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Thread: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 09.08.19)

  1. #101
    Jake Armitage's Avatar Artifex
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    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    Quote Originally Posted by Falco View Post
    Holy ! That's awesome! Am I wrong in thinking it would be a ton of work implementing it in DeI because it involves startpos?
    Probably. We could start collecting money for the families of the people that will fall, to never raise again, during this adventure!

    @Kam: really good idea with this mod btw (didn't try it yet).
    Last edited by Jake Armitage; April 08, 2018 at 08:21 AM.

  2. #102

    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    80 something turns into an Antigondai playthrough and it's been gritty as hell. It's probably the slowest progress I have ever made where I am actively trying to expand but not really facing any risk of losing. It was pretty shaky there for awhile but for the past 20 turns or so I am stable and feel pretty safe but my attempts to expand keep getting thwarted.


    Other observations: The AI is upgrading their cities but not really their armies. Some factions don't create more than 7-10 units. I saw this with Sparta and Athens. Also, I play with 41 units but I haven't seen one max sized army or even one greater than 30 units and armies are usually less than 20. They might have ~30ish units but it's spread between 2 forces. Then again, as a single settlement I have only been able to get to ~30 and only temporarily. Not really surprising that max armies aren't being built but during my my Roman playthrough pre update 4/7 I don't remember it being an issue for myself(for obvious reasons) or the AI. A lot of factions fielded max or near max stacks.
    Last edited by Satansblofish; April 09, 2018 at 04:42 PM. Reason: added some other details

  3. #103
    KAM 2150's Avatar Artifex
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    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    Thanks mate!

    There are different AI budget policies which I don't understand fully yet so I will be looking into those in near future. I just don't want to jump into changing AI behaviour randomly
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  4. #104
    Jake Armitage's Avatar Artifex
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    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    Quote Originally Posted by KAM 2150 View Post
    Thanks mate!

    There are different AI budget policies which I don't understand fully yet so I will be looking into those in near future. I just don't want to jump into changing AI behaviour randomly
    You could try with a script that trigger economical bonuses to AI when they have 1/3 regions. Or I can write it down and then upload if you think this could be an idea to explore.
    Probably small AI factions tend to hoard wealth for buildings.

  5. #105

    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    I just deleted that save. I haven't been able to find a way to save it since I deleted it in game, whereas if I deleted from the app data folder I could just restore it from the recycle bin but deleting in game doesn't seem to offer the same choice. A lot of mixed emotions at the moment


  6. #106

    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    does the no attrition mod work in IA or am I missing something? :/
    disabling attrition with Cheat Engine still works though.

  7. #107

    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    Quote Originally Posted by hoho96 View Post
    does the no attrition mod work in IA or am I missing something? :/
    disabling attrition with Cheat Engine still works though.
    No, I don't think it works right now.

  8. #108

    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    Quote Originally Posted by Falco View Post
    Holy ! That's awesome! Am I wrong in thinking it would be a ton of work implementing it in DeI because it involves startpos?
    If I remember correctly from screwing around with the game shark many many years ago, hex editing is very time-consuming.

  9. #109
    KAM 2150's Avatar Artifex
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    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    I will fix attritio mod today. File itself is correct but since patch 19, my packs do not always work as standalone.
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  10. #110
    ♔Greek Strategos♔'s Avatar THE BEARDED MACE
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    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ivan_Moscavich View Post
    If I remember correctly from screwing around with the game shark many many years ago, hex editing is very time-consuming.

    @Dresden's favorite thing.

  11. #111

    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    Quote Originally Posted by Greek strategos View Post
    @Dresden's favorite thing.
    So if we put the mod on hold for like 5 years, sure oh, no problem.

  12. #112
    KAM 2150's Avatar Artifex
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    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    I've updated the link to the no attrition submod.
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  13. #113
    ScipioTheGreat's Avatar Miles
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    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    KAM, so the AI is more likely to siege with the no-attrition mod?

  14. #114
    KAM 2150's Avatar Artifex
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    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    Yes, at least it does for me.
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  15. #115

    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    Thanks KAM

  16. #116

    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    I have more observations from my 50ish turn Pergamon campaign. Almost as grueling as my Macedon campaign but the start this time around was smoother since I have a better idea of how to go about achieving a safer start as a single settlement faction. It is a safe second place though as this is only the second time I have been limited to 1 settlement after 50+ turns into a campaign(Macedon being the first). It's also similar to my most recent Macedon campaign in that while at only 1 settlement I feel very stable and safe.

    My settings: VH/DAIA/CT/12tpy

    Observations:

    -Really can feel the difficulty as a single settlement start, especially if you have a difficult starting faction. The difficulty I think stems in the debate/gamble to build an army and try to conquer or build your city first. There are risk vs reward in every scenario. I like that if you go for the immediate blitzkrieg it's high risk for high reward. Good example: I lost after taking ephesos within ~15 turns. Fought a couple decisive battles, hobbled back to pergamon to replenish. Bithnayia declares war and starts raiding me, I don't have the funds to pay them off, or enough to get the army I need to ward them off permanently. They basically raided me into oblivion. Which leads me to..

    -Raiding is a really big deal. It can be absolutely devastating to your campaign if done against you, especially early game. I lost another Macedon campaign to some excessive/strategic/well-timed raiding against me. I almost lost a second(then I raided my save file and accidentally raided it myself...). It absolutely devastates your income. When done with a sizable force of your own it's an economic relief. There were times early game after I created a massive force I had to raid my own settlement to recoup some of the funds and just suffer the PO penalties. Example being long winters or after excessively raiding your neighbors/enemies. It's a spicy dynamic for sure. I used to use it solely for diplo purposes but it has taken on a new life(threat).

    -It can devastate the AI as well. If your force is too big for the AI w/out their garrison to support them, they will likely sit in their settlement and you can raid them into starvation.

    -Some factions not building more than 7-10 units. Again, Sparta only has a 7-10 unit stack. It's impossible to tell if it's faction specific though. Without going into detail since I don't really know , my working theory is that the AI keeping their overall army small is tied to their politics/diplomatic circumstances.

    -No factions walking around with multiple max stacks or a full stack. But this time around, Athens(who is a total badass colonizing/fighting over in southern turkey this time around) has a huge stack between 35-39 units and a couple 16 unit armies that do a lot of fighting as well. Macedon and Rhodos both have a large stack + small stack too.

    -The AI is upgrading their cities.

    -Settlements have a different value/dynamic. Now hat the AI seems to upgrade their cities and with the AI reducing the size of their armies, garrisons matter more. Especially when these garrisons have 20+ units. Hellas and basically from Rhodos to Ankara are great examples of extremely difficult areas to conquer.

    -Settlements are where the big battles happen with the addition of the garrison forces.

    -Less battles per turn and they feel more definitive in that it's very difficult to recover from heavy losses so the losing army usually loses a good chunk of land. It can depend though on how challenging the subsequent garrisons prove to be.

    -Regularly playing with 41 units, I am already used to trying to get the most bang for my buck, but even more so with this mod. 300 man units with 2 javelins seems to be very efficient.

    -I am playing battles a bit differently too as I am much more hesitant to risking my most valuable units. My archers are taking the brunt of this as I scale the learning curve. So many have died valiantly serving as a meat shield to keep enemy units off my pike phalanx.

    -Further, I have found value and new appreciation for units I used to care very little about. A great example is the hippakontistai(the most basic greek jav cav). As we all know, they're cheap, fast, and maneuverable. While this makes them great for taking down long range infantry they're also useful for providing a highly mobile meat shield. I love pairing one with my general to make a very deadly duo. I like using them to catch units for my general or to hold a unit in place for my general to repeat charge. Plus, they have been great for saving my general in tight spots and using my best commanders more safely in general.

    -Obtaining and maintaining expansion is very difficult.

    -Playing lots of politics, especially trying to get those trade agreements.
    Last edited by Satansblofish; April 11, 2018 at 03:17 AM.

  17. #117

    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    @KAM.
    - Playing as Pergamon my epistratoi hoplitai upkeep is 208 while for Lydia is 88 wich is the basic upkeep without this submod.

  18. #118

    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    Having a blast with Galatia, playing hard/normal, turn 101. Expanded to control most of thrace/macedonia/syria/palmyra/most of Turkey too. Have fought wars with Bosphorus and all over establishing allies in the place of enemies. Palmyra had just sent two doomstacks of about full on heavy syrian archers and spearman, taking a few provinces before I could mass recruit with the same troops and take it back plus elephant fun. Made Antioch my capital with edit. So far really enjoyable and it feels like I was one more faction invasion away from falling apart. Luckily my god king has like 21 zeal and is 70 with maxed stats, not looking forward to his death, he fights in every battle. Also, I noticed the syrian heavy archers used by palmyra had 10 armor instead of 30 something like the regional troops, is this intended? Thanks again for the mod.
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  19. #119

    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 03.31.18)

    Quote Originally Posted by Slashas View Post
    I solved it by changing the attrition type for besieging to attrition_none instead of changing the besieging attration value to 0!
    Can you explain?

    It says; rom_attrition_sieging 0
    rom_attrition_none 0


    mod still not working.

  20. #120
    ~Seleukos.I.Nikator~'s Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: [Submod] Alternative Economy (Updated 04.07.18)

    I've just tested no attrition pack, as well. Doesn't work for me, either. I've tried various loading orders, just to be sure.

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