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Thread: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

  1. #1

    Default Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    I plan to present my work here, and hope you enjoy. Critique, even negative or nit-picky, is highly appreciated and can help me become better.
    My drawing skills are atm. mostly focused on mapmaking, but later on I'll have other stuff to share as well.

    I'll start by sharing some of the coat of arms I have made recently. I plan to use them both as symbols on a map, as well as ingame to spice up the screenshots for my AAR.
    Most of them are semihistoric and based on the year 1080. Many countries didn't have one at that time though, especially since the age of heraldry hadn't really begun yet, so I took my liberties.
    Coat of arms
    Kingdoms of Aragon and Lon and the county of Portugal:

    The kingdom of Aragon emerges later in the game.

    Muslims: Fatimid caliphate, Moors and the Seljuks:


    3 versions of the Kingdom of England, I have yet to decide which to use:

    Why not 3 lions? Because the third one symbolises Aquitaine, which the English failed to gain.

    Kingdoms of Denmark, France, Hungary, Poland, Scotland, and Sicily (coat of arms of the dynasty of Hauteville):

    Why the raven banner as a symbol for Denmark? Well, I wasn't sure if I should use the Danish 3 lions. As was the case with most countries in 1080, Denmark didn't have a coat of arms in 1080. I decided for now not to use the blue lions on yellow background, since everyone associates red and white with Denmark and most M2TW-players already know the raven, whereas the blue-yellow coat of arms would simply confuse.



    Orthodox factions: Byzantine Tetragram, Novgorodian bear and Kievan ??? :

    The Kievan thingy is the historic one. Most modders simply use the modern day crest of Ukraine, which was the symbol of Grand prince Vladimir the great/the babtiser, for the grand principality Kiev itself. Every Rurikid ruler tended to have his own symbol, however, and the symbol of the grand prince of Kiev ruling in 1080 (Vsevolod Yaroslavych) is the one you see above.
    I gave the orthodox factions a drop shape to distinguish them from muslims (round) and catholics.


    House of Este (light blue), kingdom of Burgundy (red), kingdom of Italy (green) and various combinations of those:


    Now this is where it's somewhat complicated. It has to do with the ingame developments and my faction (ingame Milan) changing identity semifrequently, as well as to symbolise various factions inside my realms. I start out as the margraviate of Milan, and manage to become dual king of the two kingdoms of Italy and Burgundy.
    The house of Este were the historic rulers of Milan at the beginning of the campaign in 1080, and thus it's their symbol that I'm going to use.
    The coats of arms of Este and Burgundy are historic, the latter being the coat of arms of the free county of Burgundy before 1280.
    The Italian one is a fictional one, based on ingame developments. I gave it a green background, since Italy is often associated with that colour.


    I might, and probably will make crests of some important dynasties, counts and duchies as well.

    I have made a couple of generic map symbols such as the classic crossed swords one that I might share with you at a later date. I hope to finish some city symbols before that.

    Afaik all the symbols I used were free to use, and most of them from Wikipedia. You are free to use these symbols as well for your leisure.

  2. #2
    cedric37's Avatar Why Not ?!
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    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    First of all welcome to the Graphics Workshop, and that's a good thing that you are open to criticism.
    Nobody was really good at start (if not in the GW, generally speaking ).

    I have done extensive faction symbols lately for Stainless Steel Titanium and that's a lot of work, in terms of research, and to transform in game files format.
    So good job here

    For which mod / game is it ?
    My submods & other links
    AUI for 3rd Age|EFI for Call of Warhammer|E2DI for Stainless Steel
    Making Kingdoms UI's (basics)|New Campaign UI's for 3rd Age
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  3. #3
    Araval's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    They look very nice!

  4. #4

    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    Thanks guys.
    Quote Originally Posted by cedric37 View Post
    I have done extensive faction symbols lately for Stainless Steel Titanium and that's a lot of work, in terms of research, and to transform in game files format.
    So good job here

    For which mod / game is it ?
    It is for an AAR, which in turn is based on a hotseat where we played retrofit MP. So basically vanilla. I have already replaced the strat models and textures with those from other mods to reduce the eye cancer. One thing to remember about these images is however, that they are dual use, and might also be used on outgame maps. I thought about adding shadows, but refrained from doing so for that reason.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vince Gilligan
    I can't think of a movie where I like it that the bad guy gets dumb, because it's like I want the bad guy to be smart smart smart, so the good guy has to be even smarter!
    Please stop using politics as an excuse for bad writing.
    That being said: A deep philosophical take about god, Nietzsche, Marx & faith.
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    So deep!
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    A polished masterpiece!
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    Hey! I never said any of those things!

  5. #5

    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    A WIP-map with the coats of arms integrated, as well as some minor swords symbols I've created:
    Map


    Probably should've made those swords thicker. Oh well.

    The map shown is 1920 x 1080 px, so standard wallpapersize. It is merely a cutout of a much, much larger map (6735 x 3900 px) spanning from Ireland til the Caspian sea and from the Shetlands in the north til the red sea in the south. Having done it twice before my loss of data, I've gotten much quicker at making those maps.
    It doesn't have any rivers outside France yet, but I've given each river its own path and name to quickly activate and deactivate it at leisure.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vince Gilligan
    I can't think of a movie where I like it that the bad guy gets dumb, because it's like I want the bad guy to be smart smart smart, so the good guy has to be even smarter!
    Please stop using politics as an excuse for bad writing.
    That being said: A deep philosophical take about god, Nietzsche, Marx & faith.
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    So deep!
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    A polished masterpiece!
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    Hey! I never said any of those things!

  6. #6

    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    Well done, keep on going!

  7. #7
    paleologos's Avatar You need burrito love!!
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    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    Welcome to the workshop mate, looking forward to seeing more of your work!

  8. #8

    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    Hey Cookiegod, would you mind putting the sword image up for others to use for their own maps? I want to have something nice (like what you've got), but am too lazy/inept to get something together myself.

    Also, how did you go about making each river have it's own path to be "(de)activated" at your leisure? By activate/deactivate, I assume you mean they are all in different layers that can then be hidden or not, but maybe I'm wrong. Any info would be much appreciated, as I'm trying to improve my own mapping skills bit by bit.
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  9. #9

    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    Now that I have played around a bit with my graphics tablet, I couldn't help but notice how much time I've wasted with the path tool and how much easier it is to simply draw the stuff. It also looks to me a little bit less eye-cancery and less machinery, especially thanks to their sharper quells, though I failed with regards to the inconsistent stroke thicknesses.
    What do you guys think? I made a cut-out of our usual spot (France) so that you can compare those two.
    rivers hand drawn

    rivers from paths
    Quote Originally Posted by Vince Gilligan
    I can't think of a movie where I like it that the bad guy gets dumb, because it's like I want the bad guy to be smart smart smart, so the good guy has to be even smarter!
    Please stop using politics as an excuse for bad writing.
    That being said: A deep philosophical take about god, Nietzsche, Marx & faith.
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    So deep!
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    A polished masterpiece!
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    Hey! I never said any of those things!

  10. #10
    Lifthrasir's Avatar A Clockwork Orange
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    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    I like that new style a lot
    Under the patronage of Flinn, proud patron of Jadli, of the Imperial House of Hader



  11. #11

    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    My mapping continues, at a slow pace.
    Cookieworld

    The rivers etc. are mostly done now. Please correct any mistakes you might find.
    At some point I simply had to give up on researching every single river.
    It's too impractical and time consuming, but every error that's being pointed out to me will be corrected!

    Also, especially in Russia, but also elsewhere, manmade lakes and rivers have given me major headaches. Especially the Russian rivers are filled with lakes and hydroelectric power stations. Also, many countries, especially again Russia and also France, are filled with canals, and from my template it isn't always easy to identify which is which. I had to give up in certain areas and simply assume all lakes there to be artificial. Given that I want to use these maps for historical maps, those manmade wonders of engineering have no place here.

    Stylistic advice will also be appreciated. I think I overdid it with the rivers a bit and should perhaps delete some of them.
    Soon I'll move on to placing cities, borders, etc. I hope that part will be quicker and easier, and will perhaps provide me with an opportunity to identify which rivers are in the way and should be deleted and which of them I should keep.

    The size of this abomination is 6735x3900 pixels; the equivalent of 8 pieces of DinA4 paper if one were to print it with 300dpi...
    Quote Originally Posted by Vince Gilligan
    I can't think of a movie where I like it that the bad guy gets dumb, because it's like I want the bad guy to be smart smart smart, so the good guy has to be even smarter!
    Please stop using politics as an excuse for bad writing.
    That being said: A deep philosophical take about god, Nietzsche, Marx & faith.
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    So deep!
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    A polished masterpiece!
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    Hey! I never said any of those things!

  12. #12
    Skotos of Sinope's Avatar Jupiter Give Me Victory
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    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    I think the hand-drawn quality adds a lot, CG. I wouldn't delete the rivers, rather I would suggest lightening them up and giving them a bit of a soft-blue tint. (Keeping the color low-saturation.) Once you start drawing the cities and borders I think they won't be so noticeable, but will in fact, actually complement the overall image, giving it some added depth.
    Last edited by Skotos of Sinope; December 10, 2018 at 11:17 AM.

  13. #13
    Araval's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    You gave my country only one river.
    I can tell you that this artificial lake was created in 1950-1956: https://tools.wmflabs.org/geohack/ge...arva+veehoidla
    But an important lake you are missing is this: https://tools.wmflabs.org/geohack/ge...B5rtsj%C3%A4rv

  14. #14

    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    Good input both of you. I'll implement it. Vrtsjrv and the river Emajogi flowing from it to Peipus are perfect for this otherwise empty space.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vince Gilligan
    I can't think of a movie where I like it that the bad guy gets dumb, because it's like I want the bad guy to be smart smart smart, so the good guy has to be even smarter!
    Please stop using politics as an excuse for bad writing.
    That being said: A deep philosophical take about god, Nietzsche, Marx & faith.
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    So deep!
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    A polished masterpiece!
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    Hey! I never said any of those things!

  15. #15

    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    Hey man, you said you are going to move onto placing cities, borders, etc. That means your map will be locked to a particular time period though (at least, the layers with those elements will be so locked). What time period are you planning on mapping out? I ask because I have been thinking about whether or not to add any cities or anything to my maps, but have hesitated for lack of desire to make a layer for each historical period.
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  16. #16

    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    Quote Originally Posted by Kilo11 View Post
    Hey man, you said you are going to move onto placing cities, borders, etc. That means your map will be locked to a particular time period though (at least, the layers with those elements will be so locked). What time period are you planning on mapping out? I ask because I have been thinking about whether or not to add any cities or anything to my maps, but have hesitated for lack of desire to make a layer for each historical period.
    Yeah, it's still for the AAR so I'm aiming for ca. 1100 AD + reflecting the vanilla M2TW map to a certain degree.

    Flexibility is all good and well, I have that same mentality, but only to a certain point. You have to ask yourself what a blank map is useful for. The answer is probably: Nothing at all. Then you can ask yourself what all your maps will have in common. Which'd most likely be the shores, mountains and rivers, more or less.
    But the whole point of maps of specific time periods is, that they change. So in my case I'm close to the point where the general purpose map is almost done, and I'll move on to make the specific map based on that one. If I ever want to make a second map, e.g. of antiquity, I'll still be free to base that one on the general purpose map as well. But we all have to commit at a certain point.
    I will also need to be able to change the 1100/vanilla map as the situation in this world evolves, so there's another layer of flexibility right there.

    But the question is also which cities you actually need in your map, or if you need cities at all. If it's for Written in Sand or most other stories, I'd wager you need at least some of those cities that feature in the story. Those cities are more important than borders.
    Especially given that the vastness of the Arabian desert has few enough geographical landmarks one can orient himself on to begin with.
    Everyone knows more or less what Europe looks like. But few people know what Europe looked like in 270 BC. And even those who do still appreciate to have it visualised. A blank space doesn't cut though.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vince Gilligan
    I can't think of a movie where I like it that the bad guy gets dumb, because it's like I want the bad guy to be smart smart smart, so the good guy has to be even smarter!
    Please stop using politics as an excuse for bad writing.
    That being said: A deep philosophical take about god, Nietzsche, Marx & faith.
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    So deep!
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    A polished masterpiece!
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    Hey! I never said any of those things!

  17. #17

    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    No doubt. I want to make more detailed maps myself, but can't muster the will to put in the work until I need something out of that particular area/time period. But who knows; maybe I'll start chipping away at making a settlement layer for each era. Since you've already begun in on the Medieval era, I'll start with antiquity. Besides, antiquity is just so much cooler than medieval stuff

    Quote Originally Posted by Cookiegod
    But few people know what Europe looked like in 270 BC.
    This is actually an interesting point, and one that makes much more justifiable the idea of adding in region boundaries. Settlements will largely be in the same spots as they later are, even up to the present (antique Massalia --> contemporary Marseilles), but the borders will be so different, and having them in there can help to change the space of things in people's heads. Another thing worth considering might be some layer for forests, as that is a huge difference between eras, the amount of deforestation and attendant spread of farmland. Obviously it couldn't be added to the furthest zoomed out map, otherwise it would be too busy, but maybe for insets or closer in maps of specific regions. Definitely something worth considering.


    I actually wanted to fire a request to you for an .svg image for mapping purposes, namely something to mark ports. I was thinking a simple anchor would do the trick and look nice. Thoughts?
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  18. #18

    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    I'll make those anchors. If you have more requests fire them at me (btw. the story you sent me to read & review: is it ok if I do it on the 19th? I need something to do for my journey).

    As to what's supposed to go on your map: That wholly depends on what you need to convey. I struggle with that crucial point as well and that's the main reason why I consider myself bad at making maps.
    As to forrests: Mapping deforrestation would be much of a challenge, especially since it was often a bit cyclic. Example: I heard once that the point in history where Britain was the most deforrested was actually in the bronze age.
    If you try to show us how different the world looked all those years ago it might be a bit too much to chew on. So much has changed, it's crazy.
    Also, forrests matter the way they matter, right? For me mostly as barriers and also to hide troops in. Sometimes as fillers.
    They aren't that good as waypoints. I'm very happy that I put all those rivers in. They help me put those cities in the right spots. They also help me orient myself with regards to strategy and so on. So much that happened in history makes much more sense to me now that I know the geographic reasons.
    So even if I have to remove some of the rivers (not that I want to, but might have to), it'll still have payed off.
    That's what different to the forrests, which is why the forrests will be the very last thing I'll put in, to even out the map.

    What you're saying about cities isn't always entirely true. Extreme example: Modern day Ryazan <- 55km -> Old Ryazan. I know other quite extreme examples from antiquity.

    Most are of course much less extreme and would stay on the same pixel in your map even when they moved a bit. But I'd consider the fact that many cities remain the same across the times to actually be an advantage, right? It should make your work easier.
    Province borders are also an issue for me. I'm not sure how and if I should do this. You might remember my old map; doing those precise can demand some research.


    Also: I'd just like to let y'all know I found one mistake with my rivers in Spain. :O
    Quote Originally Posted by Vince Gilligan
    I can't think of a movie where I like it that the bad guy gets dumb, because it's like I want the bad guy to be smart smart smart, so the good guy has to be even smarter!
    Please stop using politics as an excuse for bad writing.
    That being said: A deep philosophical take about god, Nietzsche, Marx & faith.
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    So deep!
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    A polished masterpiece!
    Quote Originally Posted by Derc View Post
    Hey! I never said any of those things!

  19. #19

    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    Yeah. What gets included in a map definitely has much more to do with the map's purpose than with what is really there. That is one of the reasons I am so glad to be mapping in GIMP with all the different layers, because you can make a layer for each thing, so you have it, and then leave it for later in case you need it. I mean, it's always better to have it, cause then you have it (first one to call the reference going on here gets a free rep from me ).

    Your point about settlements not moving much is a good one too (certainly not far enough for it to matter for our mapping purposes at these scales). I actually do a somewhat odd, but ultimately helpful thing with my settlements layer, which is that I have a single layer with just the icon for settlements, and then another with the names. That makes it so I can have layers with different names from different eras, without having to worry about popping each settlement indicator on again. Might be worth considering for your own things too.

    Regarding the story I sent you, feel free to get to it whenever you choose! I have no rush.
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  20. #20

    Default Re: Cookiegods eye cancer workshop

    Hello CG!

    I must say I am very disappointed with the quality of work here. I came looking for ways to get eye cancer and I found none. Click-bait title, shame on you!

    In all seriousness though, I can see why you haven't been posting on your AAR (naughty, naughty!), this workshop is great! I think I'm in love with the coat of arms part. (Ooh, Turkish and Ayyubid coat of arms! Perhaps if I don't eat any cookies this year CG will allow me to use them in my AAR in future?) *squints and reads more carefully* "You are free to use these symbols as well for your leisure." Looks like cookies are back on the menu, boys!

    With regards to the hand drawn vs non hand drawn rivers - I prefer the hand drawn. The non hand drawn ones feel a little too squiggly for me, and curve too much. I'm eagerly awaiting your progress with the maps.

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