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Thread: The Total War Chat Thread

  1. #21
    Daruwind's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: The Total War Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Huberto View Post
    But then we saw an abnormally large amount of people playing ME w/ Norsca once the big update hit, which is for 1/2 the 30 day period measured. In any case, the last 7 days is deeply misleading.
    As is deeply misleading using 30 day long period when WH2 was expecting such big update while all other games are in stable position. Letīs wait 14 more days.

    But even with that, the average before the patch was around like 14k just for WH2 alone..... simply no TW is beating WH2.
    Last edited by Daruwind; June 13, 2018 at 10:48 PM.

  2. #22
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    Default Re: The Total War Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Daruwind View Post
    But even with that, the average before the patch was around like 14k just for WH2 alone..... simply no TW is beating WH2.
    It doesn't matter if "any" single TW is beating WH2, the issue is whether more people play Warhammer or the historical titles. More people play the historical titles.

  3. #23
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    Default Re: The Total War Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Huberto View Post
    It doesn't matter if "any" single TW is beating WH2, the issue is whether more people play Warhammer or the historical titles. More people play the historical titles.
    You mean 10 games were toe to toe with two games before 1st June. By all means have your past victory! I salute you!

    EDIT: just my statistical mind wanted to add. Difference 200 people at 18000 is difference about 1%, if in hypothetical battle history vs fantasy any side is winning by a few % that would be total Pyrhic Victory or more likely a draw, tie, stalemale....
    Last edited by Daruwind; June 14, 2018 at 12:00 AM.

  4. #24

    Default Re: The Total War Chat Thread

    I feel sad for starting this popularity contest but I always feel the divide between the fantasy and historical fans puzzling for a few reasons:

    - Third Age mod was THE most popular M2 mod by far, even eclipised by Stainless Steel, so the fanbase has always wanted a fantasy game.
    - mods for Warhammer Fantasy already exist.
    - Warhammer Fantasy Battle is THE setting for a fantasy Total War game considering unlike LOTR or Games of Thrones (which do not elaborate all that much about war and different units), it has: well-defined factions based on real world analogues that they are easily adapted into medieval style Total War, good looking and well-functioning armors and weapons because again, they are based on real world equivalences, stats and balance already existing on the table top, recognizeable characters and a big varied, colorful world that also sorta real world Europe.

    Of course things went to during End Times and now Age of Sigmar, but people disliking WHFB because it's silly is incredibly dishonest in their criticism, Rome Total War 1 with the war elephants and parthians in purple pajama and the Pharaoh-era egyptians were sillier than Warhammer.

    Though that reminds me, one of the things I dislike about current CA is that aside from the DLC policies, they don't seem to make complete editions anymore starting from Attila, now I have to buy every little DLC which cost a ing lot.

  5. #25
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    I think this is actually not problem of Warhammer or 3K but they are just boxing bags for some other issues. Rome 1, Med 1+2, Shogun 1, Empire+Napoleon... they all have many downs yet with mods you can almost forgot there were any old problems... and because Shogun 2 is set in specific time and place where you can easily forgive some un-historical things due to arts and narrative, so everybody was expecting Rome 2 to be THE TW game. Holy grail. (Of course we have Holy Grail 2.0 as Med 3) Expectations were too high plus trailer was promise of things to come ...but they never came. And it took like 16 patches to get things running..

    From this point we got Attila which is one of the best TW so far, dark and really hardore in comparison but Attila suffered from Rome 2 backlash. Some fans were still hurted, some boycotted it, then bad optimalization and simply not many saw the bright side of the game.....fast forward into current time.

    Warhammer is massive hit, bringings tons of new people yet they are mostly "newcomers". Whatīs more WH is getting not one,not two but three games. Excellent DLCs content, FLCs, replayability And now 3K has Romance mod and some are simply nervous that the development is not going in their ideal direction and that their glorious Med 3 wonīt happen or wonīt be as perfect. Plus there is big demand for LotR, GoT games (and yes, I completely agree with you that these setting are nowhere near as suitable for TW as Warhammer is for multiple reasons and biggest being probably these universes were never developed as game platforms while Warhammer from beggining has all advantages different races,unique units, abilities, spells, items, heroes... everything had the vision about being part of gameplay, gamewise system ironed out in mumltiple editions)
    +Simply everbody has different vision of his own perfect TW which sadly will never happen. We can get pretty awesome one but never the perfect one as everybody here has different order of priorities, wishes..

    CA is trying to do at least something for history fans...we have Rome 2 DLCs, ToB but many see it as being handed second grade stuff. Everybody looking at shiny new toys like Tomb Kings and thinking what it could be like having such resources for their perfect game.. I just think that if CA announce that after 3K, WH3 there will be Med 3 many will be happy and will just wait. It is similar to Norsca problems in WH2. Because CA was honest and layed out plans, people accepted delay.

    On other hand steam sales are really really predictable like season in the year. I mean if somebody doesnīt want to play right or if money are problems I would always advise to wait for these sales..

    And here Iīm. Fan of TW no matter what, enjoying both history and fantasy content among fanatics from both sides. Of course every TW has many problems, bugs, of course every time there could be more features and ideas but the games are still fun for me. :-)

  6. #26

    Default Re: The Total War Chat Thread

    Yeah, all said and done, I still think even the most CA hater still cares about the Total War series because they know CA as a whole still cares, even if a little bit.

    There's so many dead strategy franchises nowadays that fans just frankly give up because the devs really don't give a , like recently how Relic just dropped Dawn of War 3.

  7. #27
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    Default Re: The Total War Chat Thread

    I really want a new engine before Med 3, they should've ditched this one ages ago.

  8. #28
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    Default Re: The Total War Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by REhorror View Post
    I feel sad for starting this popularity contest but I always feel the divide between the fantasy and historical fans puzzling for a few reasons:

    - Third Age mod was THE most popular M2 mod by far, even eclipised by Stainless Steel, so the fanbase has always wanted a fantasy game.
    - mods for Warhammer Fantasy already exist.
    - Warhammer Fantasy Battle is THE setting for a fantasy Total War game considering unlike LOTR or Games of Thrones (which do not elaborate all that much about war and different units), it has: well-defined factions based on real world analogues that they are easily adapted into medieval style Total War, good looking and well-functioning armors and weapons because again, they are based on real world equivalences, stats and balance already existing on the table top, recognizeable characters and a big varied, colorful world that also sorta real world Europe.
    There are many TW fans who enjoy fantasy and history. I'm one of them. I just don't like fantasy in Total War games. I find Warhammer's "real world analgoues" childish and vapid. I want to do empire building and campaigning in historical settings, not fantasy ones. There are a lot of people like me and there is nothing you can do to change our opinion of fantasy Total War. It just sucks . However, there are plenty of others like you and Daruwind who like both.

    To say that Persians clad in PJ's are "sillier" than skeletons and dinosaur units is beyond reason. Obviously the latter is pure fantasy, and the former represent human beings in silly costume. Human beings and war elephants can be modded into more realistic depictions, making the game more attractive to players seeking historical immersion.

    Daruwind is right, people in my section of the two circle venn diagram don't feel that TW is addressing our interests with TWR2 dlc and ThroB, and now the Dynasty Warriors inspired 3K. Yes the fanbase is changing as the focus of CA changes. My point in the popularity posts below is that we're still here, even as the fanbase has become inundated with Warhammer fans. But if CA goes long enough without a historically authentic game that offers quality content (unlike most DLC and ThroB) we'll be gone. We're not waiting for the "perfect game," we're waiting for another quality historical title like Attila. (I'm not saying there aren't a lot of RTW/Med2 fantatics that want new editions of those games, but most of us just want a good historical title). 3K easily could have been that game, but for commercial imperatives.

    The multiple teams argument that CA makes is a lie. Look at Simon Mann moving over from Warhammer to 3K for example. They produce one big game at a time with a very large team like all studios, but now they have very small teams do DLC and side projects like Saga. 3K is fundamentally a fantasy project. All indications are that the classic version will be a stripped down Romance version. Maybe mods will help, but I don't know how you mod out things like the goofy hero UI that blocks out 1/4 of the screen and links special abilities units to specific heroes. When the hero dies do the units lose their special formation ability and wtf?

    This is all a long break up letter with Total War commercially as I feel they have been breaking up with me since WH was announced in 2015. It has zero to do with them not making Medieval 3 or the "perfect game." It's about neglecting and distorting history for all the open wallets among Games Workshop and Dynasty Warriors fanbases.

    I'll still get the motivation to play a campaign, it will be one of the older games modded, a Darthmod or Stainless Steel or Ancient Empires or DeI. I hope ThroB gets a good mod, maybe then I reinstall. But I'm done shopping TW as they no longer make quality content for me.

  9. #29

    Default Re: The Total War Chat Thread

    I really don't find how this is childish and vapid, gonna do an art comparison here:
    Warhammer lizardman:

    Actual Rome 1 Parthian pajaman spearman:


    Even if you can mod that pajama out, it does not change that the azteca dinosaurs are far from looking childishly.

    You might argue Tomb King is childish but again, Rome 1 has the same pharaoh-era naked egyptian soldiers.

    Like it or not, but Gee Dub in particular knows their regarding weapon and armor design.

    Though I have to agree with 3K, though on the opposite side, they should stick to the Romance from the get go and get creative with it, instead of halfassing.

  10. #30
    The Wandering Storyteller's Avatar Content Staff
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    Shogun 2 HAD THE MOST FANTASY SIEGES EVER! There is and there was no way that Samurai could walk on walls like that. Most likely they had siege ladders. Muskets were often used and cavalry charges were instantly the same as you saw in the 3k vid. Nothing about Shogun 2 historically was accurate either. Plus the battles were over in five minutes. Most of the fighting was done by peasant infantrymen. Same with the Chinese. The elite units really only would have fought at crucial moments.

    Plus CA added 'hero' units in Shogun 2 and no one complained then. The obvious inaccuracies of Fall of the Samurai (They clearly ripped off the Last Samurai) Where American and British troops battle Japanese troops (This was not the case at all.) Samurai charging units at infantry? Nope. How about steamships blowing holes into battlefields (Which was fun) but how could do they do that so far?

    Geisha weren't that common nor were ninja during that time but they made an appearance. China's romantic duelists weren't common either (It's unlikely that these famous Chinese warlords would have fought like this when they had hundreds of men under of their command, but that doesn't strictly rule out either that such events did happen.)

    So 3K is nothing more than a fantasy total war just as Shogun 2 is. In fact if you think about it, RTW was a fantasy total war game in many aspects - nothing of it was accurate. 3K will turn out exactly as Shogun 2 was.

    For those historical fans, haven't your games always had an element of fantasy? NTW had total fantasy - especially with the depiction of unit uniforms (true.) Musket fire (not so great in vanilla) flanked formations (NTW's mods increased numbers and allowed for more depth of fire so that battles looked like battles.) Skirmishers being eliminated in the first round, then whole ranks of infantry being decimated (not the case.) Columns (not shown in this game.) Cannons (inaccurate in the game and had wide range fire) Basically put, even the maps of NTW were so jumbled up that they didn't even reflect the wide geography of the landscape of the Napoleonic Wars. Ships couldn't fire so accurately as they do in ETW and NTW. ETW had all the same problems. RTW 2 was even more fantasy then depicted.

    I do not accept the clause that historical fans should protest just because there is a classical mode and a fantasy mode. What RTW 2 sure had the minor factions dominating the world map didn't it? Fans did ask for a historically accurate mode and a fantasy mode for factions but CA didn't implement that. Where was the outrage then? Why should it be now? I personally think you cannot avoid adding the duels. This era of Three Kingdoms is so famous in China that it's impossible to have these heroes fighting like common generals. It's in movies, games, TV, media etc. It's literally become embedded into Chinese culture just like the Legend of King Arthur has into British culture. RTW 2'S BATTLES WERE NOT AUTHENTIC NOR ACCURATE IN ANY SHAPE OR FORM!

    And I'll repeat: HISTORICAL GAMES OF THIS SERIES HAS NEVER BEEN HISTORICALLY AUTHENTIC OR ACCURATE IN ANY SHAPE OR FORM! Far from it. I don't agree that the Parthians should be depicted as they are. Fact is Persia should get way more representation and better-looking units. But until CA goes to the Ancient Middle East, unlikely to happen.

    You have a mode to choose the option to play fantasy or classical. I don't see any problems why CA fans should start complaining right now.

    Haven't you guys realized it by now? CA is a new company with new people. They maybe have played total war or not. The old guard of CA I believe is leaving for new people to come in. And new people will have completely new decisions to make hence which is why the older fans don't like the recent changes to the total war series. And these new people working at CA just copy Total War mods. How? DEI had an system where you only could recruit units based on the number of population or something like that. CA then introduced this feature into TOB.
    Last edited by The Wandering Storyteller; June 14, 2018 at 01:45 PM.





















































  11. #31

    Default Re: The Total War Chat Thread

    The duels are an absolute must if they follow the Romance (not Chronicles).

    There's like a chapter with Guan Yu killing 6 generals at 6 gates to get back to Liu Bei after he bye'd Cao Cao. Then you have absolute badass/ridiculous like Zhao Yun fending an entire army with a baby on his back.

    To not include the duel would be not accurate to the Romance.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daruwind View Post
    They have more teams. You are missing "new historical team", based in Sofia - Bulgary,which is responsible for new Rome 2 DLCs (Empire Divided, Desert Kingdoms and nex campaign pack), then they have Jack Lustenīs Saga team currently working on ToB DLCs and of course 3K "history team"..then they have at least two fantasy teams. Main one "fantasy team" probably already started pre-production works on Warhammer 3 while "new fantasy content team" is working on WH2 DLCs. These teams i can easily distinguish then there are some more for Arena, Access and these not TW teams...

    https://www.totalwar.com/blog/what-t...g-on-june-2018



    There should be another E3 presentation fo TW tomorrow so maybe we will get more there.

    About Rome 2 we know only that it should feature new smaller but detail campaign map, combination of time and place wasnīt explored a lot previously and probably wonīt feature India. :-)

    I would suggest visiting our dedicated little speculation threads in WH section

    WH2 possible DLCs
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...DLC(s)-SteamDB
    WH3 possible races
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...in-Warhammer-3

    As of now there are two unknown DLCs in WH2 steam DB while we are expecting Lord pack for Skaven/Lizardmen, next campaign pack (probably Southern Realms), then FLC roadman was about 10 pices long and we have currently 6 released (ME,laboratory mode,Steps of Isha maps, 2xLL HE+Skavens, Bone Giant) and we know that we should get two more LLs for DE/Lizardmen for sure. Then there is If question about future things like any Bretonnia style update/free race? Or WH3 preorder (Araby maybe?)

    Cathay/Ind/Nippon are related things. If old datamined info is correct for WH3, then there is probably no Cathay...if things got changed, then maybe. :-)
    If things get changed, then I'll propose a toast the day Cathay/Ind or Nippon are announced.

    Otherwise, you're telling me that there's 10 more DLCs to come for free? Wow!

    Seems ever since I said India, there's been the running joke, 'NO INDIA!' Hahaha

    Yes I think the Rat and Snake DLC is going to come very soon. Along with DOW and then Araby (I think they'll be announced like the Tomb Kings and then the game will go over to the announcement of Warhammer 3.)





















































  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by San Felipe View Post
    If things get changed, then I'll propose a toast the day Cathay/Ind or Nippon are announced.

    Otherwise, you're telling me that there's 10 more DLCs to come for free? Wow!

    Seems ever since I said India, there's been the running joke, 'NO INDIA!' Hahaha

    Yes I think the Rat and Snake DLC is going to come very soon. Along with DOW and then Araby (I think they'll be announced like the Tomb Kings and then the game will go over to the announcement of Warhammer 3.)
    These 10 are FLCs, we already got 6 of those (Trentch,Alith Anar, Steps of Isha, Bone Giant,Laboratory mode, Mortal Empire) so 4 more should come and 2 should be LL for DE/Lizardmen.

    According to the lastest blogpost next will be campaign pack ala TK so probably DoW/Southern Realms. Then probably Rats+Snakes Lord pack and then hopefully we will see something like WH3 preorder (Araby maybe?) and maybe free update ala Bretonnia (Vampire Coast like pack of LL for old world races?)

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by lolIsuck View Post
    I really want a new engine before Med 3, they should've ditched this one ages ago.
    Yeah, CA should do that. What CA actually should do was to replace the Warscape engine after the fiasko with R2TW.

    Another thing that CA should really consider and that's to only use 64-bits engine, because a 64-bit engine provides two things - (1) More stable game, (2) Better graphics since a 64-bit engine support DX11 while a 32-bit engine only support DX9.
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  15. #35

    Default Re: The Total War Chat Thread

    I'm done shopping TW as they no longer make quality content for me
    It has increasingly felt like that for me since the realisation that ThroB was quite arid and sorely missing key features. This feeling was accentuated by the 3k gameplay reveal. It just was so stale and completely missed the point of a historical strategy game.

  16. #36

    Default Re: The Total War Chat Thread

    That's why they really should have named it a historical fantasy strategy game, because people are getting the wrong expectation for it.

  17. #37

    Default Re: The Total War Chat Thread

    in my opinion CA has become a fast food chain. A zillion projects in the making, subsidiaries pouring out mediocre DLCs, expansions passed as full games, stripped features and excessive amounts of streamlining, not to mention taking valuable members of the modding community away to work for them on more mediocre projects.I dont feel the magic anymore. Never felt it again since 2010. And yes I forgave them for Empire. It was a massive endeavour and something in the middle went horribly wrong that much is clear. But the people that formed the core idea 10 years ago, the passionate group of individuals striving for something great, I feel like none of them remains Nowadays specific indie titles have more appeal to me. I really hope some competitor shows up soon, so that they'll be forced to change something.
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  18. #38
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    Default Re: The Total War Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Theramines View Post
    It has increasingly felt like that for me since the realisation that ThroB was quite arid and sorely missing key features.
    I only bought ToB for two reason. The first reason is about bringing back the memories I had with the Vikings in MTW in ToB and the second one is because it was cheap on Steam.

    That's why I bought ToB and if ToB hadn't been cheap then I would not bought it as my interest in the TW game series ended with R2TW.



    Please sticky this TW chat thread.
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  19. #39

    Default Re: The Total War Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Leonardo View Post
    I only bought ToB for two reason. The first reason is about bringing back the memories I had with the Vikings in MTW in ToB and the second one is because it was cheap on Steam.

    That's why I bought ToB and if ToB hadn't been cheap then I would not bought it as my interest in the TW game series ended with R2TW.



    Please sticky this TW chat thread.
    Hi Leonardo, would you recommend ToB over Attila? I will purchase a gaming computer and I was thinking if worth getting Attila or ToB instead. I have played Attila, but performance issues discourage me to purchase this title. I can get a decent gaming computer but I don't know if is good enough to compensate the performance issues in Attila and this would have a great impact in my gameplay experience. I am not a huge fan of vikings period but I also value the performance.

    Sorry for the offtopic...

  20. #40
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    Default Re: The Total War Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Incendio View Post
    Hi Leonardo, would you recommend ToB over Attila? I will purchase a gaming computer and I was thinking if worth getting Attila or ToB instead. I have played Attila, but performance issues discourage me to purchase this title. I can get a decent gaming computer but I don't know if is good enough to compensate the performance issues in Attila and this would have a great impact in my gameplay experience. I am not a huge fan of vikings period but I also value the performance.
    I am sorry, I can't answer your question because I don't have Atilla.

    I've played very little in ToB, but FWIW I had no performance issues with a computer like this.

    ASUS Z97 ProGamer, Intel i5 2700 Mhz (second hand), 32 Gb RAM, Nvidia 750 GeForce 2 Gb

    So, if you have something that's close to what I have then I recommend ToB.

    If you are not a fan of the Vikings then I assume you haven't played MTW, but if you have played MTW then you should try the Vikings.

    Quote Originally Posted by Incendio View Post
    Sorry for the offtopic...
    Telling us "sorry for being off topic" is just that be off topic, since this thread is a general thread about everything related to TW.
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