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Thread: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

  1. #101

    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    Quote Originally Posted by mishkin View Post
    "Ethnic cleansing is the systematic deliberate removal of ethnic or religious groups from a given territory with the intent of making it ethnically homogeneous.[1][page needed] The forces applied may be various forms of forced migration (deportation, population transfer), intimidation, as well as mass murder and genocidal rape". (Wikipedia)

    It is ethnic cleansing when you want to deport a whole social (ethnic) group based on false allegations that they are all criminalst, are in the country for spurious reasons or are directly terrorists. Regrettable OP, by the way. Just say that you want Europe white and free of Muslims.


    Can we agree that the most progressive thing to do would be to bring in 100-200 million new people, presumably African and Arabic Muslims, to displace and replace the historic population of Greece, Italy, Switzerland, Austria, Germany, France, etc?
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  2. #102

    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    Quote Originally Posted by ByzantinePowerGame View Post
    Can we agree that the most progressive thing to do would be to bring in 100-200 million new people, presumably African and Arabic Muslims, to displace and replace the historic population of Greece, Italy, Switzerland, Austria, Germany, France, etc?
    What do you mean by "displace and replace"? Natives are still there, right?
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  3. #103
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    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    And what does "historic population" means? First time I've heard that concept. Does it refer to the characteristics of a population at a specific time?

  4. #104

    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    The people who were in France for the last 2000 years are being squeezed out.

    I suppose colonialism never happened in Africa because the various African populations were still there.

    The Portuguese never colonized Angola because the native Angolans "were still there."
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  5. #105

    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    Quote Originally Posted by The spartan View Post
    What do you mean by "displace and replace"? Natives are still there, right?

    Muslims in France occupy space and use resources that would otherwise be used for the sustainment and expansion of the French people.


    Every million Muslims who move into Europe are taking resources and space that would otherwise be used for the birth and rearing of one million European children.

    Each outsider who enters into Europe represents one more European who will never be brought into existence, if not because of the resource competition and the crowding then because of the demoralization that their presence causes.

    It has been demonstrated that the Anglo-American birthrate, which was so high that the US population doubled every decade from 1780-1840, began to flat-line and plummet with the waves of non-Anglo immigration that began in the 1840s and 1850s and more so from 1880 to 1920.

    Natives tend not to want to have children because they don't feel optimistic about the future when they witness hordes of outsiders pouring in.

    If there are perhaps presently 40 million Muslims/outsiders in Europe it means that they represent 40 million Europeans who will never be brought into existence.
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  6. #106
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    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    Quote Originally Posted by mishkin View Post
    And what does "historic population" means? First time I've heard that concept. Does it refer to the characteristics of a population at a specific time?
    Do you not see that the historic inhabitants of France are a distinct nation in their homeland from both their neighbours and certainly those from off-continent.
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  7. #107

    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    Quote Originally Posted by ByzantinePowerGame View Post
    The people who were in France for the last 2000 years are being squeezed out.
    I suppose colonialism never happened in Africa because the various African populations were still there.
    The Portuguese never colonized Angola because the native Angolans "were still there."
    For the past 2000 years? You seem to need to take a look at French history...
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  8. #108
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    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    Quote Originally Posted by ByzantinePowerGame View Post
    The people who were in France for the last 2000 years are being squeezed out.
    I did not know that the French were so long-lived.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aexodus View Post
    Do you not see that the historic inhabitants of France are a distinct nation in their homeland from both their neighbours and certainly those from off-continent.
    Again, could you please define "historic inhabitants"? A Frenchman is a citizen protected by the French state and who has the obligation to comply with its laws and pay their taxes. No matter its origin, skin color or beliefs. (And god forbid me to have to differentiate a Frenchman from a Belgian or a Swiss. Neither silent or speaking the language of their choice).

    If you want to talk about skin tones or religions as essential characteristics of a European citizen (no matter the country), do it.

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    Have the courage to use Spain or Portugal as examples when talking about "historic inhabitants" or when you mention nations, please.
    Last edited by makawa; March 03, 2018 at 06:49 AM.

  9. #109

    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    Quote Originally Posted by mishkin View Post
    And what does "historic population" means?
    A better term would be "indigenous".
    Quote Originally Posted by Enros View Post
    You don't seem to be familiar with how the burden of proof works in when discussing social justice. It's not like science where it lies on the one making the claim. If someone claims to be oppressed, they don't have to prove it.


  10. #110
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    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    Quote Originally Posted by sumskilz View Post
    A better term would be "indigenous".
    No, they are talking about nations/states (they have given as an example modern france) and about something stable for millennia and the concept "indigenous" is linked to a certain moment in time and to a specific geographical area (nothing to do with nations, something quite fickle, and states, something equally changing). I think that when they speak of "historical population" what they refer to is, simply, white population. Even more in the context of a discussion defending the expulsion of non-white/muslim illegal immigrants.

  11. #111

    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    Quote Originally Posted by mishkin View Post
    No, they are talking about nations/states (they have given as an example modern france) and about something stable for millennia and the concept "indigenous" is linked to a certain moment in time and to a specific geographical area (nothing to do with nations, something quite fickle, and states, something equally changing). I think that when they speak of "historical population" what they refer to is, simply, white population. Even more in the context of a discussion defending the expulsion of non-white/muslim illegal immigrants.
    So they're claiming that Europeans are the indigenous population of Europe, what's controversial about that? There hasn't been a major population replacement from outside Europe since the Neolithic. Within Europe there is significant local population continuity back to the Bronze Age. As a comparative example, the Inuit are considered the indigenous people of northern Canada and Greenland, yet they are much less deeply rooted there both in ancestry and in culture than the French are in France.
    Quote Originally Posted by Enros View Post
    You don't seem to be familiar with how the burden of proof works in when discussing social justice. It's not like science where it lies on the one making the claim. If someone claims to be oppressed, they don't have to prove it.


  12. #112
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    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    They are defending an eternal homogeneity in Europe ignoring the great migrations, changes in borders, changes in the composition, culture and religion of the populations to reject the current flow of immigrants. Euphemisms not to say "close the borders to muslims and africans, we want a white Europe like that of our grandparents".

  13. #113
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    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    Quote Originally Posted by mishkin View Post
    They are defending an eternal homogeneity in Europe ignoring the great migrations, changes in borders, changes in the composition, culture and religion of the populations to reject the current flow of immigrants. Euphemisms not to say "close the borders to muslims and africans, we want a white Europe like that of our grandparents".
    Why shouldn't we oppose mass immigration that displaces the original populace and fundamentally changes the culture of their homeland. A concept that has somewhat been forgotten in most western countries, regrettably.

    As sumskillz has already said:

    There hasn't been a major population replacement from outside Europe since the Neolithic.
    So, why should there be such a massive population change as is happening now. Who decided that this was going to happen. Certainly not the mass native European populace.
    Last edited by Aexodus; March 04, 2018 at 09:33 AM.
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  14. #114

    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aexodus View Post
    Why shouldn't we oppose mass immigration that displaces the original populace and fundamentally changes the culture of their homeland. A concept that has somewhat been forgotten in most western countries, regrettably.
    As sumskillz has already said:
    So, why should there be such a massive population change as is happening now. Who decided that this was going to happen. Certainly not the mass native European populace.
    You thought French people are same as that of 2000 years ago. You should first acknowledge the utter failure of uttering something like that.

    You are also operating under a bunch of false premises. No one is displacing no one, nor they're changing the local's culture. Just because they practice their own culture doesn't mean your culture changes. The mass immigration part is debatable as well.
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  15. #115
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    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Setekh View Post
    You thought French people are same as that of 2000 years ago. You should first acknowledge the utter failure of uttering something like that.

    You are also operating under a bunch of false premises. No one is displacing no one, nor they're changing the local's culture. Just because they practice their own culture doesn't mean your culture changes. The mass immigration part is debatable as well.
    So are current levels of immigration from outside Europe 'normal', then?

    On account of displacement, the English are a minority in London. Tell me that's not displacement.

    I know the French aren't exactly the same, but they've always been Europeans. Now, by no means am I saying that we deport anyone who isn't white, that's idiotic. What I would argue for, is how do we prevent what's happened in London in cities in the rest of the UK, and more broadly Europe. It is likely ethnic Brits will be a minority in Britain by the end of the century at current trends.
    Last edited by Aexodus; March 04, 2018 at 09:56 AM.
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  16. #116

    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aexodus View Post
    So are current levels of immigration from outside Europe 'normal', then?

    On account of displacement, the English are a minority in London. Tell me that's not displacement.

    I know the French aren't exactly the same, but they've always been Europeans. Now, by no means am I saying that we deport anyone who isn't white, that's idiotic. What I would argue for, is how do we prevent what's happened in London in cities in the rest of the UK, and more broadly Europe. It is likely ethnic Brits will be a minority in Britain by the end of the century at current trends.
    Do I really need to post the definition for the word "displacement"? London have been a center stage for centuries. It always housed a great number of foreigners. Though in the beginning it was a Roman city, not a British one. Bad example.

    French have always been European? Why does it matter that a tribe from north eastern Europe is OK to settle in France but a tribe from north Africa is not? The north eastern European tribe was as foreign to France as the north African tribe. Same goes for Romans that settled there.

    I forgot to ask the real question though; what's wrong with immigration? It was immigration that created today's England, France, Italy, Spain, so on and on.
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  17. #117
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    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    White British in London ARE being displaced, it's called white flight http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21511904

    When the Indo-Europeans invaded Europe from the East, they replaced the hunter-gatherer population that was already there. That's who the French take 90% of their ancestry from. And I don't know if the people who were native at the time were that happy about it, as their culture was replaced. It's not a question of what is right and wrong, it's about defending who you are as a people.

    The thing about immigration is that you're right, it did create the countries we know today. The Roman Invasion spelled disaster for the old Celtic traditions in England. It is immigration that will create tomorrow's England, France, Spain, Italy... and we don't know what future that holds. Take the Balkans, and what happened there over a few hundred years. And what we are seeing now is greater migration from outside Europe than ever before, meaning Europe as we know it will change.

    And London is an English city, 100 years ago it housed more than 50% less ethnic minorities.
    Last edited by Aexodus; March 04, 2018 at 10:32 AM.
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  18. #118

    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aexodus View Post
    The thing about immigration is that you're right, it did create the countries we know today. The Roman Invasion spelled disaster for the old Celtic traditions in England. It is immigration that will create tomorrow's England, France, Spain, Italy... and we don't know what future that holds. Take the Balkans, and what happened there over a few hundred years. And what we are seeing now is greater migration from outside Europe than ever before, meaning Europe as we know it will change.
    Come again? Today's migration is greater compared to entire tribes marching in mass with swords and shields at hand? Seriously?
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  19. #119
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    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Setekh View Post
    Come again? Today's migration is greater compared to entire tribes marching in mass with swords and shields at hand? Seriously?
    It's already been put that this is the greatest migration since the Neolithic, which ended over 4000 years ago. They don't need swords and shields, or other weapons, the borders have been opened.
    Last edited by Aexodus; March 04, 2018 at 10:55 AM.
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  20. #120

    Default Re: Since when is deportation a type of "ethnic cleansing"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aexodus View Post
    It's already been put that this is the greatest migration since the Bronze Age, which ended over 4000 years ago. They don't need swords and shields, or other weapons, the borders have been opened.
    Greatest in which way?
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