MERCHANTS

[j.a.luna]

An alternative approach would be to drop the literal term "merchant" altogether, and recast the mechanic in terms of a "trading camp". Thus, England doesn't set up a merchant on a wool resource, but instead sets up a trading camp there. This seems to me to pay more heed to the greatly limited number of available "merchants", to make a bit more historical sense (no one is actually sending some dude out there, but a trading camp might well be established by the crown), and to explain why one might stay in one place for so dang long.

The downside to that is that many of the traits and ancillaries would need to be recast with the "camp" idea in mind. Their triggers and effects (the game mechanics side) need not be changed, but the descriptions and names of things definitely would need to be. That is work I'd be okay doing though. Changing merchants to "trading camps" would also necessitate new strat map models and new "portraits", which are tasks I would not be suited for (though I think we've now got one or two lads who could do such things well).

In my opinion this is a good idea @Kilo11! and with more historical sense than only send a "guy" trading in other lands, better this idea about trading / mercantile company

[Kilo11]

I have been thinking about this more, and I think this could actually be reworked in a very interesting way. If we change the basic agent "Merchant" to "Trading Company", then I think the following things could be done to accommodate all the necessary alterations.

1. Traits and ancillaries for merchants would need their descriptions tweaked so that they make sense for a trading company (game effects and triggers could however be left exactly as is; the only difference here is the "cosmetic" one of changed descriptions and in-game trait/ancillary names.
2. The "age" of a Trading Company would just be the age of the company. We can even add a trait for "old age" that only applies to merchants, and that has as a description something like "This trading company is nearing the end of its royal charter. It will likely only have a few years left before it must be replaced by a newer one.".
3. We would have to check where the names for merchants are drawn from, and ensure that they are not getting names from the same pool as the normal faction characters' names. If they are, then this is a problem. If there is an easy way to create a list of "merchant's names", then there we can simply give some clever potential names for trading companies. This is something to check though.

[Jurand of Cracow]

3. We would have to check where the names for merchants are drawn from, and ensure that they are not getting names from the same pool as the normal faction characters' names

Unfortunately, they do.

[Kilo11]

Well, that sucks, and sinks my entire idea. I guess we are stuck with merchants then, and will have to make our peace with them as they are.

[Jurand of Cracow]

Well, that sucks, and sinks my entire idea. I guess we are stuck with merchants then, and will have to make our peace with them as they are.

Make war somewhere else!

Besides, the merchants need my work on programming the traits. Maybe for 098, if I feel urge to improve them (otherwise, they're doing quite well, I think, the AT-NGB bug is not much dangerous for them).

MERCHANTS (JoC)* the goal is to limit the increase of time the player deals with the merchants as the faction grows. The fewer merchants but each providing more income will be good for playing experience.
- availability (ie maximum limit of the number of merchants) limited to a few per faction. They'll be provided by:
(1) each capital (ie if you take another faction capital, you can recruit an additional merchant)
(2) guilds: Merchants, Explorers & Hanseatic (only after Ostsiedlung event).
(3) large cities in North Italy and in the Low Countries (if Warehouse is built).
(4) all huge coastal cities (if Docklands is built).
- a pop-out window with the above information has been included.
* the traits of the merchants have not yet been reviewed after 092, but they seem to work more-or-less ok. They may be in the future.

[removeduser_28376423423]

[QUOTE=Jurand of Cracow;15955860]Hey, finally somebody interested in this part of the game! Great! I've been working on resources and merchants recently so I'm happy to see the interests!

I think the main issue was the amount of them though, i tried limited them with TM's tweaks in a way similar to how it is being proposed now, back in 0.9.2 and i remember it felt much better, so i think it's looking good, also really appreaciate considering the other trade related buildings for their availability. Changes on resources seem great!

Yes, i check this subforum a lot lately, but english is not my native language, i wish i could contribute to something in the submod, i'm kind of motivated, but for now i think i wouldn't have the skills, nonetheless, keep up the good work, and looking forward to implementation!

[Jurand of Cracow]

An example from a v. 098 test game how much you can make out of a merchant:

[Khevsur]

I do not want Merchants in the game.

[Kilo11]

I do not want Merchants in the game.

If you are adamantly against merchants in the game, that is something you can pretty easily do with your own files. It is just one file to change to remove the starting merchants that are spawned on campaign start, and it is likewise a simple enough task to make it so merchants cannot be recruited.

From our side of things though, there is not currently a plan to remove merchants entirely, especially as they provide an important balancing tool for some otherwise very poor factions. We are always revising how they function, what numbers they bring, and everything else, but right now they are there to stay. But again, feel free to change your files if you wish, and if you have a specific suggestion about how to improve merchants, we always like suggestions

[Jurand of Cracow]

Another thing on economy, as I did on 0.9.7 my economy 100% relies on having merchants in order to field armies and expand. Without them situation would be dire and as soon as the merchants guilds pop up I expand my army and borders proportionally.
It is good that you start with few merchants other you would be able to snowball really hard as the Romans. I don't know how to feel exactly about it, but the gold mines in Egypt and Caucasus are my savior. But without them there is no way to secure the borders with enough troops, since I am attack by also sides.
In Crimea and Bulgaria by the Kipchaks, in the Balkans by the Serbians and the Sicilians, in the east by the Georgians (briefly) and the Crusaders.

[Jurand of Cracow]

Guys,
it would be interesting to observe how important the merchants for the finances are now. We've lowered the parameters as they're noticed to bring a few thousands florins just after a dozen of turns of work.
It might be we've overdone it. Here is a very good merchant working on a not-so-profitable resource and bringing rather little money. Can post pics of your merchants (not AI) from your games?

[Macaras]

I played 200 turns with KoJ, here are some observations:
I think merchants are optimal as they are right now:

[AndAnd92]

Hi everybody.

I am playing as Venice and I have conquered so far 20 territories (of which many cities), turn 35. I have built everywhere markets however I cannot recruit any more merchant than the 3 that were assigned to me at the beggining, as it says that I have achieved the agent cap.

Also, in milan for instance (that is obviously a city), where I have the market and all, merchants do not even appear to be available for recruitment. What am I missing?

[vovery]

Hi! I don't remember at which turn the info scroll on the limitations of merchants pops up in-game, and I'm not familiar enough with the mod files to know where to check it, but I could find the text at least:

Merchants are rare in the SSHIP but they do provide significant money.

At the beginning of the game, a medium-sized faction is likely to have just one or two, and there will only be a small increase in this number as you progress through the campaign. This is because the maximum number of merchants one can recruit grows only with each:

• Market in a starting capital of any faction (that means that if you would conquer such a settlement, your limit will grow +1)
• Warehouse building in Large Cities in Northern Italy, Dalmatia, or the Low Countries
• Docklands in any Huge City
• Merchants' Guild
• Adventurers' Guild (after the First Rudder is invented)
• Hanseatic buildings (only in areas settled by the Germanic settlers and after cooperation between Lubeck and Cologne has begun)

The merchants start with different levels of skill which increases as they work on trading a resource. The best merchants are recruited from cities where a Merchants' Guild is located, in particular cities with the guild's Master level present.

If you add together that you should be able to recruit more by now, best report it in the bugs thread