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Thread: Can we re-establish Creedal National Identity?

  1. #21
    Aexodus's Avatar Persuasion>Coercion
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    Default Re: Can we re-establish Creedal National Identity?

    I think if religious and ethnic identities are considered to be vague, and if it is that specific quality that is their drawback, then surely that means abstract creeds and values are even more so? How can that be compared to something tangible and material? I’ll refer to the Sinicization of Tibet for why it matters. China and Tibet might be similar, but they’re still, quite different. The cultural uniformity that you would require in a global sense can only be achieved using China’s methods, unless you took a long, long term approach.

    If it already exists, then sure a common creed can work.

    The changes, evident since the incorporation of Tibet into the People's Republic of China in 1950–51, have been facilitated by a range of economic, social, cultural and political reforms introduced to Tibet by the Chinese government. Critics cite the government-sponsored migration of large numbers of Han Chinese into the Tibet Autonomous Region as a major component of sinicization.

    The government in exile says that the policies intend to make Tibet an integral part of China and control desire for Tibetan
    self-determination.

    The Chinese government maintains that its policies have benefited Tibet, and cultural and social changes are consequences of
    modernization. According to the government, Tibet's economy has expanded; improved services and infrastructure have improved the quality of life of Tibetans, and the Tibetan language and culture have been protected.
    Now that is a very extreme example, an extreme one, but I think it proves a point.

    I’d like to reference Obama’s 2008 speech, where he talks of uniting ‘many colours and creeds’. Now let’s assume he really means that, literally (probably not but anyway) What do you use to unite if colour (specifically not a great choice really) and creed (better) are ruled out?

    It’s interesting you mention about ‘some medieval army’. I don’t think it’s as arbitrary as you think. These things heavily define the present and future. I think there’s a big difference in different countries when it comes to attitudes to past armies and wars, and it varies person to person. An Appalachian Presbyterian will likely tell you all about his ancestors in the Independence War, while perhaps the average Californian might not, even though California is probably the region that was influenced more drastically, culturally in the long run (American manifest destiny, etc). You’ve got the Boyne, Hastings, Siege of Constantinople, and so on.
    Last edited by Aexodus; October 12, 2018 at 06:45 AM.
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  2. #22

    Default Re: Can we re-establish Creedal National Identity?

    Actually the most Reactionary movements were always about Creedal National identity.
    The leaders of tribes, tribes who hated each other, would have their leaders marry among themselves in order for the tribes to stop warring each other and creating a ruling class that was mixed blood of the two formerly enemy tribes

    This was known as the early monarchies.

    Since the fall of monarchy after the 1700s-1800s (said fall likely being justified) the clamour to find identity in the Blood/DNA re-rose again, and the idea of Ethno-State is re-gaining a glamour that Monarchies formerly erased.
    It will be seen that, as used, the word ‘Fascism’ is almost entirely meaningless. In conversation, of course, it is used even more wildly than in print. I have heard it applied to farmers, shopkeepers, Social Credit, corporal punishment, fox-hunting, bull-fighting, the 1922 Committee, the 1941 Committee, Kipling, Gandhi, Chiang Kai-Shek, homosexuality, Priestley's broadcasts, Youth Hostels, astrology, women, dogs and I do not know what else.

    -George Orwell

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