Was the Mueller Investigation Legal?

[Coughdrop addict]

You don't seem to realize how problematic those FISA warrants are. First of all they state categorically at the top of the page that the information has been verified. It never was. Two weeks before Comey signed the warrant he was informed that the information provided by Stele (source 1) was bogus. On page 16 it lists Source 1 as a verified and credible source.

You are mistaken on what "verified" means when it comes to a FISA warrant application. It doesn't mean that every tip provided by a source has been independently corroborated. Rather, “verification” refers to the process laid out in the woods procedures (please excuse the poor copy on doccloud) which requires Justice Department officials to verify that representations made in a submission to the FISA Court match the information in the FBI’s investigative files. If the application relies upon a source for some claim (Steele in this case), the documentation in the case file needs to support that the source actually said what the application claims the source said. “Verification” in this case doesn't mean the FBI claimed to have tracked down Steele’s sources to corroborate his claims. Rather it means that the FBI “verified” that when the application summarized what Steele had told the FBI, it did so accurately.

Additionally Page was never charged with anything. He was debriefed voluntarily by the FBI every time he came back from Russia. The FBI was aware of everything he was doing because he gave them information about it before and after his trips.

That's not relevant. If an investigation turns up evidence of another crime, investigators aren't supposed to just ignore it. If the police were searching a home for a meth lab and instead found bodies in the crawlspace they wouldn't be expected to ignore them.

According to the FISA applications, “the FBI believes that the Russian government’s efforts are being coordinated with Page and perhaps other individuals associated with” Trump’s campaign, and that Page “has established relationships with Russian government officials, including Russian intelligence officers.” That's plenty reason to investigate.

Not to mention that Andrew McCabe testified before Congress that the FISA warrants could not have been obtained without the use of the dossier provided by Steele.

He later told CNN

"We started the investigations without the dossier. We were proceeding with the investigations before we ever received that information," McCabe told CNN as part of a wide-ranging interview. "Was the dossier material important to the package? Of course, it was. As was every fact included in that package. Was it the majority of what was in the package? Absolutely not."

And before anyone goes OMG FAKE NEWS!, these are literally the words he said while being interviewed on CNN.

[Muizer]

~Discussion of the legal predicates for the Mueller Investigation, moved from here.
-chriscase~

I know the libs here won't take the time to read this, but it is a detailed report of felony violations by members of the Obama administration abusing the FISA process in order to spy on the Trump campaign:

https://theconservativetreehouse.com...lance-program/

Didn't read all of it, but there seems to be a lot of indications of the intelligence community spying on people. Not sure about there being proof or indications it was political spying other than 'what else could it be?'

Nevertheless, I would not be in the least surprised if it were. US 'democracy' seems to have devolved into a conflict where the ends justify all means.

[B. W.]

You are mistaken on what "verified" means when it comes to a FISA warrant application. It doesn't mean that every tip provided by a source has been independently corroborated. Rather, “verification” refers to the process laid out in the woods procedures (please excuse the poor copy on doccloud) which requires Justice Department officials to verify that representations made in a submission to the FISA Court match the information in the FBI’s investigative files. If the application relies upon a source for some claim (Steele in this case), the documentation in the case file needs to support that the source actually said what the application claims the source said. “Verification” in this case doesn't mean the FBI claimed to have tracked down Steele’s sources to corroborate his claims. Rather it means that the FBI “verified” that when the application summarized what Steele had told the FBI, it did so accurately.



That's not relevant. If an investigation turns up evidence of another crime, investigators aren't supposed to just ignore it. If the police were searching a home for a meth lab and instead found bodies in the crawlspace they wouldn't be expected to ignore them.

According to the FISA applications, “the FBI believes that the Russian government’s efforts are being coordinated with Page and perhaps other individuals associated with” Trump’s campaign, and that Page “has established relationships with Russian government officials, including Russian intelligence officers.” That's plenty reason to investigate.



He later told CNN



And before anyone goes OMG FAKE NEWS!, these are literally the words he said while being interviewed on CNN.

You should have taken the time to read the Woods Procedures in its entirety. Procedure "6" specifically states that all information in the FISA warrant application be verified before a supervisor can sign off on it. Not only was the dossier not verified,James Comey had been informed by the State Department two weeks earlier that the dossier was fraudulent.

Once again, Page was working with the FBI and they knew full well he was no a Russian agent or working with the Russian government. The FBI's declaration in the FISA warrant was an outright lie.

And just so you know, Andrew McCabe was fired for lying on the recommendation of an OIG report. His congressional testimoney is a matter of record. If you want to believe what he told CNN instead of what he testified to under oath then go ahead.

Now that Barr has assigned a prosecutor to look into the origins of the fake Russian collusion hoax it seems that Comey, Brennan, and Clapper are trying to blame each other. One way or another somebody is going to jail for this. Trying to take down a lawfully elected President of the United States is treason:

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2...el-assessment/

[Coughdrop addict]

It is highly unlikely that four separate FISA judges would not notice a violation of the Woods Procedure. A FISA warrant also needs to be renewed every 90 days. In all of that, not one of the judges saw a problem with what the FBI was claiming or any indication thee was so much as a period out of place.

Where are you getting that Page was working with the FBI?


I believe that, in their desperation to defend Trump and cast him as a poor oppressed victim, the right is taking McCabes's words out of context.

The right has cried wolf that their "enemies" are about to get it for so long it's hard to take them seriously. I said it before and I'll say it again, once this latest stunt leads nowhere I fully expect Trump to fire Barr and trash him as a "deep state agent".

[B. W.]

It is highly unlikely that four separate FISA judges would not notice a violation of the Woods Procedure. A FISA warrant also needs to be renewed every 90 days. In all of that, not one of the judges saw a problem with what the FBI was claiming or any indication thee was so much as a period out of place.

Each application was headed by the declarative statement that it was a verified application. The judges had to take the word of the DOJ as they had no investigative mechanisms for their own use. The signatories on those applications clearly violated federal law and were in violation of the Woods Procedures..

Where are you getting that Page was working with the FBI?

Page's congressional testimony.

I believe that, in their desperation to defend Trump and cast him as a poor oppressed victim, the right is taking McCabes's words out of context.

You clearly can believe whatever you want to believe.

The right has cried wolf that their "enemies" are about to get it for so long it's hard to take them seriously. I said it before and I'll say it again, once this latest stunt leads nowhere I fully expect Trump to fire Barr and trash him as a "deep state agent".

It is the Dems and their accomplices in the media who have been crying wolf for over two years. It is now obvious that they were doing it in order to take the spotlight off themselves. Durham has already assembled a grand jury in Connecticut and that is a clear indication that he intends to file charges. That is the reason Comey,Clapper, and Brennan are pointing fingers at each other. They know somebody is going down for this.

[Gaidin]

Page's congressional testimony.

This thread's just weird now. I want to make sure you guys are on the same person. Carter Page or Lisa Page?

[Basil II the B.S]

The triad of liberal retards, Clapper, Comey and Brennan, are turning on each other. Great. We need to come to the point that each of them is ready to go to jail and has to beg for pardon to Trump; thus give him something on Obama or Hillary. Then we can jail one or both and let Dems make their move.

[B. W.]

This thread's just weird now. I want to make sure you guys are on the same person. Carter Page or Lisa Page?

They both testified before congress. In 2013 Carter Page worked undercover for the FBI in order to expose and convict a Russian spy, so the FBI knew he wasn't a Russian agent...they lied on the FISA warrant. They were expecting Hillary to be elected and never considered anything but that possibility. If she had been elected we wouldn't even know about the FISA warrant abuse.

[Coughdrop addict]

The triad of liberal retards, Clapper, Comey and Brennan, are turning on each other. Great. We need to come to the point that each of them is ready to go to jail and has to beg for pardon to Trump; thus give him something on Obama or Hillary. Then we can jail one or both and let Dems make their move.

After Huber, Horowitz, eight years of Obama investigations and nearly thirty of Clinton without so much as a single solitary charge filed I don't like your odds.

[B. W.]

The water is heating up for Comey, Clapper, and Brennan:

https://www.nationalreview.com/2019/...on-that-wasnt/

[Basil II the B.S]

https://twitter.com/benrileysmith/st...25239265284098
Telegraph tomorrow is revealing that heads MI5, MI6 and core advisors of Sharia May all knew of the fraudolent Steele dossier.

Trump should seriously threaten sanctions on the United Kingdom. Russia collusion? Puah. There was collusion yes, but it's between part of the CIA and the UK secret services. This is an attempted coup with intentional fake information to smear innocent people. Seriously boot the UK out of NATO as long as Sharia May is in office and the secret services aren't purged.