[UP]TES UP 2.0.5. RE-RELEASED on the 17th March 2024

[Jadli]

Well, stables dont crash for me. Perhaps reinstall. Or just dont click at it

Fixed version is uploaded! Use the link on the first page (the link is updated)

[Kamos]

Thanks for the hard work!

[skelior]

Thats interesting. However, thats the problem with three eras, as in the second era Forebears werent that "corrupted" with Nine divines yet. At least I think. Anyway, Ill change name of the temple to some other yokudan deity not used yet, so the tiny lore problem is no more.

By the way, I found tout what was causing the crash. When a khajiiti faction built second level of farms, it crashed. Just need to figure out why. Then Ill toroughly run several turns in every campaign to make sure all bugs are gone. Should be up today!

That Varieties of Faith comes from the Second Era around the time Online. Their reverence of Akatosh comes from the Second Empire which made the Forebears a thing. I'd suggest making the highest temple for Crowns to be for Ruptga, the chief deity in their pantheon instead of Satakal, and Forebears Akatosh, or even give possibility to build temples to different deities with different efffects, like Rome:TW.

Thanks for all your hard work getting that crash fixed!

[Jadli]

Well i replaced Satakal with HoonDing. We have been thinking about making separate churches for some deities. Right now, you have there religion traits, which are probably the best solution.
Dont thank me yet, hopefully I dont have to reupload something again

[skelior]

I have more suggestions!
1) Reputation is totally messed up in this mod. Tamriel shouldn't be with everyone having despicable reputation, it seems there's some weird stuff going on in descr_faction_standing, because occupying settlements does nothing for reputation, only freeing prisoners. With 12 turns per year, this means that factions go to war and the face of Tamriel changes really fast without any reputation and goodwill to keep everyone from killing each other. Becoming the new Empire is possible, if it's possible to have an immaculate reputation.
I looked into this matter; sure enough in descr_faction_standing, the city_razed_decrease_global is actually even more pronounced than ordinary; I'd suggest just ; it all out, because the only faction that is likely to raze cities is the Daedra, and since they're enemies of everyone, their reputation is going to collapse anyway. In my game, the highest reputations are dubious, and only factions that have never conquered anywhere ever have it.

2) Factions need more family members. Empire should probably stay with few family members, I like how they often just collapse when the Oblivion Crisis happens, this is a very unstable time for the Empire, but with 12 turns per year, and only two family members for many factions, it's possible to need to adopt in order to survive, and plus the warlike AIs... or else maybe make recruiting generals available at lower levels so that adopting isn't totally necessary. At 12 turns per year, it takes a long time to have family members the old fashioned way. A way for traditionalist factions to choose the heir (like an heir crown retinue) would help too.

3) We need the ebony resource! Conquering Red Mountain from Dagoth Ur is a huge quest and it should be worthy of a great reward. Ebony is the crystallized blood of Lorkhan, and Red Mountain grew on top of Lorkhan's heart! So if you capture Red Mountain you should have great wealth.

[Jadli]

1) Hm, thats pretty interesting. Will certainly look into that. AI always needs some improvements. During my 100 turns run I noticed some factions werent doing absolutely anything. Tho, it might have been because I had normal difficulty and also that i was playing Ashlanders, which are a horde faction....

2) I have been reluctant to add made up characters into the real family trees, such as Mede. On the other hand I could add hidden family trees (or whatever is it called) to important houses (tho I would have to make up few characters anyway). I have been actually playing with these yesterday... Anyway I have been also thinking about lowering how many turns do we have per year. Good thing is each campaign can have its own. That way there could be also some use for some new traits, which are inheritable.

3) We also need about a hundred other things which Im not sure I can do. Will see what I can do about this one

Also, as I mentioned in the OP, I would like to add mages and fighters guild (as guilds ofc), possibly with some special missions etc. I havent been thinking about it much yet, so if you guys have any suggestions for its triggers or missions, bring them up. Some missions could be about fightin the undead, etc.. Not any specific idea yet

[skelior]

I don't mind factions doing very little. Sticking to their province means that they're more invested in what's going on nearby, which makes them more like provinces. The map is really well-made to confine and keep provincial matters provincial, too, so I like that. For me, Pellitine and Anequina have tended to do nothing, but sometimes Pellitine attacks Valenwood. A road to Valenwood through Anequina wouldn't hurt too, since wars happened there in Dune (see Mixed Unit Tactics).

Less turns per year sounds good to me. I know it would make the Oblivion Crisis happen sooner, but maybe that's not so bad, especally if reputation was around, it could even postpone the inter-provincial wars. Speaking of the Crisis, I think when a Daedra army is defeated, it should disappear, not retreat, since in the campaign they have infinite morale. Mehrunes Dagon isn't the kind of Prince I think to call a strategic retreat anyway, he's excessively blunt and determined. I've had a few instances of crashes because Daedra armies have nowhere to retreat to, and in reality, it would never happen in an actual tactical map battle, you fight the Daedra, they lose 500, and withdraw 1500, it's a disadvantage for the AI.

I'm always a big fan of traits and inheritance and having an actual family.

Thinking about Mages' and Fighter's Guilds, maybe it would help (also to slow down wars and make borders a little more fixed) to have permanent forts all over the map. Some could be occupied by undead, some by daedra, some by bandits, and during wars, the AI would use them to defend strategic points. Fighter's Guild missions could be to go after bandits (maybe monsters in the future), Mages' to go after undead provinces/forts, to recover artifacts (so they don't just spawn up, either!). More rebels and instability within one province would be welcome. I wonder if rebel subfaction AI could be used to distinguish bandits, reavers, daedra worshippers, and stuff. If you leave a permanent fort unmanned, it could even become manned, and then the Guilds give a quest to empty it out!

Another idea I had for Fighter's Guild specifically is that they have half movement points and half upkeep, so that they're effectively just for securing your cities' countryside (or maybe as fast as siege equipment so it isn't unbalanced for AI). I don't know how to make the AI keep them in cities and not slow down all their armies though (but the AI is dumb enough that it doesn't really matter if their armies are slower). Also, this would mean that the player would want to fire them and hire them to protect places that don't have big advanced armies, just like the Fighter's Guild is for. AI would train more of them as well, and since the AI can't get rid of them, it'd make up for the AI generally training really bad soldiers, maybe.

[Jadli]

Thank you for suggesitons!

Well, a few scenarios would profit from less turns per year, some wouldnt. As I said, there can be different system for each camapaign, and that is what Ill do.

Well, Im not sure if I know how could I set it that way, that the armies would disappear instead of retreat. Perhaps just increasing their morale more, so they wouldtn retreat at all would solve it...

Well, Ill add some hidden family trees for the next version then, tho will have to make most of them up, except The Three Banners War where is a lot of known characters all over Tamriel ...

Yes, I have been also thinking about permament forts. Nice idea with artifacts. Rebels can be distinguished in a certain level. Will need to check out how much can the missions be actually modded, but at least now I have something to start from. An interesting idea with fighters guild, will see about it. It could be also done that way, that cities with a fighters guild would use the so called "garrion script", so when under siege, the garrison would receive some additional troops... The guild might be also providing some special generals I think.

Anyway, I have been checking the patch, and found few really tiny bugs (descriptions, pics, small adjustments in EDU, etc), mostly not worth of mentioning. So I made a small hotfix (extract into mods/The_Elder_Scrolls). However, if you are already playing a campaign, probably dont install it, as it would make your old saves incompatible. Will update the link in the OP with soon.

[AsbjornIronside]

Hello! With some game play in the sub mod patch, I've noticed the Orcs did not receive much love (in my eyes, anyway). I feel the Orsimer deserve some form of cavalry, albeit light cavalry. Orsinium would probably not be able to afford fine Cyrodillic coursers or hardy Skyrim warhorses, but I do feel they would field a bit of cavalry. Maybe lancers, mounted javelin-men, or even some bare bone melee cavalry. The models are already there, it's just a matter of putting them together. I know it may not coincide with the lore, however some sacrifices must be made for certain playability aspects.

[AsbjornIronside]

Also, as a note, maybe some more mercenary recruitment. Different regions can have different mercs, with all regions getting bandits (race specific to region, obviously), and with a faction or region-specific mercenary, with Orsimer maybe getting the "Wrothgarian Reavers," let's say. All in all, this is a GREAT sub mod, addressing, and fixing, some of the bad aspects of TES:TW. Bravo, my good modders!

[Josh42392]

Thank you for suggesitons!

Mmm but I feel like at some point they do experience fear and close gates as a results. Anyways I'm having a problem, so all the new custom campaigns arn't starting for me. I did not do what was recommended by clearing that one folder beforehand.

Okay what happens is I can go into it and select my faction but then when I click next it goes to the previous screen.

[StShoot]

btw did you fixed /added some of the skripts that were planed or bugged like uniting the kingdom of morrowind or that the daedra dont despawn after the end of the crisis ?

[StShoot]

Are the stats of the dremora-churl-mages bugged ? 19 attack 28 defence seems pretty high if you compare it with their elite infantery (Dremora kynreeve : 18 attack 20 defence )

[Jadli]

To AsbjornIronside: well, perhaps enough might be extending alikr merenaries to Evermor, so orcs could get a cavalry time from time. Our skills in making units are slightly limitied right now, so cant promise anything. K'Sharra will hopefully make some, I plan to try my hands with some too. Same goes for adding new mercenary units, as some would need to be created first.

To Josh: I would suggest you reinstall (reinstalling only the patch should be enough). Make sure it ask you to overwrite, once you extract the patch into the folder. The thing with deleting settlements folder shouldnt affect the functionality of the game. It might only cause that some settlements might have incorrect models on battlemap...

To StShoot: Havent done anything with unite script, as this one is pretty complicated, neither daedras do despawn, what is not even possible as far as Im aware. Only thing that can be done is giving up their settlements, tho, they would take them back eventually I suppose. Anyway, its not necessary, as daedras are not the end of the game now, as instead of all of them going into one place and conquering world from it they take numerous settlements all over the map, what makes them easier to defeat. About churl mages stats, well daedras have higher stats than other factions. And all mages also have high stats, especially defence, so they just dont die in the first battle you send them to, after you spend all your money to hire them. For example this unit costs 3.5k, costs 800 per turn and takes 4 turns to hire....

[StShoot]

i Just wonderd it is kind of strange that a mage unit can destroy a high ordinator unit in melee =P

[Jadli]

Well, powerful magicians should win over even the best soldiers, there is just no magic melee sadly

[AsbjornIronside]

To Jadli: If I learn how to make models/units for M2TW, would you take me on the team?

[Jadli]

Even if you dont learn . Every new pair of hands is good, if you can do something at least seemingly useful

[AsbjornIronside]

Well I can try to learn how to make maps/battle scenes. I'm not good with modeling but I'm sure I can make a good map or two (or several) if I put my mind to it.

[skelior]

Melee cavalry for Orcs sounds alright, possibly with axes. I don't imagine they have any knightly tradition to match Yokuda and High Rock heavy cavalry. Another important thing to remember is that Orcs are Pariah Folk, they are supposed to be fairly irrelevant and every time they start to become relevant, Redguards and Bretons come to smash them. So it seems to me they should have the most limited roster. There is no lore reason to NOT give them cavalry, but their place in the series' narrative isn't that of mighty conquering heroic people who can do anything, it's Malacath: spurned and ostracized, with oaths and vengeful curses on their enemies. Whenever they try to get out of Malacath's sway and worship Trinimac they get smashed.

I have some suggestions for mercenaries: Solstheim and Northern Morrowind get Nord reavers, the rest of Morrowind gets Outlander Men-At-Arms, central and southern Skyrim and Cyrodiil get Colovian sellswords, as well as much of Valenwood and outer Black Marsh (Colovians are famous all over the world, so really they could pop up anywhere.) Few mercenaries in Anequina, but lots of mercenaries available in Pellitine for Elsweyr of any races. No mercenaries available in Summerset Isle. Orcs should be available as mercenaries all over the world, showing up occasionally, in Morrowind, in Valenwood, in Cyrodiil, in Skyrim, etc. Remember that Orcs don't just live in the Wrothgarian and Dragontail mountains, but are long-settled all over the world, though in small population outside of Dragontail, Wrothgarian mountains and northern Valenwood. Just using default units for Orcs would be sufficient for now, for them.
Cyrodiil should also get region-specific mercenaries, Argonians in the Black Forest, Khajiit at Border Watch, just to keep it neat. Khajiit mercenaries available should be ambush-infantry and archers.
Valenwood mercenaries as archers, it'd be neat if sometimes they just disappear from your stacks. "For a brief time the Colovian armies used Wood Elf archers, as in the War of Rihad two years past. The Bosmer proved to be too undisciplined and prone to desertion for further use. They would sometimes walk into the shade of a single tree and vanish. Their forest-coupling skills are remarkable. The title of their most famous poem, the Meh Ayleidion, means "The One Thousand Benefits of Hiding." Again, Valenwood light archers would probably be sufficient.
Oh, and Elinhir should have mages available, but I already said that.

Disagree on bandit mercenaries. I agree that bandit units should be made, though, in general, I just don't think anyone would want to use such undisciplined troops except in special circumstances (Nord bandits available as mercenaries in Elsweyr or Nibenay, people who wouldn't really know the difference )

If you want, I'm always available for lore consultation, I've been interested in TES lore for more than a decade, and have read more of it than I can remember.