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Thread: Where now are the horse and the rider...

  1. #21
    Mergor's Avatar T H E | G O R
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    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    Loose Cannon, in a real court, you wouldn't be invited to the jury anyway because the style of your writing is equivalent to that of a 5 year old.

    You don't bring anything new to the table other than your frustration. Check your facts: I might be biased, but at least I'm not brainwashed.

  2. #22
    Loose Cannon's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    Quote Originally Posted by Mergor View Post
    Loose Cannon, in a real court, you wouldn't be invited to the jury anyway because the style of your writing is equivalent to that of a 5 year old.

    You don't bring anything new to the table other than your frustration. Check your facts: I might be biased, but at least I'm not brainwashed.
    Son, I've being a juror in multiple courts in multiple jurisdictions. There are 3 things a citizen should do-Serve, Vote, and do Jury Duty. But as an only child I wasn't allowed to serve during the draft. Then I got too old. Missed one vote in 1980-never before or again
    Last edited by Lifthrasir; May 16, 2018 at 12:29 PM. Reason: Commenting on Moderaton part removed
    Old age and treachery will always beat youth and exuberance-David Mamet

    Old age and forgetfullness makes it . . .er, I forgot-Loose Cannon

  3. #23
    Hader's Avatar Things are very seldom what they seem. In my experience, they’re usually a damn sight worse.
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    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    What a great cup of coffee I have today. I'll get back to everything before this post shortly (ish)

  4. #24

    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    Lol ..apologies Hader for the hassle .....I find myself resisting the urge like a ten year old , and pointing at people saying "he started it " ....{grins} ...

    says the admonished, blushing PBOB

  5. #25
    Hader's Avatar Things are very seldom what they seem. In my experience, they’re usually a damn sight worse.
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    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    Quote Originally Posted by Parafix View Post
    I have told anyone patricipating in seven realms not to attack TWC or repeat the same lines done from jadli and crew from burning twc hotseats down to the ground.
    That's going swimmingly then. Seems you were misheard. Perhaps even by yourself.

    Quote Originally Posted by Parafix View Post
    I didnt want to put time into a community with people such as jadli or hannibal, i started somewhere to run my own games, as i said i would on TWC a few months back, more became involved than i expected, in which i have repeated that people can be involved with both.

    Ive also repeated that i wont be stealing my own games and projects even though they are struggling here.
    Yet you still posted links and PMed people all over the place for your new site in a way you should well have known was against the ToS. If your beef was with a few select people mainly, then you could have achieved a more amicable outcome by simply asking to post it, or even just doing it in a less antagonizing fashion by not coupling it with bashing certain members.



    Quote Originally Posted by Gimli View Post
    Hader,

    Why wasn't Jadli permanently banned after numerous TOS violations, as well as his repeated disregard for authority, and his will to lie before all of this; and why above all that was he NOT permanently banned after stealing all the admin passwords, and various other things already mentioned. He constantly pursued and in-sighted confrontations with Parafix full well knowing he would receive a response, in which led to Parafix being removed from GS.

    If you were leaving, why did you not make Soul a member of the Hex in which he could be a key person to represent the community on the administration team rather than leave and let people who don't know the community try and admin it.

    As of now, there is no oversight in the hotseating community, no direction, no leadership, and no rule(s) enforcement. General Hotseating is filled with users maxed at admin capacity, as well as a blatant disregard for the rules put in place in which there are far to many hotseats for public demand, in turn, will result in mass problems should players leave.When will you appoint someone to actually lead the hotseating community again and provide new content, new leadership that Soul, and or Parafix would've provided should they have stayed?

    ___

    The whole source of this division, this problem results at the feet of one person only. All this leads back to one person who started everything, and in turn can deal with the consequences. Everyone has blame for letting this disease, this sickness fester in which it grew to a point that it resulted in half the community being ripped apart. We as a community failed to act.
    Permanent bans are not handed out lightly. Beyond adbots and someone that posts porn, I think only one person ever has actually been permabanned from TWC (perhaps some more, though I doubt it, and in any case, it still is very few). Say what you will of the situation here, but permabans were never an option last year, last month, or even now (though it has come closer to that).

    As I've said before, it was a mistake of me to leave as hex and not set things up proper. But I intentionally did not make Soul a hex either, both for reasons relating to his personal behavior I think that have become evident recently, and that having a GS hex focused on one section would not be the best way to fill the position. I don't question his dedication and hard work to hotseats, but it was limited to just that.

    This entire thing has obviously left staff undermanned, but it isn't something that can't be remedied over time either. Other parts of staff have faced similar issues, even if for different reasons. We'll find a way. But it is up to those who do play hotseats here and wish to help to actually do so, train others as admins, participate in discussions, etc.



    Quote Originally Posted by General Dragon. View Post
    @Hader
    So it does mean that people can send in their applications for GS, but when will be the time period when you will consider actual approval of joining? Right now there is atleast one GS for every section, making it that General will have 2 could ease some burden for Athelstan, but it is your call in the end.
    I will accept any and all applications, I have no timeframe for accepting any, though I don't intend to wait much on it, and there may be special conditions depending on who applies.

  6. #26

    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    Quote Originally Posted by Hader View Post
    Yet you still posted links and PMed people all over the place for your new site in a way you should well have known was against the ToS.
    Noone was forced to go to Seven Reals, all games hosted by members (staff and non staff) that went to SR didn't move their games.
    Jadli on the other hand forced people to come over. I didn't want to join his forum so I just got kicked from those hotseats.
    That is quite a differnce in attitude/ not wanting to hurt TWC on purpose/ blackmailing TWC
    Even tho he did all of this, he's allowed to come back, quite rediculous imo

  7. #27

    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    Quote Originally Posted by King of Dawn View Post
    Noone was forced to go to Seven Reals, all games hosted by members (staff and non staff) that went to SR didn't move their games.
    Jadli on the other hand forced people to come over. I didn't want to join his forum so I just got kicked from those hotseats.
    That is quite a differnce in attitude/ not wanting to hurt TWC on purpose/ blackmailing TWC
    Even tho he did all of this, he's allowed to come back, quite rediculous imo
    From my memory , that was not the case , some people moved to the new area, some played on both areas , some declined to stay at TWC, some even decided that they had enough of the bickering of either side and refused to support either side and stayed away, others just simply stopped playing altogether. Some of the hotseats died in this new climate [on jadli's site] , as with personel lacking [other later did so after they returned, momentum lost], others were suspended . From memory again , I remember , people could stay or people could go , and some hotseats still continued on TWC , although however both areas , were suffering from toxicity , which effected all ..

    All sides were hurt , and most have admitted there part in things .., apart from soul of course [who is blameless ..in his view at least] ...but all sides were damaged in this event.

    To some degree Soul didn't have to leave.....he could have just asked for a small folder for himself and his friends if he wished, or conducted his own games in private in a quiet area of the site. In my mind , his decision to do so , and his current attitude , just reinforces the fact , he holds himself without blame , and that he holds all here at TWC to blame , for what I think is partly also his fault. Why did he not stay if he felt , he was blameless ,..and if he wanted to just to help the community here playing games , he could equally done so ?
    Last edited by paladinbob123; May 16, 2018 at 11:51 AM.

  8. #28
    Parafix's Avatar I have this stick...
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    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    Quote Originally Posted by Hader View Post
    That's going swimmingly then. Seems you were misheard. Perhaps even by yourself.

    Yet you still posted links and PMed people all over the place for your new site in a way you should well have known was against the ToS. If your beef was with a few select people mainly, then you could have achieved a more amicable outcome by simply asking to post it, or even just doing it in a less antagonizing fashion by not coupling it with bashing certain members.

    Permanent bans are not handed out lightly. Beyond adbots and someone that posts porn, I think only one person ever has actually been permabanned from TWC (perhaps some more, though I doubt it, and in any case, it still is very few). Say what you will of the situation here, but permabans were never an option last year, last month, or even now (though it has come closer to that).

    As I've said before, it was a mistake of me to leave as hex and not set things up proper. But I intentionally did not make Soul a hex either, both for reasons relating to his personal behavior I think that have become evident recently, and that having a GS hex focused on one section would not be the best way to fill the position. I don't question his dedication and hard work to hotseats, but it was limited to just that.

    This entire thing has obviously left staff undermanned, but it isn't something that can't be remedied over time either. Other parts of staff have faced similar issues, even if for different reasons. We'll find a way. But it is up to those who do play hotseats here and wish to help to actually do so, train others as admins, participate in discussions, etc.

    I will accept any and all applications, I have no timeframe for accepting any, though I don't intend to wait much on it, and there may be special conditions depending on who applies.
    I posted links in my mods threads and pm'd anyone currently using our mod / HS work. As the work has moved elsewhere.
    I remember the days you praising my way of talking and doing things, seems it was only good when it wasn't directed at you or your colleagues.

    You leaving Hex was rather meaningless, you did nothing to as the role apart from assign GS said need to be assigned, role which other Hex filled in the time you were gone. Once other members of Hex agreed Tango over stepped his place as Hex, and had to other hex members address the ways he was moderating my posts, it was obvious he wasn't fit to run or make decisions on GS / HS matters, your return was just the enforcement of already poorly made decisions of Tango. GS hasn't had a hex since poach, you were a temporary filler, hence the lack of work from yourself.

    If those of Sevenrealms are attacking anyone, it's those of the HS community you refused to listen too, attacking you or those who stole TWC hosted official games, forced players to move off site, blackmailed to get what they wanted. You ignored the entirety of your GS team, started removing members without giving reason.

    You'll find the games i have admin password to, i have left alone, upon request of some players to move them over here, i messaged Bolton who is current admin, that if he and all the players wished for that to happen, so they can be ran properly compared to how they're being ran now, that was fine. (These are games i created, with my mod and systems, if the admin and entire playerbase agreed (obviously with the exception of Jadli) then i consider no issue with this.) Bolton said he wanted to try continue them, so i wished him luck. It's rather public me close to yelling at certain individuals persisting the games being moved over, against the admin and full players will, and at this point is crystal clear that i don't need to jump down a canyon to reach the same level of Jadli to run a HS community.

    I will enjoy watching you appointing those into GS who we know you'll appoint, no matter the time frame, you can almost sense their giddiness, at which point you would of lost all credibility.

    Now, no need to advertise Sevenrealms on a sticky thread, Jadli has gone out his way to harass players in pm's already and i'd rather not have TWC "representatives" having cause to continue this behavior, also the site has no ambition of stealing anything from TWC, the veterans, youngbloods and new players filling are playerbase at a swift rate are not property of TWC, they can play where they like. Just happens we offer more of a welcoming experience, and a more rewarding one.

    Your not completely at fault for this Hader, in the end it goes onto Jadli and Tango, and expecting someone who has spent years as "GS Hex" who's workload in the HS department consisted of nothing, you cannot hardly be expected to jump into a lot of work without screwing up.

  9. #29
    Mergor's Avatar T H E | G O R
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    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    King of Dawn, while I don't want to get into another argument, I really want to adress this, because this is one of the biggest lies, and I don't know why Soul spreads this. He, of all people should know that this is a lie, because I adressed this to him, the moment hotseats started moving.

    Jadli did not force people to come over. There were two separate types of HS-s.
    One: Those what were Jadli's. Since he was the one making these scenarios, and he knew the password, was the admin, ran the game, it is quite understandable that he'd want to continue them. Good example is IR I and II where without him, it is impossible to continue, because of the custom missions and events. He had all the rights to bring these games over because of this one reason, and furthermore, most players wanted to move for the time being. He had his own right, and the support from his players.
    Two: Every other game. In every other game, the admins of the hotseats agreed with moving the HS-s. There was no password stealing, because the players of those hotseats, and the admins wanted to move. I moved my games, but I didn't even want to. You know why? Because I asked every single player to voice their opinions, and other than 2 players (from the combined playerbase of two big HS-s) (One of which wasn't even on "Soul's side") wanted the HS to go. Thus, popular demand told me to move, so I did. Dare someone tell me after this that I blindly followed Jadli after he stole my passwords and forced me to move, and I'll have words ready for him I don't normally use.
    Last edited by Mergor; May 16, 2018 at 11:53 AM.

  10. #30
    Loose Cannon's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    @Hader Wow, another puffpiece from some one who should know better. This reply is directed only to you. You should be able to answer yourself.

    Yes, some people did ask some admins over here (and those people are already with seven realms) to move some games even after Parafix told them not to. This morning, the Head of Moderation over at Seven Realms laid down the law for other members concerning this problem. They now understand what will happen to them if it occurs again.

    Actually, what are you doing about all the porn posted here? Ever since I visited Victories Secrets for some stuff for a special someone all the ads I get fed here on TWC are VS's and they all have lingerie with most showing areolas in violation of the TOS. But you won't do anything about it because you are you. And that explains it all.

    I know you see my deleted posts here why haven't you replied? You are you.

    Why would anyone care to be GS here where the Admin won't support GS. If your job here is too tough you can resign from HEX and go about other business.

    And do you know how I know the Head of Moderation threatened some People at Seven Realms? He has the same avatar I have but hasn't added the David Mamet quote yet because a better place deserves better than the crap people receive over here? I am so glad I never took up the people who wanted to offer me Citizen-ship status here.

    And I'm still waiting for your reply from 2 months ago. Because you are you. Stop being scared, man up!



    @paladinbob13 No, TWC doesn't have the ability (server or software wise) to expand folders or subforms. Maybe one day they'll run a Kickstarter or just beg for money here like GED always does. And then the same people will give their pennies.
    Old age and treachery will always beat youth and exuberance-David Mamet

    Old age and forgetfullness makes it . . .er, I forgot-Loose Cannon

  11. #31

    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    Quote Originally Posted by paladinbob123 View Post
    From my memory , that was not the case
    Which of my points are uncorrect?
    Everytime, this fact just gets ingored... just blackmailing untill you get what you want...

    @Mergor
    What? The admin asked me if I would follow to the new forum.
    I said no, so I just got kicked, that's the reality how it went, face it.
    You forced people to come over/ get kicked
    Soul and Para didn't. Even tho they made the mods (ADOS 0.1) and started hotseats on it, they don't move them
    Last edited by King of Dawn; May 16, 2018 at 11:52 AM.

  12. #32

    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    Quote Originally Posted by King of Dawn View Post
    Which of my points are uncorrect?
    Everytime, this fact just gets ingored... just blackmailing untill you get what you want...
    from what I remember ... your statement is incorrect :- "Jadli on the other hand forced people to come over"

    ask others if you wish for more views..but those who stayed , stayed and those who wanted to leave left....nobody was "forced" in my mind...how could we "force" a person to come over? Some just threw there hands up in despair and just left all games from my recollection from both forums.
    Last edited by paladinbob123; May 16, 2018 at 12:10 PM.

  13. #33

    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    @PBOB, you couldn't force people to make an account on the new site and play ofcourse. But you just moved all the hotseats (even though some players didn't want), and the players that didn't want to come over were kicked.
    Soul and Para on the other hand, told their new members not to move their hotseats away from the site.
    They started new ones, noone was kicked, nothing was moved.
    So please adress this point, tell me how Jadli is the good guy, tell me how Soul and Para are the bad guys.

  14. #34

    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    Quote Originally Posted by King of Dawn View Post
    @PBOB, you couldn't force people to make an account on the new site and play ofcourse. But you just moved all the hotseats (even though some players didn't want), and the players that didn't want to come over were kicked.
    Soul and Para on the other hand, told their new members not to move their hotseats away from the site.
    They started new ones, noone was kicked, nothing was moved.
    So please adress this point, tell me how Jadli is the good guy, tell me how Soul and Para are the bad guys.
    I think there is always going to be differiculty when deciding what is to be moved...from memory , the only ones that were moved successfully, where when a majority of players were happy to have a hotseat moved..[for lets face it..if one person objects and the others want to play..then it is going to moved or a new thread started for it..for a hotseat is basically the players that play it]...and those that didn't have the support ...were not moved [for they would not have the support and/or were suspended]

    As for saying Jadli or Soul/Para are neither Good or equally Bad [per se]....but a fight needs two sides...and neither side looked out responsibility for the community as whole at that time...Was not Soul equally doing things for the benefits of his position? , rather than for the community [similar to Jadli] ...Therefore both sides are equally to blame...but Soul doesn't see it that way
    Last edited by paladinbob123; May 16, 2018 at 12:39 PM.

  15. #35

    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    Quote Originally Posted by paladinbob123 View Post
    I think there is always going to be differiculty when deciding what is to be moved...from memory , the only ones that were moved successfully, where when a majority of players were happy to have a hotseat moved..[for lets face it..if one person objects and the others want to play..then it is going to moved or a new thread started for it..for a hotseat is basically the players that play it]...and those that didn't have the support ...were not moved [for they would not have the support and/or were suspended]
    Just don't move the hotseats? moving a hotseats is hurting TWC.
    If Jadli had enough followers, just start new hotseats, and let the old ones be played untill the end on TWC?
    That's how Soul and Para are handling the situation right now, that's the good way to handle things.

    Just moving hotseats is completly worng.

    If you wanted to follow Jadli, fine,just be a honorable man and finish your hotseats on the site that they were started

  16. #36
    Lifthrasir's Avatar "Capre" Dunkerquois
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    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    Gentlemen, I'd like to remind you to discuss about these events in a civil manner. You can discuss/review, comment, criticize and share your own opinion but always in a respecful manner. Any further infringement may conduct to harsher moderation action than just post edition/deletion. Thank you for your understanding.
    Under the patronage of Flinn, proud patron of Jadli, from the Heresy Vault of the Imperial House of Hader

  17. #37

    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    Quote Originally Posted by King of Dawn View Post
    Just don't move the hotseats? moving a hotseats is hurting TWC.
    If Jadli had enough followers, just start new hotseats, and let the old ones be played untill the end on TWC?
    That's how Soul and Para are handling the situation right now, that's the good way to handle things.

    Just moving hotseats is completly worng.

    If you wanted to follow Jadli, fine,just be a honorable man and finish your hotseats on the site that they were started
    It sounds absurd. If great most of players wanted to move some HS off side and just one or dwo players opposed it then HS should move off side. Why great most of players should play on the side on which this very few players wants to play insteed of on the side the rest players wants to play on. It is a bit choosing the lesser evil, but it was better to HS end just for you then for all the players involved. Also this "If Jadli had enough followers, just start new hotseats, and let the old ones be played untill the end on TWC"... You criticize Jadli for alleged forcing players to changing side they play on and on the other hand you claim that HS should continue to TWC or nowhere just because you want it that way when you know whole rest of players want to move it off side. You are not the navel of the world.

  18. #38

    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    Quote Originally Posted by Potatoto View Post
    It is a bit choosing the lesser evil, but it was better to HS end just for you then for all the players involved..
    Meh, here we go again:
    Or the players could just man up and finish the hotseat on TWC. Instead of running away.
    I'm wanting to leave this site. But I just stay to finish my hotseats.
    Moving hotseats and being like "if you don't accept our saviour back on your site, we leave it and general section will be dead" is just a wrong thing to do.
    If you think you were in the right leaving the site, blackmailing TWC to accept Jadli back, that's fine for me. But your morals are a bit messed up

  19. #39
    misafeco's Avatar Biarchus
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    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    Morals of both sides are messed up TBH. Why not just end fighting and stay here in peace?
    I know, I know.

    Btw. I declined to continue HS's on Jadli's site back then, but I didn't mind they moved it as it was the decision of most of the players. I do agree with the person who said that Hotseat=The Players whoever it was. The site only gives them the technical background.
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  20. #40
    Hannibal2001's Avatar Simply Barbaric
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    Default Re: Where now are the horse and the rider...

    Quote Originally Posted by King of Dawn View Post
    Which of my points are uncorrect?
    Everytime, this fact just gets ingored... just blackmailing untill you get what you want...

    @Mergor
    What? The admin asked me if I would follow to the new forum.
    I said no, so I just got kicked, that's the reality how it went, face it.
    You forced people to come over/ get kicked
    Soul and Para didn't. Even tho they made the mods (ADOS 0.1) and started hotseats on it, they don't move them
    Excuse me? After the majority of the players said they'd want to move the hotseat to the newly created forum I accepted and moved it there. I did not force you to come to the new forum nor did any other admins during that period. I simply asked if you wanted to continue the hotseat there with the other fellows. You refused, I respected that, but as your access to the hotseat was cut off since you didn't want to join the forum where it was moved by the players decision you couldn't play your turns. I tried to keep every hotseat on TWC same as other admins here.

    If you and other players choose to join Soul's newly created forum then go ahead. No one is forcing you to stay here. We respect your decision but do not come here, insult us and make false accusations.
    Last edited by Hannibal2001; May 16, 2018 at 02:51 PM.

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