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Thread: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

  1. #1001
    Mergor's Avatar T H E | G O R
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    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

    Right.

    If we start a discussion like this, the claim that I abused that faction to help my own needs investigation, properly. That, or stop bringing up it up in this context. I have not done what I did with Western Skyrim only because I wanted to help my faction, even if indirectly I got a boon from that. I am ready to defend myself at any time, because there are things that can be debated in that decision, such as writing Skyrim that we should demilitarize the border, and I have my own opinions why it could be argued that it was within the bounds of RP rules. That said, screaming abuse for a reason like that after me trying to explain myself over and over does nothing but stir up drama again. So either stop doing it even if you think a certain way, or ask that its investigated.

    The other thing. I talked with Bantu Chieftan, I've asked his opinion and permission regarding certain things we've talked about in the past, and he gave his blessing for subbing. I am ready to show proof of this to the admin at any time. I don't demand that I sub, I leave it to the admin knowing what I know, but I have a strong claim to sub.

  2. #1002
    Potatoto's Avatar Centenarius
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    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

    "If we start a discussion like this, the claim that I abused that faction to help my own needs investigation, properly. That, or stop bringing up it up in this context. I have not done what I did with Western Skyrim only because I wanted to help my faction, even if indirectly I got a boon from that. I am ready to defend myself at any time, because there are things that can be debated in that decision, such as writing Skyrim that we should demilitarize the border, and I have my own opinions why it could be argued that it was within the bounds of RP rules. That said, screaming abuse for a reason like that after me trying to explain myself over and over does nothing but stir up drama again. So either stop doing it even if you think a certain way, or ask that its investigated."

    From my point of view what you did is clear and evident and it doesn't matter how hard you will try to persuade me that black is white and white is black I am not gonna believe you.

    "The other thing. I talked with Bantu Chieftan, I've asked his opinion and permission regarding certain things we've talked about in the past, and he gave his blessing for subbing."

    For how long did this guy played Skyrim, like 5 turns? His words should not be considered viable. Also you are allied by Ebonhart pact to Estern Skyrim which in fact makes you enemy to Western Skyrim. This alone should totally eliminate you from being allowed to sub Western Skyrim. Add to it what you were doing when you were subbing Western Skyrim last time makes it totally unacceptable that you would be allowed to sup Western Skyrim.

  3. #1003
    Mergor's Avatar T H E | G O R
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    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

    Your point of view came from sources that were not me. You didn't even ask. So be so kind as to stop stirring up drama.
    The point about Eastern Skyrim could be debated, if not for the fact, and I think even paladinbob agrees, that Eastern Skyrim is close to being defeated and then I could remake the ebonheart pact with the new Skyrim anyway if I wished. Even then, I can freely reveal that the first thing I was tasked with by Chief was to continue the war with them when subbing. But, my point stands: admin will decide.

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...0/BD_BM_50.sav

  4. #1004
    General Dragon.'s Avatar Champion of Dragons
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    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake



    "The Dragon is wise, a sage among the ignorant. He knows not all that glitters is gold."

  5. #1005
    BerryKnight's Avatar Kings Guard Commander
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    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

    Cleared Save sent

  6. #1006
    Jadli's Avatar The Fallen God
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    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

    Pretty sure Merg shouldnt sub W. Skyrim...


    Anequina subbed, Hlaalu up! https://www.mediafire.com/file/vuklr...lu_50.sav/file Its really fun when a player screws up the whole faction/alliance and then leaves...

    (I assume Potato will sub Hlaalu)

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    Potatoto's Avatar Centenarius
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    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake


  8. #1008

    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

    Mergor, you're not going to make another Ebonheart pact with yourself.

    Edit: I haven't written this here yet but I believe Mergor has no business what so ever to sub Western Skyrim.
    Last edited by Isenbard; June 23, 2021 at 07:48 AM.

  9. #1009
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    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

    I would have every right to sub Skyrim in my opinion, and people are too biased against me to even listen (Starting with the fact that I've not even demanded that I sub, I wanted the admins opinion). That said, I've decided that I am not going to use either the pass or the admins approval in DM-s to sub, I'll rather help in getting a new player (and then he can decide for himself) or let someone else sub W. Skyrim. Berry or Jadli.

    But I am going to write a big message here sometimes soon, presenting my case. In game messages, DM-s, everything. Its really time you drop away your biases and let me actually speak for myself instead of relying on... whatever certain people told you. This is toxicity on your parts.

  10. #1010
    Potatoto's Avatar Centenarius
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    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

    "I would have every right to sub Skyrim in my opinion, and people are too biased against me to even listen"

    It is such an absurd. It is if Dragon would leave then Isenbard would clam he has every right to sub both Dragon's factions due to Sherhelm being in good relations with Orcs or if Paladinbob would leave and then I would claim I have right to sub his both factions due to Empire being allied to Crowns. Moreover that is yet not to mention what you were doing when you subbed this faction last time...

  11. #1011

    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

    Quote Originally Posted by Potatoto View Post
    "I would have every right to sub Skyrim in my opinion, and people are too biased against me to even listen"

    It is such an absurd. It is if Dragon would leave then Isenbard would clam he has every right to sub both Dragon's factions due to Sherhelm being in good relations with Orcs or if Paladinbob would leave and then I would claim I have right to sub his both factions due to Empire being allied to Crowns. Moreover that is yet not to mention what you were doing when you subbed this faction last time...
    To be honest, i find this whole argument and penalization of Mergor insane? so you continue to attack mergor for a supposed move [in subbing a faction] that benefited my faction and his? where is the prove of that? Skyrim is hanging onto the map by their fingernails and his own faction in the tribute temple is not fairing much better? if mergor is supposely so sneaky in making a move that ends up making matters so much poorer for either of our factions,then what is the crime? then why are you complaining? [sighs] i think there are personal grievances here , that are at play here , rather than constructive criticism (
    Last edited by paladinbob123; June 23, 2021 at 05:34 PM.
    "War is the continuation of politics by other means." - Carl von Clausewitz



  12. #1012
    Potatoto's Avatar Centenarius
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    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

    "To be honest, i find this whole argument and penalization of Mergor insane"

    What penalization? We talk about subbing another faction, not a penalization Mergor's factions by any way.

    "so you continue to attack mergor for a supposed move [in subbing a faction] that benefited my faction and his? where is the prove of that?"

    Prove for what exactly? For that making peace between both Skyrim factions would benefit his own faction? You serious?

    " Skyrim is hanging onto the map by their fingernails "

    I believe Western Skyrim is much stronger than that

    "f mergor is supposely so sneaky in making a move that ends up making matters so much poorer for either of our factions,then what is the crime? then why are you complaining? [sighs]"

    Honestly I do not get what you mean by that at all.

    " i think there are personal grievances here , that are at play here , rather than constructive criticism "

    Not at all. I just do believe that Margor is one of the least if not the least player who should get right to sub Skyrim for the warious mentioned already reasons.

  13. #1013

    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

    Quote Originally Posted by Potatoto View Post
    "To be honest, i find this whole argument and penalization of Mergor insane"

    What penalization? We talk about subbing another faction, not a penalization Mergor's factions by any way.
    i didnt say penalization of Mergor's faction, just mergor ...by your own and others words....there's a difference...and not just in the words we use and the words you add or neglect,as has happened here in this statement?

    Quote Originally Posted by Potatoto View Post
    "so you continue to attack mergor for a supposed move [in subbing a faction] that benefited my faction and his? where is the prove of that?"

    Prove for what exactly? For that making peace between both Skyrim factions would benefit his own faction? You serious?
    oh yes, the benefit for skyrim[eastern skyrim which is called my faction] saw our southern regions smashed to pieces by the actions of mergors agreement [this was of course after a lengthy period of conflict where both western and eastern skyrim had reached a point of zugzwang where neither faction risked putting a large force in range of each other]...by the way there was no "peace" in that agreement,just a temporary ceasefire which was used to smash my southern regions in a surprise attack , so you are ill informed, if that is your thought process on this matter, but yes i am still waiting to see what wonderful benefits my faction got from Mergor's supposed actions , i am sure you can also "invent" a list of those supposed benefits my faction has at this particular moment from his actions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Potatoto View Post
    " Skyrim is hanging onto the map by their fingernails "

    I believe Western Skyrim is much stronger than that
    actually i was referring to "eastern skyrim" or as my faction as traditionally been called during the turns as "skyrim"...and if you think western skyrim is hanging onto its areas, by its fingernails,, then i suggest you read the battle reports to see it is doing quite nicely thank you....as for me with "eastern skyrim" ...i cant see a long term future for them , considering the fact their navy is rather destroyed, southern regions smashed[during this action]and when most of their settlements are on the coastline, you can read the future of their faction.......but thank you for giving me a opportunity to say how badly my faction is doing after some critical areas, were smashed due to actions due in part from mergors actions? ...i think its called "cause and effect"..if you are blaming mergor for his actions in making my faction stronger, then you are badly ill informed, critically so, as that is not the case,...you dont have a legal case, to argue that mergors subbing actions have "benefited" eastern skyrim for that sadly has not been the case....its a little like blaming hillary clinton and the democrats for asking russians to "hacking the election" in their favor so efficiently that donald trump got in? its just without merit

    Quote Originally Posted by Potatoto View Post
    "f mergor is supposely so sneaky in making a move that ends up making matters so much poorer for either of our factions,then what is the crime? then why are you complaining? [sighs]"

    Honestly I do not get what you mean by that at all.
    yes as i said before "cause and effect"..if mergors actions are so malicious , that he is doing things purely for his own faction and mine, then why have we benefited so little for his actions? its a little like accusing two people for robbing a bank , then finding out they have no money, as they have spent most of what they have in upholding the banks shares, and have lost out on it? if you still dont understand, i will put it in simplier terms?

    if mergors actions were so ill , can you explain to me, how i benefited? please do so , because i cant see it?



    Quote Originally Posted by Potatoto View Post
    " i think there are personal grievances here , that are at play here , rather than constructive criticism "

    Not at all. I just do believe that Margor is one of the least if not the least player who should get right to sub Skyrim for the warious mentioned already reasons.
    so blaming a player again and again for helping out for subbing....is purely done for various reasons that seem unfounded, that has neither benefited me or mergor seems to be for ..what reason again? pray tell us all? or perhaps... is that you are so ill informed of what is going on?or just perhaps its just personal?
    Last edited by paladinbob123; June 23, 2021 at 07:58 PM.
    "War is the continuation of politics by other means." - Carl von Clausewitz



  14. #1014
    Jadli's Avatar The Fallen God
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    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

    Well, I dont know what happened during the last sub, whatever happened, was mainly due to the original players (zender, and then Bantu for a relatively short time recently) allowing it.

    Anyways, a situation like this would simply disqualify Mergor from subbing W. Skyrim/Haafingar in every HS afaik. The Pact is meant to be the highest form of alliance, and all yours the three factions in it (E.Skyrim/Eastmarch, Tribunal and Blackmarsh) are actively participating in it, and fighting the same enemies, etc. Eastmarch is fightng the morrowind rebellious houses as well afaik, hence I fail to see how Mergor subbing Haafingar can possibly be unbiased. Even if he tried really hard to be unbiased, he simply cant - him being in control of the damage/diplomacy dealt to Eastmarch, or even knowing all the intel about the war, simply cant work, doesnt matter if he would use it to his advantage or not.

    Simply:
    If player A is a close ally of faction B, and faction B is at war with faction C (while B is also helping A to fights it's enemies), faction A cant be the one subbing faction C. I would have through that is clear, the equation is applied like this in every HS...
    (and again, Im not saying that player A must have some inherent "shadow" intentions, but simply the HS cant work if A controls C)

    Anyways, sheep_whisperer said he might take some factions, so hopefully he takes it, and hence things get resolved

    BTW, if we hopefully get another player, I suggest to couple Anequina and Hlaalu (they are next to each other in turn order anyways), while subbing the almost dead bosmer I suppose. Not much to do with the faction anyway, and its kinda teamed up with Anequina forces anyways rn... (Anequina was originally coupled with Daggerfall, but its dead)
    Last edited by Jadli; June 24, 2021 at 03:08 AM.

  15. #1015
    Potatoto's Avatar Centenarius
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    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

    "oh yes, the benefit for skyrim[eastern skyrim which is called my faction] saw our southern regions smashed to pieces by the actions of mergors agreement [this was of course after a lengthy period of conflict where both western and eastern skyrim had reached a point of zugzwang where neither faction risked putting a large force in range of each other]...by the way there was no "peace" in that agreement,just a temporary ceasefire which was used to smash my southern regions in a surprise attack , so you are ill informed, if that is your thought process on this matter, but yes i am still waiting to see what wonderful benefits my faction got from Mergor's supposed actions , i am sure you can also "invent" a list of those supposed benefits my faction has at this particular moment from his actions?"

    "actually i was referring to "eastern skyrim" or as my faction as traditionally been called during the turns as "skyrim"...and if you think western skyrim is hanging onto its areas, by its fingernails,, then i suggest you read the battle reports to see it is doing quite nicely thank you....as for me with "eastern skyrim" ...i cant see a long term future for them , considering the fact their navy is rather destroyed, southern regions smashed[during this action]and when most of their settlements are on the coastline, you can read the future of their faction.......but thank you for giving me a opportunity to say how badly my faction is doing after some critical areas, were smashed due to actions due in part from mergors actions? ...i think its called "cause and effect"..if you are blaming mergor for his actions in making my faction stronger, then you are badly ill informed, critically so, as that is not the case,...you dont have a legal case, to argue that mergors subbing actions have "benefited" eastern skyrim for that sadly has not been the case....its a little like blaming hillary clinton and the democrats for asking russians to "hacking the election" in their favor so efficiently that donald trump got in? its just without merit "

    "yes as i said before "cause and effect"..if mergors actions are so malicious , that he is doing things purely for his own faction and mine, then why have we benefited so little for his actions? its a little like accusing two people for robbing a bank , then finding out they have no money, as they have spent most of what they have in upholding the banks shares, and have lost out on it? if you still dont understand, i will put it in simplier terms?

    if mergors actions were so ill , can you explain to me, how i benefited? please do so , because i cant see it?"

    I never said Mergor did anythink to help out your faction. What it comes to Tribunal then obviously Skyrim factions being at peace with each others would allow you to fully support Tribunal Temple in its homewar and therefore abviously benefits Tribunal hugely. That your southern lands were smashed comes from breaking this deal to your suprise by new player, not from creating it by Mergor which btw is for me pure example of karma for abusing subing rights that way.

    "Well, I dont know what happened during the last sub, whatever happened, was mainly due to the original players (zender, and then Bantu for a relatively short time recently) allowing it."

    The think is it is not like that. Zender declared war on Estern Skyrim and Mergor after some turns (idk how much was that, 3 turns or so?) decided by himself to make with Estern Skyrim.

  16. #1016
    Mergor's Avatar T H E | G O R
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    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...wSkyrim_50.sav

    Bantu Chieftan's instructions given to the admin to sub.

    Pics:
    https://postimg.cc/gallery/wgzJZx2

  17. #1017
    Bantu Chieftain's Avatar Biarchus
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    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

    E. Skyrim was on verge of defeat last time i played so i told Mergor or whoever wanted to sub that they need to be removed sooner or later. Whatever happends next is no more concern of mine.

  18. #1018

    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

    Quote Originally Posted by Jadli View Post
    Well, I dont know what happened during the last sub, whatever happened, was mainly due to the original players (zender, and then Bantu for a relatively short time recently) allowing it.

    Anyways, a situation like this would simply disqualify Mergor from subbing W. Skyrim/Haafingar in every HS afaik. The Pact is meant to be the highest form of alliance, and all yours the three factions in it (E.Skyrim/Eastmarch, Tribunal and Blackmarsh) are actively participating in it, and fighting the same enemies, etc. Eastmarch is fightng the morrowind rebellious houses as well afaik, hence I fail to see how Mergor subbing Haafingar can possibly be unbiased. Even if he tried really hard to be unbiased, he simply cant - him being in control of the damage/diplomacy dealt to Eastmarch, or even knowing all the intel about the war, simply cant work, doesnt matter if he would use it to his advantage or not.

    Simply:
    If player A is a close ally of faction B, and faction B is at war with faction C (while B is also helping A to fights it's enemies), faction A cant be the one subbing faction C. I would have through that is clear, the equation is applied like this in every HS...
    (and again, Im not saying that player A must have some inherent "shadow" intentions, but simply the HS cant work if A controls C)

    Anyways, sheep_whisperer said he might take some factions, so hopefully he takes it, and hence things get resolved

    BTW, if we hopefully get another player, I suggest to couple Anequina and Hlaalu (they are next to each other in turn order anyways), while subbing the almost dead bosmer I suppose. Not much to do with the faction anyway, and its kinda teamed up with Anequina forces anyways rn... (Anequina was originally coupled with Daggerfall, but its dead)
    Coupling Hlaalu and Anequina sounds like a good idea. Subbing the Bosmer would of course bring another faction into the equation. It is still a third turn, although the faction is near dead. We would need to find someone who is willing to play all three factions

  19. #1019
    BerryKnight's Avatar Kings Guard Commander
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    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

    High Kingdom of Skyrim subbed.
    Heartlands up ~ https://www.mediafire.com/file/7lx9s...ds_50.sav/file

  20. #1020
    Potatoto's Avatar Centenarius
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    Default Re: [The Elder Scrolls - Unofficial Patch 1.42] Black Drake

    Forebears up
    https://drive.google.com/file/d/16j8...ew?usp=sharing

    I beaten BM's merchant with my own merchant as Duchy. As Colovia I assaulted Orc castle with men 300 loses and took Waryest town with balista and OO. As Talvani I killed BM's diplomat near Narsis with 95%.

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