Faction specific formations is possible!!

**bitterhowl** · May 11, 2020, 08:54 PM

I made nothing but mentioned it this thread - made custom formations for attack/defend situations and had to disable G5 for the sake of saving formation without regroup into vanilla. Same about .xmls - only to save formations and fixing battlefield behavior according to unit formation roles.

The purpose of this upload is to find such bugs as you describe and fix them. I'd be very pleased if you discribe more detailed - what was the battle type and composition of armies.

**stevietheconquer** · May 12, 2020, 10:39 AM

that one fight was all with enemy archers and crossbow unit,just played yesterday a new siege and the ai was very smart and almost lost the battle,they attaked the ram(as i do always) lucky i had mine general_unit to charge them from behind,on the walls units were well organized, only they left their general alone to be defeated, but they were fighting well as a whole and it was close, or I would have lost the battlein open field battles the general seems to get too close to my troops and then waits a few meters so I can shoot him with my crossbows and archers

i guess it is difficult to use the wright number of code for the general unit,maybe a 9 will do(distance to attack) but it will never be perfect

**bitterhowl** · May 12, 2020, 08:07 PM

Tnx for feedback! It's vital to fix such problems.

As for general_unit - I always wanted it to be more proactive, especially in minor battles, seems that general sometimes can deal such battles entering combat. But yes, in my test general dies too fast, not in the beginning but in the middle of the battle, which is deadly for troop morale. I'll think about it.

As for sieges - credits goes strait to z3n, I didn't changed nothing in that part.

**stevietheconquer** · May 16, 2020, 05:24 PM

just had some more battles and i must say that i had a lot of fun with it,now i will see what the enemy will do if they besiege me with more then 1 army and if it can handle more then 1 ai armies

**bitterhowl** · May 17, 2020, 12:49 AM

Thanks! I'd like you to post feedback here.

https://www.twcenter.net/forums/show...-Aimless-Steel

**Lusitanio** · September 17, 2020, 04:54 PM

Originally Posted by bitterhowl

So, bitterhowl proudly presents - TrueGeneral Alpha: Aimless Steel.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1RkW...ew?usp=sharing

Well, the name is self-explanational. Aimless Steel means that it's an early version and sometimes things may look ugly and AI goes wrong. I need much more tests which I can't perform alone, that's why I place it here.

Formations I use are made by GrandViz, he is the best. Pathfinding made by z3n, as well as initial .xmls.

All I made is bent them together. Here we got 5 custom formations - 2 for attack and 2 for defend (both dedicated to anti_cavalry/anti_infantry options) and 1 universal multi-purpose formation for byzantium faction.

All formations are choosen for only test purpose (to see a possibility of having more then 1 working formation at all), setting adequate formation to battle situation is a goal for the next version, if the whole method will show workability at all.

You have to disable any battle scripts before playing.

Copy all files to data folder with replace option and backup original ones.

Would this work with Europa Barbarorum II?

**bitterhowl** · September 20, 2020, 12:30 PM

Yes it will, but you better have to change descr_formations_ai file for something related for thar era because in this version I didn't include phalanx-oriented formations. I thought to make "Homeric Steel" for that period but haven't enough time for modding at the moment.

**Lusitanio** · December 30, 2020, 07:34 PM

Originally Posted by bitterhowl

Yes it will, but you better have to change descr_formations_ai file for something related for thar era because in this version I didn't include phalanx-oriented formations. I thought to make "Homeric Steel" for that period but haven't enough time for modding at the moment.

Doesn't seem to be working with EBII. I think it crashes with the campaign_script.

**bitterhowl** · March 21, 2021, 09:47 AM

Since reverse modding came to town it will be very useful to see things about attack/defend/anti_cavalry/anti_infantry settings, supported_factions line in descr_formations_ai and how formation's priority written and read by .exe

Those things are vital for final dealings with faction specific formations, or at least attack/defend specific formations. I posted video somewhere around this thread with 3 different stable formations on battlefield at once, so it's possible without any additional apps.

**jdofo** · March 26, 2021, 02:29 PM

Originally Posted by bitterhowl

Since reverse modding came to town it will be very useful to see things about attack/defend/anti_cavalry/anti_infantry settings, supported_factions line in descr_formations_ai and how formation's priority written and read by .exe

Those things are vital for final dealings with faction specific formations, or at least attack/defend specific formations. I posted video somewhere around this thread with 3 different stable formations on battlefield at once, so it's possible without any additional apps.

M2TW Engine Overhaul Project are far more active in their Discord server than in TWcenter, in case it's helpful

**CavalryCmdr** · June 01, 2021, 03:49 PM

Don't feel bad for just discovering this. Multiple formations have been enabled and disabled several times as the game has updated. Specifically the steam version, I know in 2016 multiple formations would ctd at battle start, but is now possible again. However priority tags do not seem to work now, it just seems to take the first applicable formation in formations_ai. Unfortunate, back in @ 2012 it would actually still use formation and unit priorities, which allowed the AI to adopt formations based on army make-up, like it did for Rome. I hope they put that back in, but just having multiple formations available is better than nothing.

**bitterhowl** · February 02, 2023, 12:35 AM

Finally I dealt with it, preparing now a beta version of my TrueGeneral project.

As usual, best solution is aurea mediocritas - use both .xml and scripted AI behaviour.

At the current moment it's possible to use functional formation for defender AI, when it's restricted to move for AI army before melee contact, while shooting is allowed for missile and artillery units.

If we use only frontal attack option for all classes of units in .xml then it seems formation will stay stable after unlocking army movement ability. But in this case we loose outflank and rear maneuver I think.

**bitterhowl** · February 11, 2023, 02:52 AM

Well, I've find a way to use custom formations in attack phase too. Here's an example of AI using "planned grinding" tactics, when AI has advance in ranged weapons and destroy player's army on a distance.

I use special formation with gap between first line of missile units and rest army.

**bitterhowl** · February 16, 2023, 07:04 AM

Well, looks like I'm done with any custom formation in attack phase. This is an example of "classic" Medieval knights charge tactics.

I see a very wide horizon of possibilities here. I can set custom tactics for any general depending on faction specific, personal traits and army composition. Looks like a break through, you know.

**bitterhowl** · February 19, 2023, 06:51 PM

Some phalanx study

**bitterhowl** · February 23, 2023, 07:18 PM

Specific knights charge formation for Khornites army in Call of Warhammer 1.5.1.

Phalanx in attack in EBII 2.3

**CavalryCmdr** · March 19, 2023, 04:20 PM

Ok, I've made some formations, when they work they're good, but causes CTD way too often. Is there something specific you can do to prevent this? Or is there a tutorial or something about how to avoid this?

**bitterhowl** · March 20, 2023, 05:03 AM

Well, this workaround took several years from me, as you can see from this thread. First I found an entire possibility of different formations existing. Then I tried to implement them into game without any scripting with only .xml and descr_formations_ai, have had many trial and error attempts and tons of nerves burnt when AI composed all units into one single line when I expect to get field formation that I composed for several days.

So now I find a solution when I decided to use advisor script method. I have default formation in descr_formations_ai_db, which will cover all situations and will not give CTD or single line. Then I write analyzer for AI and player's army content and when conditions match I script particular formation guaranteed I will not have CTD.

Formation is stable in this case because AI units are under script control. I decided to keep it under script control before main melee contact, so I won't get situation when AI will regroup army to default formation immediately after battle started.