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Thread: [Decision] Moving the CCT

  1. #21
    Hader's Avatar Things are very seldom what they seem. In my experience, they’re usually a damn sight worse.
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    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    OP updated, we'll stick with option 3 as the support/vote version then since it's so far most popular, and definitely the easiest to accomplish.

  2. #22
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    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    Support option 3.
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  3. #23
    mishkin's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    Is not it comforting when things are that easy?

  4. #24
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    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    Complete stick in the mud that I am, I actually like the idea of having all the commentary threads in the same place. Judging by recent comments elsewhere, it appears others have had difficulty locating certain commentary threads too (namely the new Modding Staff one), as a fair few of them are scattered about. Can I propose a small amendment to the proposal, where we at least have a sticky thread in the Q&S with links to all the commentary threads?

  5. #25
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    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    Quote Originally Posted by Hitai de Bodemloze View Post
    Can I propose a small amendment to the proposal, where we at least have a sticky thread in the Q&S with links to all the commentary threads?
    I'd support that. Or at least stickied, permanent re-directs to the threads that aren't in the Q&S.




  6. #26
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    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    Quote Originally Posted by Hitai de Bodemloze View Post
    Complete stick in the mud that I am, I actually like the idea of having all the commentary threads in the same place. Judging by recent comments elsewhere, it appears others have had difficulty locating certain commentary threads too (namely the new Modding Staff one), as a fair few of them are scattered about. Can I propose a small amendment to the proposal, where we at least have a sticky thread in the Q&S with links to all the commentary threads?
    It is right here.
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  7. #27
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    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    Option 3 seems to be the most efficient. Perhaps leave a stickied thread in Q$S with a redirect for about 6 months.

  8. #28
    Hader's Avatar Things are very seldom what they seem. In my experience, they’re usually a damn sight worse.
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    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    Quote Originally Posted by Hitai de Bodemloze View Post
    Complete stick in the mud that I am, I actually like the idea of having all the commentary threads in the same place. Judging by recent comments elsewhere, it appears others have had difficulty locating certain commentary threads too (namely the new Modding Staff one), as a fair few of them are scattered about. Can I propose a small amendment to the proposal, where we at least have a sticky thread in the Q&S with links to all the commentary threads?
    I'd prefer to keep this proposal to just the CCT and not bunch it, even loosely, with other staff commentary threads not as related to the Curia. If it is something that can help reduce the number of stickies per forum and still get that important information out where it should be, then that can be a good proposal to look into doing.

    Redirects can certainly be a thing for the CCT as well, though I personally doubt anything more than a month at most is necessary for that. But that's just me.

  9. #29
    mishkin's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    Quote Originally Posted by Halie Satanus View Post
    This will likely be my last post in the CCT. Since the curia seems intent to move it in house. Though I feel this removes even the illusion of impartiality, this is as much as I intend to say on the matter.

  10. #30
    Veteraan's Avatar TATW Local Moderator
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    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    Move it in house? The Prothalamos is not "in house" and every member can post there. At least that is what I understood from the change earlier this year. However, my interest in the Curia has taken a nosedive this year, so I might have missed some changes.

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  11. #31
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    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    Took me a while to understand the reason of such opposition but finally...

    Quote Originally Posted by mishkin View Post
    you ignore my argument (the CCT is not yours to decide its location) and point out others that I have not done (censorship).
    So, I'm quoting the relevant part here from the CCT to, hopefully, broaden the discussion
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  12. #32

    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    I have to say, it's going to feel silly using the old practice of members commenting about proposals in the CCT (even if it's entirely relevant there too) while also arguing on the proposal, as a member.

  13. #33
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    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    Yes, it's actually funny to see that the curia has not the monopoly of the conservatism

    Tbh, I honestly don't care. I understand why these guys are opposed to this proposal but I fully disagree with the validity of their argumentation. I've stated my support to this proposal already and I haven't changed my mind nor will do. The purpose of quoting here is to show that the place has changed and habbits should do so as well
    I mean, any member can voice his opinion here, in the Prot, now. If they refuse to do so, why keep compaining in the CCT? But I'm disgressing here.
    Last edited by Lifthrasir; April 26, 2019 at 06:55 AM. Reason: typo
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  14. #34
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    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    The proposal is like putting lipstick on a pig. As long as citizenship is "exclusive" (in which it was never intended to be) then there will always be an "us vs then" mentality.
    What purpose does the CCT serve now? Commentary on elections and near nonexistent citizenship applications. Of course, there is another reason. Unless I am mistaken, unless you are citizen, you cannot make a proposal, so the CCT is peregrinii best recourse. This would support the notion that it is best serve (now anyway) in the Prothalomos. Option 3 is the most logical of the choices unless you want to rename the thread. Anyway the moving of the CCT changes nothing. I look forward to putting pretty earrings on the pig next time. Abstain

    (enjoy the facetiousness of the post)
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  15. #35

    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    Quote Originally Posted by PikeStance View Post
    Unless I am mistaken, unless you are citizen, you cannot make a proposal, so the CCT is peregrinii best recourse.
    Facetious or not (which, despite the disclaimer, has been missed in the extreme already and I must confess is a poorly blended addendum to a both deadpan and aimless post), there is a factual inaccuracy which I will let you decide for yourself between a quote and a screenshot.

    For being moved to vote the latest version of a resolution requires at least three Citizens to post in its Prothalamos thread indicating their support. The latest version of the resolution must be debated for at least three days in the Prothalamos before the proposer can request it be moved to vote.
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...64/unknown.png

    While vague on the specific point, the wording is not exclusive to non-citizen thread openings, and the ability to do so strikes me as a poor permission to give if it was not intended. In conjunction with the passed proposal on this board:

    Any member can propose a resolution for discussion by posting a thread in the Prothalamos.
    Resolutions can be Amendments, making changes to this document; Decisions, suggesting changes to the site; or Nominations, proposing a member for a Curial award; or Votes of No Confidence (VoNC) against Curial Officers or Staff Members. A VoNC may only be initiated for neglect of duty or abuse of authority and, if successful against a Curial Officer, results in their immediate removal from office.

    All resolutions are voted on at the proposer's request and pass on the basis of a two-thirds majority of non-abstaining votes in favor. All Amendments and Decisions are considered to have immediate effect and no retroactive effect unless specifically stated otherwise. The Administration may veto any resolution.

    After a successful vote the Consul enacts the resolution, or requests the administration to enact it or to give an official reason for not doing so.
    I could indeed create (nearly) whatever I want.

  16. #36
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    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    Off-Topic material removed

    Most of my applicants are modders with little or no interest beyond modding. everyone else I can proudly say have shared their opinion either with me or against me. Either is their prerogative alone and i would have it no other way. Also, the only time I have ever applied for an elected position was to provide at least one candidate for the position. You are right; everything have done was done in vain and my reputation is poo poo. Thanks for the validation.

    Off-Topic material removed

    Every person I have patronized I believe are top class. I hope they do not feel as you. ironically, you addressed this to Alwyn and I patronized him.

    Quote Originally Posted by CommodusIV View Post
    Facetious or not (which, despite the disclaimer, has been missed in the extreme already and I must confess is a poorly blended addendum to a both deadpan and aimless post), there is a factual inaccuracy which I will let you decide for yourself between a quote and a screenshot.
    While vague on the specific point, the wording is not exclusive to non-citizen thread openings, and the ability to do so strikes me as a poor permission to give if it was not intended. In conjunction with the passed proposal on this board:

    I could indeed create (nearly) whatever I want.
    I did write this. I was not aware of any passage as I have not been reading the forum a great deal as of late.

    Quote Originally Posted by PikeStance View Post
    Unless I am mistaken, unless you are citizen, you cannot make a proposal, so the CCT is peregrinii best recourse.
    I am still abstaining.
    Last edited by Van Zandt; May 06, 2019 at 10:36 AM. Reason: Off-Topic material removed - Van Zandt
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  17. #37

    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    I do want to add as I read it but didn't address it (and since I'm replying to everything else),

    Off_Topic material removed

    This is absolutely, absolutely silly and disengenuous, particularly the former. I've rarely seen people Pike's patronized even comment at all on most things relative to his 'curial ambitions', and his proposals (recent and easily accessible) are obviously not doing anything to support his own standing. I've often disagreed with him and I think there are critical flaws in how he goes about things, but this is not one of them, and this is an insult equally worthy of looking into as your construction of Pike's post being malicious when he attempted to explain there was a base of humor without even editing it in. Pike has tons of people he's patronized. Many of them I think are worth it and others I simply don't know about enough to care. Name literally one case where Pike's gotten a minion from his patronage. I'd like to know one. We can do that by DM if you like. It certainly didn't come into use for the certification program proposal.

    Off-Topic material removed

    You realize that if you have any serious will to get anything done, you'd poke a hex and/or curial officer, right (and presumably by DM to put up a real case)? Instead you randomly poke a mod who hasn't even participated much if at all in this thread who does not have this section in his active attention thanks to it being managed and actively looked at by far more relevant, dedicated staff.

    And FFS, this is a forum, are you really complaining an hour and a half later if timestamps are any indication?

    If you had any respect for citizenship in the first place, you'd work to make it better, not leave on such a flimsy ground and jump on someone while you clearly have an axe to grind and no argument to support your heated claims.

    Quote Originally Posted by PikeStance View Post
    I did write this. I was not aware of any passage as I have not been reading the forum a great deal as of late.
    I'm not entirely sure what you mean, so I assume you mean you didn't see the proposal pass (it was kinda big in relation to recent affairs, but ok) and weren't aware. In any case, I'm assuming you know now and all's well on that tidbit.
    Last edited by Van Zandt; May 06, 2019 at 10:34 AM. Reason: remove off-topic material - Van Zandt

  18. #38
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    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    I would remind everyone to stay on topic for the thread now.

    As for this proposal, I've sat on it for a bit and while I have some reservations about perhaps going for this too soon, I've come to the conclusion that it is still a minor thing that can easily be undone in the future with little to no harm (and it's moving in the first place really should do little to no harm). We will stick with option 3 for sure so you may reaffirm support if you wish and perhaps this will go to vote eventually (regardless I don't think this is the most time sensitive thing either way so more discussion is certainly fine too).

  19. #39
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    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    Quote Originally Posted by CommodusIV View Post
    I'm not entirely sure what you mean, so I assume you mean you didn't see the proposal pass (it was kinda big in relation to recent affairs, but ok) and weren't aware. In any case, I'm assuming you know now and all's well on that tidbit.
    I have no have the time to go back to look to what has passed or not passed. I have been preoccupied. if anything, if the proposal was not passed, it would had credence to moving to the Prothalomos. The fact it was passed would leave the question open on whether or not there is merit or benefit to moving it all. However, i would be hypocritical to agree. It literally means very little to move it or leave it as is. There are far more pressing issues, but I won't stop progress.

    Let's expedite this. I will SUPPORT to go to vote, but will abstain.
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  20. #40
    Carmen Sylva's Avatar Domesticus
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    Default Re: [Decision] Moving the CCT

    Opposed with the same reasons as Muizer.

    Quote Originally Posted by Muizer View Post
    I consider this a place where members can discuss the Curia's role in general more than individual proposals, and its audience are the general membership who might be affected by Curial decisions as well as to the Administration whose endorsement these decisions require. Describing the Curial commentary thread as a thread to comment on the Curia's decisions is already a reduction of its scope. A post about the very ligitimacy or general functioning of the Curia would become technically off-topic. I do not mean that as 'help we will be moderated' but as in people with misgivings about the Curia deciding 'this is not where I should be posting'.

    In short, to all those who might want to support this decision: Yes this move would stop me from posting in the commentary thread. I don't expect to convince those who have no such qualms. But the question you have to answer is not about your principles but about mine and anyone who might feel the same as I: do you want to close off this avenue of expressing our opinions because you think it is logical and have no problem with it.
    And as Muizer i will abstain from the CTT thread in future.

    Quote Originally Posted by PikeStance View Post
    The proposal is like putting lipstick on a pig. As long as citizenship is "exclusive" (in which it was never intended to be) then there will always be an "us vs then" mentality.
    What purpose does the CCT serve now? Commentary on elections and near nonexistent citizenship applications. Of course, there is another reason. Unless I am mistaken, unless you are citizen, you cannot make a proposal, so the CCT is peregrinii best recourse. This would support the notion that it is best serve (now anyway) in the Prothalomos. Option 3 is the most logical of the choices unless you want to rename the thread. Anyway the moving of the CCT changes nothing. I look forward to putting pretty earrings on the pig next time. Abstain

    (enjoy the facetiousness of the post)
    And personally i go one step further and stop posting in the prot forum, as obviously citizens can insult non-citizen there without consequences.

    Please molest me in future not with any other curial award, especially becoming artifex.

    Thanks.
    Last edited by Carmen Sylva; May 05, 2019 at 11:25 AM.

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