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Thread: Any good references for Roman Army composition?

  1. #1
    Civis
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    Icon5 Any good references for Roman Army composition?

    I keep getting conflicting reports on the internet: e.g. The damn italian wiki contradicts the english wiki!!!
    Any help would be appreciated.
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  2. #2
    QuintusSertorius's Avatar EBII Hod Carrier
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    Default Re: Any good references for Roman Army composition?

    Have you checked out the historical compositions thread?

  3. #3
    Civis
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    Default Re: Any good references for Roman Army composition?

    I have,
    and I’m not convinced.
    The numbers just don’t match up,
    and some concessions are made for gameplay
    instead of history.
    Is there some repository that the EB team has found reliable?
    I’m especially anal about proportions and want them to match up...
    Last edited by OJ33DA; December 13, 2018 at 05:37 PM.
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  4. #4
    Laetus
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    Default Re: Any good references for Roman Army composition?

    During my Rome campaign I have problem with passive enemies especially with Carthage.
    Do you have any ideas how I can "help" them to have more fun?
    Will help if I start new game on campaign level very hard? Until now I always played H/M.
    Or maybe I will be in defensive for 20-30 turns?

  5. #5
    Lusitanio's Avatar Content Staff
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    Default Re: Any good references for Roman Army composition?

    Quote Originally Posted by Manivs View Post
    During my Rome campaign I have problem with passive enemies especially with Carthage.
    Do you have any ideas how I can "help" them to have more fun?
    Will help if I start new game on campaign level very hard? Until now I always played H/M.
    Or maybe I will be in defensive for 20-30 turns?
    Start a new campaign, VH/H (take care that VH campaigns up automatic battles(, change AIGeneral Hitpoints to 3 on all levels (makes battles harder but still realistic) and wait some good turns before starting a war with Carthage, even still, they aren't hard to defeat by a Roman player.

  6. #6
    Civis
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    Default Re: Any good references for Roman Army composition?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lusitanio View Post
    During my Rome campaign I have problem with passive enemies especially with Carthage.
    Do you have any ideas how I can "help" them to have more fun?
    Will help if I start new game on campaign level very hard? Until now I always played H/M.
    Or maybe I will be in defensive for 20-30 turns?
    Start a new campaign, VH/H (take care that VH campaigns up automatic battles(, change AIGeneral Hitpoints to 3 on all levels (makes battles harder but still realistic) and wait some good turns before starting a war with Carthage, even still, they aren't hard to defeat by a Roman player.
    Lol, please keep on topic.
    I just want a reliable site that has info to help make my Roman armies (Camilian, Polybian, Marian) historically proportional.
    Any help would be appreciated.
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  7. #7

    Default Re: Any good references for Roman Army composition?

    Just in case you haven't seen this, this old guide is still pretty useful

  8. #8

    Default Re: Any good references for Roman Army composition?

    I usually just put in the 60 scorpio's per legion Vegetius talks about to fill the gap

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Any good references for Roman Army composition?

    Quote Originally Posted by cowrecked View Post
    Just in case you haven't seen this, this old guide is still pretty useful
    Thanks, I’ve see that guide and it’s good for the info but the unit composition is somewhat outdated—it’s for OG EB not EB2.

    I’ll crunch the numbers and try to get a moderately accurate 2-legion full stack army using vanilla stats

    Anyways, can someone let me know if this following information is correct:
    - There are 4800 soldiers to a Marian legion, 9600 for two
    - the First Cohort equaled the numbers of each other cohort (i.e. 480 men) until the Augustean era
    - the Antesignani were a detachment unit (first rank) recruited from within the 10 cohorts
    - Equites Consulares (Bodyguard unit) were a piece of the 600 Equites in a Consular army
    - Equites Legionis were equal in number to the Equites of past (i.e. 600 for 2 legions)
    - Evocati Cohorts were soldiers placed within the 10 cohorts, not an additional unit/formation
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  10. #10
    QuintusSertorius's Avatar EBII Hod Carrier
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    Default Re: Any good references for Roman Army composition?

    Surely you mean two legion plus two alae stack?

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Any good references for Roman Army composition?

    Quote Originally Posted by QuintusSertorius View Post
    Surely you mean two legion plus two alae stack?
    I guess this means my information is correct?
    I’m working on two versions:
    one for 2-legion full stack and one for 4-legion full stack
    I’ll release my findings and my adjustments into the wild once I’m finished
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  12. #12
    QuintusSertorius's Avatar EBII Hod Carrier
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    Default Re: Any good references for Roman Army composition?

    Quote Originally Posted by OJ33DA View Post
    I guess this means my information is correct?
    I’m working on two versions:
    one for 2-legion full stack and one for 4-legion full stack
    I’ll release my findings and my adjustments into the wild once I’m finished
    A proper Roman army is comprised of two legions and two alae. It is 50% Roman and 50% allied. If it only has Roman legions in it, it is not a historically accurate composition, for any era.

  13. #13
    Laetus
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    Default Re: Any good references for Roman Army composition?

    Sorry, my mistake. I was thinking I'm writing in main forum.

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Any good references for Roman Army composition?

    Quote Originally Posted by QuintusSertorius View Post
    A proper Roman army is comprised of two legions and two alae. It is 50% Roman and 50% allied. If it only has Roman legions in it, it is not a historically accurate composition, for any era.
    Well yeah but the player could always rp by having one stack be roman and another 2 half stacks covering the flanks, though I admit this is an imperfect solution since Ai-controlled armies are absolute buns.

    Anyways, I’m experimenting with getting 2 legions + 2 ala (or 4 legions) to fit to scale while still being divisible by four (for single legion armies). Will report when the work has been completed.
    Last edited by OJ33DA; December 18, 2018 at 03:51 PM.
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  15. #15
    QuintusSertorius's Avatar EBII Hod Carrier
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    Default Re: Any good references for Roman Army composition?

    Quote Originally Posted by OJ33DA View Post
    Well yeah but the player could always rp by having one stack be roman and another 2 half stacks covering the flanks
    There's no "but" or "rp", the whole point of this thread was supposedly that you wanted historically accurate Roman army compositions. Now you're quibbling over one of the fundamental elements, that half the army wasn't even Roman.
    Last edited by QuintusSertorius; December 18, 2018 at 03:54 PM.

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Any good references for Roman Army composition?

    Quote Originally Posted by QuintusSertorius View Post
    There's no "but" or "rp", the whole point of this thread was supposedly that you wanted historically accurate Roman army compositions. Now you're quibbling over one of the fundamental elements, that half the army wasn't even Roman.
    No more quibble. My heart has accepted that 4 legions in a stack must be the way to go.

    Quick Question: Must Praetorian armies (Camilian, Polybian, Marian) be led by a General, or is a Captain fine?
    Second Question: Are auxiliaries necessary for historical Marian era depiction?
    Third: Did Marian armies field allied/auxiliary “ala” (as in, whole allied legions) like they did in the Camilian/Polybian days?
    Fourth: Did a Double-Strength Consular Army also have double the “ala?”
    Last edited by OJ33DA; December 18, 2018 at 05:45 PM.
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