View Poll Results: Who's your favourite candidate for the 2020 Democratic Primaries?

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  • Bernie Sanders.

    19 48.72%
  • Joe Biden.

    5 12.82%
  • Neither.

    15 38.46%
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Thread: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

  1. #481

    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    Quote Originally Posted by alhoon View Post
    Weeeeell... it's not like the Rohingya people that are currently being genocided were bothering anybody. They were just an easy target for the Buddhists.
    indeed, one of few cases where they are actually legit victims.
    Quote Originally Posted by The spartan View Post
    @Nos
    You just described politics. Islam was that way, but then politics happened and now it is this way because the dominate interpretation of the religion changed. So it isn't about the religion having to be a certain way, it can interpreted however, it is about the political situation on the ground. In more recent history, the Middle East has been continuously messed up since the hackneyed carving of their nations post Ottoman Empire. Isn't that more relevant to their political woes than the general concepts of Islam?
    I dont think it does much good judging islam only by its optimally good side. The islamic conservatives won. all that follows from that is as much part of islam as crusades and inquisitions are part of christianity. Of course in history everything affects everything else, so its very misleadig to try to just explain everything by politics.. islam is a set of ideas which its believers think arr literally true, as matter of life and death. of COURSE that will greatlt impact how the group behaves. I dont understan this, why people are so keen on discounting the influence of religion. maybe it is because you are not religious yourself, and cannot imagine someone seriously believing e.g islam. well, you lack imagination. Imagine believing that the koran i whollh true, and consider how greatly that would change your life. then consider how a society would be affected by having all its members be believers for a thousand years. its nonsense to deny it has major implications
    Quote Originally Posted by Sukiyama View Post
    Islam and Christianity aren't particularly responsible for living conditions in places of their worship.
    of course they are. religion affects peoples values, which affect government.

    Expand its influence? Which Muslim country has annexed Christian land? Which Muslim country has designs to annex Christian land?
    firsrlt i am not speaking of a country, but the religion. secondly you can dxpand inflienxe witjout outright conquest, e.g. saudis funding mosques everyhere.

    what about televangelists, missionaries, and radical christian terrorism? Do they get a pass? Or do their efforts to spread Christianity and enforcing their values on others not count because Christianity is the "superior" religion?
    in terms of being generally more compatible with modernity and human welfare, yes christianity os currentlt VERY superior, and also islam is probably the worst religion of all. Bit yes, of course christianity is also a missionary religion. But the issue was muslims migrating to west and being hard to assimilate. the reverse is not happening, so its irrelevant.

  2. #482

    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    Hypocrisy is the twin brother of liberalism.
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...=.b75c679e5330

    Bernie ''15$ per hour'' is paying his own campaigners below that. He's also a millionaire. Animal Farm!

  3. #483

    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Basil II the B.S View Post
    Hypocrisy is the twin brother of liberalism.
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...=.b75c679e5330

    Bernie ''15$ per hour'' is paying his own campaigners below that. He's also a millionaire. Animal Farm!
    From the article:
    The draft letter estimated that field organizers were working 60 hours per week at minimum, dropping their average hourly pay to less than $13.
    Basically, when the workload is not so much the workers are getting paid $19.5 based on a 40 hours a week workload. This is an overtime issue.

    Also from the article:
    But on May 17, Shakir convened an all-staff meeting, during which he recommended raising the pay for field organizers to $42,000 and changing the workweek specifications, according to an email he later wrote to staff. The union draft indicated he was seeking to extend the workweek to six days. Shakir pressed for a swift vote so he could make budget decisions and decide how many field organizers to hire, according to his email. The union rejected his offer, because the raise would have elevated field staff to a pay level responsible for paying more of their own health-care costs, according to the draft proposal the union was preparing this week.
    Basically, Sanders campaign does pay much better and they do encourage workers to maintain strength through the union which grants them the appropriate channels to raise such issues. There is also clear evidence that the campaign is taking steps to address such issues.

    Again, from the article:
    This week, the union, in conjunction with the Sanders campaign staffers it represents, has been preparing to send Shakir a new proposal. According to a draft of the proposal obtained by The Post, they are asking for $46,800 for field organizers and $62,400 for regional field directors. The draft also asked the campaign to cover 100 percent of the health-care costs for employees making $60,000 per year or less. Under the current agreement, the campaign pays all premiums for salaried employees making $36,000 or less per year. Those making more are covered at a rate of 85 percent.
    The Armenian Issue

  4. #484

    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    Castro, De Blasio and Warren have all added their preferred pronouns to their Twitter profiles as if someone ever got them wrong.
    Best primaries ever. Liberalism is idiocracy.

  5. #485
    alhoon's Avatar Comes Rei Militaris
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sukiyama View Post
    "That's all". Uhh no alhoon. That's basically the de-facto reason why states don't attack each other. The International system is a place of anarchy. If Muslim and Christian countries switched places tomorrow, it'd be Islamic countries railing about the radical Christians and it'd be Christian countries being economically exploited by Muslims.
    Yes.
    I don't remember where I started or what I wanted to say with what you quoted, but what you said is historically proven to be correct. It's not religion that directs politics, politics exploit religion.

    Back to the Hijab and most importantly how such things hurt Democrat candidates:
    Regardless of Middle East being less powerful, in Cultural perception of American voters, Hijabs are as much a symbol of women oppression under Islam, as blackface is a symbol of racist. Whether it is right or wrong, this is how it is perceived.
    Those Hijab-for-a-day ultraprogressives wanted to "challenge" the view that Hijabs are such symbols and Miss Michigan said in Tweeter that she disagrees with it in simple, respectful tones. Then, waaaay after the fact, the Pageant that hasn't vetted her on time removed her title because of things they should have noticed before the fact, just proving they were never careful.
    Yes, the free publicity didn't hurt the woman.

    However, the free publicity of this PC-run-amok does hurt Democrats in a battleground state. And while this is too "ground level" for Democratic candidates to discuss, they will have to fight against the "Democrats are a bunch of PC idiots!" in the general election. On the other hand, they cannot fight it before the primaries are over as they would lose the support of that vocal 3-4% of ultraprogressive idiots.
    I.e. Biden, Sanders, Buttiegieg etc can't go up and say "Enough with this PC crap." because then they will lose the nomination.

    But the general election is too close to the primaries. So they won't have time to shed the stink and stigma of the SJWs that turns away many moderate voters.
    So, between "the devil you know" that for all his crude words leads a booming economy and record-low unemployment and the "SJW sanctimonious guy that talks about stuff we don't care"... a lot of moderates will again move to Trump.


    In short, what I want to say is that... the primaries take too damn long. If the Primaries were 3 months and then it was a year-long fight to the General election from the candidate to move more to the center and embrace the moderates things would be better for all involved.

    Quote Originally Posted by Basil II the B.S View Post
    Castro, De Blasio and Warren have all added their preferred pronouns to their Twitter profiles as if someone ever got them wrong.
    Best primaries ever. Liberalism is idiocracy.
    I don't even know what that means...
    Last edited by alhoon; July 22, 2019 at 09:13 PM.
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  6. #486

    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    You don't know what means what?
    The preferred pronouns habit?
    Trannies on twitter have the habit of adding their preferred pronouns on twitter in their bio, eg xyr/xim or she/her. ''Allies'' do it as well to show their support for the cause.

  7. #487

    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    Former Vice President Joseph Biden reverses his slump following the first Democratic presidential debate and now leads the pack with 34 percent of Democrats and independent voters who lean Democratic, according to a Quinnipiac University National Poll released today. Massachusetts Sen. Elizabeth Warren has 15 percent, with 12 percent for California Sen. Kamala Harris and 11 percent for Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders.

    This compares to results of a July 2 survey by the independent Quinnipiac (KWIN-uh-pe- ack) University National Poll, showing Biden with 22 percent, Harris with 20 percent, Warren with 14 percent and Sanders with 13 percent.

    In today's results:

    Biden gets 53 percent of black Democrats, with 8 percent for Sanders, 7 percent for Harris and 4 percent for Warren;

    Women Democrats go 34 percent for Biden, 15 percent for Warren, 14 percent for Harris and 10 percent for Sanders;

    Very liberal Democrats go 29 percent for Warren, 25 percent for Biden, 15 percent for Sanders and 12 percent for Harris;

    Somewhat liberal Democrats go 34 percent for Biden, 16 percent for Sanders, 14 percent for Warren and 10 percent for Harris;

    Moderate/conservative Democrats go 39 percent for Biden, 12 percent for Harris, 9 percent for Warren and 8 percent for Sanders.

    Rounding out the Democratic field are South Bend Mayor Pete Buttigieg with 6 percent, and former U.S. Rep. Beto O'Rourke and entrepreneur Andrew Yang with 2 percent each. There are four candidates with 1 percent each and 14 candidates at less than 1 percent each.

    "In the blink of an eye, the post-debate surge for Sen. Kamala Harris fades and former Vice President Joseph Biden regains his footing among Democratic presidential contenders," said Mary Snow, polling analyst for the Quinnipiac University Poll.
    https://poll.qu.edu/national/release...ReleaseID=3635
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  8. #488

    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    Of the likely candidates, Biden would be my choice too.



  9. #489

    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ep1c_fail View Post
    Of the likely candidates, Biden would be my choice too.
    I understand that most people don't understand what cancer is and the media can only report "Orange man bad", but how is Biden not getting racked over the coals for promising to cure "cancer" by 2024?

    I'm a biochemist, so I compare it to him promising hoverboards. I can say this is the biggest lie and stupidest thing I've ever heard. Democrats claim to be the party of science and should know he is lying. How much bigger can a lie be before the Left calls him out? I feel like Frank Grimes, this whole place is insane I tell you, insane.

  10. #490

    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    Quote Originally Posted by NorthernXY View Post
    I understand that most people don't understand what cancer is and the media can only report "Orange man bad", but how is Biden not getting racked over the coals for promising to cure "cancer" by 2024?

    I'm a biochemist, so I compare it to him promising hoverboards. I can say this is the biggest lie and stupidest thing I've ever heard. Democrats claim to be the party of science and should know he is lying. How much bigger can a lie be before the Left calls him out? I feel like Frank Grimes, this whole place is insane I tell you, insane.
    I'm pretty impressed that you're heckled by Biden's well-meaning comment during his campaign, while giving a general pass for the media coverage of all the dumb, insensitive, and crazy that Trump says. "Orange Man Bad". Not to mention that the "Left" did call him out. Though I can imagine how difficult a simple google search must be.

  11. #491

    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Sukiyama View Post
    I'm pretty impressed that you're heckled by Biden's well-meaning comment during his campaign, while giving a general pass for the media coverage of all the dumb, insensitive, and crazy that Trump says. "Orange Man Bad". Not to mention that the "Left" did call him out. Though I can imagine how difficult a simple google search must be.
    So I should praise him for being stupid and a liar? What percentage of candidates promises can be lies before they're ridiculed off stage? Seriously, what percentage?

    "If elected president I promise cold fusion, everybody will be in great shape and live forever, faster than light travel, no more pollution, no more crime, nobody will have to work and be rich, and every Tuesday we'll get free ice cream."

    Do you really just want to be fed well-meaning fictions?

    I did do a search, that's why I stated he's not getting ridiculed enough. I'm not going off on Trump because this is the thread about the Democrat presidential candidate.

  12. #492

    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    Quote Originally Posted by NorthernXY View Post
    So I should praise him for being stupid and a liar? What percentage of candidates promises can be lies before they're ridiculed off stage? Seriously, what percentage?
    Your indignation would carry far more weight if you applied consistently to Trump, instead of solely on Biden. Where was your demand for Trump to be ridiculed off stage for his lies? Where is your outrage behind all the stupid lies that Trump has spouted last week? Not to mention the last three to four years. But to answer your question, no. I'm not asking you to praise his ridiculous and hopeless promise. What I am asking is to tone down your indignation because it does not appear to be genuine.

    Biden's "lies" can possible result in the Government investing billions into trying to cure cancer, and failing, after 4 years. That's not a negative result, as it will likely move medical science forward in an area that affects all Americans. So while his promise is certainly unrealistic, it's not necessarily harmful.

    "If elected president I promise cold fusion, everybody will be in great shape and live forever, faster than light travel, no more pollution, no more crime, nobody will have to work and be rich, and every Tuesday we'll get free ice cream."

    Do you really just want to be fed well-meaning fictions?
    It's not about wanting to be fed well-meaning fiction, but Biden has years of experience in public administration, he has a fairly good policy plan on his website, way more comprehensive than Trump's 2016 platform (which was basically promises with no plan to get there). If you're upset about "well-meaning fictions". You're targeting the wrong guy. I'm amused that it's the cancer promise that got you all riled up. In comparison to the lies and false promises fed by the Trump campaign in 2016 and his administration today, an unrealistic cancer promise is extremely tame in comparison.

    I did do a search, that's why I stated he's not getting ridiculed enough. I'm not going off on Trump because this is the thread about the Democrat presidential candidate.
    Uh no, you didn't say that. You criticized Biden for lying and wondered when the "Left" (whatever the hell that means) will call him out. They did, so you moved goalposts. To answer your comment, he's not "getting ridiculed enough" because it's fairly innocuous and tame in comparison to the lies and hyperbole constantly being fed by the Trump administration. In comparison to that, it's not particularly egregious. Especially when the "lie", is beneficial to the country even if it spectacularly fails. Can't say any American will complain about 4 years of increased funding for cancer research.

  13. #493
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    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    It's amazing how a Trump supporter could get mad at any other politician when they say silly things. Irony has never been their strong suite.
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  14. #494

    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    Mariane Williamson had a ''all white people apologize to the next African-American'' moment:
    https://twitter.com/TitaniaMcGrath/s...03482216026112

    Shame she's not going to win. It'd be a guaranteed landslide for Trump.

    Quote Originally Posted by NorthernXY View Post
    I understand that most people don't understand what cancer is and the media can only report "Orange man bad", but how is Biden not getting racked over the coals for promising to cure "cancer" by 2024?

    I'm a biochemist, so I compare it to him promising hoverboards. I can say this is the biggest lie and stupidest thing I've ever heard. Democrats claim to be the party of science and should know he is lying. How much bigger can a lie be before the Left calls him out? I feel like Frank Grimes, this whole place is insane I tell you, insane.
    Grimey no!

  15. #495

    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Sukiyama View Post
    Your indignation would carry far more weight if you applied consistently to Trump, instead of solely on Biden. Where was your demand for Trump to be ridiculed off stage for his lies? Where is your outrage behind all the stupid lies that Trump has spouted last week? Not to mention the last three to four years. But to answer your question, no. I'm not asking you to praise his ridiculous and hopeless promise. What I am asking is to tone down your indignation because it does not appear to be genuine.

    Biden's "lies" can possible result in the Government investing billions into trying to cure cancer, and failing, after 4 years. That's not a negative result, as it will likely move medical science forward in an area that affects all Americans. So while his promise is certainly unrealistic, it's not necessarily harmful.



    It's not about wanting to be fed well-meaning fiction, but Biden has years of experience in public administration, he has a fairly good policy plan on his website, way more comprehensive than Trump's 2016 platform (which was basically promises with no plan to get there). If you're upset about "well-meaning fictions". You're targeting the wrong guy. I'm amused that it's the cancer promise that got you all riled up. In comparison to the lies and false promises fed by the Trump campaign in 2016 and his administration today, an unrealistic cancer promise is extremely tame in comparison.



    Uh no, you didn't say that. You criticized Biden for lying and wondered when the "Left" (whatever the hell that means) will call him out. They did, so you moved goalposts. To answer your comment, he's not "getting ridiculed enough" because it's fairly innocuous and tame in comparison to the lies and hyperbole constantly being fed by the Trump administration. In comparison to that, it's not particularly egregious. Especially when the "lie", is beneficial to the country even if it spectacularly fails. Can't say any American will complain about 4 years of increased funding for cancer research.
    What's your area of research? I'm betting you're a breast cancer gal. What's your least favorite part of writing grants? Mine is when it gets close to finals. I'm assuming you too are a scientist and aren't just speaking out of your ass by assuming you can simply give every scientist a blank check and every disease will be cured.

    Quote Originally Posted by irontaino View Post
    It's amazing how a Trump supporter could get mad at any other politician when they say silly things. Irony has never been their strong suite.
    I'm not a Trump supporter, didn't vote for him and won't vote for him. I would have voted for Bernie had he gained the Democratic nomination but Hillary stole it. Democrats have been challenging each other to see who can play identity politics the hardest, and I don't believe things like sex, gender, race, or sexual preference to be the only things that matter about a person. They've been going farther and farther to the left so now I don't have a party.

    The Left is slowly becoming irrelevant. Fox News is/was ridiculed by the Left, but after the Covington incident, I have to believe the Left is truly brainwashed by the media. It wasn't about reporting the news, it was about attacking kids and spreading hate. I complain about Biden and it immediately becomes "Shut up Trump supporter". In the 90s Democrats would say "I don't agree with what you said but I'd die to defend your right to say it." Now, they want people fired for not using the gender they want to be called that day. I attack the Left because it betrayed the principles it stood for and left me feeling stupid for having trusted it.

  16. #496

    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    Quote Originally Posted by NorthernXY View Post
    The Left is slowly becoming irrelevant. Fox News is/was ridiculed by the Left, but after the Covington incident, I have to believe the Left is truly brainwashed by the media. It wasn't about reporting the news, it was about attacking kids and spreading hate. I complain about Biden and it immediately becomes "Shut up Trump supporter". In the 90s Democrats would say "I don't agree with what you said but I'd die to defend your right to say it." Now, they want people fired for not using the gender they want to be called that day. I attack the Left because it betrayed the principles it stood for and left me feeling stupid for having trusted it.
    I've had that often too. Whenever I criticize the Democratic Party for conspiring to sabotage Sanders' campaign or highlight that the Russia hysteria is a ploy to distract voters from Clinton's deceitfulness and incompetence I'm accused of being a Trump supporter. That's just the reaction that you get from partisans. As for the Covington affair, I'm surprised that you hadn't realized the grotesque extent of the liberal press' dishonesty long before that.



  17. #497

    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    What are the odds Beto doesn't answer a question in Spanish tonight?

  18. #498

    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    Quote Originally Posted by NosPortatArma View Post
    I dont think it does much good judging islam only by its optimally good side. The islamic conservatives won. all that follows from that is as much part of islam as crusades and inquisitions are part of christianity. Of course in history everything affects everything else, so its very misleadig to try to just explain everything by politics.. islam is a set of ideas which its believers think arr literally true, as matter of life and death. of COURSE that will greatlt impact how the group behaves. I dont understan this, why people are so keen on discounting the influence of religion. maybe it is because you are not religious yourself, and cannot imagine someone seriously believing e.g islam. well, you lack imagination.
    Who was judging Islam only by it's optimally good side? I am saying trying to use a religion, of all things, to explain cultural and political phenomenon is kinda weird in this day and age. Newsflash, every religious practitioner believes whatever it is is literally true, that is the point of a religion. But it is weird to use someone's religion to explain political things they are doing as more recent political influences are probably more relevant. When the troubles were going on in Ireland, it would have been insanity to suggest the IRA was committing terrorist acts because they were informed by Catholicism. Obviously, you would say it was because of past Irish and British political tensions; if you brought up the Catholic practices of the IRA, people would probably think you are trying to tie the IRA's terrorist acts into something inherent about Catholicism.

    Quote Originally Posted by NosPortatArma View Post
    Imagine believing that the koran i whollh true, and consider how greatly that would change your life. then consider how a society would be affected by having all its members be believers for a thousand years. its nonsense to deny it has major implications
    Ok
    Imagine believing that the [INSERT RELIGIOUS TEXT HERE] i whollh true, and consider how greatly that would change your life. then consider how a society would be affected by having all its members be believers for a thousand years. its nonsense to deny it has major implications
    Unless your point is that the Islamic holy text (and I guess Islam overall by extension) is a special kind of religiously bad, I don't get it. But see, it seems as if you want to pick on Islam in particular for some reason.
    Last edited by The spartan; July 30, 2019 at 07:29 PM.
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  19. #499

    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    Quote Originally Posted by irontaino View Post
    It's amazing how a Trump supporter could get mad at any other politician when they say silly things. Irony has never been their strong suite.
    The difference is Trump says something provocative on purpose, to weaken his opponents, Democrats just act irrational and just blame Russian boogeyman for their failures.

  20. #500
    irontaino's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: USA Democratic party 2020 candidates and primaries thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Heathen Hammer View Post
    The difference is Trump says something provocative on purpose, to weaken his opponents, Democrats just act irrational and just blame Russian boogeyman for their failures.
    Except he isn't, he just blurts out whatever comes to his mind because he has no filter and is a pathological liar. Up until becoming president, had nobody telling him no or calling him out.
    Last edited by irontaino; July 30, 2019 at 07:48 PM.
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