View Poll Results: What should we do with the last faction slot?

Voters
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  • Use it for a new faction

    48 37.80%
  • Use it for scripting purposes

    78 61.42%
  • Not use it at all, leave it forever open

    1 0.79%
  • Something else entirely, not listed above!

    0 0%
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Thread: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

  1. #1
    QuintusSertorius's Avatar EBII Hod Carrier
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    Default [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    This is a perennially thorny topic, including within the team because it's a zero-sum game. Something that is chosen means something else can't be, given our limitations.

    So bearing in mind that we are not going to radically alter the map, and can't add any new cultures, what do you think we should do with the last faction slot?

    I've included a poll of the broad options - note we don't feel bound to accept whatever this thread produces by way of majority, it's just a point of interest.

  2. #2
    Genava's Avatar Ordinarius
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    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    What will be the main asset to have a faction only for scripting ?
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  3. #3
    QuintusSertorius's Avatar EBII Hod Carrier
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    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    Quote Originally Posted by Genava View Post
    What will be the main asset to have a faction only for scripting ?
    We could do much more sophisticated things than are possible with the existing Rebel faction alone. It would have full CAI (rather than a stunted version of it) and wider scripting possibilities (even small things like being able to spawn navies - you can't do that with the Rebels).

  4. #4

    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    Hello, long term silent EB stalker here.

    Use it for scripting!
    With your talent, you guys can do wonders with it

  5. #5

    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    Kinda torn. I don't know fully what you can do with it if you leave it for scripting. But then...an Illyrian or third NW African faction would also add a lot to gameplay.

  6. #6
    isa0005's Avatar Content Staff
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    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    Scripting!

  7. #7

    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    Quote Originally Posted by isa0005 View Post
    Scripting!
    Yeah...you are probably right. Considering the amount of scripted rebel attacks and events in EBII, using the faction slot for scripting would affect far more factions than adding another faction somewhere on the map.

  8. #8

    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    I didn't know about the possibility of that faction slot allowing for a better overall "Rebels" faction. Hmm. Before this knowledge, I'd certainly love to see an Illyrian facton, but honestly, if the extra scripting capabilities can ensure a richer experience throughout the map, and I trust you guys to do amazing things with it, that wins out, really.

  9. #9

    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    voted 'Use it for scripting purposes' but with the caveat it doesnt undermine the overall game stability. just had one of those unpleasant reminders of it as my game crushed on the end screen just when i thought i was done with the pesky KH.

  10. #10
    Lusitanio's Avatar Content Staff
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    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    In the end its two things:

    Using it for a Faction:

    It would probably mean creating a Ilyrian Faction or another in the regions between the Boii and the Getai. Why that area of the game you ask? Because from all the testing, it is clear that that region is the most problematic in relation to expansion, since its full of rebel cities and both the Boii and the Getai rarely expand there. So adding another faction there would greatly help. Besides that, adding the Ilyrian would mean more fun for the Helenic factions who would have another enemy to combat and would give the Roman players a early enemy (because they conquer Taras pretty quickly and the closer enemy becomes Carthage but thats it for them since the Celtic factions are too far away).

    Using it for scripting reasons:

    This brings other concerns, will the current rebel faction be fully eliminated or will it function together with this faction? In a long term it could be good because it would divide the rebel cities into two factions and make way for more expansion for the other factions. Also, if we keep both factions, what would happen when a city goes rebel?
    It would also mean that players would be able to make peace with them and trade, but if they enter at war with that faction, they would have a more agressive faction fighting them and would have like half the campaign map cities at war against them?
    Other than that, what more would this new faction be capable of doing to improve the game?

  11. #11

    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    While the hypothesis of having a new faction is always a tempting idea, if using the last slot could make the Eleutheroi more active, better simulate rebellions, civil wars, invasions by factions outside of the map (Mauryans, Yezhui, etc), historical events like tribal migrations, etc, without compromising stability... I'm all for it

  12. #12
    alex33's Avatar Ordinarius
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    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    I think it would be a waste to use the last slot for scripting while we can represent another interessting faction. Imho we should use the slot for something illyrian to keep epirus and Macedonia at bay, challange the romans and the getai a bit. They would bring something completley new to the table and make a portion of the map that is only used to get some special units interessting. While scripting is great and all I personally really don't think it should be wasted for another unplayable faction that the AI strugles with. I personally don't want to play 90 % of the game against "non" factions.



  13. #13
    Morrowgan's Avatar Ordinarius
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    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    With so many possible new factions it'd be a waste to use it only for scripting purposes IMHO
    Member of the Beyond Skyrim Project

  14. #14

    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    Torn between Illyrian faction (Ardiaei) and scripting. I think we need to know more about what would happen with real rebels, how would that faction make sense if it'd be spread across many different enclaves on the map, etc.

  15. #15

    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    I would use the last faction slot for scripting, and it could also open in the future the possibility for faction submods (like the one you did with Epirus/Syracuse).

    However i'm going to say it now: i think there are factions that are too similar or too close to the edge of the map to be presented properly. I'm talking about the Aedui/Averni, which made sense in EB1 but now we have the Boii and a likely upcoming belgic tribe - why should two celtic factions that are an exact copy of each other occupy a faction slot?. Takashila is a faction that lives on the edge on the map and relies on rebel scripting to represent threats from outside, it's natural eastern border isn't well represented at all due to limitations of the M2TW engine. A faction like Epirus seems to exist only to be an alt story device for a Pyrrhos storyline, the game could start with him dead or being eleutheroi, and little would change - Epirus wasn't a major power at all.

    Basically what i'm saying is that current selection is what it is, but i don't agree with the selection being the best for everythihng, some areas of the game are going to lack due to choices, no matter what. Do each ancient people need a faction to represent them? Because if it is so, then many aren't included - illyrians, iberians (the lusitanians are close but not the same), italiotes, medes/persians, thracians, nubians, etc.

    So in the end it is up to the dev team, and there is little point in discussing this. Each person has their own interest and i think EB2 did a very good job at making each place of the world map populated enough so that the players can interact and learn about the ancient cultures there. Do i think that factions could have been picked differently, and by doing so explore areas that are currently underdeveloped? Yes. Do i think that some factions are stretched to be represented properly due to gameplay limitations? Yes.
    Last edited by Hellenikon; December 14, 2018 at 05:03 PM.

  16. #16

    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    Assuming that Faction 29 is Belgae, I went for new faction, cos I think we need a Thracian or Illyrian faction to occupy that space.

  17. #17
    Genava's Avatar Ordinarius
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    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    I'm talking about the Aedui/Averni, which made sense in EB1 but now we have the Boii and a likely upcoming belgic tribe - why should two celtic factions that are an exact copy of each other occupy a faction slot?
    I kinda agree with this. The Aedui vs Arverni narrative is based on the Gallic War, which is incredible late for the game. Moreover, they are closely related by their proximity. Both ended with an oppida civilization and with a magistrate government. I would prefer a Cisalpine or a Balkanic celtic faction over the Aedui.
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  18. #18

    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lusitanio View Post
    In the end its two things:
    Who said it couldn't be both?
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  19. #19
    Lusitanio's Avatar Content Staff
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    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kull View Post
    Who said it couldn't be both?
    Well, It would be another faction and would be used for scripted reasons, but what I meant was either a particular faction like Ilyria, Thracians, etc or a faction to do the same as the rebels currently do with some more things x)

  20. #20
    demagogos nicator's Avatar Domesticus
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    Default Re: [30th Faction slot] What would you like to see?

    I am well aware of the advantages of haveing faction slot left for scripting purposes and although, I am tempted to see what wonders you would be able to do with it, my vote is still for adding new faction, EB2 map is geographicly huge and it is in my humble oppinion far from overpopulated. I see no problem in the fact that you could not add any new culture to the game. You have alredy proven that you are capable of making every faction unique despite sharing culture and units with the other factions (see celts, hellenes, (celt-)iberians).

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