ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

[dogukan]

PYD is as secular as AKP was when they were trying to look nice for the West.

May I ask you what you define secularism as?

Since AKP are pretty much blatant Islamists, are you suggesting that PYD are islamists?

[PointOfViewGun]

May I ask you what you define secularism as?
Since AKP are pretty much blatant Islamists, are you suggesting that PYD are islamists?

You don't need me to define secularism as you have access to dictionaries. AKP is Islamist leaning, but not as extreme as the groups we quickly label as Islamist. Though nowadays anyone that uses Arabic is labeled as Islamist. No one really bothers to check their statements. PYD plays nice with the West just like AKP was playing nice back in 2002-2008. Given Kurds in general are some of the most conservative groups I wouldn't guess that their secularist approach to governance is genuine.

[Heathen Hammer]

While regime is somewhat secular, it is not THAT secular.
There are still Islamic laws afaik in Syria.
And each sect that make up the regime are quite conservative.
They do not really promote secularism is social life as much, it is still a highly conservative-dominated system.

Not to mention that half of the fighting force that keeps Assad afloat are Shia-fanatics.

You also ignored PYD which is instituionally a ton more secular even by the regime's standards.

I would say that being a militant socialist/communist can be just as bad as religious fundamentalist.
AFAIK Syrian government does have some laws inspired by religion, but compared to other factions it is still rather secular as in not destroying ancient ruins because "muh allah is jelly of ancient gods", or forcing women to cover their faces.

[dogukan]

Given Kurds in general are some of the most conservative groups I wouldn't guess that their secularist approach to governance is genuine.

How does that relate to the institutional and ideological structure of PYD or the laws they try to implement?

When it suits you, you seem to say PYD=/=Kurds and now you say PYD must have Islamist leanings because it has Kurds.

You ve said many things to smear the PYD, but calling them "likely non-secular", comparable to AKP is a new level.

I would say that being a militant socialist/communist can be just as bad as religious fundamentalist.
AFAIK Syrian government does have some laws inspired by religion, but compared to other factions it is still rather secular as in not destroying ancient ruins because "muh allah is jelly of ancient gods", or forcing women to cover their faces.

Militant baathism and the personality cult of a leader (like Assad) is not different. Baathism was based on the real socialist model of the Cold War. It isn't much different than that basis. Baathists defined themselves as revolutionary socialists.

[PointOfViewGun]

How does that relate to the institutional and ideological structure of PYD or the laws they try to implement?
When it suits you, you seem to say PYD=/=Kurds and now you say PYD must have Islamist leanings because it has Kurds.
You ve said many things to smear the PYD, but calling them "likely non-secular", comparable to AKP is a new level.

What's claimed and what happens on the ground by PYD are two different things. It presents itself as one of the most democratic groups in the world but PYD through YPG actively targets any political opponent. We saw this even when Kobane was being attacked by ISIL. They refused the help of other Syrian Kurdish factions just because they adhered to different political factions.

[dogukan]

Political repression and not being secular are seperate issues.

And who does any better? SDF areas are the safest most transparent regions where most international journalists and UN entities resided in and lived safely in peace.
SDF so far proved to be the most democratic and inclusive of all factions of the war. Blaming them for not holding "open elections to include all factions" in a civil war is a ridiculously hypocritical attitude.
No one says SDF is the beacon of democracy in the world, it is the best out of all factions.
By that logic, Turkey and its jihadis have already ousted hundreds of Kurds and not a single PYD representative remains in where they entered.
Is the regime held areas any different when it comes to their treatment of opposition? The very same regime that has been blmaed for using chemical weapons, mass tortures and terrible jailings where thousands are claimed to have died.....

Under SDF, we have seen that thousands of ISIS and ISIS families are still held in relatively good conditions...

[PointOfViewGun]

Political repression and not being secular are seperate issues.

And who does any better? SDF areas are the safest most transparent regions where most international journalists and UN entities resided in and lived safely in peace.
SDF so far proved to be the most democratic and inclusive of all factions of the war. Blaming them for not holding "open elections to include all factions" in a civil war is a ridiculously hypocritical attitude.
No one says SDF is the beacon of democracy in the world, it is the best out of all factions.
By that logic, Turkey and its jihadis have already ousted hundreds of Kurds and not a single PYD representative remains in where they entered.
Is the regime held areas any different when it comes to their treatment of opposition? The very same regime that has been blmaed for using chemical weapons, mass tortures and terrible jailings where thousands are claimed to have died.....

Under SDF, we have seen that thousands of ISIS and ISIS families are still held in relatively good conditions...

If I see that PYD is actively playing a face when they act differently I wouldn't really assume they would not be hypocritical about secularism. Given that large portion, if not overwhelming majority, of the people they claim governance over are some of the most conservative groups of people their secularism will likely resemble that of AKP's early days.

SDF controlled areas are where these happened:
Have the Syrian Kurds Committed War Crimes?

The pace of the expulsions picked up dramatically after the United States began joint operations against the Islamic State in Syria in mid-2015, as the Kurdish militia threatened Arabs with air strikes if they didn’t leave their villages. While they slowed in 2016, expulsions continue even as the militia turns on its political rivals and jails, tortures, or expels them.

At least 300,000 Syrian Kurds have also fled the region to neighboring Iraqi Kurdistan, according to officials there, and no fewer than 200,000 have fled to Turkey rather than submit to forced conscription and political suppression by a group that insists on ruling as a one-party state, according to Kurdish human-rights monitors in Turkey. Officials in Iraqi Kurdistan say that if the Syrian Kurdish militia opened the borders, at least half the Kurdish population under its control would flee.

Tammu and other Kurds opposed to the Assad regime quickly became the first target in the YPG crackdown. There were mass arrests and assassinations of leaders—first Tammu, killed in October 2011; then Mahmud Wali in September 2012 and Ahmad Bunjak in September 2013.

The most dramatic assault on government opponents occurred in late June 2013, when YPG security forces opened fire during a demonstration in Amouda, killing three (and three more in the area soon after). The protesters were demanding that the PYD release anti-regime activists it had detained, but one day later, the PYD arrested another 100 and closed all opposition party offices in the city. This and other such assaults, together with arrests of Kurdish party leaders opposed to the PYD, led to the flight of tens of thousands—to Iraqi Kurdistan, where there are now some 300,000 Rojava Kurds; and to Turkey, where there are at least 200,000.

The YPG’s assaults on Arabs began in late 2013, with three massacres, according to the Syrian Network for Human Rights: Al-Aghybish town in November 2013, in which six were killed; Tal Brak in late February 2014, with a death toll of 43 civilians; and Al Hajiya and Tal Khalil in mid-September 2014, in which 42 were killed.

Expulsions and destruction of villages also started in Hasakah late in 2013, and gained momentum after the US Air Force began to carry out air strikes to save Kobani from the ISIS assault in October 2014. It accelerated the following year, as the YPG, backed up by US air power, captured the border town of Tal Abyad, which ISIS deserted without a fight.

By the way, this is a scene from an ISIL detention camp:


Bursting at the seams: Inside an ISIS prison in Syria

Many of the prisoners there are all skin and bones. The most fortunate have a bed to lie on, but most of them just sit directly on the floor, exposing amputation stumps and bandaged wounds. The prison clinic is as crowded as the other cells. A greying man with axillary crutches painstakingly picks his way through the ghostly crowd.

[Heathen Hammer]

Militant baathism and the personality cult of a leader (like Assad) is not different. Baathism was based on the real socialist model of the Cold War. It isn't much different than that basis. Baathists defined themselves as revolutionary socialists.

Given history of the region, Baathism in itself was the only way to contain influence of Israel and Gulf's islamist fundamentalism.
Plus if neocons hate something so much, then it must be kind of okay, at the least.

[ioannis76]

Many of the prisoners there are all skin and bones. The most fortunate have a bed to lie on, but most of them just sit directly on the floor, exposing amputation stumps and bandaged wounds. The prison clinic is as crowded as the other cells. A greying man with axillary crutches painstakingly picks his way through the ghostly crowd.

I am in tears. Weren't these the same people who murdered and raped, and committed all sorts of atrocities?

Furthermore, there are actual INNOCENT people who, even today got bombed by the Turkish Airforce:

Civilians injured as result of drone strike on the village of Hishe near Ain Issa

https://syria.liveuamap.com/en/2019/...rone-strike-on

And despite even such brutal attacks, the turkish "army" keeps losing:
https://syria.liveuamap.com/en/2019/...ures-a-village

It looks like Turkey isn't even going to have the territory it negotiated with Russia. Such a shame.

[ioannis76]

Turkey's mercenaries conducting extensive looting in Ras-Al-Ayin.

https://www.sana.sy/en/?p=177724



video:

https://twitter.com/kurdistannews24/...92818097438720

[Yayattasa]

Trump deranged statement on Fox News:

'Maybe we will, maybe we won't’: Trump doubles down on threat to take oil from Syria

Donald Trump has renewed his threats to forcibly steal oil from Syria, a move which experts say would amount to a war crime.
The president defended his decision to leave a small number of American troops in the war-torn nation after a general withdrawal in October by claiming they were only there to secure Syria’s oilfields.
“They say he left troops in Syria... do you know what I did? I took the oil,” he said during a Fox News interview.“
The only troops I have are taking the oil, they are protecting the oil.”
When the interviewer, Laura Ingraham, attempted to correct Mr Trump by insisting the soldiers were not there to take the oil but to guard the facilities, the president cut her off.

BTW his fake tan is looking worse everyday, he's looking like a clown.

[Abdülmecid I]

Some positive news, as the Syrian Army has liberated one of the largest cities still controlled by the jihadists, Maarat al-Numan. The goal is probably to set the M5 highway under control, which, together with relieving Aleppo from the constant pressures of mortar-shelling, could help the Syrian economy recover a little. It's still going to be strangled by the West-imposed sanctions, but restoring basic communications can somewhat contribute to a slight improvement. Meanwhile, the number of Turkish observation points isolated from the rest of the rebel strongholds has risen to three. Erdogan probably still insists on maintaining military presence in Idlib, just to protect its popularity among the most religious and nationalist of his voters, but with the recent advances of the Syrians, it can easily devolve into a domestic debacle.

[ioannis76]

Some positive news, as the Syrian Army has liberated one of the largest cities still controlled by the jihadists, Maarat al-Numan. The goal is probably to set the M5 highway under control, which, together with relieving Aleppo from the constant pressures of mortar-shelling, could help the Syrian economy recover a little. It's still going to be strangled by the West-imposed sanctions, but restoring basic communications can somewhat contribute to a slight improvement. Meanwhile, the number of Turkish observation points isolated from the rest of the rebel strongholds has risen to three. Erdogan probably still insists on maintaining military presence in Idlib, just to protect its popularity among the most religious and nationalist of his voters, but with the recent advances of the Syrians, it can easily devolve into a domestic debacle.

If you consider the advance of the SAA as positive news (I agree with that as well as the term liberation), then what is your view on the turkish attempts to curb or block this advance? Is the turkish military acting as a proxy for the HTS and the FSA/SNA, in effect jihadists?

[Abdülmecid I]

That's not a proxy relationship.The FSA in Afrin and the rest of the formerly YPG-held areas are the mercenaries of Ankara, but what happens in Idlib is that the Turkish government indirectly protects the jihadist warlords, in order not to worsen the refugee crisis inside Turkey herself. It's a morally reprehensible policy that resulted from amateurish foreign policy decisions, but that doesn't mean that al-Qaeda is the proxy of Turkey. By that logic, Washington is also the ally of ISIL, because some of its airstrikes under Obama and Trump indirectly helped the Sunni extremists in their fight against the government in Damascus.

Anyway, in other Saraqib is effectively under the control of the Syrian army, together with invaluable archeological site of Ebla. I wonder what happened to the tablets that were supposed to safeguarded by the Syrian Ministry of Cultural affairs. At least, the Mari clay tablets from the Archeological Museum of Deir ez-Zhor had been successfully transported to the capital. The Syrian Army will probably continue to advance along the M5 highroad, liberating most of the territory west of Aleppo, so the remaining militants must quickly flee, if the don't want to get encircled and trapped. Finally, a very interesting review about the issues plaguing openly biased films featured in international festivals, which are however interpreted as accurate depictions of reality, by either clueless or partial commentators. The rebels have decisively lost the war, but their influence in the media remains as strong as ever.

[nhytgbvfeco2]

Also a hilarious routine developed, whereby Turkey desperately builds new observation posts (4 around Saraqaib alone) and the SAA just.. walks around them.

[Yayattasa]

Israeli airstrikes in Syria 'force passenger jet into emergency landing'

Israel got this thing going on where, when they fly to attack deep into Syria they often shield their fighters behind civilian aircraft routes.

They've done that before. That's horrendous, to say the least.

[Vanoi]

And Assad sends weapons to militant groups who fire them in Israel against civilians. I am more than willing to bet there wouldn't be any israeli strikes in Syria if it weren't for that problem.

[Yayattasa]

And Assad sends weapons to militant groups who fire them in Israel against civilians. I am more than willing to bet there wouldn't be any israeli strikes in Syria if it weren't for that problem.

Don't deflect. Putting innocent civilians into risk is heinous, no matter who does it.

[Vanoi]

Don't deflect. Putting innocent civilians into risk is heinous, no matter who does it.

Does that change what i said? There's a cause and effect to things. Assad helps create the dangerous situation. If that flight was downed Assad and his government would be as responsible as the Israelis.

[sumskilz]

Israel got this thing going on where, when they fly to attack deep into Syria they often shield their fighters behind civilian aircraft routes.

They've done that before. That's horrendous, to say the least.

RT News (the original source) has likewise claimed that Syrian air defenses shot down 71 out of 103 US cruise missiles and that Israeli F-16s were using a Russian Il-20 to shield themselves when Syrian air defenses shot it down. What are the odds that the Israelis are cocky enough to deliberately endanger Russian military aircraft? What are the odds that the Israelis use F-16s to strike at targets deep in Syria when they have F-35s? I'd say lower than the odds that the Russians are trying cover for the apparent impotence of the Syrian air defense systems Russia sold to them and attempting to pressure Israel into dialing back the embarrassing strikes.