Page 1 of 5 12345 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 118

Thread: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1

    Default Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...ng-near-cyprus

    Turkey warns oil companies against drilling near Cyprus

    President Erdoğan calls foreign energy firms ‘bandits of the sea’ for defying Ankara over hydrocarbon resources

    The Turkish president, Recep Tayyip Erdoğan, has warned foreign oil companies against energy exploration near Cyprus, describing those defying Ankara as “bandits of the sea” who would face a similar response as its foes in Syria.

    Drilling for hydrocarbon resources off the coast of Cyprus, an EU member, is hugely sensitive. The northern third of the island is occupied by Turkey, which invaded in 1974 in response to a coup aimed at uniting the island with Greece. The breakaway portion was declared to be the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus (TRNC), which is recognised only by Ankara. UN-backed efforts to reunify the island have failed.
    Do you believe that Erdogan's claims on Cypriot resources are founded in anything else but brute strength?
    Do you agree with the mentality of Turkey, as presented by Erdogan, ie, that "my neighbor's resources are also mine, because I have a bigger army"?

  2. #2
    nhytgbvfeco2's Avatar Protector Domesticus
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Israel
    Posts
    4,631

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    Quote Originally Posted by ioannis76 View Post
    who would face a similar response as its foes in Syria.
    Does he mean ISIS? if so, that just means that he'll buy oil from them, that's not too bad.


  3. #3

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    Quote Originally Posted by nhytgbvfeco2 View Post
    Does he mean ISIS? if so, that just means that he'll buy oil from them, that's not too bad.
    I hadn't thought of that possibility.

    But it seems that Turkey states that if its neighbours find oil, then Turkey should have a piece of the pie:

    https://www.in.gr/2018/12/17/english...cyprus-greece/

    Akar sticks by claim of ‘azure fatherland’ in the seas off of Cyprus Greece
    Turkey has often made clear that its perceived interests include the territorial waters and Exclusive Economic Zones (EEZs) of its two neighbours.
    I mean, that's textbook bully behaviour.

    It seems that Erdo and Turkey are getting increasingly desperate. It would be such fun if Turkey were to try something. Already, a part of the "Blue Oyster" (or something similar) exercise of the turkish military involved "landing on an island of a hostile country".

  4. #4

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    The matter of fact is that the EEZ areas around the island of Cyprus is disputed. Parts of it belong to the north, parts of it belong to the south, and parts of it belong to Turkey. Each party has its own interpretation of what's whose and what's not.

    Sigh, I just noticed that this is an article from November 2018, about 4 months old...
    The Armenian Issue
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/group.php?groupid=1930

    Cities: Skylines
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...ities-Skylines

    "We're nice mainly because we're rich and comfortable."

  5. #5
    alhoon's Avatar Moderator
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Chania, Greece
    Posts
    21,230

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    Quote Originally Posted by nhytgbvfeco2 View Post
    Does he mean ISIS? if so, that just means that he'll buy oil from them, that's not too bad.
    Nope, he means the Kurds, which he treats worse than ISIS (he doesn't buy oil from them, he bombs them).

    Quote Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun View Post
    The matter of fact is that the EEZ areas around the island of Cyprus is disputed. Parts of it belong to the north, parts of it belong to the south, and parts of it belong to Turkey. Each party has its own interpretation of what's whose and what's not.
    These areas are disputed because a bully disputes them. If Montenegro disputes Greek ownership of Kozani, it doesn't mean we have to postpone digging for coal there. Same thing with the idiotic statements of the Turkish government. I believe Erdogan knows he has no real argument there and just tries to drive away investors or drive the price lower.
    Since it's oil companies we're talking about here, which are guys without the most clean business practices, he plays a dangerous game that could potentially see him ending like the Shah of Persia or Saddam's invasion of Kuwait.
    DIE: Diversity, Inclusion, Equality (Pun on SJWs, I am not far-right)
    _______________________________________________________
    Beta-tester for Darthmod Empire, the default modification for Empire Total War that does not ask for your money behind patreon.

    Developer of Causa Belli submod for Darthmod, headed by Hammeredalways and a ton of other people.
    Developer of LtC: Random maps submod for Lands to Conquer (that brings a multitude of random maps and other features).

  6. #6

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    Quote Originally Posted by alhoon View Post
    These areas are disputed because a bully disputes them. If Montenegro disputes Greek ownership of Kozani, it doesn't mean we have to postpone digging for coal there. Same thing with the idiotic statements of the Turkish government. I believe Erdogan knows he has no real argument there and just tries to drive away investors or drive the price lower.
    Since it's oil companies we're talking about here, which are guys without the most clean business practices, he plays a dangerous game that could potentially see him ending like the Shah of Persia or Saddam's invasion of Kuwait.
    We don't really have a bully and a victim here. We have bullies. Both Turkey and Greece are bullies in their own mechanisms. Montenegro doesn't really have a border with Greece, nor has an issue with Greek sovereignty that pretty much requires bilateral agreements. Turkey, Northern Cyprus, Greece and Southern Cyprus do.
    The Armenian Issue
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/group.php?groupid=1930

    Cities: Skylines
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...ities-Skylines

    "We're nice mainly because we're rich and comfortable."

  7. #7

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    Quote Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun View Post
    We don't really have a bully and a victim here. We have bullies. Both Turkey and Greece are bullies in their own mechanisms. Montenegro doesn't really have a border with Greece, nor has an issue with Greek sovereignty that pretty much requires bilateral agreements. Turkey, Northern Cyprus, Greece and Southern Cyprus do.
    Yeah, that's not gonna fly. ExxonMobil doesn't recognize this "Northern Cyprus". Neither does anybody else.
    Quote Originally Posted by Enros View Post
    You don't seem to be familiar with how the burden of proof works in when discussing social justice. It's not like science where it lies on the one making the claim. If someone claims to be oppressed, they don't have to prove it.


  8. #8
    Aexodus's Avatar Persuasion>Coercion
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    NI
    Posts
    6,457
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    Quote Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun View Post
    We don't really have a bully and a victim here. We have bullies. Both Turkey and Greece are bullies in their own mechanisms. Montenegro doesn't really have a border with Greece, nor has an issue with Greek sovereignty that pretty much requires bilateral agreements. Turkey, Northern Cyprus, Greece and Southern Cyprus do.
    Don’t you mean Cyprus and Turkey

    The Islamisation of Cyprus under Erdogan is bad enough, without him having other plans for European territory.
    Last edited by Aexodus; March 07, 2019 at 10:08 AM.
    Patronised by Pontifex Maximus

    Quote Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun View Post
    Nope. There is nothing to suggest dramatically that his heart is giving out. His heart attack is a testament to how well he can recover from something like that.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    Quote Originally Posted by Aexodus View Post
    Don’t you mean Cyprus and Turkey
    Nope. I mean Turkey, Northern Cyprus, Greece and Southern Cyprus. These are the entities that are party to the current conflict.
    The Armenian Issue
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/group.php?groupid=1930

    Cities: Skylines
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...ities-Skylines

    "We're nice mainly because we're rich and comfortable."

  10. #10
    Aexodus's Avatar Persuasion>Coercion
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    NI
    Posts
    6,457
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    What is Turkey’s claim to Cyprus POVG?

    The ‘state’ you are referring to is a de-facto administrator of the Northern portion of Cyprus. Turkey first established an admin in 1974 after the invasion to allow them to occupy the region. There are still Turkish troops stationed in Cyprus.

    Northern Cyprus does exist, legally, and de facto.
    De facto, yes, de jure or legally, no. Northern Cyprus is not a party to any negotiations on Cyprus.

    The Islamic State of Syria and the Levant exists too. Northern Cyprus has the same legality as ISIL/ISIS.

    And, if Northern Cyprus is an independent sovereign nation, why is Turkey involved? Why does Erdogan care about oil drilling? Are you sure it isn’t just a Turkish occupation?

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autonomous_Turkish_Cypriot_Administration
    Patronised by Pontifex Maximus

    Quote Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun View Post
    Nope. There is nothing to suggest dramatically that his heart is giving out. His heart attack is a testament to how well he can recover from something like that.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    Quote Originally Posted by Aexodus View Post
    What is Turkey’s claim to Cyprus POVG?
    The ‘state’ you are referring to is a de-facto administrator of the Northern portion of Cyprus. Turkey first established an admin in 1974 after the invasion to allow them to occupy the region. There are still Turkish troops stationed in Cyprus.
    De facto, yes, de jure or legally, no. Northern Cyprus is not a party to any negotiations on Cyprus.
    The Islamic State of Syria and the Levant exists too. Northern Cyprus has the same legality as ISIL/ISIS.
    And, if Northern Cyprus is an independent sovereign nation, why is Turkey involved? Why does Erdogan care about oil drilling? Are you sure it isn’t just a Turkish occupation?
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autonomous_Turkish_Cypriot_Administration
    Turkey has no claim over Cyprus. Northern Cyprus does. An administration was set up in 1974, named Autonomous Turkish Cypriot Administration, to administer the region under Turkish control while peace negotiations continued as the purpose at this point was to bring the island back to the situation in 1960. A year later leaders of Northern and Southern Cyprus, respectively Denktaş and Clerides, signed a population exchange treaty under UN supervision. As negotiations did not promise a quick deal Turkish Federated State of Cyprus was established in 1975 as part of the Republic of Cyprus, not as a separate state as at the time they were still hoping to remain as a single state. Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus was only unilaterally established as a separate state in 1983, 8 years after failed negotiations in countless proposals.

    To say that Northern Cyprus is as much of a state as the ISIL is quite an insult and an utterly idiotic statement. Northern Cyprus may only be recognized as a sovereign state by Turkey, but it is recognized as a constituent state by Organisation of Islamic Cooperation (OIC), as an observer by the Parliamentary Assembly of the Council of Europe (PACE) and the Economic Cooperation Organization (ECO), as well as the International Federation of Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies (IFRC). Its a state that's been in existence for decades with its own constitution and elections. It's been taking part in negotiations for decades now. In the end, it will be the signature of the president of the Northern Cyprus that will be on that peace agreement.

    Northern Cyprus simply relies on Turkey militarily just like Southern Cyprus relies on Greece. Just like there are troops from Turkey on Northern Cyprus, there are troops from Greece in Southern Cyprus. In fact, the invasion of the island happened days before any Turkish soldier from Turkey set foot on the island. As part of their effort to conduct a coup and ethnically cleanse the island, the Greek officers from Greece conducted the coup. Makarios himself, addressing the UN Security Council, called their action an invasion. The same Greek force, ELDYK, that took place in the coup against Makarios and the ethnic violence, continues to exist on Southern Cyprus. Perhaps, the only part of Cyprus that is not under occupation is the British military bases...
    The Armenian Issue
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/group.php?groupid=1930

    Cities: Skylines
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...ities-Skylines

    "We're nice mainly because we're rich and comfortable."

  12. #12
    alhoon's Avatar Moderator
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Chania, Greece
    Posts
    21,230

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    Quote Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun View Post
    Turkey has no claim over Cyprus. Northern Cyprus does. An administration was set up in 1974, named Autonomous Turkish Cypriot Administration, to administer the region under Turkish control while peace negotiations continued as the purpose at this point was to bring the island back to the situation in 1960.
    Right. Meanwhile Turks launched Attila 2 during those "peace negotiations".


    Quote Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun View Post
    Northern Cyprus simply relies on Turkey militarily just like Southern Cyprus relies on Greece.
    The Republic of Cyprus, the only recognized and legal authority in the island of Cyprus can invite whomever they want to help them, it's their country. Since they didn't ask for the Turkish troops, those troops are there illegally. They also have the right to invite people and theoretically, they can settle them in the occupied part. I remind you that Cyprus entered the EU as a single whole country. Turkey is occupying part of EU.

    The comparison with ISIS is not completely accurate since ISIS is a gathering of extremists and zealots that grabbed some land. Cyprus situation is closer to the one with Crimea - although there I support the Russian annexation since Crimea was theirs till Stalin decided to hand it to Ukraine in the 50s and also Russians didn't expel 1/4th of Ukranians out of Crimea nor they killed tens of thousands of civilians to cause them to flee so they could help a population exchange to be accepted after it has been done de-facto.
    DIE: Diversity, Inclusion, Equality (Pun on SJWs, I am not far-right)
    _______________________________________________________
    Beta-tester for Darthmod Empire, the default modification for Empire Total War that does not ask for your money behind patreon.

    Developer of Causa Belli submod for Darthmod, headed by Hammeredalways and a ton of other people.
    Developer of LtC: Random maps submod for Lands to Conquer (that brings a multitude of random maps and other features).

  13. #13

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    Quote Originally Posted by alhoon View Post
    That is false. You make it appear as if Turkey launched a second operation during those 9 years of negotiations. That did not happen. The first operation started on July 20 and took about 3 days. The fighting did not stop on July 24. Clashes in various locations continued. Attila 2 operation was launched on August 14 and it too took about 3 days. The fighting on Cyprus happened between July 20 and August 18. Even then, a Greek sniper killed the ambassador from USA, Rodger Davies, during an anti-USA demonstration by the Greek Cypriots.


    Quote Originally Posted by alhoon View Post
    The Republic of Cyprus, the only recognized and legal authority in the island of Cyprus can invite whomever they want to help them, it's their country. Since they didn't ask for the Turkish troops, those troops are there illegally. They also have the right to invite people and theoretically, they can settle them in the occupied part. I remind you that Cyprus entered the EU as a single whole country. Turkey is occupying part of EU.

    The comparison with ISIS is not completely accurate since ISIS is a gathering of extremists and zealots that grabbed some land. Cyprus situation is closer to the one with Crimea - although there I support the Russian annexation since Crimea was theirs till Stalin decided to hand it to Ukraine in the 50s and also Russians didn't expel 1/4th of Ukranians out of Crimea nor they killed tens of thousands of civilians to cause them to flee so they could help a population exchange to be accepted after it has been done de-facto.
    Except, Makarios, the president of Cyprus at the time, did request the Greek contingent from Greece to leave the island. The Greek response was to go forward with the coup. Greeks were the first invasion force on the island. In such a case, under the guarantee agreement that Turkey is a party to, Turkey does not require a request from Cyprus to intervene.

    Southern Cyprus entering EU without reaching a solution is a complete travesty. It was nothing more than an idiotic and biased move on EU's part which defies EU principles all together. Southern Cyprus entered EU having a claim over the whole island without people in the north having any say in it.

    Expelling 1/4th of Greeks from the north of Cyprus sounds much better than what Greeks tried to do, to expel all Turks from entirety of the island. Trying to argue that somehow Turkey caused this debacle is to ignore historical context. Turkey didn't kill tens of thousands of civilians either. The total casualties of the conflict summed up from both sides barely pass 10 thousand. The population exchange did not just happen on paper because Turkey tried to somehow document a reality it caused. Population from both sides were living on the other side. About 50 thousand Turks from the south moved to north while certain Greek villages, with total population over 10 thousand, chose to remain on the north. The population exchange was done under the Third Vienna Agreement between Clerides and Denktaş.
    The Armenian Issue
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/group.php?groupid=1930

    Cities: Skylines
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...ities-Skylines

    "We're nice mainly because we're rich and comfortable."

  14. #14
    nhytgbvfeco2's Avatar Protector Domesticus
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Israel
    Posts
    4,631

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    Quote Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun View Post
    In such a case, under the guarantee agreement that Turkey is a party to, Turkey does not require a request from Cyprus to intervene.
    Yep, under the guarantee agreement Turkey is allowed to intervene to restore the status quo on the island. Attempting to force the state to become a federation is not however restoring status quo, but rather a breach of the treaty. So is establishing a puppet state on the island. Turkey's response to Cyprus breaching the treaty was.. breaching the treaty.
    Quote Originally Posted by article IV of the treaty
    Article IVIn the event of a breach of the provisions of the present Treaty, Greece, Turkey and the United Kingdom undertake to consult together with respect to the representations or measures necessary to ensure observance of those provisions.

    In so far as common or concerted action may not prove possible, each of the three guaranteeing Powers reserves the right to take action with the sole aim of re-establishing the state of affairs created by the present Treaty.



  15. #15
    alhoon's Avatar Moderator
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Chania, Greece
    Posts
    21,230

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    Quote Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun View Post
    That is false. You make it appear as if Turkey launched a second operation during those 9 years of negotiations. That did not happen.
    No, I make it appear as if Turkey launched Attila 2 during the peace negotiations in Geneva in August.
    DIE: Diversity, Inclusion, Equality (Pun on SJWs, I am not far-right)
    _______________________________________________________
    Beta-tester for Darthmod Empire, the default modification for Empire Total War that does not ask for your money behind patreon.

    Developer of Causa Belli submod for Darthmod, headed by Hammeredalways and a ton of other people.
    Developer of LtC: Random maps submod for Lands to Conquer (that brings a multitude of random maps and other features).

  16. #16
    Odenat's Avatar Senator
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    City of world's desire
    Posts
    1,463

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    There would be no such problem at Cyprus if Greek Cypriots accepted the UN brokered peace deal at 2004 but Greeks refused the peace deal and voted against it. Today Cyprus would be a single state and a member of the EU. After the referandum, UN asked for the lifting of the embargo to the Northern Cyprus, saying "if the Greek Cypriots are ready to share power and prosperity with the Turkish Cypriots in a federal structure based on political equality, this needs to be demonstrated, not just by word, but by action”.

    And now the same GREEKS who refused the peace deal accuse Turkey of defending Northern Cyprus economic rights. Please tell me, are Greek Cypriots ready to share power and prosperity with the Turkish Cypriots in a federal structure based on political equality?

  17. #17
    alhoon's Avatar Moderator
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Chania, Greece
    Posts
    21,230

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    The Turkish Cypriots, yes. The thousands of muslim settlers? No and they shouldn't.
    DIE: Diversity, Inclusion, Equality (Pun on SJWs, I am not far-right)
    _______________________________________________________
    Beta-tester for Darthmod Empire, the default modification for Empire Total War that does not ask for your money behind patreon.

    Developer of Causa Belli submod for Darthmod, headed by Hammeredalways and a ton of other people.
    Developer of LtC: Random maps submod for Lands to Conquer (that brings a multitude of random maps and other features).

  18. #18
    Aexodus's Avatar Persuasion>Coercion
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    NI
    Posts
    6,457
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    Didn’t the 2004 deal give Turks and Greeks 50/50 representatives in parliament? Sounds unfair.
    Patronised by Pontifex Maximus

    Quote Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun View Post
    Nope. There is nothing to suggest dramatically that his heart is giving out. His heart attack is a testament to how well he can recover from something like that.

  19. #19

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    Quote Originally Posted by Aexodus View Post
    Didn’t the 2004 deal give Turks and Greeks 50/50 representatives in parliament? Sounds unfair.
    Not exactly. The new state would have a senate and a chamber. The senate, the upper house, would have 24/24 representation. The chamber's 48 members would be based on population percentages with no fewer than 12 Turkish Cypriots. A simple majority would be required to pass any legislation in both houses. Executive power was to be exercised by a presidential council that neither side could have less than 1/3 representation. What the plan did was to put safeguards in place to make sure legislations are not passed at the expense of the Turkish Cypriots, though it still allows the Greeks to do whatever they want if they can win over a single Turkish Cypriot in the chamber.
    The Armenian Issue
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/group.php?groupid=1930

    Cities: Skylines
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...ities-Skylines

    "We're nice mainly because we're rich and comfortable."

  20. #20
    alhoon's Avatar Moderator
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Chania, Greece
    Posts
    21,230

    Default Re: Erdogan warns oil companies against drilling in... Cyprus

    And the president would be rotating between Greek and Turkish Cypriots.
    In a Greek island that was 80% Greek before the invasion, it is unfathomable to give half a chamber to a minority that was supported by a hostile and illegal regime just to appease that regime. There are other ways to make sure that there's no oppressive legislation. Namely... the EU. Do you think the EU would allow Greek Cypriots to pass oppressive measures? No, they wouldn't.

    Quote Originally Posted by PointOfViewGun View Post
    though it still allows the Greeks to do whatever they want if they can win over a single Turkish Cypriot in the chamber.
    You mean, it allows the Turkish Cypriots to do most of what they want in the chamber, since Greek Cypriots are very unlikely to be united while the muslim members would be. All it would take is one SYRIZA-like senator to flip and there goes one of the oldest Christian States.
    DIE: Diversity, Inclusion, Equality (Pun on SJWs, I am not far-right)
    _______________________________________________________
    Beta-tester for Darthmod Empire, the default modification for Empire Total War that does not ask for your money behind patreon.

    Developer of Causa Belli submod for Darthmod, headed by Hammeredalways and a ton of other people.
    Developer of LtC: Random maps submod for Lands to Conquer (that brings a multitude of random maps and other features).

Page 1 of 5 12345 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •