Are certain types of racism becoming acceptable?

[Aexodus]

I just wanted to start this thread to talk about the double standard when it comes to accusiations of racism.

The New York Times has just hired this lovely lady to its editorial board.

The NYT said they knew about these comments before hiring her, and are standing by their decision to employ her. Well, it’s a bold statement I’ll give them that.

Now if she’d said such things about any other race, there would be a huge fallout eg “NYT hires racist white supremacist”, if they had said for example Jews should live underground like grovelling goblins. But so far there isn’t much apart from an article from Fox News, and BBC.

There’s also things like when BBC puts out stuff like this

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

and this

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

and this



Now I’m not saying the long arm of the law should get involved here. What I am saying is this: what on Earth is going on within Western media culture, and why?

[95thrifleman]

There has always been permitted discrimination within cultures. Only thing that changes is the target from generation to generation.

[Prodromos]

Anyone with younger siblings or relatives understands why "reverse racism" isn't a thing, and that is due to racism. When a child calls you a doodyhead, everyone laughs, because we know it's not true. But when an adult calls a child an idiot, we're outraged, because you're not supposed to say the harsh truth out loud; it could damage the child, etc. Likewise, these leftists believe the white race is the master race, the intellectually and physically superior race, hence it is perfectly okay for the inferior races to insult the white race, because we know it isn't true. These leftists are actually pretty racist, and this "bigotry of low expectations" is really insulting to "minorities", and could get leftists knocked the heck out in a real life conversation. Luckily these leftists live in lily-white neighborhoods and wouldn't be caught dead around a minority, except for the rare, hand-picked, token. The only way they can raise their low self-esteem, is by pretending to be Dances With Wolves. They're like big babies, completely self-centered, and only interested in patting themselves on the back for saving the weak inferior races.

[Ludicus]

Luckily these leftists live in lily-white neighborhoods and wouldn't be caught dead around a minority

Read below. I presume that these poor white guys are not leftists, they certainly live in African American neighborhoods, and they have a genuine fear of being murdered by a non-white criminal.
How Trump's America went from inclusion to a tribal nation,
UMD stands by “safe space” group for white students to discuss race ...

So, what's the reason behind the creation of "safe spaces" for whites? the reason is, "In general, when people who are white discuss the topic, it's seen as inherently racist."
It's so hard to be white in a black America.

[Sir Adrian]

Read below. I presume that these poor white guys are not leftists, they certainly live in African American neighborhoods, and they have a genuine fear of being murdered by a non-white criminal.
How Trump's America went from inclusion to a tribal nation,
UMD stands by “safe space” group for white students to discuss race ...

So, what's the reason behind the creation of "safe spaces" for whites? the reason is, "In general, when people who are white discuss the topic, it's seen as inherently racist."
It's so hard to be white in a black America.

Nah, those and Aexodus links are just the effects of the participation trophy and victimization culture that has been permeating the American educational system.

[The spartan]

I don't know why people want to always discuss the individual perceptions around racism instead of the systemic aspect of it. I don't think people really care if someone has racist thoughts, they care if Racism is effecting societal structures.

[Diamat]

I don't know why people want to always discuss the individual perceptions around racism instead of the systemic aspect of it. I don't think people really care if someone has racist thoughts, they care if Racism is effecting societal structures.

Ah, the old Marxist strategy: use the totality (i.e., the systematic aspect) to define the parts. That is, give your own analysis of the system and then say that every part of the system is necessarily what you think it is (i.e., racist), even when, upon a case-by-case examination, this is not necessarily true. Put yet more differently, create a ghost called "the system" and then see this ghost reflected in every corner of society, wherever you want to see it.

[The spartan]

Ah, the old Marxist strategy: use the totality (i.e., the systematic aspect) to define the parts. That is, give your own analysis of the system and then say that every part of the system is necessarily what you think it is (i.e., racist), even when, upon a case-by-case examination, this is not necessarily true. Put yet more differently, create a ghost called "the system" and then see this ghost reflected in every corner of society, wherever you want to see it.

Marxist? I just don't think society can make individuals not racist, and so society should focus on addressing societal problems. I never did a personal analysis of what aspects of society are "racist" and which aren't; honestly I think it exists on a spectrum. In this day and age, most of society is not what we would really call "racist", but there are some aspects that are still problematic.

[Diamat]

Marxist? I just don't think society can make individuals not racist, and so society should focus on addressing societal problems. I never did a personal analysis of what aspects of society are "racist" and which aren't; honestly I think it exists on a spectrum. In this day and age, most of society is not what we would really call "racist", but there are some aspects that are still problematic.

It's just that your use of the word "systemic" set off alarm bells in my thinking. It immediately reminded me of radical leftists' claims that there exists a "systemic racism," i.e., that racism is endemic to the "system" (a vague notion in and of itself). Thus, once these radicals have the vague notion of the evil "system," believing in this notion even in the face of empirical counter-evidence, then they will begin to see anything that maintains this "system" (i.e., whatever they don't like) as something that needs to be radically transformed. In short, they want to transform society as a whole in accordance with their vague visions. The notion of "system" erases all the nuances, complexities, and internal contradictions that exist within society. It allows you to interpret every aspect of society in a way that suits your needs.

[Basil II the B.S]

On twitter hating white people is acceptable and widespread especially among white liberals.

It's a core element of being a cosmopolitan progressive.

https://imgur.com/a/XGu5PZN

Warning, viewer discretion, censorship bypass, vulgar language..

[z3n]

Self hating flagellants and inquisitions in the worship of a religion that nasty and manipulative people oversee is not surprising. They always manage to make some form of power worship in a society.

Liberals nowdays constitute the majority of this religion but what can you do? It's going to happen one way or another.

[Knight of Heaven]

Social media is truly a sickening place.

[Basil II the B.S]

Self hating flagellants and inquisitions in the worship of a religion that nasty and manipulative people oversee is not surprising. They always manage to make some form of power worship in a society.

Liberals nowdays constitute the majority of this religion but what can you do? It's going to happen one way or another.

That's generally true but even then, socities eventually get some sort of shape up. Given that their hatred interests me directly, I'll work towards the shake up.

Social media is truly a sickening place.

Social media are a terrible invention indeed.

[Sir Adrian]

I don't know why people want to always discuss the individual perceptions around racism instead of the systemic aspect of it. I don't think people really care if someone has racist thoughts, they care if Racism is effecting societal structures.

Probably because there is no systemic racism in modern civilized countries.

[Cyclops]

Probably because there is no systemic racism in modern civilized countries.

There are some strong "ingroup outgroup" tribal subcultures in Australia, and I'd say its systemic in other countries too. There's a very strong Freemason/Protestant/Loyalist identity in some UK police forces and army units, and their racism toward most Irish and bigotry toward Irish Catholics is well known.

No doubt here is some sublimated racism among liberal urban elites, they want to support (for example) Australian aborigines or Somali refugees, but don't want to live next door to them. There's also braindead tit-for-tat racism from groups that feel oppressed.

However its unsupportable to say they are the main racist problem here. Entrenched racism in some police forces is a real problem, and when multiculturalism fails it can lead to violent gangs defined on ethnic grounds. Its one thing to sling some insults on Twitter, and another to drive a car into a crowd as we saw in the US.

Its not the case that "past white racism has led to justifiable current backlash from oppressed minorities" but it is true that people love to belong to a group and part of the ingroup outgroup dynamic is belittling other groups. Breaking down corrupt and/or violent loyalty structures is part of the modern state function: eg rooting out Freemason networks from the UK police forces would be a very good thing, not because "they're white people and white people are bad rawr XD", but because they are a remnant of violent tribal factionalism and they serve now as a conduit for corruption in a nominally open society.

[Sir Adrian]

That's just tipycal human behavior and the need to subconciously seek and stick to those simmilar to you. Some can be fixed, most can't as it's just part of our survival mechanism and animal instinct. Even chimps and mice will rip "foreigners" to shreds if caught on their territory.
But to imply that a modern european/western country actively discriminates against a given race at a governmental level (systemic racism) is just bonkers.

[Cyclops]

That's just tipycal human behavior and the need to subconciously seek and stick to those simmilar to you. Some can be fixed, most can't as it's just part of our survival mechanism and animal instinct. Even chimps and mice will rip "foreigners" to shreds if caught on their territory...

I agree completely.

...
But to imply that a modern european/western country actively discriminates against a given race at a governmental level (systemic racism) is just bonkers.

I'm not implying it, I am stating as fact that parts of modern European/Western countries do discriminate against people on the basis of race, religion or other perceived otherness. I'd say its bonkers to suggest otherwise.

I disagree with OP that certain types of racism are becoming acceptable, in the past many people subscribed to ideas that we would find racist, and sexist, and bigoted etc etc. If he's noticing (and I think this is his point) some non-white people slagging off white people i think its because non-white people are getting heard more.

I'd add that Twitter and other non-face-to-face comms have an unfortunate side effect of echo-chambering, lowest-common-denominating and other hyphenated effects that lead to people making sickening statements quite casually.

[z3n]

No doubt that's exactly why immigrants come in droves to western society. They want to be systematically oppressed.

[Aexodus]

I disagree with OP that certain types of racism are becoming acceptable, in the past many people subscribed to ideas that we would find racist, and sexist, and bigoted etc etc. If he's noticing (and I think this is his point) some non-white people slagging off white people i think its because non-white people are getting heard more.

It’s more than that, it’s job discrimination too, there’s financial institutions in England for example that want to recruit 72% female, prioritising bame women. My economics teacher told us this, a class of about 20 white kids, only one of us a girl. This kind of thing has to stop. There wasn’t a single one of us who thought that was fair, so why is it allowed?

And if the answer is ‘women blacks minorities historically oppressed etc etc’ I really don’t care.

[Genghis Skahn]

https://imgur.com/a/XGu5PZN

Warning, viewer discretion, censorship bypass, vulgar language..

It's just sad that people still think using collective guilt will improve their society in any way. No, no, no! I swear! This time it will work, this time society will be purified and surely nothing tragic will occur from collectively blaming whitey, just like all those other times we used collective guilt. These people really have no historical grounding whatsoever if they think that spreading these hateful ideas will improve anyone's lives.

Here's a short and very incomplete list of the times the use of collective guilt, be it racial or otherwise, resulted in the mass killing of the "guilty" party: The Holocaust, The Partition of India(see the movie "Earth" for eg.), The Balkan wars of the 90s(anecdotally speaking, my father knew a Canadian peacekeeper who fought there. They once came upon a Croatian military unit in a village filled with dead Serbs. When the Canadians asked what had happened there, the Croats simply responded "They were Serbs".), The Cultural Revolution(targets were senior officials and any "experts" such as doctors, teachers, etc.; also see The Five Black Categories), The Russian Revolution(mass extermination of the "bourgeoisie" and the "petty bourgeoisie"--resulting in the expulsion or destruction of Russia's best and brightest such as engineers, scientists, doctors and even labour leaders), The Kulak purge(most Kulaks weren't affluent at all, the term became rather nebulous and virtually any property owner could be considered a Kulak--this resulted in the destruction of Russia and the Ukraine's most productive farmers via collectively blaming them as "class enemies", arguably resulting in the 1932-33 famine), The Armenian genocide, The Rwandan Genocide, etc. etc. etc.

Collective guilt was used in all, or most of, those human tragedies--but don't worry, this time we'll get it right. This time, collective guilt will work and seriously improve our society, I swear. Just one more try! This time it will be different, since Whitey deserves it(just like all those other victims were believed to have "deserved it" by their oppressors).