[The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

[Jadli]

Dragon was salty (or just the pre empitive strike was effective as planned, to make him stand down), therefore we agreed that that I dont sink the Wylon Montclair army, and we let the trial decide. A new save (Isenbard should have it up very soon) https://www.mediafire.com/file/efk17...48new.sav/file

A new letter to Ranser Branquette, King of Rivenspire and Duke of Camlorn:
"Our agents from Ring of Daggers has found suspicious activities in your lands that are not in accordance with the royal orders. In fact, the troops were being sent to the opposite direction, to our border, hiding in the woods. Some of Rivenspire men and siege equipment have been even hiding in our lands close to our settlements. You are therefore immediately called into Wayrest to answer for your actions, or possibly the actions of your unworthy vassals! Arrive only with your personal bodyguards. If this is doing of your vassals instead, then you have no reason to not arrive into Wayrest city and easily clear your name, as the Divines would surely be on your side. If you refuse to arrive at once, it would prove your true intentions...

Signed,
Adrien Guimard-Cumberland, High King of High Rock, King of Bangkorai, a titular king of Stormhaven and lord of Craglorn"

I actually forgot to show pics of Abahs Landing before, so there you go https://www.mediafire.com/view/o7d5x...105_1.jpg/file

[Jadli]

Personally i think its ultra-difficult to get a balance between a role-play scripted hotseat with intense rules to get somesort of immersion[reflecting a fantasyworld based on a game/film], and a competitive hotseat ..its a problem that has been revisited several times on this forum, and in perhaps all cases it has failed, as many people have different ideas on what is the scope and shape of such a hotseat, as opposed to the combative hotseat where most players just want world domination and the destruction of his enemies[which is the case that most players know]. In examination of all the ones we have tried[on this forum], with complex rules trying to obtain that balance, i think most have failed in their aim, as many hotseaters really dont have the time for the immersion and/or only have the barebones time[and commitment]for the combative competitive hotseats they know and love.

i dont want to get involved with either position here, as both mergor and jadli probably have two different ideas of how this type of hotseat should or should not have been played , as will any other player if you asked them....for my part, the clan of crowns had a alliance of sorts with the clan of forebears for around thirty turns or so, a clear opponent in the scope of the rules that jadli had laid out, so i think that it is difficult to blame any players where the ideology is different for all, ...These sorta complex hotseat games, need players with a firm commitment of obtaining what the admin is trying to achieve, which has to be clearly laid out, with rules all agree on...in reflection it is really difficult to get players that are truly committed too such a event as most dont understand/dont have time for/are not really interested in ,such complexities and they just want to play things out . Add in the extra fact that in a large hotseat, the turnover of players leaving and new player jumping in, is sure to change the ideals of the hotseat .

Furthermore, i dont think the future for such large complex hotseats is very bright, and i would perhaps recommend that larger hotseats be kept to a simpler more combative system that people can jump in , with less worry of understanding a listing of rules the admin is trying to achieve......

well thats my ten penny worth

PBOB

@paladinbob

I think too many rules makes things a bit confusing yeah. I prefer the style that the Tsardoms game on the hub has (speaking of which, that mod really deserves a TWC hotseat).

Thanks for the input... Well, I think that without the additional rules it would have been much worse, as otherwise some players would have been doing whatever whey wanted (and lot of people dont know TES lore, and lot of TES fans dont know Second Era lore. Its not a historical HS, where everyone kinda have an idea whats going on). You dont have to know all of them, just the ones related to you obviously. The intention of this HS wasnt to be a full RP HS (such as TIOC or HRE HS), but somewhat a "semi RP", where people are obliged to play their factions in regard to the factional lore, while not necessarily doing some extensive "roleplay".

Except a few cases/areas I think it worked pretty well I would say... Its turn 48 and there are still numerous local wars, mostly based on some lore/events for the factions, lot of going on everywhere, while very few factions has been destroyed. In a normal HS, it would have turned out into the usual one alliance vs other alliance by turn 20 likely, while half the factions would have been dead by that point... everyone would be playing kind of predictably, the same way they always do, samely as in other hotseats.. instead, some people are playing a bit differently, having different goals/limiations, which was the whole point. Being someone else... Tbh, this has been my most favourite hotseat to play. Most turns have so much going on...

My question to paladinbob, would be how would you draw a line between a what is a roleplay hotseat and what is a competitive hotseat? What is the end state of a roleplay hotseat? Would not a purely roleplay hotseat end up being a conquer all as well? For example if Tribunal forms the ebonheart pact they get special characters - what would you then use those special characts for?

Custom win objectives? Maybe, but if we take a moment to consider what options there are outside of in-game warfare, maybe voting on a king might be a form of alternative victory conditions. However still could be influenced by destroying all enemies who are opposing voters.
First one to get to a place, a collaborate hotseat? maybe. Not sure.
First one to lots of money? Maybe idk.
A lot of these seem to be able to facilitate world domination, and even if not then I don't think many players will want to have hotseats where they just sit put for a while. It would be difficult to work out, imo.
Before hotseats I used to play Roll The Dice forum games which focused heavily on the diplomacy, and also why I am awful at the hotseat combat here. I like the roleplay, but can't compete in the realm of fighting. (I also have a deep burning passionate hatred for "metas" they incentivise really wacky gameplay as well as disadvantaging non-tryhards and people who don't know every new tip and trick.) So yeah.

Also, even if it is a pure roleplay, anything that is around for a bit will have flucutations of activity and commitment, so I wouldn't say that wouldn't solve these problems.


1. It's not my fault that the rules say that Valenwood cannot make peace with any other faction that holds territory in Valenwood if they are not my allies (and your rules tell me your faction cannot make allies with other races, meaning that was a dead end.)
2. It also says I cannot make any major political decision without putting down the cormont rebellion which I think was taken by you? How can I play an entire game without major making political decisions?
3. I actually never agreed to your non-aggression pact/miltiary access, I just never replied to you and you assumed I had accepted it and then accused me of breaking the truce when it's very clearly in my rules that I cannot make peace with those who break the Green Pact. And the only explicit section of the green pact that's in the rules itself is the clause about holding lands in Valenwood.
4. That's not even a good Argument, Khajiit will be giving me back lands once we win. They're my allies. You're the one not giving me back lands at all.

So don't go around playing the cry bully. You invade people, you get treated like an invader. That simple.
(You're also essentially playing in-universe Nazis. Maybe these Khajiit and Bosmer might be concerned about this.)

2. Pretty sure it was meant in a way that as long as the Blacksap Rebellion in Cormount is not defeated, your diplomacy options are limited, as your realm is in civil war. Therefore, that the Veiled Heritance took them out is not a huge issue, but obviuosly that would lower your authority, as you werent able to deal with the rebels yourself.

But for other stuff yes.

The line between RP and competitive HS is definitely unclear, though wherever it is, we are supposed to be somewhere close to it (as in my mind full RP is something whole different than this HS). Here you are relatively "free", every player should just follow the baseline limitations/rules for his faction, mostly targetted at diplomacy.

I am sure the same could be said to you, you hold plenty of bosmer lands yourself Jadli.

That said, every negotiation I opened with Valenwood in the matter was shut down by non other than The Kingdom of Valenwood itself. So once again the truth is that I am blamed for something where I don't have a real say at all. That is why I said to staph with the propaganda, haha. If that wasn't enough, I catched you numerous times breaking our treaty by having agents inside my territorry. You even told me you'd leave, only for me to find an assassin in the middle of my Empire. The Veiled Heritence might feel superior, but clearly, its the cats who prove themselves to be inferior by breaking their own words numerous times.

As for the throne, it was the WILL of the previous king to make my dynasty the heirs. As such, my dynasty cannot be contested, especially that Summerset is a loyal partner in this union.

I'll happily open negotiations any time when you stop claiming that that the "evil" altmers are the problem.

What Librarian said.

If it was the will of the dynasty/altmer people, then it means they have all chosen the path of racial superiority, hence the salvation for the altmers is even more distant .
The alternartive course of events for a mutual friendship would have been, that you helped the bosmers reclaim ther land and strenghten their position (which btw is what lorewise Summerset kingdom did, but later facing Veiled Heritance rebellion because of it). Instead, there is now a pile of dead bodies in Valenwood, that can probably be never ever burried.

(BTW, what zender (all respect to him, but...) did with his Summerset and W. Skyrim factions didnt really work well for this HS... The fact that royal dynasty would just give up their throne to some radical party is hard to believe while in full power, but welp, it happened while he was leaving (maybe because of it), we cant do anything about it now..)

A quick answer for you Librarian, I, again, didn't claim that I am completely right and you are completely wrong, I claimed that Jadli is doing that, haha. There is some things were we are restricted yes, and I am supposed to play the in universe-nazis, yes, but I am losing my mind over how I am STILL vilified as a PLAYER and not just as a faction after everything I said regarding the Tribunal and Skyrim drama. So if Mr. Jadli starts pumping propaganda out in public where I am blamed for everything, I am going to argue with him.

Thats still the same converation we have been having several times... You are not here in this HS to play yourself, you are here to play your two factions. If your factional rules require to betray other players, behaving honourlessly towards other factions (because they are inferior), please do it. If you are supposed to be someone's enemy, throw at them all the propaganda and hostility there is. Nobody is gonna hold your responsible for it, because everyone knows you did it because you play your faction to the bone (you will not harm your name/reputation, despite you believing otherwise).

We are not hostile towards Veiled Heritance because of you, but because of what Veiled Heritance is and what the VH has done so far (which only reassured what they re). Any sane faction would reallistically be hostile towards VH, if they cared about their future. When I say that Veiled Heritance is a bunch of honourless superiority obssessed creatures that have no place in Tamriel, I mean that against the faction, not you... It has nothing to do with you (I still love you )... You are vilified as a faction, not a player, at least speaking for myself. (though, obviuosly, your expediton to Morrowind wasnt the best thing to do)

When playing Veiled Heritance, please be as evil and honourless against other races as you can be, thats whats supposed to be happening here, thats what Im happy to see in this HS, when people stop playing themselves, but embrace their faction. (BTW, the dunmers in general are pretty similar to the Heritance, they are just a bit more isolationist.. we are all n'wahs to them ... TES lore is full of rascism )

For example, Im not sad or angry at Dragon for betraying me as Sharnhelm at all, Im actually very happy that he did it, eventhough its possibly gonna cause my faction a great harm. Because thats what his faction/characters are supposed to be doing, while such behavior is very unlike how Dragon usually plays his hotseats

[Isenbard]

Kingdom of Skyrim, turn 48: https://1drv.ms/u/s!AiWJ2Nmu_LjIt1sT...3rwBA?e=zHhtBw

Dres assassinated an Argonian diplomat next to Davon's Watch settlement with 95%.


Grandmaster Omin's fear had come to sting a hundredfold. The Tribunal received their reinforcements and broke the siege of Narsis. He can only admire the skill of the enemy. Tanval, The Grandmaster of The House Indoril and Danys, who was appointed as the leader of the forces in Morrowind belonging to the Ebonheart pact. It was these two Dunmer with their loyal warrior priests, the final remnants of The Tribunal that lived up to the legend of The Gods, who are no more.
It was a great surprise to witness the victorious Telvanni forces charge against the sieging army of House Dres at sunrise, like if they had been cursed by Hircine with a great bloodlust. Only after the first few hundred casualties of unprepared soldiers did the commanders notice the true nature of their allies. The forces of the Tribunal had abandoned their sacred armor and weapons and disguised as Telvanni soldiers. Telvanni had been utterly routed from the fields! The Grandmaster tried to keep his forces intact, riding back and forth with his bodyguard and shouting his throat dry, but to no avail. The lines were broken and the battle was pure chaos.

Some of the Dres army fought their way to the shore and boarded the ships stationed there to escape. Years of harassing the ports and waters of Narsis had payed off, for the Tribunal forces had no ships of their own. However, Grandmaster Omin's regiment were cut off and forced to flee east. After a while they had left the city of Narsis behind and their pursuers finally gave up the chase. While leading his forces in the best orderly retreat he could manage, Omin managed to spot some of the Telvanni allies either fleeing east as well, or crowding ships of their own near the shore. He had also seen the east side of Narsis littered with bodies, most of which were stripped from their armor and weapons. In their haste, the Tribunal forces had also cut off limbs and heads to aquire the bonemold armour from their enemies faster. All of this was done during the night. A night that will be hard to forget for centuries to come.

Now, The Grandmaster and his remaining army have reached the region of Stonefalls, unable to continue all the way to Davon's Watch before their provisions have been refilled. It will take some time before the scattered forces, from Narsis to Mournhold can unite again, and their time is running out. This defeat has left the lands of Dres only mildly defended against a possible counter attack. Even the Argonians, who are eager for more blood from House Dres have now an opening to invade the rest of Southern Morrowind.
The people's turst in their Grandmaster has been noticed to waver. Whispers are heard in the streets, even as far as in Ebonheart. It will only be an uphill battle from now on to gain their respect once more, and for that he needs a decisive victory and great spoils of war.

[paladinbob123]

skyrim
========

1 assault on settlement



tribute temple up
https://www.dropbox.com/s/tothe37icl...le_48.sav?dl=0

[BerryKnight]

Figured I should at least post something about this.

So, the army in question that was on the other side of the world has been teleported home.
They will be allowed to move this turn, but cannot attack anyone/anything, since there are places that are advantageous vs. disadvantageous, I just dropped them on the coast, and yeah.
Anyways, Mergor has the turn, and should be playing today.

[REDBOOSTY]

Can I join this as Empire? I know I used to play another faction so its ok if I'm not allowed. Berry can you send a picture of the map so I can see the situation?

[Potatoto]

Can I join this as Empire? I know I used to play another faction so its ok if I'm not allowed. Berry can you send a picture of the map so I can see the situation?

Empire has been joind up with Colovia as single faction and is no longer up for grabs.

[Mergor]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...8/BD_BM_48.sav

BM up

https://postimg.cc/gallery/MW93BGj
(Dres Fortress taken)

[REDBOOSTY]

Empire has been joind up with Colovia as single faction and is no longer up for grabs.

I see. I said it was only subbed by Colovia, guess they haven't updated it then.

[Jadli]

Well, Empire almost died, but mainly all their lore died/was used, so they dont have much to do on their own right now, except being a vassal to Colovia (they are not even called The Empire anymore).

Not any spots right now...Perhaps someone who finds his factions to be too close to each other to be able to play them separately, will offer his faction for taking in future, dont know ....

[General Dragon.]

I will need an extension for this one, will post the turn tomorrow.


EDIT: Something came up in my turn regarding what I could do and would like to get an admin conformation, before actually doing it, that I am not breaking any rules.

[Potatoto]

If it is about your opportunity of sunking some Talvani's ships near former Dres's capital then you should not do than and you should not be allowed to do that. Those ships were placed there purely to sunk VH's ships which acording to recent admin's decision should not be there in the first place. Beside that it would be simply unhonorable to sunk them same as unhonorable was senting VH's armys to claim settlements for BM and to use VH's army in Morrowind home war.

[Mergor]

I can speak in Dragon's name that we completely forgot about that, but the turn is almost done and was very hard, so could you let us ask the admin to just spawn one for you?

[Potatoto]

Did you really go for that ships... :/

[Mergor]

Well, both of us forgot. But talked with him, he did it at the end of his turn (assumed otherwise) so no problem.

[General Dragon.]

Apologies for the long wait, here it is!
Anequina up and no telvanni ships were hurt in the process:
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/679756511630589979/837097668797792276/BD_Anequina_48.sav

Other Dunmers weren't so lucky however, 2 telvanni agents were killed:
https://imgur.com/QkKciA8

Following the major victory and forced marches, finally reaching the dunmer lines the Argonians launched their attacks fericously on the weakened dunmer forces, taking over a telvanni fort, overrunning the careless hlaalu and dres forces and laying siege on another telvanni fort and on the city of Almexia itself.
https://imgur.com/qCmuMlT
https://imgur.com/ppPUdTv
https://imgur.com/NBzO0yg

Meanwhile within the lands of Cyrodiil the Argonian warriors took the opportunity to surround cheydinhal and retake it in the next season, while defeating a hiding imperial ballista unit and wiping them out.
https://imgur.com/36KLmR5


EDIT:
Ranser arrived with his personal retinue to the city of Wayrest and soon was escorted to the great halls, ready to be heard by the High-King.
"High-King! I am hereby to refute the allegations of treason! I, as the King of Sharnhelm did not have any hands in what almost transpired. I do however admit, that I have a score to settle, that hasn't been fulfilled yet with you my king, a grudge Sharnhelm suffered due to what happened in the past and I with my people believe we have been wronged!
To summarize it, my late father, King Hurlburt helped Wayrest out againts the Imperial invasion and later on againts Daggerfall in the Breton civil war. Sharnhelm in the war againts the Imperial Black Drake invasion captured from imperial hands the castle of Alcaire and the settlements of Crosswych, Dvinnen, Camlorn and Westtry. The brave men of Sharnhelm under my father's guidance also rooted out undead cults from Camlorn and, through some sacrifices we also defeated and killed once and for all the Worm King, Mannimarco!
However my father was forced to relinquish Dvinnen and Westtry to the bretons of Daggerfall by orders of the previous High-King of Wayrest after the Imperials were utterly crushed. My father gave in, so that peace will be settled between High Rock and that Daggerfall gets pleased. What followed the relative few years of peace was Daggerfall attacking us to declare their independence and themselves as High King. My father focused on dealing and holding back Daggerfall, but their sudden attack shattered our defenses at first. Camlord, Crosswych and the homelands of House Ravenwatch, Castle Ravenwatch soon fell into their hands. It took many battles for the armies of Sharnhelm to slowly push back Daggerfall from our lands, while Wayrest and it's Redguard allies invaded the homelands of Daggerfall. Despite our effort a rogue, suicidal army of bretons charged our ancestral citadel, Old Gate, captured it and burned it down completely, before they were slainned. The civil war shortly ended after this with Daggerfall completely annihilated and my father soon died of old age, but atleast somewhat happy, that he managed to secure the peace, but left Sharnhelm is a very bad situation.
This is where I, King Ranser took over the leadership and also this is where my grudge started! After the civil war we got back all the lands I mentioned before except Wesstry, which Wayrest kept for himself just like all the rich former lands of Daggerfall, while Sharnhelm received nothing apart from some "good words and praises" for our help. Then I focused all my attention to rebuild Old Gate and revitalize the lands, that have been ravaged, while also retraining and refilling the armies of Sharnhelm.
However out of nowhere just before a few season, before Sharnhelm was ready to participate in the far away conflicts of the High-King, I received a message from you, my lord! A message, where after, what my father had done to help your kingdom, after what we went through and how we got almost nothing for our participation in the civil war, after we had to spend years to repair the damages, you, High-King insulted us, that we aren't doing anything and that your allies of orcs and redguards are far more helpful to your current cause. This is where I felt, no we, Sharnhelm as whole has been wronged and got insulted!
However despite all of this I didn't not plan any treason againts Wayrest. It was no secret, what I thought about this "score" within my royal court and the one, who is knew of this, and wanted to use it, to dethrone me is the perpetrator of, what I have been accused of and it is non other than my vassal, Wylon Montclair! It is no secret we don't get along well and our Houses are againts each other and as a powerful vassal, he tried to frame me for a betrayal, with sending orders in my name in secret to my forces to march againts Wayrest! While this plot of his was on the move I marched down with towards Alcaire to hold a war council with my other vassals, where I was informed of what is happening.
Through some very fast thinking and a bit of luck I managed to get control of the situation and give the orders to all forces to march back towards Sharnhelm including Wylon himself now under a close watch.
And this is when I received my summoning and I travelled to here. Wylon is the true culprit of what almost happened and I am far above to commit such treason. Yet as I am here now, questioned, I feel obliged to do this and to keep the honor and pride of Sharnhelm. So I challenge your for your words and actions High-King! Sharnhelm has been wronged by you and Sharnhelm deserves a compensation!"

[Aexodus]

Extra please

[Aexodus]

Bosmer https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen..._Bosmer_48.sav

[Librarian]

Will do turn soon, didn't know I had a turn.

[Mergor]

Bump