Unbalanced forces

[redeemer6]

I'm new to medieval total war, I played rome total war for years and loved it. I've just started playing the medieval Britannia campaign and I'm surprised at how terrible the battles are compared to rome total war. The archers seem to do little to no damage, charging does all as most of the soldiers don't engage and most of the men don't commit to the fight. I just had tried to take a castle and sent heavy billmen onto the ramparts vs scottishs archers, comparing the stats on the paused screen it seemed like my heavy billmen would mess up the archers because they had little attack or defense stats, plus I had 50 billmen vs their 30. Somehow their archers won! This happened twice! It's such an unsatisfying game compared to rome total war and I'm really regretting buying it. Does anyone else feel the same?

[paleologos]

...
Does anyone else feel the same?

Everybody felt that way the first time we tried M2:TW after having played R:TW.
It takes some time getting used to it.
Keep in mind that the different strength balance is supposed to reflect the changes in warfare and social organization since antiquity.
Medieval societies, especially early medieval societies, did not - and for a few centuries would not - have the capability to train large numbers of well trained, solid infantry like the hoplites of ancient Greece of the Roman triarii and legionaries.
Cavalry tactics on the other hand were continually honed, culminating in the conrois formation cavalry charge (knights charging in a formation tight enough for their stirrups to touch).

[Sar1n]

Your poor billmen got slaughtered because of two things. Vanilla animations for two-handed weapons are bugged and slow, so they get interrupted and slaughtered by quicker troops with one-handed weapon...and then, of course, there are towers. They can hurt a lot if they hit your troops in the back when fighting on the walls.

Charging with infantry can be weird. There are three main things that can mess it up, so before you give the order, make sure that guard mode is off, if the unit has ranged weapon, its ammunition is completely expended, and there is enough distance between them and target to actually charge (it's not long, for infantry a few meters is enough).

M2TW is good game, but mods are what really makes it great. If you want to play vanilla campaign with fixes only, there's Bare Geomod around, then Retrofit, KGCM and Total Vanilla that stick close to vanilla feel while improving the game, and then tons of other mods around.

[DaCMan]

I don't know, I might like M2TW more than RTW. I loved Rome Total War, but Medieval II seems more modern of a game, and the battles are much larger than in Rome. I do admit that I find myself auto resolving more battles, but that's just because of more troops. I think I was a bit more meticulous with the Rome campaign, but I prefer the battles in medieval (likely because of the extra units you can recruit in one turn.)

[NorseThing]

I the to suggest that you not do what I did when starting out. Do not auto resolve!!! Take each of the battles as a learning opportunity. A simple battle will teach you loads of tactics such as flanking with even you archers and other infantry. The beginning of a campaign will have loads of these simpler battles. Do an auto-save before starting the battle. Play out the battle a few times trying differing tactics and see what works better. You will be surprised how much you can learn with only a 4 or 5 units on each side rather than trying to manage a massive army with reinforcements.

[EoNightcore]

Archers do little damage because it's mostly Crossbowmen in the Medieval Age.

You want Archers that do damage? You best look to Poland, England (their higher-tier Longbowmen are deadly), the Byzantine Empire... uuuh.... Idk who else, everyone else mostly uses Crossbows.

Charging does little in terms of Infantry units in M2TW, they're more of a.... keep the enemy in place thing. Think of them like an Anvil.

You should never use 2h units as front-liners, they just don't have the stats before they start mounting heavy casualties, much better to send in sword units like Dismounted Feudal Knights. 2h units should be used as Shock Troops, charging in to tear up the enemy, before leaving so the actual front-line troops can arrive, or attacking from the back to begin tearing up the enemy as front-line troops attract the enemy's attention.

In fact, most battles I have in M2TW tend to develop into flanking the enemy, mainly because attempting to fight the enemy in a straight-on fight causes battles to turn into a slog unless I have superior forces.

Also, just a note, when charging with cavalry, you have to form them up every time before they charge, or else they'll just do little to no damage once they hit the enemy's lines. They'll just pull out their swords and begin swinging.


In other words, most of the tactics developed from RTW are useless here, and you either adapt to the new warfare, or your armies die trying.

[Jurand of Cracow]

My advice would be: play only mods. You may try Europa Barbarorum II for the Ancient Times, SS with a submod (BGRIV, SSHIP or BtfB) for the Medieval Age, Dawn of Conquest for the MA in the Western Europe, Broken Crescent for the MA in the Middle East, TIW for the Renaissance in Europe, The Thirty Years War for the Pike&Shot period. They improve so many of the Medieval features that you feel like they're different games from M2 vanilla.

[Kataphractos]

plus I had 50 billmen vs their 30. Somehow their archers won! This happened twice! It's such an unsatisfying game compared to rome total war and I'm really regretting buying it. Does anyone else feel the same?

Wall defenders are disproportionate because they're not facing off against the entire attacking unit at once if they're using ladders. This is why a unit of peasants can repel feudal knights, for example. Siege towers change it up and tilt the balance back toward the attackers, but as expected they take longer to build.

And as others have said, 2hand units are kind of jacked, so you need special strategies for effectively using them.

[Dismounted Feudal Knight]

You can get good 2 handed units again with a basic mod (basically the same experience, with a bit more polish), like the ones suggested above. Retrofit 2.0 should handle it just fine - that's the most vanilla one I use.

[UndrState]

Also , make sure you learn how to do a proper charge - you can't just run at an enemy esp. with horses in M2TW like you could in RTW .

[Iosif Stalin]

I'm surprised at how terrible the battles are compared to rome total war. The archers seem to do little to no damage

Really? I think the archers are better in M2TW than in RTW. Roman archers (pre-Marian reforms) in RTW are absolutely worthless. I can have 60 archers firing volley after volley at an enemy army and get, like, two kills by the time the gap between armies closes and my archers have to quit firing. That would never happen in M2TW. The archers in M2TW are more realistic. Not completely realistic, but more so than RTW archers. They don't completely slaughter the enemy, not every arrow hits and not every hit kills, but they're good enough for gameplay purposes in my experience.

As for the thing with your billmen doing badly against archers, well, I agree that billmen are underpowered, but picture a battle like that happening in real life. A bunch of guys with big long heavy two-handed weapons going up ladders to attack defenders on the ramparts with more easily wielded one-handed blades in a narrow confined space. The defenders are going to have the advantage in any case, but in this situation especially so. Frankly I would be more surprised if the billmen won.