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Thread: About the Total War Player

  1. #21
    AnthoniusII's Avatar Μέγαc Δομέστικοc
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    Default Re: About the Total War Player

    Quote Originally Posted by Star_destroyer View Post
    Druwind that is what eventually turned me away from DEI and europa barborum they went overboard with the educational factor I want to play a game not a college thesis


    RTRVII and Roma surrectum 2 still provide some vanilla game play elements which also somehow boost the immersion factor anyway.


    The key to a successful mod in my mind is to not completely reinvent the wheel.
    Quote Originally Posted by Abdülmecid I View Post
    Well, it depends on your personal preferences. If you are a fan of chaotic engagements and spectacular visual effects, then Warhammer is the best option, where you can deploy giants, mammoths, kamikaze goblins and dinosaurs riding... dinosaurs. If you like something more relaxed, basically a long series of battles briefly interrupted with meaningless campaign breaks, then you should choose everything from Empire to Attila. Keep in mind that Rome II still suffers from a variety of bugs, but Empire, even if you adore the period, is practically unplayable, unless you install a mod. Last but not least, Medieval II and Rome I are not only by far the most moddable games, but are also very feature-rich, in what concerns immersive mechanics. For example, the late-game challenge is provided by the "distance-to-capital" mechanic, which forbids irrational expansion, due to low public order and lack of profitability. Granted, it's not as cartoon-fun as suddenly everyone declaring war against you for no apparent reason in Shogun or the Huns indefinitely spamming hordes, until you kill their king thrice or more. In my opinion, the older games are much more satisfying, from a more realistic trait-system and more coherent family tree to more atmospheric UI and cleverly integrated logistics, but I recognize the fact that, for example, the lack of auto-replenishment, albeit objectively more immersive, can pose difficulties to excited video-game players.
    I would agree with Abdul's thesis in this. Its always a matter of taste of gameplay.
    Answering though to Star_destroyer we must define " reinvent the wheel"phrase. Whe it comes to historical games we also have different points of view depending of how we view History.
    TW games and their abillity to simulate ancient battles making the player that he is participating in them was their biggest feature. Other games offered better diplomacy or other features but NEVER participating in battles.
    Now...History may be for someone a banch of knights that unstopably clean a path through thousands of enemies without many losses. Histor for others though may be a banch of knights that will be desimated by peasants if they have no room to manuevre! That is where mods come in to the sceen offering "history" in many prospectives for all tastes but...there is always a but. Not all historical mods can simulate (as possible ofcourse) the accuracy that TW games player seek from the dawn of modding! You may be too young but for me it was just yesterday when Medieval Total Realism Age of Ambition apeared ...Its a pity that that mod did not have the available tools we have today 12 years later! Otherwise no official TW game would even dare to compare with that mod!! Personaly i involved to modding trying to use Medieval Total War 2/Kingdoms game engine as an educational tool.
    What educational tool means? Following the instructions of REAL historians and trying to squiz them in the limitations a game has.
    Neutral position of how a faction portays in game (we are not here to judge history but to show it and let the player live it by playing it).
    Realistic portay of units (again with muc help of historians REAL HISTORIANS), that means no unit that defeat all the others and make battles as chaotic as it gets to offer the feeling to the player how those battles were just like the last decade historical movies try to do. There is no need for "blood DLC" to achive that goal!
    All it needs is a chaos that player must go to the "ground" find his men and give the right order to win or lose (because defeats give us lessons).
    Can you easily recognise the Rus Vikings from the Normans ? For some that is the meaning of the phrase "reinvent the wheel"...

    In the end its all about taste ...
    TGC in order to continue its development seak one or more desicated scripters to put our campaign scripts mess to an order plus to create new events and create the finall missing factions recruitment system. In return TGC will give permision to those that will help to use its material stepe by step. The result will be a fully released TGC plus many mods that will benefit TGC's material.
    Despite the mod is dead does not mean that anyone can use its material
    read this to avoid misunderstandings.

    IWTE tool master and world txt one like this, needed inorder to release TGC 1.0 official to help TWC to survive.
    Adding MARKA HORSES in your mod and create new varietions of them. Tutorial RESTORED.


  2. #22
    Incendio's Avatar Semisalis
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    Default Re: About the Total War Player

    Quote Originally Posted by Steph View Post
    I'm a software engineer, and was good in science, but I was also very good in history and liked it a lot. At some point, I wonder if I should go for history or science. and I decided it was better to have good income as an enginner and have history as a hoby than the opposite.
    But my children are happy; they can learn a lot more with me than with their history teacher at school . So they have good marks.
    Can't understand you better. I am a Chemical Engineer and while I was not truly good in history I have history as a hobby as well. My favourite Total War game would be in the very first place Empire Total War if it was not buggy in my computers. 18th century warfare is my favourite period of history, followed very closely by 17th century and 19th century. Currently I am spending less time playing and more time reading books. This is the last book I ordered and I want to start reading it soon:



    I wish I could read french because I found really interesting military memories written in this period. I would also like to read Maurice de Saxe and fortunately there is a book translated into english: Reveries on the Art of War. I am also interested in the Eastern Warfare of this period: Russo-Turkish Wars and War of the Polish Succession.

  3. #23
    Kyffhäuser's Avatar Libertus
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    Default Re: About the Total War Player

    To me familiarity implies a life time of research, intimacy with primary sources, and lots of sleuthing. I just watch Lindybeige for warfare stuff.
    Last edited by Kyffhäuser; February 13, 2019 at 04:47 PM.

  4. #24

    Default Re: About the Total War Player

    Quote Originally Posted by Incendio View Post
    Which kind of people play Total War games? Are they familiar with military history? Before I purchased Empire Total War I had already read two books covering naval warfare in 17th century and 18th century (Four Days Battle of 1666 and Trafalgar campaign of 1805). Before purchasing Napoleon Total War, I had already seen some documentaries about Waterloo, Austerlitz, Borodino and read some articles about Nile Battle and a book of Napoleonic Wars. I admit that I have Shogun 2 but still I have to read some books about the period.

    In other strategy games/tactical simulators I know about people with very good knowledge of the military period of the game, just as an example, in Scourge of War Waterloo there are players with outstanding knowledge of Napoleonic Warfare, even some of them knows every single detail of Waterloo battle. Regarding the naval tactical/strategy simulators "Jutland" and "Distant Guns" there are players with good knowledge about the naval warfare of the period, I read some stuff of naval warfare in Russo-Japanese war.

    Do you think Total War players, at least those who play historical titles, have a good knowledge of the military history of the periods they are playing?
    Druwind that is what eventually turned me away from DEI and europa barborum they went overboard with the educational factor I want to play a game not a college thesis
    Last edited by z3n; October 21, 2020 at 04:59 PM. Reason: removed unsolicited advertisement

  5. #25

    Default About the Total War Player

    Which kind of people play Total War games? Are they familiar with military history? Before I purchased Empire Total War I had already read two books covering naval warfare in 17th century and 18th century (Four Days Battle of 1666 and Trafalgar campaign of 1805). Before purchasing Napoleon Total War, I had already seen some documentaries about Waterloo, Austerlitz, Borodino and read some articles about Nile Battle and a book of Napoleonic Wars. I admit that I have Shogun 2 but still I have to read some books about the period.

    In other strategy games/tactical simulators I know about people with very good knowledge of the military period of the game, just as an example, in Scourge of War Waterloo there are players with outstanding knowledge of Napoleonic Warfare, even some of them knows every single detail of Waterloo battle. Regarding the naval tactical/strategy simulators "Jutland" and "Distant Guns" there are players with good knowledge about the naval warfare of the period, I read some stuff of naval warfare in Russo-Japanese war.

    Do you think Total War players, at least those who play historical titles, have a good knowledge of the military history of the periods they are playing?

  6. #26
    alhoon's Avatar Comes Rei Militaris
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    Default Re: About the Total War Player

    Nope, I definitely don't think that the majority have a good grasp of military history. I include myself in that majority. I learned about the existence of many many things through games. I read about them AFTER I found out about them in games, but first I figured they existed from games.

    Also, please keep in mind that Total War games are not military tactical simulations, they are first and foremost games. I.e. in ETW you start in the 18th century but you don't have first rates even as England. Etc etc.
    alhoon is not a member of the infamous Hoons: a (fictional) nazi-sympathizer KKK clan. Of course, no Hoon would openly admit affiliation to the uninitiated.
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  7. #27
    Dismounted Feudal Knight's Avatar my horse for a unicode
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    Default Re: About the Total War Player

    Total War is the arcade simulator of strategy games. It's a disparaging take, but while it has the best (and only) campaign and battle blend, consider that both across every entry are pretty superficial to more dedicated counterparts in either field. That combination is what gives it substance. Paradox games go into extreme depth and detail. Other games in the genre similarly go beyond in campaign, and that is where you are more likely to find both historical depth and the historically inclined. They certainly exist here and there's a strong minority, but like above, it shouldn't be considered the majority. Piece by piece Total War is little more than a passing 'what if' scenario maker playing fast and loose with the premise and giving a unique combination of what are otherwise simple factors.

    Kudos to you for being inspired towards military history in correlation with playing games, but total war games, especially modern appeal of Medieval 2, the Warhammer track, and even Three Kingdoms, have little to no draw on historical basis alone. They are all rather gamey games when it comes down to it. One shouldn't really even pretend CA is designing for appeal towards the military audience. Compare their modern design with, say, the EB2 mod for Medieval 2, an exception to the rule where historical authenticity and depth (with what they have) is the priority over just using the premise to support a form of gameplay.

  8. #28
    Leonardo's Avatar Reborn Old Timer
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    Default Re: About the Total War Player

    Thread merged.
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  9. #29

    Default Re: About the Total War Player

    Thanks for the help.

  10. #30
    Leonardo's Avatar Reborn Old Timer
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    Default Re: About the Total War Player

    You're welcome.
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