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Thread: [Submod] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions (Massalia and Syrakousai)

  1. #1
    QuintusSertorius's Avatar EBII Hod Carrier
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    Default [Submod] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions (Massalia and Syrakousai)

    People may remember that I used to do this with EB1 a lot - take Epeiros (who are the most disposable faction, IMO) and turn them into someone else. I used them as Pergamon and the Bosporans in particular, though obviously neither of those is necessary in EBII. I also used them to play as Massalia and Kyrene, which was a lot of fun. You get a different native mix to add to your Hellenistic units, along with different tensions and dynamics in your new home.

    This would never be a total conversion overhaul, I don't have the time or the historical resources to make a proper "new" faction from Epeiros, and I wouldn't want to divert EBII's team from the main task at hand. There'd be no new biographies or government buildings (Epeiros' are fairly generic anyway), but there'd be new local pools for government buildings, a different starting location and upgraded infrastructure in your new starting capital. I might even change the faction's colour scheme (though that won't impact units).

    Would that interest anyone? Massalia, Kyrene or Syrakousai are the most obvious choices; none would ever be proper factions in EBII, making them good candidates for this.



    EDIT: Here's a results. No need to migrate or do anything but fire up a campaign (I wouldn't recommend playing as anyone else in this game):

    Epeiros-as-Massalia

    Epeiros-as-Massalia v4.zip

    EDIT: Updated to v4. Major changes:
    Now aligned with EB2.2m (so all those changes present).
    Corrected an error in the Native Admin/Supervised Native Admin that didn't allow them to be built in Gaul/Iberia/the islands.
    Fixed error with the Greek colonists script.
    Adjustment to ship recruitment

    I won't be updating this zip any more, too much rework involved and it's not as viable as the other.


    Epeiros-as-Syrakousai

    Epeiros-as-Syrakousai v8.zip

    EDIT: Updated to v8 - aligned to 2.2r
    Corrected double-placement of Syrakousai...
    Corrected elite ownership.
    Some text edits so things are labelled correctly
    Adjustment to ship recruitment
    Last edited by QuintusSertorius; June 17, 2017 at 04:49 PM.

  2. #2

    Default Re: [Interest] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions?

    I can do that for you if you don't have the time just say what you want I've made Syracuse from Pergamon once.

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    QuintusSertorius's Avatar EBII Hod Carrier
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    Default Re: [Interest] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions?

    Oh no, I was offering to make them as a submod, not ask someone to do it. Note the choice of Epeiros isn't accidental; they pretty much faded from the historical account after the death of Pyrrhos, that's why I consider them disposable. Pergamon on the other hand wasn't by any interpretation.

  4. #4

    Default Re: [Interest] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions?

    Yes I understand, the only reason I made it with Pergamon is just because it was more practical But anyway you can make Massalia for example and I make Syracuse I actually would like to help and I love ancient Syracuse

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    QuintusSertorius's Avatar EBII Hod Carrier
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    Default Re: [Interest] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions?

    Quote Originally Posted by MagusCaligula View Post
    Yes I understand, the only reason I made it with Pergamon is just because it was more practical But anyway you can make Massalia for example and I make Syracuse I actually would like to help and I love ancient Syracuse
    How's it more practical, given Pergamon since 2.2j has a very specific government setup and tailored reforms?

    Epeiros is functionally generic, it's basically a Makedonia-clone with a different starting position and slightly variant local unit-pool access. Much as Pergamon was before it's recent change.
    Last edited by QuintusSertorius; April 08, 2017 at 07:08 AM.

  6. #6

    Default Re: [Interest] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions?

    Wow, Massalia would be very cool! I really like the feel of distant Greek colonies. I imagine Massalia has the best position and initiative to expand as well, allowing you to form a small trading empire along the coasts of the Western Mediterranean (and maybe even colonizing parts of Britain and northern Gaul and Germania, following the discoveries of Pytheas). Sicily, on the other hand, is squeezed in between Rome and Carthage, and Kyrene is in a very sparsely populated area between Carthage and the Ptolemaioi. What do you think Quintus?

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    QuintusSertorius's Avatar EBII Hod Carrier
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    Default Re: [Interest] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paltmull View Post
    Wow, Massalia would be very cool! I really like the feel of distant Greek colonies. I imagine Massalia has the best position and initiative to expand as well, allowing you to form a small trading empire along the coasts of the Western Mediterranean (and maybe even colonizing parts of Britain and northern Gaul and Germania, following the discoveries of Pytheas). Sicily, on the other hand, is squeezed in between Rome and Carthage, and Kyrene is in a very sparsely populated area between Carthage and the Ptolemaioi. What do you think Quintus?
    Massalia also has some pretty obvious targets nearby. Alali/Aleria was once a Massalian colony, but they were driven out by the Carthaginians. Emporion was also founded by Phokaia, they share a mother-city. Taking those will obviously pitch you into conflict with Carthage, opening the possibilities of Sicilian and Iberian expansion.

  8. #8

    Default Re: [Interest] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions?

    Well it was in an older version and I obviously deleted the Pergamon reform

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    QuintusSertorius's Avatar EBII Hod Carrier
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    Default Re: [Interest] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions?

    See the original post for Epeiros-as-Massalia. Compatible with 2.2b onwards, but not savegame compatible. Not recommended that you play it as any faction other than Massalia.

  10. #10

    Default Re: [Submod] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions

    I'm not sure if that was an answer to me, didn't understand. Anyway what I did want to say is that I can help turning Epeiros in a different faction for a submod, you just need to tell me what you want, government, units recruitable, recruiting conditions, family members, generals, etc. I believe I already know everything (or almost everything) needed to know to do that, that's all.

  11. #11

    Default Re: [Submod] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions

    Ups nevermind didn't see the post edited and can't edit my own posts for some resaon.

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    Default Re: [Submod] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions

    Already done it.

    As I said, I wasn't looking for assistance, just if anyone would be interested in the output.

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    Roma_Victrix's Avatar Gatorade, is it in you?
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    Default Re: [Interest] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions?

    Interesting idea for a mod, Quintus! I'd give you rep for it, but I'm unable to seeing how I've repped you too recently.

    I think it would be pretty cool to have a Syracuse faction, but Massalia is just as good. I just miss those Syracuse hoplites from Roma Surrectum II. Then again, the Massalian hoplite with a mixture of Hellenistic and Celtic gear was pretty awesome too. I realize, however, that you guys are done with the Hellenic roster.

    Quote Originally Posted by QuintusSertorius View Post
    Oh no, I was offering to make them as a submod, not ask someone to do it. Note the choice of Epeiros isn't accidental; they pretty much faded from the historical account after the death of Pyrrhos, that's why I consider them disposable. Pergamon on the other hand wasn't by any interpretation.
    Are you saying they faded from political and military relevance or that there is a scarcity of evidence for any activity whatsoever? You'd be right to say there wasn't an ambitious Epirote leader like Pyrrhos after his death, but we certainly know what went on in the kingdom and League of Epirus thereafter. That includes the republican revolution that overturned the monarchy with the flight and murder of Deidamia II of Epirus during the reign of Demetrius II of Macedon (c. 233 or 231 BC).

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    Default Re: [Interest] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions?

    I've updated to v2; both to align to 2.2l, but more importantly fix an issue with the governments.

    Quote Originally Posted by Roma_Victrix View Post
    Are you saying they faded from political and military relevance or that there is a scarcity of evidence for any activity whatsoever? You'd be right to say there wasn't an ambitious Epirote leader like Pyrrhos after his death, but we certainly know what went on in the kingdom and League of Epirus thereafter. That includes the republican revolution that overturned the monarchy with the flight and murder of Deidamia II of Epirus during the reign of Demetrius II of Macedon (c. 233 or 231 BC).
    If EBII started six months later than it does, Epeiros wouldn't be a faction. Their immediate post-Pyrrhos chaos wouldn't merit them taking a valuable slot.

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    Default Re: [Submod] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions

    I've realised on doing a proper playtest that there's an error in the special scripted event for Massalia; if you capture one of Emporion/Aleria, but not the other, you keep getting colony points every turn until you capture the second. Not game-breaking in terms of causing a game to stop but it's an unintentional exploit.

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    Default Re: [Submod] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions

    In spite of the bug above (I cleared my excess colony points by repeatedly queuing and cancelling a colony), I'm having a really good time with my Massalia game. It's just passed turn 50 and I've got Massalia, Emporion and Alalia, plus Syrakousai by revolt (twice!). Having wrapped up a war with the previous owners of Syrakousai (they sued for peace), the Romans decided to have a go. I guess I'm moving into a new phase where my accidental empire (I wasn't planning on any expansion until I'd consolidated my new League) will bring me into conflict with the major power in the region. I'll drive Rome off Sicily, maybe fight them in Italy a bit to reduce their armies, then leave them alone. If they test me again, I'll take southern Italy off them.

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    Default Re: [Submod] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions

    Would anyone be interested in me making an Epeiros-as-Syrakousai version? I've already got some ideas of little tweaks to apply. Having gained it by revolt in my Massalia game, I can see that it could be viable, even if you'd have to rush to take all of Sicily to get a secure economic base.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: [Submod] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions

    OK, I've done a Syrakousai conversion, though it'll need testing. I can't do that without ruining my current Massalia game, which I'm not willing to do because it's too much fun.

    Could someone please test the Syrakousai one works? Just need to start a campaign with it, or if that doesn't happen, give me the error log so I can correct it.

  19. #19

    Default Re: [Submod] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions (Massalia and Syrakousai)

    Not works.
    https://yadi.sk/i/AXMiBQsX3HG8ea - log

    After long "Epeiros campaing" loading it was thrown me in main menu, and then after clicking "Grand campaing" - to the desktop.

  20. #20
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    Default Re: [Submod] Epeiros as alternate Hellenistic factions (Massalia and Syrakousai)

    Quote Originally Posted by Vledis2 View Post
    Not works.
    https://yadi.sk/i/AXMiBQsX3HG8ea - log

    After long "Epeiros campaing" loading it was thrown me in main menu, and then after clicking "Grand campaing" - to the desktop.
    That means a descr_strat error. Give me a minute to correct.

    EDIT: Try it now.
    Last edited by QuintusSertorius; April 23, 2017 at 08:54 AM.

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