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Thread: Corruption & where are forts?

  1. #1
    Agrippa19's Avatar Tiro
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    Default Corruption & where are forts?

    As the title says why is corruption so bad in my cities? I'll admit I'm kind of new to m2tw engine as I have always played RS3 for Rome1, but shouldn't having a governor sort the problem? Are there law buildings to fix this? It looks on average that about 15-20% of my income is being eaten away through corruption, that's massive.

    Also why can I only construct watchtowers and not forts? Is this intended?

  2. #2
    Ἀπολλόδοτος Α΄ ὁ Σωτήρ's Avatar Yeah science!
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    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    Corruption can't be completely eliminated but there are law providing buildings and good, not just any, governors can help. No forts buildable is intended due to AI issues.
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  3. #3
    QuintusSertorius's Avatar EBII Hod Carrier
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    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    Corruption isn't sorted simply by having a governor. Distance from capital, culture clashes, all sorts of things of things contribute to it. Law buildings will help, but it isn't that easily fixed.

    Forts were removed, they break the CAI.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    Do you think forts will ever make a comeback? The team has done such a wonderful job when it comes to topographical detail and strategy, it would be nice to see an extra layer added on to that.

  5. #5
    z3n's Avatar State of Mind
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    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    No, their drawbacks heavily outweigh the benefit(s).

    IIRC, QS already put in minor fort trade icons where the forts originally were.
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  6. #6
    Agrippa19's Avatar Tiro
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    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    Ah okay. It just seems to be very high, especially compared to other mods. Not that I particularly mind I much prefer mods like this with endless info's to read, I just don't really understand how to lower it when its so high.

    How do forts break the campaign AI?

  7. #7
    z3n's Avatar State of Mind
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    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    The high level AI is very simplistic, no matter how much the low level AI can account for certain other faults the LTGD will always be inadequately coded to account for the situations mods force it to account for.

    For example, mod x adds a fort nearby a city within a region.
    The AI will then gather its troops within the fort and thereby designate said troops as NON free strength. The AI can only use troops to defend its cities that are classified as free strength. There's other very obvious faults as well but I won't explore those, suffice to say, it's much better to remove forts than have them.
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  8. #8

    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    maybe permanent forts can be used as "extra" minor cities to slowdown conquests.

  9. #9
    QuintusSertorius's Avatar EBII Hod Carrier
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    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    Quote Originally Posted by betto View Post
    maybe permanent forts can be used as "extra" minor cities to slowdown conquests.
    No, were you not reading that we removed them because they break the AI?

  10. #10

    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    Quote Originally Posted by QuintusSertorius View Post
    No, were you not reading that we removed them because they break the AI?
    dream_is_free_

  11. #11

    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Agrippa19 View Post
    As the title says why is corruption so bad in my cities? I'll admit I'm kind of new to m2tw engine as I have always played RS3 for Rome1, but shouldn't having a governor sort the problem? Are there law buildings to fix this? It looks on average that about 15-20% of my income is being eaten away through corruption, that's massive.

    Also why can I only construct watchtowers and not forts? Is this intended?
    Just to check, you're looking at this in the city view, right? Or are you looking at the 'corruption and other' section on the overall budget report? If the latter, that line is combined with devastation as one of the 'others', while in the city view you can properly see corruption vs devastation costs. And yeah, law temples, strategic fortifications, way stations and garrisons, the coastal patrols unlocked by higher level ports, etc. But there's just way too much coin flowing not to expect people a couple of months' ride from the capital not to keep a decent chunk of it whenever they can get away with it. You'll see that once you're built up you're swimming in money anyway, so it won't be a big deal.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    And how could one, if one was so enclined, re-enable temporary wooden Forts?

  13. #13

    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Domeric_Bolton View Post
    And how could one, if one was so enclined, re-enable temporary wooden Forts?
    would be great to have temporary forts back (the extra dimension that they add to the gameplay outweighs the potential shortcomings imho) and it is 'possible' but unfortunately results in 'migrating wonders' whereby they spawn virtually anywhere on the map, appearing and disappearing at random. probably tied to the fact that (most?) wanders are fort-attached. if anyone knows how to prevent that from happening, if possible, please share.

  14. #14
    QuintusSertorius's Avatar EBII Hod Carrier
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    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    You can't stop the Wonders from wandering if you re-enable constructible forts, because they've been "attached" to otherwise-unused forts. So unless you're willing to give up on Wonders on the battlemap (which is why they're attached - there's nothing else left available to use), that's what will happen.

    Note constructible forts cause all the same CAI problems that fixed ones do.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    Quote Originally Posted by QuintusSertorius View Post
    You can't stop the Wonders from wandering if you re-enable constructible forts, because they've been "attached" to otherwise-unused forts. So unless you're willing to give up on Wonders on the battlemap (which is why they're attached - there's nothing else left available to use), that's what will happen.

    Note constructible forts cause all the same CAI problems that fixed ones do.
    if it is the obsession with garrisoning them at the cost of guarding the cities then potential is there. in actuality though, i havent seen it happen with temporary forts and its probably due to the fact that, firstly, the AI rarely bothers with them, and secondly, when it does build a fort, it does not stick to it and abandons it almost as soon as it is built. from what i've seen, unfortunately AI doesn't/cannot use forts as a human player would - having them as 'permanent' 'army bases' or as strategically placed strongholds.

    correct me if im wrong but wonder at Hallicarnasus isnt attached to the fort, is it? or is it the one next to it? one of them is listed as a unique building but also present on stratmap and has no 'forts', iirc.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sarkiss View Post
    correct me if im wrong but wonder at Hallicarnasus isnt attached to the fort, is it? or is it the one next to it? one of them is listed as a unique building but also present on stratmap and has no 'forts', iirc.
    Both wonders (Diana & Mausoleum) tie to the same fort.
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  17. #17

    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    So, just to recap - And I am sorry fi I misunderstood something - one can't reactivate temporary forts because the Wonders are tied to permanent Stone-forts? How do temporary forts make the Wonders wander?

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Domeric_Bolton View Post
    So, just to recap - And I am sorry fi I misunderstood something - one can't reactivate temporary forts because the Wonders are tied to permanent Stone-forts? How do temporary forts make the Wonders wander?
    Temporary forts and PSFs are one and the same. They're only PSFs if you've disabled the temporary build-able sort.

  19. #19

    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    So how does one go about enabling forts (and perhaps disabling the wonders)? This is something I miss a great deal for immersion purposes.

    I agree with some of the people here that the benefits outweigh the occasional drawbacks. If it is possible to enable forts for individual factions perhaps a script could enable them for the player only, thus solving the problem of the AI shooting itself in the foot. Also cant wonders be tied to trade goods instead? That way they could also generate extra income from pilgrimages & tourists, and allow for unique buildings for their provinces.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Corruption & where are forts?

    I don't understand : I have a fort in a province in southern English Island. At least it looks like it : it is a "minor" town where I can garrison my troops but without anything to build or any town interface. Looks like a perm fort to me.

    Edit : never mind : it is just confirm what was said : it is Stonehenge.
    Last edited by Floren d'Asteneuz; April 13, 2017 at 11:40 PM.


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