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Thread: History channels.

  1. #221
    Lord Oda Nobunaga's Avatar 大信皇帝
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    Default Re: History channels.

    The Mede controversy doesn't really imply the lack of an "Empire" though. Whatever that really means. What it suggests is that the Medes were not a civilized peoples and did not build very many constructions, such as at Ecbatana, despite the assertions of Herodotos and others. So I would assume that Ecbatana was actually built much later during the Achaemenid period and then expanded upon greatly under later dynasties. Honestly some of these claims made by Herodotos about how Babylon looks or about the city of Ecbatana are completely wrong and it sounds like he just made it up.

    The implication here is that the Medes were clearly tribal nomads who herded horses and probably sheep. Incidentally that area around Tabriz and Teheran are extremely well suited to herding. The Kara Koyunlu and the Safavids originated there as the dominant horse people of the area during their respective centuries. That the Medes had basically subjugated most of the region through a system of tribal alliances is not surprising given their history for warfare, as is related to us by the Greeks.

    Their expansion into the Armenia, Cappadocia, and Arbela regions are actually not that surprising given this full context. Those are good areas for keeping horses and no doubt the Medes were also looking for plunder. Though as Herodotos states the Medes were also trying to remove the Assyrian yoke. As sumskilz just implied the Medes unleashed their mighty horde into the Assyrian heartland. This shows that they were indeed quite powerful. Such tribes do not sit idle for very long, I have no doubt that they subjugated many of the Iranian tribes. For example both Herodotos and Ktesias frame the overthrow of the Medes by Cyrus (Kyros, Kurosh, or what have you) as a war of liberation. Probably true but take these Greek sources with a grain of salt.

    Although the Persians were similar to the Medes and were both Indo-Aryan peoples. The Persians seem to have been influenced by the Elamites. They could read and write cuneiform, they began to build settlements, and more importantly to distinguish them, they fought on foot with spears. Maybe because the mountainous terrain in south west central Iran is not conducive to cavalry. Chariots were reserved for the nobility. That is unlike the popular perception of the Persians as being horse riders, which actually comes from the Arsacid and Sassanid periods.

    In terms of how powerful the Medes must have been... In order to dominate Iran and to actually carry on the fight against the Assyrians in their own territory it was necessarily considerable. For this period that is somewhere in the range of 20,000 if not 30,000 soldiers at its peak. But due to logistical constraints surpassing 30,000 men was not easy. There are ways around these limitations but they are finite, especially for an underdeveloped region. My assumption is that a good portion of this army must have consisted of cavalry. Likely 1/6th to 1/4th which for nomads to supply a massive amount of horses in the ballpark of 5,000 cavalrymen, and supplying this army was not impossible. At least not a society as large and apparently as powerful as the Medes. While the rest would have been spearmen and foot archers because they are mentioned as being part of the Persian contingents as well. Perhaps they had more cavalry than that but it is not really consistent with this time period and that is somewhat difficult even for nomadic pastoralists. Also consider that the Persians themselves made up most of the Achaemenid infantry.

    I assume that this sedentary or semi-nomadic lifestyle eventually gave the Persians an advantage against the Medes. The Persians were apparently very capable at adapting. What I found interesting is that accounts of the "Persian Revolt" seem to imply some kind of mobile guerilla warfare with fall back positions in the mountains. Where the Median cavalry would not be effective and such a prolonged struggle might put the subsequent mutiny against Astyages in its proper context. Though if these Greek sources are correct then Cyrus was some kind of propaganda mastermind. Whether Cyrus actually adopted larger cavalry contingents and used them with his infantry in a combined arms approach at this time, similar to what we can surmise of actual Achaemenid armies, would be interesting to consider.

    The Sassanid era tends to provide much higher density of wares and settlements than the Achaemenid period. In terms of material culture the Sassanid era comes off as an Iranian golden age. Where as during the Achaemenid period much of Iran appears desolate by comparison. Although a lot of foreign wares tend to show up in key areas like Susa. But most of the Achaemenid material within Iran tends to be found in places like Susa and Persepolis regardless. Weapons like Achaemenid arrow heads are found in large numbers in places like Egypt and Anatolia. Confirming that the Achaemenids loved to spam archers. But also that they were always engaged in warfare in those areas, or at least those areas had high troop presence... for whatever reasons. Probably having nothing to do with warfare. Right anthropologists, sociologists, and Achaemenid apologists?

    A lot of the finds from this period are concentrated in the south west of Iran and actually around the Tigris and Euphrates. Not only did the Achaemenids conquer Mesopotamia/Babylon but it was their key holdings and they outright colonized areas of it. Since the Persians and Medes were the source of manpower for the Achaemenid armies, later the Bactrians and Sogdians as well, they must have resettled a lot of these in conquered lands in order to secure these territories. They undoubtedly wanted to expand their manpower base so giving lands to soldiers is a no brainer. The importance of Mesopotamia/Babylon and the lack of importance which much of Iran seemed to hold I think indicates that there wasn't really a national concept of Iran. The concept was new under the Achaemenids but actually appears to have developed during the Sassanian era.
    Last edited by Lord Oda Nobunaga; June 14, 2021 at 10:29 AM.

    "Famous general without peer in any age, most superior in valor and inspired by the Way of Heaven; since the provinces are now subject to your will it is certain that you will increasingly mount in victory." - Ōgimachi-tennō

  2. #222

    Default Re: History channels.

    I don't think they were nomadic, at least totally. There have been found settlements dated during the era of the Medes, including Hamadan. The issue is that there is generally a lack of large buildings, which could function as administrative centers, and that there are hints of decline since the collapse of the Assyrian Empire. This is why it has been suggested that the Median state was a predatory entity, which disintegrated, once there was no more Assyrian palaces to loot and exploit. In my opinion, there was probably a Median kingdom around Ecbatana, geographically quite close to the Assyrian heartland, which might have also extended his suzerainty over the adjacent lands, like Rhagae, Persis and what was later called as Media Atropatene, but their control was loose, through client kings, like in the case of Cambyses I and Cyrus II. The claims about Parthia, Bactria and the rest seem fantastical. The societies there were probably a mix of mountain tribes, sedentary communities and nomadic populations, depending on the geography.

    Totally agree about the cavalry thing. The Persian nobility also rode horses, but the Medes were definitely the experts on this. It's not a coincidence that their cavalry was still deployed by the Seleucids, while most Persian soldiers were slingers. One extra advantage might have been the Nisaean stallions, much valued thanks to their size and strength. About the revolts, Egypt must have been the most problematic satrapy of the Empire. There were local rebellions during the reigns of practically every Great King (including most probably poor little Arses) and it was the only region to successfully secede from the empire for several decades. In Syria, I can think of Megabyzus' rebellion, Evagoras' raids and the Sidonian uprising under Artaxerxes, but these were large-scale events. I suspect that most of these arrows were spent in more local affairs, against brigands, marauders and local potentates that refused to pay taxes or clashed with their superior.

    The Persians were definitely inspired from the Elamites. Herodotus' ignorance about Elam probably explains why he insisted so much on Persians copying the institutions of the Medes. That being said, the Old Persian script was first used under Darius and it was preferred in most cases for ceremonial purposes, like the royal inscriptions at Behistun and Persepolis. There are also a few Old Persian tablets for everyday affairs, but the administration preferred the Elamite and Aramaic scripts, even in the Iranian-speaking regions (Persepolis and Bactria).

  3. #223

    Default Re: History channels.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Oda Nobunaga View Post
    Weapons like Achaemenid arrow heads are found in large numbers in places like Egypt and Anatolia. Confirming that the Achaemenids loved to spam archers. But also that they were always engaged in warfare in those areas, or at least those areas had high troop presence... for whatever reasons. Probably having nothing to do with warfare. Right anthropologists, sociologists, and Achaemenid apologists?
    The fact that they used bronze or leaded bronze cast arrowheads meant that they could be mass produced even in the field. It also means they're easier to find on a dig, because iron anything from that period has a tendency to degrade to the point of being unrecognizable except as a piece of corroded iron.

    These are all the Achaemenid type:

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Whereas the type the Medes used were like this:

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    These were probably the type Babylonian texts referred to as Cimmerian.
    Quote Originally Posted by Enros View Post
    You don't seem to be familiar with how the burden of proof works in when discussing social justice. It's not like science where it lies on the one making the claim. If someone claims to be oppressed, they don't have to prove it.


  4. #224
    kambiz's Avatar Ordinarius
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    Default Re: History channels.

    @everyone
    Iran is an old country which its existance dates back even before Haxāmanišian (Achaemenids). This is undeniable thus undebatable

    Regarding the topic ,This channel named Eastory despite it's look being simple but actually I love the detailed maps and especially paying attection to details like exact units and their location at every given time




  5. #225
    Lord Oda Nobunaga's Avatar 大信皇帝
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    Default Re: History channels.

    Quote Originally Posted by sumskilz View Post
    The fact that they used bronze or leaded bronze cast arrowheads meant that they could be mass produced even in the field. It also means they're easier to find on a dig, because iron anything from that period has a tendency to degrade to the point of being unrecognizable except as a piece of corroded iron.

    These are all the Achaemenid type:

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Whereas the type the Medes used were like this:

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    These were probably the type Babylonian texts referred to as Cimmerian.
    Very nice. The Achaemenid arrow heads are certainly distinct. It does show the importance and care which the Achaemenid Persians took to ensure the viability of their archers in the field. As much as I can surmise they employed a combined arms approach.

    It appears to me that "Cimmerian" and "Mede" were some kind of umbrella terms for the Mesopotamians to refer to a lot of barbarians from the north.

    "Famous general without peer in any age, most superior in valor and inspired by the Way of Heaven; since the provinces are now subject to your will it is certain that you will increasingly mount in victory." - Ōgimachi-tennō

  6. #226

    Default Re: Kings and Generals, Youtube channel about historical battles

    Underrated channels:



    Of these facts there cannot be any shadow of doubt: for instance, that civil society was renovated in every part by Christian institutions; that in the strength of that renewal the human race was lifted up to better things-nay, that it was brought back from death to life, and to so excellent a life that nothing more perfect had been known before, or will come to be known in the ages that have yet to be. - Pope Leo XIII

  7. #227

    Default Re: Kings and Generals, Youtube channel about historical battles

    I considered starting a thread elsewhere but perhaps this will be adequate. This is meant to serve dually as a suggestion and a request for comparable media.

    I often listen to podcasts at work. I'd like to share some and hopefully receive some suggestions!

    The Napoleonic Quarterly (good quality with scholars)
    The Ottoman History Podcast (as above)
    Thersites the Historian (some political commentary - I do not subscribe to or proclaim any identitarianistic [by which I mean conforming to any identity, not Identitarian movement] politic, but I will say he and Sean are mostly bearable and I'm willing to entertain their discourse even if I disagree with them on occasion)
    Flash Point History
    Fall of Civilizations

    Podcasts I know of, but haven't listened to extensively
    History of Poland Podcast
    History of Japan
    History of Rome
    History of Byzantium

    Yes, I know kings and generals, sandrhoman, bazbattles, tik, Jack rackam, epimethus, pike and shot, metatron, lindybeige, and all these popular ones on YouTube for the most part.

    Please do not suggest "Real History xyz" - I have no interest in anyone claiming to know real history.

    Despite being an American, I love British narration so, bonus for the accent. If anyone knows of any 1hr+ kind of high quality stuff. I'd greatly appreciate it.

  8. #228

    Default Re: Kings and Generals, Youtube channel about historical battles

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephalophore View Post
    I considered starting a thread elsewhere but perhaps this will be adequate. This is meant to serve dually as a suggestion and a request for comparable media.

    I often listen to podcasts at work. I'd like to share some and hopefully receive some suggestions!

    The Napoleonic Quarterly (good quality with scholars)
    The Ottoman History Podcast (as above)
    Thersites the Historian (some political commentary - I do not subscribe to or proclaim any identitarianistic [by which I mean conforming to any identity, not Identitarian movement] politic, but I will say he and Sean are mostly bearable and I'm willing to entertain their discourse even if I disagree with them on occasion)
    Flash Point History
    Fall of Civilizations

    Podcasts I know of, but haven't listened to extensively
    History of Poland Podcast
    History of Japan
    History of Rome
    History of Byzantium

    Yes, I know kings and generals, sandrhoman, bazbattles, tik, Jack rackam, epimethus, pike and shot, metatron, lindybeige, and all these popular ones on YouTube for the most part.

    Please do not suggest "Real History xyz" - I have no interest in anyone claiming to know real history.

    Despite being an American, I love British narration so, bonus for the accent. If anyone knows of any 1hr+ kind of high quality stuff. I'd greatly appreciate it.
    There is a youtube channel called "Flash Point History."

  9. #229

    Default Re: History channels.

    Yes, indeed. It was originally only a podcast. He began with the Attila and Punic Wars series. It is a favorite of mine. I only wish I knew of more quality channels like his. I enjoy those that go beyond the battle narrative and get into the nuisances which is certainly something Ottoman History Podcast and Napoleonic Quarterly do exceptionally well imo.

    Flashpointhistory has nice animations, but I drive for work and I'm not looking at the videos.

  10. #230

    Default Re: History channels.

    You would probably like the following
    Strategy Stuff (He does one on the Peloponnese War)
    TIK (WW2)

  11. #231
    Lord Oda Nobunaga's Avatar 大信皇帝
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    Default Re: History channels.

    TIK's condescending economics 101 content actually triggers me. Honestly I don't think that is a guy who is as smart as he acts.
    Additionally I just want to point out that he has been saying things that I was talking about 10 years ago. Except back then people told me I was wrong. Even down to some of the exact source material. Such as his citation of Anand Toprani's essay on the Soviet-German petrol war. Admittedly not a hard thing to top because most of the WW2 enthusiasts are using outdated sources from the 1960's and 1970's.

    TIK has good content because of his thorough examination of secondary sources. If not for some of his insane tirades about X Y Z being Socialist. I think the reason why he is a good content creator is because he has made many long and informative videos. While also managing to gather lots of controversial perspectives about various aspects of WW2, which have ended up being true. But again this is largely due to the publishing of more up to date books in the past 20 years, which themselves benefitted greatly from the archives of the Warsaw Pact countries in the 1990's.

    But I think he has correctly been called out more than once by more consistent content creators such as Blitz of the Reich. So again, brilliant but inconsistent. Also he should stop trying to apply Austrian garbage to everything. By his reckoning I suppose FDR and Churchill must have been Communist. As a matter of fact Chiang Kai-shek and Mao were both Communists. Japan was actually a Socialist Liberal utopia if not for that darn Ludendorff.
    Last edited by Lord Oda Nobunaga; January 19, 2022 at 09:13 AM.

    "Famous general without peer in any age, most superior in valor and inspired by the Way of Heaven; since the provinces are now subject to your will it is certain that you will increasingly mount in victory." - Ōgimachi-tennō

  12. #232
    Basileos Leandros I's Avatar Writing is an art
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    Default Re: History channels.

    A bit of a different video, something which us naval geeks appreciate - an homage video to ORP Blyskawica, the Polish destroyer made in England, which helped defend the town itself against Luftwaffe attacks in WW2.

    Blyskawica still exists, it's a museum ship in Gdynia, Poland.

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  13. #233

    Default Re: History channels.

    Quote Originally Posted by Basileos Leandros I View Post
    A bit of a different video, something which us naval geeks appreciate - an homage video to ORP Blyskawica, the Polish destroyer made in England, which helped defend the town itself against Luftwaffe attacks in WW2.

    Blyskawica still exists, it's a museum ship in Gdynia, Poland.

    Saw that. I gotta say Mark Felton's video of the Voyage of the 2nd Pacific Fleet was quite entertaining.

    If anyone's interested in 20th century history, the folks at Time Ghost History are some of my favorites. Got hooked on them back when we were all stuck home. They are currently narrating World War 2 week by week.

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