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Thread: Have you notticed?

  1. #1
    AnthoniusII's Avatar XXI ARMORED BRIGADE
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    Default Have you notticed?

    Have you notticed the odd dates that apear in TGC's pictures when we show the strat_map?
    Have you notticed that Varangians will apear in the middle of the mod's timeframe via several event?
    A Finnish group devoted two albums to tell the story of those Rus from all over Scandinavia to the "Land of the Greeks" .
    Despite the term Byzantium that is false the article is interesting. Also we will explain later why Norse people called the "State of the Romans" as "land of the Greeks".
    https://www.academia.edu/36999059/Bo...z_2018_391-419
    There are moments (in history), in which a nation owes,
    if it wants to be considered as a great one, to be able to fight.
    Even without hope of winning. Just because it has to.
    Greek War motto.
    XXI Armored Brigade. Proud that served in that unit in 1996!
    "Spartans do not ask how many (enemies are) but where they are"!
    XXI Armored Brigade's motto.
    The Greek Secret (or why they will fight again if it will be necessary or why they do not sell their history).


  2. #2
    AnthoniusII's Avatar XXI ARMORED BRIGADE
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    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    Have you notticed that in the map that shows the rebels based on the culture of people that lived in that areas east Sicely and south Italy has Roman rebels?
    The basis of that population was the hellenic (mostly Doric) Greek collonies of antiquity. They still speak that doric dialect (with many Italian additions of course):
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-mCjaWXXuA
    Every aspect of TGC has a historical basis that needed to be invastigated.
    There are moments (in history), in which a nation owes,
    if it wants to be considered as a great one, to be able to fight.
    Even without hope of winning. Just because it has to.
    Greek War motto.
    XXI Armored Brigade. Proud that served in that unit in 1996!
    "Spartans do not ask how many (enemies are) but where they are"!
    XXI Armored Brigade's motto.
    The Greek Secret (or why they will fight again if it will be necessary or why they do not sell their history).


  3. #3
    paleologos's Avatar You need burrito love!!
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    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    The Greeks did notice.

  4. #4
    Lusitanio's Avatar Content Staff
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    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    Good work AnthoniusII! I just discovered this mod from a comment that you made on EBII forum and its an impressive work. Can you tell me the current state of the mod?

  5. #5
    _Tartaros_'s Avatar "Harzschütze"
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    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    we are preparing the internal alpha 0.9.1
    atm correcting scripts and testing new units + recruitment
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Quote Originally Posted by k/t View Post
    "But I don't know how to mod!!!!"
    Learn. I didn't know how to do anything when I got this game, and now I know how to do quite a bit. Volunteer. Struggle. Figure it out.
    There are lots of cool mods that never see the light of day because people don't realize that mods need workers, not watchers, or realize it but continue to watch anyway.

    The Great Conflicts
    872-1071

  6. #6
    Lusitanio's Avatar Content Staff
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    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    Very nice indeed.

    Have you found a way of dealing with the switching of units from spears to swords? In EBII they only use one type of weapon (in infantry and not on missile units) because they say its broken, but I read somewhere in this forum that you did it in a different way?

  7. #7
    _Tartaros_'s Avatar "Harzschütze"
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    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    it´s a matter of micromanagement. somehow, if a soldier of a spearunit falls down, he grabs his secondary weapon. this is the problem - but you can bring them back to order, if you oneclick attack to an engaged unit. also "stand your ground" option is important. best is to test this in a vanilla campaign and experience this commands.
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Quote Originally Posted by k/t View Post
    "But I don't know how to mod!!!!"
    Learn. I didn't know how to do anything when I got this game, and now I know how to do quite a bit. Volunteer. Struggle. Figure it out.
    There are lots of cool mods that never see the light of day because people don't realize that mods need workers, not watchers, or realize it but continue to watch anyway.

    The Great Conflicts
    872-1071

  8. #8
    Diocle's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    Quote Originally Posted by paleologos View Post
    The Greeks did notice.
    Not only the Greeks .. also the Langobards did notice ..

    Last edited by Diocle; September 02, 2018 at 09:35 PM.

  9. #9
    AnthoniusII's Avatar XXI ARMORED BRIGADE
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    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    There are moments (in history), in which a nation owes,
    if it wants to be considered as a great one, to be able to fight.
    Even without hope of winning. Just because it has to.
    Greek War motto.
    XXI Armored Brigade. Proud that served in that unit in 1996!
    "Spartans do not ask how many (enemies are) but where they are"!
    XXI Armored Brigade's motto.
    The Greek Secret (or why they will fight again if it will be necessary or why they do not sell their history).


  10. #10

    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    A citizen of Byzantium.

  11. #11
    AnthoniusII's Avatar XXI ARMORED BRIGADE
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    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    Quote Originally Posted by perris0707 View Post
    A citizen of Byzantium.
    I would sugest you read the article carefully .
    There are moments (in history), in which a nation owes,
    if it wants to be considered as a great one, to be able to fight.
    Even without hope of winning. Just because it has to.
    Greek War motto.
    XXI Armored Brigade. Proud that served in that unit in 1996!
    "Spartans do not ask how many (enemies are) but where they are"!
    XXI Armored Brigade's motto.
    The Greek Secret (or why they will fight again if it will be necessary or why they do not sell their history).


  12. #12

    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    Interesting. I have always read that the Europeans referred to the eastern Romans "Greeks" while the Muslims referred to them as "Romans".

  13. #13
    AnthoniusII's Avatar XXI ARMORED BRIGADE
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    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    Quote Originally Posted by perris0707 View Post
    Interesting. I have always read that the Europeans referred to the eastern Romans "Greeks" while the Muslims referred to them as "Romans".
    If you search our previews carefully you will find two "Roman" Empires. The official one and the one Otto created succeding the Frankish Empire. It was not a "mistake" on our behalf but we tried to show the political conflicts that lead to armed ones in Italy with the 4th Crusade as their climax! REMEMBER TGC is a playable educational tool and not simply a mod. That is why 9 years and still there is no release. Flieger is a real historian that gave his knowlege for how the "Germans" saw the Romans trying to embrace a Roman consciousness that the real Roman CITIZENS in the east already had because of their political continuity.
    There are moments (in history), in which a nation owes,
    if it wants to be considered as a great one, to be able to fight.
    Even without hope of winning. Just because it has to.
    Greek War motto.
    XXI Armored Brigade. Proud that served in that unit in 1996!
    "Spartans do not ask how many (enemies are) but where they are"!
    XXI Armored Brigade's motto.
    The Greek Secret (or why they will fight again if it will be necessary or why they do not sell their history).


  14. #14
    AnthoniusII's Avatar XXI ARMORED BRIGADE
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    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    Have you notticed that we call the "Byzantine" empire Roman Empire?
    Here is an answer: https://www.facebook.com/RomeNotByza...6dWhQU&__xts__
    There are moments (in history), in which a nation owes,
    if it wants to be considered as a great one, to be able to fight.
    Even without hope of winning. Just because it has to.
    Greek War motto.
    XXI Armored Brigade. Proud that served in that unit in 1996!
    "Spartans do not ask how many (enemies are) but where they are"!
    XXI Armored Brigade's motto.
    The Greek Secret (or why they will fight again if it will be necessary or why they do not sell their history).


  15. #15
    AnthoniusII's Avatar XXI ARMORED BRIGADE
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    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    The heritage of Orthodoxy and the Roman Rule over modern Syria and Lebanon can be seen in the Easter Chunt with Arabic and Greek chunts co -exist.


    It also shows the tolerance between diferent religions that we forgot in our darken days.
    Chist has Risen to all PEOPLE regardless their religion.
    Religions get people close not devide them as St Georgios Church in Pringiponissa out side of Constantinople that thousands of Muslims go to beg for health and prosperity.
    Last edited by AnthoniusII; April 30, 2019 at 01:06 PM.
    There are moments (in history), in which a nation owes,
    if it wants to be considered as a great one, to be able to fight.
    Even without hope of winning. Just because it has to.
    Greek War motto.
    XXI Armored Brigade. Proud that served in that unit in 1996!
    "Spartans do not ask how many (enemies are) but where they are"!
    XXI Armored Brigade's motto.
    The Greek Secret (or why they will fight again if it will be necessary or why they do not sell their history).


  16. #16
    paleologos's Avatar You need burrito love!!
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    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    Thanks for the videos.
    Personally I don't like identitarianism even when it's the kind that includes me, but the Arabic version of "Christos Aneste" is nonetheless very well executed here.

  17. #17
    Diocle's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    Quote Originally Posted by AnthoniusII View Post
    Have you notticed that we call the "Byzantine" empire Roman Empire?
    Here is an answer: https://www.facebook.com/RomeNotByza...6dWhQU&__xts__
    Yeah, I noticed and .. yeah, I fully and plainly disagree with you and .. yeah, I love you & your work Antonius!

    I've decided to write down this pretty silly post to explain that I'm interested in this work even for its peculiar cultural approach to history, so even though I have different opinions about the actual grade of "Romanitas" of the Byzantine Empire, I love traveling in a different cultural environment than my own approach to that age and to that matter.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    in my personal opinion the last notion of the roman empire died with Justinians attempt to regain the western part.
    a disastrous attempt that ruined Italy, ruined the economy and decimated Europe by plague.

    true that the Byzantine empire, the Greek empire or what ever one prefer to call it held the best claim of all the successor states for a while, being de facto remains of the eastern empire. but claiming Roman empire without control of Italy in general and specifically Rome - nix. if one is to accept that then the Frankish empire of Charlemange held an equally valid claim and in extension of that Ottos German empire. Nostrum, nostrum est imperium Romanum.

    in my opinion, to be Roman empire one need to hold Rome and speak latin at least as an administrative language. otherwise even Clovis make a good bid for the empire.
    Hr. Alf han hugg til han var mod, Han sto i femten Ridderes Blod; Så tog han alle de Kogger ni Og sejlede dermed til Norge fri. Og der kom tidende til Rostock ind, Der blegned saa mangen Rosenkind. Der græd Enker og der græd Børn, Dem hadde gjort fattig den skadelige Ørn.
    Anders Sørensen Vedel

  19. #19
    Giorgios's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    Quote Originally Posted by absinthia View Post
    in my personal opinion the last notion of the roman empire died with Justinians attempt to regain the western part.
    a disastrous attempt that ruined Italy, ruined the economy and decimated Europe by plague.

    true that the Byzantine empire, the Greek empire or what ever one prefer to call it held the best claim of all the successor states for a while, being de facto remains of the eastern empire. but claiming Roman empire without control of Italy in general and specifically Rome - nix. if one is to accept that then the Frankish empire of Charlemange held an equally valid claim and in extension of that Ottos German empire. Nostrum, nostrum est imperium Romanum.

    in my opinion, to be Roman empire one need to hold Rome and speak latin at least as an administrative language. otherwise even Clovis make a good bid for the empire.
    One hears this a lot, and I really must object to the argument, which in many ways simply perpetuates the ignorance and racism of the first Crusaders.

    First and foremost: we really should let ethnic groups themselves decide on their name. Nobody insists on referring to the Inuit people as "Eskimos" nowadays, and I don't really see why the Romaioi of Romania should get lumped with whatever label outsiders wish to apply to them. The state of the people who referred to themselves as Romans was Romania, although I agree there's half an argument to ditch the term "Empire" for what by the fourth century was evolving into something much more closely resembling a nation state. I think the term "Byzantine Roman Empire" is perhaps acceptable, to reflect the dominance of a capital whose intellectual elite still knew as "Byzantion", but "Greek Empire" most certainly is not.

    In terms of the language- certainly by the eleventh century, but in all probability long before this, the language was called "Roman"- or "Romaic". Byzantine Romans referred to the "Roman language" (ie Romanic, or medieval Greek) and "our ancestral language" (Latin), and there are descriptions of texts being translated (oddly, to our areas) between "Latin" and "Roman". In any case, the upper classes of the Roman world had always spoken Greek. The earliest Roman historian, Q. Fabius Pictor, wrote the earliest work of Roman historiography in Greek, for example.

    In terms of control of Rome, well, Mark Antony never controlled Rome during the wars with Caesar Octavianus- does that mean Caesar was right when he portrayed the wars of the late 30s BC as purely a Roman conflict with Egypt? How about the Emperor Diocletian, who always based his administration in the Eastern Mediterranean: was he not a Roman Emperor? In both cases, clearly not- these were men who had been brought up in a thoroughly Roman society, and did not lose their Roman-ness when divorced from the city itself. To give another example: Hawaii isn't part of North America, so do the people of Hawaii cease to be Americans? How about British Falklanders?

    In short- certainly up until 1204, you're dealing with a state that called itself either simple Romania (Romanland) or else "Politeia ton Romaion", which is best translated as "Republic of the Romans". It was inhabited by a people who had called themselves Romans certainly since the fourth century AD, and in many cases for considerably longer than that, and whose language was known as "Roman", and was always known to its eastern neighbours as "Rum". This, quite simply, was not the case for Francia, or Ottonian Germany (or indeed the Ottoman Empire, at the later end of the spectrum, although at least the Ottomans did rule over a people calling themselves, and identifying as, Roman!).

  20. #20
    Jurand of Cracow's Avatar History and gameplay!
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    Default Re: Have you notticed?

    A recent book deals with the problems you're discussing here: Romanland. Ethnicity and Empire in Byzantium. Anthony Kaldellis

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