Custom settlement problem in Linux

[Socrates1984]

I haven't tested the last files you sent me, probably tomorrow, but I have one question: You are actually saying that IWTE is required to alter the paths for each submod? This would mean that even if you were the one to do this, it would only work for TATW and for no other mod. If this is the case, to play custom settlements in every possible mod and submod (that has custom settlements, that is) one would have to be directed to you to ask for the change.

Not very handy, is it? A better, if difficult, solution would be to make IWTE work for Linux. WINE doesn't seem to be able to run it, so my guess as with all modding tools around is that a language needs to be downloaded and installed. Do you happen to know if this would be the case with IWTE?

[Socrates1984]

I've done the last test and it doesn't work.

Now, I'd like to say I wasn't very focused when trying to run IWTE in my PC. I had forgotten that there was a problem with my WINE installation, which was causing IWTE to not run. I fixed the problem now and IWTE runs like a charm.

Spoiler for IWTE and Linux: 

Sooooo... First, I'm sorry I put you through all this mess; I could RTFM and do it myself, although it must be said you did it in a very small fraction of the time I would need to do it.
Second, I'll find out how to properly operate IWTE and write a tutorial on how to have working custom settlements in Linux, but with vanilla animations, based on what we've done in this thread. I will probably come back with more questions on the specifics of our tests here after I understand how IWTE works and play around with everything for a while.

Thanks again though for everything.

[makanyane]

ahh, good, glad you got that working. I'll do one of the TATW settlements and take some screenies to explain the way I was going to do it... then see if you can take over

[Socrates1984]

You're the best and thank you. I would have repped you a million times, but since you have disabled it I am thanking over and over again to express my gratitude.

[makanyane]

Right... try this first;
https://www.dropbox.com/s/agcdtgkox2...nburg.rar?dl=0
It's revised files for Hornburg (campaign map version - the custom battle one I think is the Aztec, large_castle) - with wall anims removed and gate anim redirected back to vanilla. It should work according to what we tested before but do check! Copy the hornburg_a.world etc over the files in unique_settlements/hornburg.

This is how I made those changes with IWTE;

'WorldFiles' tab - 'Read 3 Binary Files' - then select the .world, then .worldcollision, then .animinstances, give it a save name to use for the .world (it won't actually overwrite the existing files, it'll add _1 to the end)

Preferably enlarge the 'Objects' window so you can see more columns;

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Sort by the 'Animref' column - any object with a value over -4 in there has an animation, 0 is first animation type, 4 is second, etc. Which is which will vary according to the order they were added, but you can see from the 'TypeDescr' which the walls are using.
We need to remove the animations from anything using the wall animation (4 in this case) - Hornburg has an oddity here in that one of the default objects also has the animation assigned, that needs to get removed as well.

Select one of the affected objects in the object screen, and in 'Animations' tab hit 'Remove Object Animation', the screen below will show the Object No: - hit OK to confirm, re-sort the objects by Animref column, rinse, repeat, till they're all gone.

Now go back to 'WorldFiles' tab and select 'update animation paths'. You'll get a dropdown box - for Hornburg and most others that should now only show the gate animation (you might see tower animations for some of the cities, but so long as they aren't using the 'new_settlements' animations path you can ignore them)

Select the gate animation from the drop-down box, click OK and you should get a screen like this;

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

To get the gate to work properly you need to direct the path back to the correct vanilla animation - luckily they're reasonably obvious because the .anim name includes the description! The Hornburg ones were NE_huge_city_... looking in an unpacked M2TW/data, & with educated guess-work you'll find those are in
blockset/north_european/animations/gate_animations/huge_city_gate_anims. Change the paths on all the lines to suit that. Click OK.

Save 3 Binary Files!

re-name your new files so they replace the originals - test...

[Socrates1984]

Right... try this first;
https://www.dropbox.com/s/agcdtgkox2...nburg.rar?dl=0
It's revised files for Hornburg (campaign map version - the custom battle one I think is the Aztec, large_castle) - with wall anims removed and gate anim redirected back to vanilla. It should work according to what we tested before but do check! Copy the hornburg_a.world etc over the files in unique_settlements/hornburg.

Makanyane, I did that and it worked. Two remarks:
1) You were right in predicting that the wall animation wouldn't work. Indeed the walls fall down, but with no animations; they just go right through to the next stage of destruction.
2) Ditto for gate animations. However it must be said that the only glitch found so far is that whenever a ram hits the gate, the later changes textures for a brief moment (for as long the hit lasts). It becomes briefly a different door with more detailed graphics and then reverts back to the previous simpler version. I have to play a siege defense to find out if the opening/closing animations is bugged too.

It will have to do though. For now at least. I will see if I can follow your detailed instructions to change the animations for a few settlements for practice and after that write the tutorial. Thanks again...

This question is certainly coming from an utter newb: Is it probable that altogether new animations have to be made for Linux?

[Gigantus]

However it must be said that the only glitch found so far is that whenever a ram hits the gate, the later changes textures for a brief moment (for as long the hit lasts). It becomes briefly a different door with more detailed graphics and then reverts back to the previous simpler version

That sounds painfully familiar, and eventually solved (for windows).

[Socrates1984]

That sounds painfully familiar, and eventually solved (for windows).

Can you please elaborate a bit? In my case, it's the first time I encounter this and seems bearable considering the alternative.

[Gigantus]

We discussed it recently in the main IWTE thread, starting roughly here.

And here is the sad news (not sure if it is still applicable):

Ah!

Actually is all that's happened with your mod that someone's done a revised settlement which uses a new gate/wall texture but not done a custom anims folder for it, see; http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?323503-IWTE-World-editing-(General-Discussion)&p=14732667&viewfull=1#post14732667
for how to make anims which use a different texture - but note also that, that currently seems to be what's breaking things in Linux

[makanyane]

We discussed it recently in the main IWTE thread, starting roughly here.

And here is the sad news (not sure if it is still applicable):

Yes that is still applicable - Gigantus's problem was that he didn't have custom anims when he should have...
Linux problem is you can't have custom anims

2) Ditto for gate animations. However it must be said that the only glitch found so far is that whenever a ram hits the gate, the later changes textures for a brief moment (for as long the hit lasts). It becomes briefly a different door with more detailed graphics and then reverts back to the previous simpler version. I have to play a siege defense to find out if the opening/closing animations is bugged too.

That bit where the texture changes is the animation (it doesn't move much) - and yes you'll get the same texture change when the gates open/close - because it's using the vanilla animations which have the original texture.

1) You were right in predicting that the wall animation wouldn't work. Indeed the walls fall down, but with no animations; they just go right through to the next stage of destruction.

Yup the animations were removed totally - otherwise you get the texture change thing on the wall & because it happens not just to the bits of wall that look like they're breaking, but the entire 20m block of wall, that is a lot more disturbing to watch than the gate texture switch.

This question is certainly coming from an utter newb: Is it probable that altogether new animations have to be made for Linux?

The problem doesn't seem to be the animation itself - I suspect if I overwrote the original anim sets with ones with a new texture it would work - the trouble is that would give vanilla/other settlements the wrong texture. Our problem is that it apparently won't look up anims with a new name/path so we can't have extra ones.

Any chance that the makers of the Linux version might come back with any info?

[makanyane]

Just remembered this bit of ancient history;
https://wiki.twcenter.net/index.php?...es_file_-_M2TW

the 3rd picture shows the size of the chunk that changes texture if you use a wall anim with a different texture to the static model.

[Socrates1984]

Yes that is still applicable - Gigantus's problem was that he didn't have custom anims when he should have...
Linux problem is you can't have custom anims


That bit where the texture changes is the animation (it doesn't move much) - and yes you'll get the same texture change when the gates open/close - because it's using the vanilla animations which have the original texture.


Yup the animations were removed totally - otherwise you get the texture change thing on the wall & because it happens not just to the bits of wall that look like they're breaking, but the entire 20m block of wall, that is a lot more disturbing to watch than the gate texture switch.


The problem doesn't seem to be the animation itself - I suspect if I overwrote the original anim sets with ones with a new texture it would work - the trouble is that would give vanilla/other settlements the wrong texture. Our problem is that it apparently won't look up anims with a new name/path so we can't have extra ones.

Any chance that the makers of the Linux version might come back with any info?

Thanks for the clarification!

As for Feral Interactive, asking about m****** is like using the m word. Any message that contains the m word receives an automated response about Feral not supporting modding. I guess they are right in doing so, because they don't seem to have the requisite manpower to release new sexier games and support older ones at the same time. That's what they claim the reason is, and I believe them. A counter argument would be this: If you got in the trouble to release M2TW, you surely know that its selling point is the mods, so you should support them too. Otherwise why did you release it? (I've told them that already.)

I started this new adventure to change some animations on my own for practice, before unleashing my super tutorial-writing skills.

1) I opened the three files for the same settlement and saved it. I don't know where it got saved, but for now I will restrain myself and not ask.
2) I removed all the animations that walls were using. In my case it was 0, so I removed all items using the 0 animation. In addition to all the walls, there were also three gates, which I removed too. (There are no gates in the objects now.)
NOTE: The three gates were using the 4 animation all along. But when I removed the last wall animation the gates animations changed from 4 to 0. That's when I changed those animations too.
3) I updated the animations path in the WorldFiles tab, but nothing showed up. I guess because all remaining objects in the Objects window have -4 animation (i.e. no animation)?
NOTE: Following the reasoning behind your instructions, this probably wouldn't solve the issue, because now the gates should have no animations whatsoever.
4) That's why I should try to redirect the gate animation paths to vanilla ones. Problem is I can't because there is no dropdown menu at all.

Spoiler for Deadend: 

NOTE: I will also read the IWTE manuals located in the IWTE general discussion thread OP, but for now I thought I give it a shot without that.

[makanyane]

1) I opened the three files for the same settlement and saved it. I don't know where it got saved, but for now I will restrain myself and not ask.

The 4th thing it asks for when you open the files is the new .world save name - if you just did the default thing and selected the .world you were opening again, then the new files will be in the same folder as the original .world but with _1 added to the file name for the first save -2 for second save etc to avoid accidental overwrites - do check it is actually creating the files!

2) I removed all the animations that walls were using. In my case it was 0, so I removed all items using the 0 animation. In addition to all the walls, there were also three gates, which I removed too. (There are no gates in the objects now.)
NOTE: The three gates were using the 4 animation all along. But when I removed the last wall animation the gates animations changed from 4 to 0. That's when I changed those animations too.

Don't remove the animations for the gate. When all the original wall animations using '0' have gone, the gate ones and anything else with anims will re-number Yours being in that sequence makes it harder to know when to stop - but you should be able to see from the object type (and the number of damage transitions will be different - gates are always 8, walls vary)

3) I updated the animations path in the WorldFiles tab, but nothing showed up. I guess because all remaining objects in the Objects window have -4 animation (i.e. no animation)?
NOTE: Following the reasoning behind your instructions, this probably wouldn't solve the issue, because now the gates should have no animations whatsoever.
4) That's why I should try to redirect the gate animation paths to vanilla ones. Problem is I can't because there is no dropdown menu at all.

Don't remove the gate animations...

NOTE: I will also read the IWTE manuals located in the IWTE general discussion thread OP, but for now I thought I give it a shot without that.

Some/most of the tutorials are a bit out of date, might be worth reading for some general background but a few things (like changing the animation paths) that you used to have to do by converting to text file and back now have easier methods...

[Socrates1984]

That's what happens when a layman tries pro stuff...

The 4th thing it asks for when you open the files is the new .world save name - if you just did the default thing and selected the .world you were opening again, then the new files will be in the same folder as the original .world but with _1 added to the file name for the first save -2 for second save etc to avoid accidental overwrites - do check it is actually creating the files!

It actually had asked me the first time and I just forgot to report it. However when I go over there at the folder I can see no file created, despite the Objects, Structures and Textures filling up with info in the right. Truth be told, after I exit IWTE, the three files are there, in the place where I initially saved them (with the correct name - _1-1 etc), but not while I work in the IWTE.

Don't remove the animations for the gate. When all the original wall animations using '0' have gone, the gate ones and anything else with anims will re-number Yours being in that sequence makes it harder to know when to stop - but you should be able to see from the object type (and the number of damage transitions will be different - gates are always 8, walls vary)

Don't remove the gate animations...

Oops... Now, I removed everything that had Walls in the TypeDescr column and 0 as anim. They have 5 DmgTrans, while Gates indeed have 8 DmgTrans.

So, this is what happened:

Spoiler for Start: 

Spoiler for Finish: 

Assuming I did everything right, I saved and renamed the three files, after exiting IWTE. (Always keeping a backup of course.)

Some/most of the tutorials are a bit out of date, might be worth reading for some general background but a few things (like changing the animation paths) that you used to have to do by converting to text file and back now have easier methods...

Well, then, I will read some of them just to get the general idea, as you say. May I ask if there are others more up to date? I guess you would have directed me there already, but just in case.

Another question: This is save-game compatible, right? (Note: It is.)

It worked!! Thank you!

On top of that, it suddenly seems easy!

[makanyane]

It actually had asked me the first time and I just forgot to report it. However when I go over there at the folder I can see no file created, despite the Objects, Structures and Textures filling up with info in the right. Truth be told, after I exit IWTE, the three files are there, in the place where I initially saved them (with the correct name - _1-1 etc), but not while I work in the IWTE.

Yeah, for the minor functions it doesn't automatically save as it goes along - only when you select 'save 3 binaries'. Some other more complicated (for it) routines it will save automatically, e.g. adding/removing structures & the lighting stuff.

Well, then, I will read some of them just to get the general idea, as you say. May I ask if there are others more up to date? I guess you would have directed me there already, but just in case.

No sorry... I think Leo's are probably the most up to date. I will eventually try and up-date the wiki stuff but at the moment that's actually even older as it was mainly from the 'research in progress' stage

[vconesa]

Hey guys, I'm having the CTD with custom settlements for TATW as well but I'm using Mac. Everything else from the mod seems to be working fine (I've played Umbar and quick battles with no crashes). Let me know if you want me to try anything on my installation.

[vconesa]

Thanks!

So, I made a backup of the minas_tirith folder and pasted the new one you provided. Started the game and attacked the city with an Isengard army. It started loading!
It loaded!!
Oh my, look at this!!!

Spoiler for WHAAAAAAAAAAA: 

You are true magicians!!

How did you do it? Is it something I could do? Can it be done only in that obscure, outdated OS we call Windows??

On a different note: Linux is case sensitive, so every time I want to tweak something I have to make it lower case first. If at all is possible, please make any new files downcased. Keep in mind that it is probably easier for me to make all files and folders lower case, so if it's too much of a burden for you to do it, just let me do it.

EDIT: Scratch the above note! I am too enthusiastic to care for it right now!

I tried this in my Mac and it still crashes.

[makanyane]

Could you have a look at the list of settlements here;
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...1#post15216896
and see if you get similar results?

[Socrates1984]

Could you have a look at the list of settlements here;
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...1#post15216896
and see if you get similar results?

Ooooooh, I can see it coming! This question reminds me of something, I have a certain deja vu!... If it works, I will probably name the tutorial "... for Linux and Mac" and offer Gigantus (and me) another riddle on where to post it.

[Gigantus]

@Mak - you might want to give this java script a shot - it converts all files (and folders) in a directory to lowercase. I used it on my latest Bare Geomod edition - simply extract into the directory you want to convert and run the BAT file.
Due to all the java versions floating around I recommend testing it first.

We tried to get it working on Linux but some Java install problem threw up road blocks.

PS: I am going to publish a tool thread with a refined set up in a short while in the Linux forum here.