill him.

    Not far-right, not islamist, not a terrorist. Just a crazy guy.

  15. #235
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    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mithradates View Post
    His name was Karl Foyer, he had severe paranoia. He left a letter where he explained that hooded men kidnaped him and threatened to kill his family if he wont kill the imam between 15 and 30 june. Also they implanted a chip in his arm to track him or something. He even said in the letter that he is deeply sorry for the relatives of Rachid El Jay, but he has no choice but to kill him.

    Not far-right, not islamist, not a terrorist. Just a crazy guy.
    I am quite sure that if a muslim shot a christian priest you would say that

  16. #236
    Mithradates's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    Quote Originally Posted by Papay View Post
    I am quite sure that if a muslim shot a christian priest you would say that
    I would say what?

  17. #237
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    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mithradates View Post
    I would say what?
    You would say "he was just a crazy guy". And not omg "he did it in the name of Quran, expell all muslims". I am quite sure about that...not

  18. #238
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    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    Quote Originally Posted by Papay View Post
    You would say "he was just a crazy guy". And not omg "he did it in the name of Quran, expell all muslims". I am quite sure about that...not
    When an attack by a muslim involves things like pledging allegiance to ISIS, yelling about allah and the koran while killing "infidels", yeah, thats not "just a crazy guy", thats an islamist terrorist.
    Do you know any attacks by muslims on christian priests where these muslims "were just crazy guys"?
    Tell me, let's hear it.

  19. #239
    Papay's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mithradates View Post
    When an attack by a muslim involves things like pledging allegiance to ISIS, yelling about allah and the koran while killing "infidels", yeah, thats not "just a crazy guy", thats an islamist terrorist.
    Do you know any attacks by muslims on christian priests where these muslims "were just crazy guys"?
    Tell me, let's hear it.
    Any time a muslim does these things its ALWAYS because quran, ISIS etc. They are never "unbalanced individuals" like non muslims people are always declared. So can you explain why only muslims have the blessing of never having disturbed individuals in their ranks?

    Bty since we talk about Germany

    https://www.dw.com/en/suspect-in-ger...ses/a-49357904

    A far right sympathizer confessed on the murder of a pro-immigrant politician. Of course he is not terrorist either correct? Unless his name is Muhammad then terrorism can be ruled out

  20. #240
    nhytgbvfeco2's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: German Jews warned against wearing kippah in public.

    Quote Originally Posted by Papay View Post
    Any time a muslim does these things its ALWAYS because quran, ISIS etc. They are never "unbalanced individuals" like non muslims people are always declared. So can you explain why only muslims have the blessing of never having disturbed individuals in their ranks?
    Did this crazy guy pledge allegiance to some Christian fundamentalist group and declare that he is acting in the name of god?


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