Proper Pike Etiquette

**TWoxy** · December 28, 2006, 07:57 AM

How do you use Pikemen effectively? Sometimes, a unit of Pike Militia can hold foot knights at bay and other times they simply draw swords and are subsequently massacred. I heard is has something to do with guard mode, like turning it off so they stand up and hold their pikes out in two ranks.
When this happens they cease to be defensive and can steamroller units like those phalanxes (which were too powerful, I'll admit) in Rome: Total War and RTW: Alexander.

Any ideas?:hmmm:

**Kalis** · December 28, 2006, 09:27 AM

practice practice practice

Essentially, to use pikes properly...
- leave the phalanx and guard modes on at all time (they start with them on, just don't turn them off!)
- never double click to attack. Always single click (so they never charge. If they don't charge, they're holding out the pikes).
- make sure they're facing the right direction! If they're hit on the flanks or the back, no pikes!

**GODzilla** · December 28, 2006, 09:38 AM

When you use them against infantry, make sure to always deactivated the guard mode!

When fighting cavalry, it should be activated.

Same goes for Halberd Militia and Swordstaff Men.

**Hex Khan** · December 28, 2006, 09:45 AM

One thing I find rather annoying is the spaces between the pikemen units when youhave them line up in single line formation, I know it possible to overcome this through manually lining them up but thats time consuming, is there a way to modify a game file so all units stand shoulder to shoulder when placed into single file?

**Hossi** · January 12, 2007, 03:43 AM

Originally Posted by Hex Khan

One thing I find rather annoying is the spaces between the pikemen units when youhave them line up in single line formation, I know it possible to overcome this through manually lining them up but thats time consuming, is there a way to modify a game file so all units stand shoulder to shoulder when placed into single file?

In the export_descr_unit.txt there is a formation entry for every unit. The description says:
; formation soldier spacing (in metres) side to side, then front to back for close formation
; followed by the same measurements in loose formation.
; followed by the default number of ranks for the unit

So if you would change for Heavy Pike Militia the formation value from
formation 1.2, 1.2, 2.4, 2.4, 8, square, phalanx
to, lets say
formation 0.8, 0.8, 2.4, 2.4, 8, square, phalanx

say should stand closer together by default. Haven't tested this jet.

**Canesfan** · December 28, 2006, 10:26 AM

Yea, I don't like those spaces, and the only way i've been able to fix it is in deployment mode. During the battle though, it's just too time-consuming.

It's like every unit can be hit in the flanks at the same time...hmm.

**ckrisz** · December 28, 2006, 11:29 AM

The best way to have pikes actually use their pikes without ridiculous micro-management is to confiscate their swords. This fix originated with Dopp at the Org forums and works like a charm. The only real side effect is that your pikes become nearly unstoppable from the front and very tough even when hit from the rear and flanks, making them a bit TOO powerful --- but this can be alleviated by giving them less armor or attack.

**Hex Khan** · December 28, 2006, 12:13 PM

I'lll give it a go, at least from the scottish point of veiw it makes sense, considering the scottish nobles werent the richist nobles in the europe, considering the cost of a high middle-age sword in todays currency is about £100'000 for a single sword.

**Hex Khan** · December 28, 2006, 12:24 PM

reading that post reminds me of my first reenactment i hated using the spear, so i just had to whip my sword out my impetous nature lol

**TWoxy** · December 28, 2006, 02:52 PM

Just tried some Aventuros against foot knights. It would seem with guard mode disabled you get a unit with front ranks standing up with levelled pikes.
the Aventuros, because of this, massacred the foot knights. Thanx for the advice.

**Godfrey Boss** · January 11, 2007, 10:36 AM

How do you get them to only use their pikes? Is their a mod for this?
In one battle my pike men were doing good until the pulled out their swords. Then they got butchered by heavy infantry.

**Hex Khan** · January 11, 2007, 11:55 AM

it is possible to alter their stats so they only use their spears, it takes next to no time to do if you like I'll talk you through it, all you need to to first is have access to the export descr_unit file from the patch unpacker

**Godfrey Boss** · January 11, 2007, 12:03 PM

Ah man. I have no idea what you just wrote. I am rubbish with computers.

**Hex Khan** · January 11, 2007, 12:04 PM

dont worry about it, have installed the patch for this game?

**Skouser** · January 11, 2007, 01:13 PM

could you describe how to do it,

thanks

**Shazz** · January 11, 2007, 03:21 PM

I'm getting very unclear directions from the posters here.. Some people say to have guard mode one, some people say turn OFF guard mode..

What's the inside scoop? Can someone lay out a clear, definite answer on the question of using the pikemen's pikes effectively ^^?

**Shaio** · January 11, 2007, 04:37 PM

the advice is unclear because all the posters have been both wrong and right.

its not guard mode on or guard mode off... you switch it about a bit during the battle.

ie pikes go forward with guard mode off at attack unit.. pikes start pushing but not killing fast enough... hit it back to guard mode so the men on the flanks don't continue to walk forward and mess up the formation.

basically follow these basic rules.

if attacking have guard mode off, unless you attacking a unit thats to strong for the pikes to roll over, then wait till they close and engage for a bit then switch back to guard mode.

know when to push forward and know when to stand and fight. basically all you need.

remember when a unit has guard mode on it will hold its place while fighting or move backwards slowly.. with guard mode off it moves forward slowly.

these effects are useful in different circumstances.

basically you can push over most units without worry.. but sometimes when you line is spread wider they keep advancing even when there already got the enemy at pike tip.... then keep walking forward till there forced to engage with swords.. avoid such things..

**Ippius** · January 11, 2007, 09:28 PM

Don't let the enemy flank u. Don't run. Don't rush to attack, letting cavalry charge into pikes is better than ur pikeman waving swords charging at cavaalry who are charging at them....

**Shazz** · January 11, 2007, 10:35 PM

Ahh, that sounds really awesome, I've never really played with pikemen, but this kind of micro-managing sounds really nice ^^!! Thanks Shaio and others.

**zerathule** · January 12, 2007, 03:52 AM

I've done countless tests on that matter, since i really love pikemen in M2TW (much more than Phalanxes in RTW).
Versus infantry, cavalry, pikes, actually anything, the battle results have ALWAYS been better with guard mode off.
Versus cavalry, with guard mode off i can face a unit of lancers with no problems, with guard mode on, after the charge impact the pikes will get slaughtered.
Try it yourself, versus various units with guard on/off and cav/inf