[Britannia Expansion - Custom Submod] The Isles of Chaos (Roleplay Hotseat)

[The Wise Coffin]

Can the barons capture a large city without siege equipment?
Because he did that.

[Dismounted Feudal Knight]

4> Auto Resolve only, with screenshots from just before the battle and after the battle.

Also applies to the initial capture of York, as I don't recall seeing that one posted either, but for the exact above reason there are screenshots involved. If a spy was used, that involves screenshots to basically say "yes, agents were involved in the capture of the settlement", the only case my slightly addled mind at the moment can think of where siege equipment could be bypassed to conduct a single-turn assault on a settlement.

[The Wise Coffin]

4> Auto Resolve only, with screenshots from just before the battle and after the battle.

Also applies to the initial capture of York, as I don't recall seeing that one posted either, but for the exact above reason there are screenshots involved. If a spy was used, that involves screenshots to basically say "yes, agents were involved in the capture of the settlement", the only case my slightly addled mind at the moment can think of where siege equipment could be bypassed to conduct a single-turn assault on a settlement.

I have not captured York. Whend it came to my turn it was in my possession.

[LordPureLegacy]

How did it come to your possession was it an event or something?.

[Dismounted Feudal Knight]

I have not captured York. Whend it came to my turn it was in my possession.

I do recall a script in the Britannia campaign where settlements can rebel to other factions, so my apologies. General screens for all engagements are still preferable to avoid the potential for confusion.

I'm curious as to what battle you refer to, then. Lord stated he only besieged the settlement (York, which is what I assume you mean), not took it.

Is your army standing just outside of it or something? Are there new units there, indicative of such a rebellion?...

I think the Barons and the Crown could be victims of a highly indecisive population.

[Der Böse Wolf]

I think what we need now, for transparency is:

1- In regards to York:
- Barons letting us know how the public order was on his last turn before the rebellion
- England telling us if he used spies to stir things up

Although I don't think England is required to justify anything in this case, unless he used agents I guess.

2- In regards to the English settlement captured by the Barons:
- Screenshots of the battle (obligatory): deployment and results
- If a spy was used to open the gates: screenshots
- As for te use of siege equipment, I think it depends on how many defenders the city has and the type of wall defenses.
So if the Barons took the city in one turn, it means that:

- Either they had the adequate artillery required for this kind of city, in which case the Barons player must specify it.
- Barons used a spy, in which case a screenshot is required with the percentage allowed
- Barons attacked an army situated just outside the city and forced a sally out of the garrison, which can be seen in the battle deployment screenshot that the Barons player must provide.

[LordPureLegacy]

The Battle of Lord Simon and King Henry was finished with a near close victory for the Barons it may be called a victory but many died and Lord Simon lost half of his men.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/16TD...ew?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1AX7...ew?usp=sharing

[Dismounted Feudal Knight]

Der Bose Wolf is correct that in accordance with the rules, screenshots are the norm for showing battle resolution.

Each level of siege assault requires some degree of equipment to have be involved as per the rules, unless a spy was used to gain entry.

[LordPureLegacy]

I took the settlement with overwhelming odds you can even ask Wise Coffin they were four English Knights and their like my best units against one militia and I sieged it with a ram I think and some other stuff.

[Der Böse Wolf]

I took the settlement with overwhelming odds you can even ask Wise Coffin they were four English Knights and their like my best units against one militia and I sieged it with a ram I think and some other stuff.

From the rules:

> If there are less than 4 full units or less than 250 men in a besieged settlement, only a battering ram is required to be able to breach a set of walls.

So you're fine in regards to siege equipment.
But still screenshots are required.

[Dismounted Feudal Knight]

From the rules: > If there are less than 4 full units or less than 250 men in a besieged settlement, only a battering ram is required to be able to breach a set of walls. So you're fine in regards to siege equipment. But still screenshots are required.

The original design of the rules was to have two layers... 1: the siege equipment required 2: the manpower/etc required, that builds on top of the initial siege rules (in the section "Next Stage of Sieges"). The original writing was unfortunately ambiguous, but the intent of the rules was to have the siege equipment be required as a baseline, and then additional rules depending on the size of the force that is being besieged. Up to admin interpretation on this one. But the interpretation I state above is how the rules were supposed to go. Alas, they were rather sloppy (thanks me), and remain a bit sloppy to this day, hence the confusion.

[Der Böse Wolf]

The original design of the rules was to have two layers... 1: the siege equipment required 2: the manpower/etc required, that builds on top of the initial siege rules (in the section "Next Stage of Sieges"). The original writing was unfortunately ambiguous, but the intent of the rules was to have the siege equipment be required as a baseline, and then additional rules depending on the size of the force that is being besieged. Up to admin interpretation on this one. But the interpretation I state above is how the rules were supposed to go. Alas, they were rather sloppy (thanks me), and remain a bit sloppy to this day, hence the confusion.

Well in this case we have a problem.

The rules say that no siege engines (artillery) can be used twice in the same turn or the turn after.

But if siege engines (artillery) are ALWAYS required, as a first layer on top of manpower and siege equipment (ladders, rams, towers), then this makes conquest WAY too slow, mega expensive and frankly impossible, as we will need to have LOTS of artillery to move
around.

The way I understood it, before what you have just explained, is that the Artillery rules need to be applied when using artillery.
And the manpower and siege equipment (ladders, rams, towers), need to always be applied regardless of artillery.

This way it's balanced and feasible.

[Dismounted Feudal Knight]

Well in this case we have a problem. The rules say that no siege engines (artillery) can be used twice in the same turn or the turn after. But if siege engines (artillery) are ALWAYS required, as a first layer on top of manpower and siege equipment (ladders, rams, towers), then this makes conquest WAY too slow, mega expensive and frankly impossible, as we will need to have LOTS of artillery to move around. The way I understood it, before what you have just explained, is that the Artillery rules need to be applied when using artillery. And the manpower and siege equipment (ladders, rams, towers), need to always be applied regardless of artillery. This way it's balanced and feasible.

The idea behind the rule was precisely to prevent easy conquest. I wouldn't consider it excessively expensive, and the idea was to help make it so borders would not instantly melt within a couple turns of work. Sieges become more of a consideration when you have to make the choice to either blitz an enemy, which takes more resources than total war indicates, or the choice to besiege forces. It was intended to greatly slow down the rate of conquest, or at least make it so more planning was involved, rather than just raw numbers. I wouldn't consider it impossible.

[Der Böse Wolf]

Ok well, it's good to know.

I'd better adapt my military strategy now as artillery is the most important part of the military.
I'm all for realism and slow expansion, so I'm looking forward to test the rules in this campaign.

Well then, it seems the Barons have breached the rules in that first siege, eventhough it seems that it was not done on purpose.

QUESTION: are we allowed to siege without the proper siege equipment, just to starve off the enemy?
Or, start the siege without the full number of footsoldiers or artillery and only assault when we have enough troops (recruited via mercenaries or arrival of reinforcements - just like we have to wait to build the siege engines (rams, ladders...)?

[Dismounted Feudal Knight]

The rules apply to assaults; there's nothing that says one can't starve out the enemy side.

[Jadli]

LorePureLegacy will replay his turn, as he didnt fulfill the criteria for taking that large town.

As it seems there wasnt a general agreement on a specific system of how to import OLB, we will do it the simple way. Winner of manual battle is is allowed to win the battle via AR on map (if he cant win it in AR admin will help). Participants in the battle should check armes of their oponenent(s) to ensure he has correct units. If a leader of one of the armies died, admin will get rid of him.

LorePureLegacy won the last OLB, thus he is allowed to defeat the enemy army (on this turn). Always notify admins when something like this come up.

TheWiseCoffin won the battle against Commodus, thus he can also win the battle on his turn.

[Der Böse Wolf]

LorePureLegacy will replay his turn, as he didnt fulfill the criteria for taking that large town.

As it seems there wasnt a general agreement on a specific system of how to import OLB, we will do it the simple way. Winner of manual battle is is allowed to win the battle via AR on map (if he cant win it in AR admin will help). Participants in the battle should check armes of their oponenent(s) to ensure he has correct units. If a leader of one of the armies died, admin will get rid of him.

LorePureLegacy won the last OLB, thus he is allowed to defeat the enemy army (on this turn). Always notify admins when something like this come up.

TheWiseCoffin won the battle against Commodus, thus he can also win the battle on his turn.

In this case can the winner of an OLB get a heoric victory at AR?

[Jadli]

Yes.

[LordPureLegacy]

England Up Again!
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1zpu...ew?usp=sharing

Everything stayed the same England armies defeated prince Edward killed. All that changed is barons want peace after the devastating battle but now England doesn't, only creates more of a reason for the Baron Rebellion and now England brings more war first he brings Scotland to war with me now Wales. This only proves England can't fight for himself and depends on others man up King Henry.

I am gonna start looking for a replacement for me I have been subjugated too much so I am leaving will do my turns until one is found.

[The Wise Coffin]

England Up Again!
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1zpu...ew?usp=sharing

Everything stayed the same England armies defeated prince Edward killed. All that changed is barons want peace after the devastating battle but now England doesn't, only creates more of a reason for the Baron Rebellion and now England brings more war first he brings Scotland to war with me now Wales. This only proves England can't fight for himself and depends on others man up King Henry.

I am gonna start looking for a replacement for me I have been subjugated too much so I am leaving will do my turns until one is found.

In our battle my prince, nor king haven't been killed, so i won't accept this result. I'm sorry, but the recent behaviours from the Barons have to much to be desired. First i was the one that asked for peace and he refused, and now that he killed a main character from my faction he wants peace. That clearly puts a bad taste on my mouth. If this situation does not clear itself i wont be participating any longer in this hotseat. LordPureLegacy to me ruined this entire experience with his rushed attack on my lands, breaking hotseat rules and behaving more like a regular hotseat.

The example between what happened between me and whales is how i was hoping for this hotseat to be conducted. In true spirit of what can a RP hotseat be like.
Sorry to bring this up, Commodus, but i came for this hotseat to refresh my love for the concept, and not fall back into the same BS that i experienced in previous ones.