Public Beta Test - 1.2.3f - Battle Stat Overhaul, CAI Overhaul and New Traits System (Updated Dec 18)

[KAM 2150]

You only need to copy pack files, you don't do anything with them. This is a standard format of all TW mods.


Also thanks everyone for feedback, I will be writing replies in the evening and work on the changes.

[♔Greek Strategos♔]

I am worried about drastic change in effectiveness of ranged units. The fact that elite archers, being able to snipe out only few armored men from behind, really puts some factions in underdog position undeservedly. While I get the argument that this period is much more about clashes of heavy troops, I feel such radical change, which would lead to whole military class being obsolete, is hardly going to be good thing from the game play perspective.

Don't worry. That'll be fixed.

[Holland_NL]

I have seen low public order decrease the management level of my generals causing worse public order causing even worse management skills. This cycle can really mess with factions that start with low public order like the Galatians. They are surrounded by foreign cultures and if their generals debuff it even further it becomes very hard to raise it. I guess it also forces looting barbarians to keep looting and return home as little as possible which I guess isn't bad but I mentioning it anyway in case it wasn't intended.

[popovic]

Curiously, on what evidence do you base this?

It was only within the 20th century that infant mortality really began to decline with advances in medicine and health - and up until then early mortality rates could easily reach 50% - which is pretty much what we are

What I meant was that infant mortality is unrealistically low atm in the mod.

But at the same time, I don`t think anyone prefers to see lots and lots of kids being born into the family, and then most of them die.
It clutters up the family tree, and is, frankly, rather macabre.

Hence my suggestion.

[Krakenz]

That really isn't normal behavior at all. I just tested Agema vs Praetorians, and the Agema pikes won very handily. I did this both with double clicking once in a while, and just leaving them there. Agema still won even after giving the Praetorians three silver chevrons of experience. Are you playing on normal battle difficulty? The game is balanced around that, and anything beyond it will just give the AI artificially inflated stats.

Thank you. But wtf i am doing wrong then? Of course its normal difficulty, no other mods (i even disabled diplomatic and blood mods). I even reinstalled the bloody game and redownloaded everything and it is still messed up. In normal DEI a bronze shield unit shatters a praetorian unit while taking like 50-55 casualties. As long as i turn the beta balance on bronze shields get shattered with only like 20 men lost on praetorian side. Also archers are literally useless in this balance and feel like a waste of slot while cavalry, even light and medium one overpeforms with devastating charges.

[Yarev]

Not sure if it's a bug but my Dignitary (whilst deployed ) does not give me all the tax income he is suppossed to, what I mean is his traits and skills include A weathy +2% tax, B cicumspect +3%tax, C arbiter +4% tax (should be 9% tax in total ) but when I click deploy the tax in province changes from -17% to -13%. Any thoughts?

[PietrolEremita]

Dignitaries don't stack, just the best bonus apllies

[Standard Nerd]

Dignitaries don't stack, just the best bonus apllies

I didn’t know this! Are you saying that multiple dignitaries in a province won’t sum their bonuses, or are you saying that whenever I have multiple traits/ancillaries, etc affecting the same bonus, like cultural conversion or tax rate % increases, that only the most significant trait/ancillary takes effect?

[CadetNewb]

Don't worry. That'll be fixed.

To be honest, I'd rather not the ranged units be buffed too much more than this, since skirmishers historically never really did have too much of an impact save for the rare occasion. I'd understand if balance had to be kept, but, I'd honestly prefer something like having them go through a lengthy reload ability or something. I know that's pretty out there and a pain, but, I had to say it.

Thank you. But wtf i am doing wrong then? Of course its normal difficulty, no other mods (i even disabled diplomatic and blood mods). I even reinstalled the bloody game and redownloaded everything and it is still messed up. In normal DEI a bronze shield unit shatters a praetorian unit while taking like 50-55 casualties. As long as i turn the beta balance on bronze shields get shattered with only like 20 men lost on praetorian side. Also archers are literally useless in this balance and feel like a waste of slot while cavalry, even light and medium one overpeforms with devastating charges.

If you're using the Steam version of DeI, make sure you got all the parts? I think there's 10 of them, but I could be wrong. Alternatively, just go with the version here on the forum instead. Hopefully that'll help.

[Krakenz]

If you're using the Steam version of DeI, make sure you got all the parts? I think there's 10 of them, but I could be wrong. Alternatively, just go with the version here on the forum instead. Hopefully that'll help.

There are only 3 parts now and i use them.

[Dresden]

How determinants strategist trait? How many are low casualties and high casualties?
Now i playing Odrysian. Currently my primary commander have rank "pawn" (used by others), since i had enough casualties, but they were necessary casualties. I captured Thrace and Pella. So if somebody plays barbarians or civilized (and specifically Rome) he will certainly have bad strategik kommander trait?

Its based on types of victories/defeats. If you have decisive/heroic victories or valiant defeats then you can increase. If you have close/pyrrhic victories or bad defeats you can decrease.

I have seen low public order decrease the management level of my generals causing worse public order causing even worse management skills. This cycle can really mess with factions that start with low public order like the Galatians. They are surrounded by foreign cultures and if their generals debuff it even further it becomes very hard to raise it. I guess it also forces looting barbarians to keep looting and return home as little as possible which I guess isn't bad but I mentioning it anyway in case it wasn't intended.

There are very limited triggers on what can constitute a good governor unfortunately. Its one reason I added libraries as reduction protection.

[♔Greek Strategos♔]

If you're using the Steam version of DeI, make sure you got all the parts? I think there's 10 of them, but I could be wrong. Alternatively, just go with the version here on the forum instead. Hopefully that'll help.

There are only 3 parts now and i use them.

That was before. Now DEI on Steam has 3 parts indeed.

[lequintal69]

Just to add some numbers to the Ranged units effectivness feedbacks, here is what I get





1 unit to tank Marian general, other one shoting straight at the back, used ~70% ammo, got 28 kills (note that my anchor units got a few volleys before getting charged by, so marians are already injured)
(custom battle, normal diff, only DEI+beta)

[ScipioTheGreat]

I think the effectiveness of ranged troops, especially slingers at long range, before the combat overhaul, was too strong. I favor this system more, and I believe unit experience should play a much bigger role with the lethality of archers and slingers since they required a high level of skill.

To be honest, I was weary of a new combat system that is quite young KAM, but I think this version is much closer to and better emulates your long term vision of battle mechanics, more so than the previous. Obviously some things to be balanced & such, but it seems to be a great foundation on which to expand from. Great job, and great to see this side of DEI getting some much needed attention!

[lequintal69]

I think the effectiveness of ranged troops, especially slingers at long range, before the combat overhaul, was too strong.

I agree with that, they were too op. But problem is that armor is so high now, that even from behind or from the sides, it will barely do any serious dmg either.
I think it could use some balancing on that part

[KAM 2150]

Just wait for new update

[lequintal69]

Just wait for new update

[lordgeorgr141]

will the new update come this month?

[KAM 2150]

More like hours/days.

[quachandy99]

More like hours/days.