''Diversity'' and ''Inclusion'' in the UK: the rise of the Racist White Liberals

[Basil II the B.S]

Arguments that you can be racist only against black people is a typical form of White Liberal racism.

[Aexodus]

No thats not racism.

Racism is, when you are physically attacked, because you are black, although you are born in that country and have represented it in the national team like Daisy Osakue in Italy.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-45017843

Not, when the English Premier League is forced by anti discrimination laws to give black managers the same chance as white ones:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Football must face up to an indisputable truth: black managers do not get the same chances as white managers

The Rooney Rule might help to address the lack of representation of BAME managers in English football but we must first face society's inherent racism


This isn’t really about individuals, so we’ll leave names out of this. When we’re talking about issues as big as race and discrimination, case studies often prove a handy distraction for those who would rather fixate on the small details than the bigger picture. Several white English ex-footballers have been given their first managerial jobs in recent weeks, including one this week, but this isn’t really about any of them either. So first of all, let’s just concentrate on the data.
Since 1990, one in four – just under 25 per cent – of retired England international footballers have been black or from an ethnic minority background (BAME). But of those ex-players who have subsequently gone into a management job, that drops to just one in seven. We’re defining a management job as a club in one of the top five divisions in England, or a big-five league or international side in Europe.

As a white ex-England player, you are twice as likely to end up in a managerial job as your black counterpart. Since 1990, just five black ex-England players have gone into management, under the definition listed above. You’d probably struggle to name all of them, given that only one of them is still in a job and only one of them made it as far as the Premier League (where he lasted six months).

Oh, and you know what else? The gap is widening. Since 2000, the proportion of black footballers playing for England has risen, but while 25 per cent of white players have been given a managerial job since retirement, that drops to just 10 per cent for black players. And if you are an aspiring black English manager with a stellar playing career behind you, you’d better get a move on: no black England footballer has ever been offered his first managerial job more than a year after retirement.


At a wider level, just 7 per cent of the current Premier League and Football League managers, and 2.6 per cent of all the permanent managers in Premier League history, are BAME. And according to the League Managers’ Association, almost two thirds of all the BAME managers in Football League history never got a second job.
That’s the data. Of course, you may well choose to dispute it, disregard it, offer complicating caveats or contradictory anecdotes, but all you would be doing is arguing against my evidence with your lack of evidence. All the data indicates that black managers do not get the same chances in the game as white managers. Again, for the avoidance of doubt: all the data indicates that black managers do not get the same chances in the game as white managers.

Unless we collectively accept that as a fact, we’re nowhere.

So what now? Even many of those who agree on the problem of a lack of black representation in management are not convinced by the efficacy of the Rooney Rule, which requires at least one BAME candidate to be interviewed for every coaching role, and which is implemented by the FA but not yet by the Premier League, and only on a voluntary basis by the EFL. This should scarcely bear repeating, but the Rooney Rule does not stop the best candidate from getting the job. It does not deny anybody an interview who wasn’t already getting an interview in the first place. But there are those – of all races – who just don’t like the feel of it. That’s fine.


At the very least, however, we need clubs to offer greater transparency to their recruitment processes. Too many jobs are still being given out informally, on the quiet, without formalities, and thus intrinsically weighted in favour of those already possessing a rich range of contacts in the game. This, by the way, is a problem in many sectors beyond football, including the media.
We also need to be more cognisant of our biases as a society. The role of the manager has never just been about coaching, academic qualifications, a checklist of boxes to tick. It’s a leadership role as much as a technical one, and so it has been given on the strength of personality, character and likeability as often as anything else. Individually, you could probably make a decent case for every single white manager appointed to a managerial role in this country. It’s only when you collate them into a broader tableau that a pattern of subconscious discrimination becomes evident.


And so it’s relevant that Ucas data shows that ethnic minority students are less likely than white students to be offered university places with the same predicted A-Level grades. It’s relevant that a 2009 study found that job applicants with a “white-sounding” name like Andrew Clarke were 74 per cent more likely to get an interview than those with “black-sounding” names like Anthony Olukayode. It’s relevant that black men are three times more likely than white men to be arrested. Are we racists as individuals? Probably not. Are we racist as a society? Absolutely, 100 per cent yes.

There will be those out there – mostly white people – who will despise this article and despise the arguments made in it. Who will despise the way that white managers are reduced to their ethnicity, when it is exactly what non-white people have been experiencing their entire lives. Who would rather believe anything – that the data is flawed, that black players don’t want to become managers, that black coaches are intrinsically less capable – than that they are complicit in a rigged system, a society that still struggles to reconcile itself with the idea of black people as leaders rather than followers.

There will be those who will lament the fact that we are introducing race into an issue where race is no issue, who will ignore the data in favour of their own intuition, which tells them that everything is fine and these people are just making trouble. They will tell themselves that they are the real victims, and we the real persecutors. They will decry us for playing the race card. But you don’t need to play the race card if you’re already winning the game.

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...-a8379111.html

You realise the Rooney rule is racial discrimination right?

[Heathen Hammer]

The phenomena of liberals being racist isn't exactly that surprising. For example, plenty of "male feminists" often turn out to be rapists, while hardcore anti-semites often have Jewish lineage.

[Morticia Iunia Bruti]

You realise the Rooney rule is racial discrimination right?

No, it isn't, but i won't discuss that with you, as there is no basic for a discussion with people, who deny an obvious inequality, as only 5 ex-footballers since 1990 , 30 years!, got a job as manager, while 25 % of all english professional football players are black. I won't waste my time with discussions about non existing discrimination against whites.

[Aexodus]

Do you have any evidence for discrimination against blacks or are you jumping to that conclusion.

It’s not discrimination against whites. It’s discrimination against non-blacks.

[Morticia Iunia Bruti]

Read the Independent article. Enough proof.

[Cope]

Read the Independent article. Enough proof.

There's something deeply exhausting about being lectured to on the alleged lack of equality afforded to obscenely wealthy, abled bodied young men who are idolized by large sections of the population.

[Morticia Iunia Bruti]

Instead of cheat appeals to the envy of the people about the wealth of "footballer" it would have been better to deliver good arguments, why it is more probably and justified that the also well earning, white footballer have a second career as manager, but only 5 black ones since 1990.

An epic fail in argumentation.

[Cope]

Instead of cheat appeals to the envy of the people about the wealth of "footballer" it would have been better to deliver good arguments, why it is more probably and justified that the also well earning, white footballer have a second career as manager, but only 5 black ones since 1990.

An epic fail in argumentation.

The petty moralizing of the cosmopolitan bourgeoisie is nauseating. Not only does the author attempt to frame an elite class as victims, but he also expects us to treat his selectively chosen, correlative data as proof for his clickbait conclusion. If you want to make a credible point about discrimination, try not relying on tabloid editorials authored by journalists riding the gravy train of race and athletics.

[mongrel]

https://www.skysports.com/football/n...om-next-season


More of this nonsense in the UK.

Indeed White Liberals think that your skin affects your performance. The definition of racism. That's what White Liberals mean with ''Equality'', as demonstrated by Mongrel's posts.

I beleive the Rooney rule is aimed at preventing just that, the idea that managers can only be of use if their skin is white is racist. Anyone who actually watches football woud know that teams are diverse. 3 ethnic minority managers out of 72 teams is pathetic , all things being equal it's doubtful that is due to fair process.

I also find it strange for someone to describe the FA as 'liberal'.

You really are struggling to find real examples to fit your made-up theory.

[Cope]

I beleive the Rooney rule is aimed at preventing just that, the idea that managers can only be of use if their skin is white is racist. Anyone who actually watches football woud know that teams are diverse. 3 ethnic minority managers out of 72 teams is pathetic , all things being equal it's doubtful that is due to fair process.

I also find it strange for someone to describe the FA as 'liberal'.

You really are struggling to find real examples to fit your made-up theory.

Over half of the Premier League teams have managers from ethnic minority backgrounds.

[mongrel]

Over half of the Premier League teams have managers from ethnic minority backgrounds.

The article refers to the EFL, but you are correct. With so much money at stake, one can presume that picking people by Englishness rather than abilty would be an expensive folly.

[Cope]

The article refers to the EFL, but you are correct. With so much money at stake, one can presume that picking people by Englishness rather than abilty would be an expensive folly.

Only half of all the managers in the the Premier League, Championship and League's One and Two are English.

[Basil II the B.S]

Lmao at Mongrel and Clodia scoring own goals in repetition on this one.

Epic fail!

[Knight of Heaven]

Instead of cheat appeals to the envy of the people about the wealth of "footballer" it would have been better to deliver good arguments, why it is more probably and justified that the also well earning, white footballer have a second career as manager, but only 5 black ones since 1990.

An epic fail in argumentation.

How Manny white footballers had careers as managers? Im sure they are minority. Not every footballer gets a career as manager afterwards generally speaking. That is true regardless of skin color. 5 people within a traditionally minority group in the industry and in the country at large doesn't seem to be hugely disproportionate. As there is already a big gap between the number of footballers, and those who become managers. The gap is even bigger for those who become successful at it, over longer periods of time.

What is interesting, is that you are incapable of seeing that hiring laws based on racial profiles, is inherently racist.

Besides this kind of policy, doesn't fit the industry either ( and many others), as the clubs will hire whom ever they want to hire, often foreign managers, there is lots of factors that supersede their skin color. Like experience track record, how Manny titles earned, methodology etc. They dont seem to have a problem in hiring black kids for footballers, why would they have a problem in hiring black coaches and managers? It doesn't make sense. There is some many factors in this.
For example, I dont care what you say, but i wouldn't hire Thierry Henrry as manager to fill a equality quota in a league, he is proven to be a terrible manager for instance.

Also that article doesn't prove anything. Firstly, there’s a lack of English managers in English football, as well footballers i might add. Secondly, the article simply counts the number of black managers. Doesn’t give any context to how many have applied to jobs, which is the real stat. I mean wasn't David James the only black person on his football managers course at one time?!
Context is important. That article on the independent is clearly click bait as are this issues today generally speaking.

Over half of the Premier League teams have managers from ethnic minority backgrounds.

Indeed, but i bet most of them are Caucasian like, (despite being part of ethnic minorities in that country), so that apparently is a problem for this people...
( i known in the premier league alone there is quite a few Portuguese managers, one of them with a darker Tanned skin tone, which was born in Africa, São Tomé, im talking about Nuno Espirito Santo, even though he passes as quite Caucasian at times). You wouldn't consider him a minority as well? I mean im pretty sure Portuguese community is quite a minority in UK. But i guess we are European so it doesn't count for this "equalists".

I mean with this logic, isn't the England national team over represented by black players right now? (some of them which were not even born in the UK), is that a problem? i dont think so. Lack of black managers shouldn't be a issue either, as long there is fair opportunities for all based on merit. Which these people need to prove, because outcome result doesn't prove there isn't fair opportunities for everyone.

Equal opportunities doesn't necessary translate to equal outcome, for all walks of life, people should understand that.

[Basil II the B.S]

They openly stated that you can be racist only if you discriminate against blacks. You can't be racist against whites. Mongrel posted it over and over.

[Knight of Heaven]

Even if those whites are from minority groups themselves right?

This new fad is quite backward, but unfortunately is catching on. Even in my country we are starting to hear the beginnings of it. ( the argument is on education though, they argue that they need to favor African descendant students regardless of performance in school, quotas for colleges and such, so the numbers of outcome is more equal) So ridiculous backward they dont even see that in the process, they are gonna hurt the best educational achievers, which are also part of minority groups, like the Chinese, and Indian, Pakistani, and Ukrainian students, usually.

[Basil II the B.S]

Is it? I find Southern Europe rather immune because we don't particularly care about ''whiteness'' as much as we do about national identities. It's more an Anglo-Saxon fetish.

[Knight of Heaven]

Is it? I find Southern Europe rather immune because we don't particularly care about ''whiteness'' as much as we do about national identities. It's more an Anglo-Saxon fetish.

Yes but as you know things today are much more permeable then they used to. So some cultural fads eventually are imported. Even if takes time.

There was a debate some time ago, about the name of new Museum of Portuguese maritime discoveries, partially because it couldn't be named as such because was deemed offensive due to the past of slavery and colonization etc, you know the drill. Last time i checked they wanted to named the new museum, "The voyage".

As if it would change the content of the historical museum. Which would deal in historical facts. The good and the bad as it should. But shame on us all, if it would dare to celebrate the Portuguese age of discoveries....
The guardian made a article about it.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-colonial-past

You cant stroke the national self esteem, that is bad. As if the Portuguese have an abundance of that to begin with. ( outside of Football that is)

This kind of historical identity revisionism stems from UK, and the US. Remember the Churchill debate, and the Nelson column? Also the Trafalgar square and Waterloo station debate, where they wanted to renamed it because of sensibilities?

Its ridiculous, PC crap imo. Im a leftist and i cant stand it.

[Basil II the B.S]

Oh I agree. 99% of the arguments of cosmopolitan liberal Italians are a copy paste of what you'd hear in London, NYC etc. I'm not sure how it is in Portugal, but at this point in Italy these people have started talking in a bizarre idiom which mixes Italian structure and English words. This is particularly accentuated among for instance top university professors and those who work for multinational corporations, and I mock them mercilessly about it.

The diversity and inclusion stuff however hasn't managed to get into politics yet, probably because the main globalist party is suffering already big time in elections, so it'd just make it worse for them. It's indeed one of those things that many patriotic leftists simply can't put up with and end up voting for the right, due to lack of alternatives.

At the end of the day, the real problem with these diversity policies is that they actually end up diluting worldwide diversity in the name of nominal one at national level. What's the point of going to Lisbon if it's the same cosmopolitan/culturally neutral environment of NYC? If I go to Portugal, I want to meet Portuguese people, speaking Portuguese and see Portuguese culture. Not the same collection of token identities that I can see elsewhere. Why travel if it's the same everywhere?