[Feedback] Questions, Critiques and Requests

[KAM 2150]

Would it be possible to add throw javelin on charge back in without breaking the longer skirmishing phase?

No, that is the sole reason why this is working.

[whitegamebox]

By the way how can I use the spoiler tag? I tried once but failed again. (as you see)
Or I'll just use link.

[FlashHeart07]

just write this.. and exchange the ( ) with [ ]
(spoiler) (img) URL FOR THE IMAGE (/img) (/spoiler)

[whitegamebox]

[IMG](spoiler) (img) http://images.akamai.steamuserconten...283B3491D58EE/ (/img) (/spoiler)[/IMG]

I think I have to use the link.
Anyway Thanks for teaching me.

[FlashHeart07]

You wrote it wrong

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[desertwind]

Hi All! From the star I must say that DEI 1.2 is a masterpiece. It changes R2TW to a brand new game. Fantastic work. Secondly i have a suggestion, or perhaps a request. Is it posible that the People of Rome aditions to be a modular part of the mod? I am not saying thar the new PoR mechanics are bad, but for a mediocre player like me is a bit overwhelming.
Thank you again for you work and effort put in DEI 1.2.

[leonardusius]

Tried for the first time the 1.2 beta. Custom battle. 3 units Getae, 1 general archer, 1 falx unit (225 men), 1 axe unit. Vs. 2 units Rome: 1 general, and 1 legionari unit (150 men). I was interested only in unit vs. unit behavior because that's my standard attitude to compare with the historical/realistic field battles. The Getae axe unit placed rear front to stay there. I moved my general unit and falx towards direct enemy, which placed theirs cavalry general in line behind legionaries. They start to move towards me when reached a some distance from them and not only stay there and wait like in previous versions (due to AI calculus between my total strength vs. his). It's a good improvement. I manoeuver my general just on the side of the legionarii flank and hold them there without firing the bows; just sitting there. Strange thing, the roman general suddenly chase my general till the end of the map, completely ignoring the let alone his legionarii. Next i was horified how the legionarii get slaughtered in seconds after charge, in 25 seconds routing after loosing more than probably 75% of troops and the falx (BTW, bare chested unit without any kind of armor) loosing only 30-40 men. Unbelievable. It's totally unrealistic. On the other hand, strange things occur: even I deactivated ''fire at will'' and activate ''melee posture'' for my archer general unit, some of it's troop still firing the bows...................Not to mention the useless pillum volley of the romans which barely killed 3-4 falx men in 2-3 volleys......I think it's totally screwed. That no means DeI is not a brilliant project, only a positive critique. Thank you.

Now that's I call a real changes ! After 10.I. update/patch my custom scenario was transformed into a good or even very good simulation. Now, the romans charged my falx but from behind the general cavalry unit charged throw theirs own ranks on my falxs with excellent results. The cavalry being in a line, the side wings of this line just go past theirs legionari with full speed and trample my falxs. Not to mention the initial pila voleys which now have a proper effect: 11-13 men killed. After initial contact a wayyyyyyyyy much better result: from initial 225 falx men 185 survived but the romans keep better theirs line with less casualties. Very good. The general disengaged, retreat and engage from the right legionary side my left side of my advancing second unit: axes. PERFECT. Off course they cannot withstand with 65 men against 225 and break soon and general killed in the process. VERY GOOD. My falxs still fighting against romans and after I moved my cavalry general in the rear of legionarii (only to stay there) they break imediately. GOOD.
I cannot say much more. Only one aspect: battles are too quick. All the battle last barely 8 minutes. VERY BAD. In reality the same scenario would last for 20-30 minutes for sure.

[Ostrogoth]

I don't like 20-30 minutes battles. Not only everyone can't afford to spend 2 hours to play 4 battles but it also comes to personal preference.

[FlashHeart07]

Im positive that KAM will create his faster and slower battles submods once he is happy with how battles in the main mod functions. Though he can explain a lot better, I believe that the reason for the somewhat faster battles are in order to actually accomplish these kinds of battles. The longer the battle, the easier it is for the player to lock the AI and do the hammer and anvil tactic. Rinse and repeat and then you win without ever fearing to lose, as it seems people have actually been doing or at least close to losing with 1.2.

I personally dont like the long battles of previous DeI versions. As I explained it just gave me enough time to actually flank the enemy with both missile troops, cavalry and even my infantry reserves.

[KennyTheKlever]

The eastern slave trade building needs balancing. As it stands, it gives no public order penalty whatsoever until level 4, at which point it gets its full penalty of -8 that should have been build up to at previous levels. It also only consumes food (-4) at level 4, which seems a bit unbalanced as well. Also, the cost of upgrading the building to its highest level is ~800, which I'm assuming is meant to be a figure closer to 10,000 than 1,000.

[Skoran]

Do you need a certain number of troops before you can patrol a region? Don't see that option sometimes.

[hippacrocafish]

Arverni is the only small faction that I've played so far that wasn't devastatingly hard, although I did have to destroy three Vivisci armies before I could attack their capital. However, their faction penalty is a pain to deal with mid-game, and to be frank I've always hated it since Rome II was released. Don't supposed it could be changed/rebalanced to account for the weakened public order bonuses in 1.2?

Speaking of Gauls, if the DeI team was thinking of adding any more of them

[KennyTheKlever]

Do you need a certain number of troops before you can patrol a region? Don't see that option sometimes.

Yes, you need 3 units along with the general - it says this in the description for the stance. You need 4 to raid afaik

Have most of the unit caps remained in 1.2, or is it just for the AOR units?

[Ostrogoth]

Arverni is the only small faction that I've played so far that wasn't devastatingly hard, although I did have to destroy three Vivisci armies before I could attack their capital. However, their faction penalty is a pain to deal with mid-game, and to be frank I've always hated it since Rome II was released. Don't supposed it could be changed/rebalanced to account for the weakened public order bonuses in 1.2?

Speaking of Gauls, if the DeI team was thinking of adding any more of them

Do you have downloaded the last update? After it I actually managed to successfully start campaign as Kolkhis on the first try which was frustratingly hard before the update. Changes in battle balance allowed me to stand against countless enemies. I am playing on normal difficulty.

[Ivan_Moscavich]

[IMG](spoiler) (img) http://images.akamai.steamuserconten...283B3491D58EE/ (/img) (/spoiler)[/IMG]

All of the parenthesis need to be replaced with brackets, not just some.

[KAM 2150]

Have most of the unit caps remained in 1.2, or is it just for the AOR units?

We only had units caps for AOR and Aux units. Not sure what would be changed here?

Now that's I call a real changes ! After 10.I. update/patch my custom scenario was transformed into a good or even very good simulation. Now, the romans charged my falx but from behind the general cavalry unit charged throw theirs own ranks on my falxs with excellent results. The cavalry being in a line, the side wings of this line just go past theirs legionari with full speed and trample my falxs. Not to mention the initial pila voleys which now have a proper effect: 11-13 men killed. After initial contact a wayyyyyyyyy much better result: from initial 225 falx men 185 survived but the romans keep better theirs line with less casualties. Very good. The general disengaged, retreat and engage from the right legionary side my left side of my advancing second unit: axes. PERFECT. Off course they cannot withstand with 65 men against 225 and break soon and general killed in the process. VERY GOOD. My falxs still fighting against romans and after I moved my cavalry general in the rear of legionarii (only to stay there) they break imediately. GOOD.
I cannot say much more. Only one aspect: battles are too quick. All the battle last barely 8 minutes. VERY BAD. In reality the same scenario would last for 20-30 minutes for sure.

How 8 minute battle with only 4-5 units combined is bad? What would change if they would fight for 20-30 minutes? They would just poke at eachother, while AI would not do more manouvers and you could pull off "realistic" NASA laser guided 15 flank attacks.

Overal neither 8 minutes or even 30 minutes is realistic, which is for me the most hated word in case of mods as we can't make stuff realistic no matter how hard we try or what words we use to describe it.

Point is that, in 20-30 minutes battles you only play on cheat mode as THERE IS NOTHING HAPPENING in the middle from AI. Nothing. While you do unrealistic NASA laser guided manouvering and flanking.

For me the most important stuff about battles is their "feeling". People in last few years of TW games seem to just judge the battle by the length and not by what is happening during it. Vanilla CA battles are way to fast and even AI can't handle that speed, while too long battles are just too easy as player is doing very complex tactics which AI can't comprehend. For 1.2 I tried to find a middle ground plus added a lot to battle time due to initial manouvering and skirmishing.

In your test you just had 4-5 units and you want them to fight for 20-30 minutes of just poking at eachother without anything happenind. If that would be the length of 4-5 units engagement, then 40 or 60 units battle shoud take an hour or more. It would plain and simple kill AI.

[KennyTheKlever]

We only had units caps for AOR and Aux units. Not sure what would be changed here?

Hmm. I thought I remember there being caps for the old Spartan Hero unit, along with a few elite troops from other factions. My mistake...

[leonardusius]

I don't like 20-30 minutes battles. Not only everyone can't afford to spend 2 hours to play 4 battles but it also comes to personal preference.

If you think to play the game in a matter of 1 or 2 days, you're OK. I'm not.

We only had units caps for AOR and Aux units. Not sure what would be changed here?



How 8 minute battle with only 4-5 units combined is bad? What would change if they would fight for 20-30 minutes? They would just poke at eachother, while AI would not do more manouvers and you could pull off "realistic" NASA laser guided 15 flank attacks.

Overal neither 8 minutes or even 30 minutes is realistic, which is for me the most hated word in case of mods as we can't make stuff realistic no matter how hard we try or what words we use to describe it.

Point is that, in 20-30 minutes battles you only play on cheat mode as THERE IS NOTHING HAPPENING in the middle from AI. Nothing. While you do unrealistic NASA laser guided manouvering and flanking.

For me the most important stuff about battles is their "feeling". People in last few years of TW games seem to just judge the battle by the length and not by what is happening during it. Vanilla CA battles are way to fast and even AI can't handle that speed, while too long battles are just too easy as player is doing very complex tactics which AI can't comprehend. For 1.2 I tried to find a middle ground plus added a lot to battle time due to initial manouvering and skirmishing.

In your test you just had 4-5 units and you want them to fight for 20-30 minutes of just poking at eachother without anything happenind. If that would be the length of 4-5 units engagement, then 40 or 60 units battle shoud take an hour or more. It would plain and simple kill AI.

I do not argue that, because is your work and I won't you feel bad. Just wait for a submod lengthening the battles; or doing myself only raising the HP in the tables.

[Skoran]

No specific Dei question but still: is it possible to change the color of the markers under soldiers / arrows on the battlemap.
The yellow ones aren't clear enough for me.

[Dresden]

I've understood the purpose of the population system. I wasn't saying that is normal to spam full stacks with elite soldiers, that never crossed my mind (even though I have about a million to spend right now, therefore I can afford not one, but 5 full stacks of elites), but at least give me some leeway to recruit at least a third of a full stack with elites since I've done the appropiate research and I have already conquered 5 regions and 5 satrapies and never lost a piece of land. I think that's fair, that's progression, an aspect just as important in a videogame just like "realism", Dresden. No offense, but where's the logic in starting with 2 regions and 1400 Eugeneis and after 100 turns ending up with 3 more regions and 5 satrapies, but only 200 Eugeneis, since I didn't lose any battle, all my campaign has been growth, expanding and development? I feel like I'm penalized for playing as I should and believe me, I've played DEI for hundreds if not thousands of hours with all factions. What exactly is causing the 1st class population to drop so dramatically and never expand? Because every other class of citizens is expanding, only the 1st class keeps getting smaller and smaller by the conquest and I don't get why that happens. I've built, destroyed, tried a different type of building while carefully watching the population happiness and food, and nothing seems to change this. Again, I get the purpose of the population system, it's good on paper, nobody wants to spam full elite armies because it's unrealistic and gamebreaking as well, but to penalize the player for playing as he should for no reason, even though the game gets tougher with higher tier buildings that come with penalties regarding food or population happiness, it's simply ludicrous. I'm not saying that the population system needs to go, but that it needs serious tweaking, since it negates players the ability to recruit better troops with no reason and logic. The way it is right now is like playing Ptolemaic Egypt after the French Revolution, with only 2 classes of citizens, but without muskets and cannons lol.

In the latest updated I reduced how much the overall population affects class 1 so they should have gotten a little boost. But class 1 will always be the lowest, they are the highest nobility and will inevitably be a small population amount. If it continues to be a problem, after the latest fix in the last update, I can give them a small bump up to population growth.

Excuse the glitch only occurs in Latium when playing as the rome faction.

This is a known issue from modding the UI as much as we have. Unfortunately it happens from time to time. I will see if I can get it a bit more consistent.

[IMG](spoiler) (img) http://images.akamai.steamuserconten...283B3491D58EE/ (/img) (/spoiler)[/IMG]

They are greyed out because they are not unlocked yet by reforms.

No specific Dei question but still: is it possible to change the color of the markers under soldiers / arrows on the battlemap.
The yellow ones aren't clear enough for me.

Not that I know of, but I have never checked - maybe a graphics modder would know more.

Hmm. I thought I remember there being caps for the old Spartan Hero unit, along with a few elite troops from other factions. My mistake...

Yes some very specific units had caps, but not many. I think for the most part now its only AOR and Aux units.