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Thread: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

  1. #1

    Default [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    This mod will add more variations to roman generals. This mod will not remove or replace the existing roman generals, it will only add more of them.


    I like to RP a lot when I play, this often involves having 20-30 politicians in every political party.
    I also like to use a mod that doubles the amount of generals that can be recruited, and since the game only offers 30 different variations of the general model for the roman factions I find myself having clone generals when I play, this kind of breaks immersion for me, so I decided to create more generals for Rome.

    So let’s start by meeting the 90 new roman politicians:
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    And here’s the original 30 politicians from base DeI:
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    I like to explain the process of making the politicians to you; the number one aim for me was to get as much variations as possible. I wanted them to be as different as possible but still look roman. I used some of the existing eastern heads for some of them so that’s why some have a darker skin tone. Regarding the hair color I went for mostly variation of brown and black. As you can see I even did some gray color to make them look older, I realize that this brakes immersion when you get a young 18 years old general and he look like a 60 year old, but in this case I sacrificed the immersion for variety.
    I know that the blond hair color was uncommon among the Romans, but the blond hair was associated with the exotic and foreign appearance and many of the wealthiest Romans did dye their hair blond or used blond wigs. So the blond hair fits on the heads of wealthy politicians but should not be used on common soldiers. On the battlefield those hair are replace but a helmet.
    Finley I like to explain my thinking of adding scars to some of the generals. Both the Legatus and the tribuni ware political appointments not military, so it was not uncommon that it was the Praefectus Castrorum that was commanding the army in battle while the Legatus and the tribuni stayed in the back. But some of the generals did get involved in the action.
    Also the general unit in the game is a fighting force. I find myself often forced to use my generals in an offensive manner so it only logical that some of them will get a battle scar or two. And besides they looks cool.


    This is still very much a work in progress so I would like to hear your opinion, impressions, suggestion and criticism, as long as it’s constructive.


    The next thing I like to talk about is the equipment and amour of the Legatus. I have to admit that I have a limited knowledge in this, so any help is appicaeted.
    So this is what I know:

    The dress and armor was based heavily on Hellenistic tradition, and my knowledge of it comes mainly from sculpture and other artwork since I only find very little archaeological sources, to my knowledge not much archaeological evidence has survived.
    Body armor was the classic lorica musculata, but sometimes a scale amour was used as well. It was most probably made of hammered Iron, Brass or Bronze, there remains the possibility that sometimes the lorica musculata was made of leather as well. They were heavily decorated with embossed designs, and likely silvered or even gilded. A fabric belt or sash with fringed ends, worn rather high, which was tied in a square knot at the front this belt is a Hellenistic tradition.


    Officers are frequently shown bare-headed, but it is safe to assume that they all wore helmets in battle. The Hellenistic "Attic" helmet was typical.

    The few depictions of officers with shields show a large round or oval shield.

    Greaves and wristband do not seem to have been part of the traditional officer's dress, but no doubt they ware be worn in battle if desired.

    Here’s some early work in progress for you:

    Roman general 01
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    Some action shots
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    Roman general 02
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    Some action shots
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    Roman general 03
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    Some action shots
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    Roman general 06
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    Some action shots
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    Last edited by pawelrut; April 14, 2018 at 03:24 PM. Reason: Roman general 03 added

  2. #2

    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    what a fabulous mod you made! anyway this mod will be compatible with save-game? and there will be more variant option for hellenic generals too??

  3. #3
    Ordinarius
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    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    What a great idea and effort, thank you. I too would love to see the same for the Greeks.

  4. #4
    ♔Greek Strategos♔'s Avatar BEARDED MODERATION
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    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    Nice one buddy. Keep it up.

  5. #5

    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    Yep looks great. Would be cool to combine the idea with Benjin's concept he is working on where generals age and change based on the season. In the campaign character arts table you can change their look based on that I think.

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  6. #6
    Jake Armitage's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    That's a really good idea and surely a major addition.
    I'm very happy you are planning this, and the work made until now is reamrkable and promising.

    I wouldn't bother about general portrait age, even if a youngster is white-haired, well, who cares. Or check what Dresden reports.

    About RP elements, the most they are, the more interesting a campaign is, imo.
    Lately I'm working on some script to give more immersion to campaigns, giving various gameplay aspects.
    Pity no one triggers yet. But I'll manage somehow.

    Btw, how can you play with so many generals? Are you able to maintain balance?
    About Rome, just for sharing some preferences, here is how I imagine (and play) politics and power partition in my roman campaigns:

    First of all we have to consider that we have four houses, right?
    - Nobiles
    - Equites
    - Patrici
    - Plebeians.

    And we are Nobiles fundamentally, right?
    So we constitute a triumvirate of Nobiles of 3 generals (have 3 generals for Nobiles house, to raise % in the senate too)
    Those generals will be commanders (when you need them) of these three legions (a sort of "inner houses" forming the triumvirate):
    - Legio Nobilis (chief of the most noble ones)
    - Legio Praefecta (chief of province administrators)
    - Legio Senatus (chief of the senate)

    Then you can add 2 more inner houses:
    - Legio Pontifex (your leader when gets older and reamin in rome)
    - Legio Caesar (when you become an empire you need a Caesar)

    The Equites House should have at maximum 2 generals imo, everyone chief of these "inner houses":
    - Legio Equites (chief of land owners)
    - Legio Pratoriani (chief of veteran legionaries)

    The Patrici House should have at maximum 2 generals imo, everyone chief of these "inner houses":
    - Legio Patritium (chief of merchants and other non noble riches)
    - Legio Aedilis (chief of roman citizens who lives outside roman territory)

    The Plebeians House should have at maximum 2 generals imo, everyone chief of these "inner houses":
    - Legio Tribunia (chief of plebs tribunes, representing plebs)
    - Legio Magistrorum (chief of the magistrates)

    PS. Latin declinations are wrong, I know, but I like the fact that every inner faction has a different declination.
    Every Legio has its own banner

  7. #7

    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dresden View Post
    Yep looks great. Would be cool to combine the idea with Benjin's concept he is working on where generals age and change based on the season. In the campaign character arts table you can change their look based on that I think.
    Plus one

  8. #8

    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    Looks awesome, will definitely use.

  9. #9
    Lupo's Avatar Libertus
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    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    Now I can not sleep because of sheer anticipation for days ....... thumbs up!

  10. #10
    Lupo's Avatar Libertus
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    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    Now I can not sleep because of sheer anticipation for days ....... thumbs up!

    please delete this......i cant

    Last edited by Lupo; March 31, 2018 at 12:58 AM.

  11. #11
    Ygraine's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    Excellent work! Now we need this for the other cultures as well
    (2nd position - Gameplay Mods-category - 2016 Modding Awards.)

  12. #12
    ~Seleukos.I.Nikator~'s Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    A neatly presented, beautiful piece of work! Congratulations @pawelrut!

    It is indeed quite amusing to see some of those Roman nobles with much darker skin complexion, but I understand the necessity here.

    I'm currently more into playing the Hellenistic factions, but once I move west to play the Romans I will certainly use this mod.

  13. #13

    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    Quote Originally Posted by Ygraine View Post
    Excellent work! Now we need this for the other cultures as well
    Indeed ! not just for Rome.

  14. #14
    Foederatus
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    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    Now we need a few more beards...

    Gotta have beardiversity, afterall!

  15. #15
    Benjin's Avatar Artifex
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    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    Nice work! I like the amount of head variety there (mixture of texture swapping + new heads from Attila's) - now you'll have less chance of the same appearance spawning twice.

    One question - have you separated the Roman Gladiator + Attila heads from their original hands / feet / bodies to fit with the vanilla Roman body? If so, that's impressive and is what I was about to do for my own mod. I noticed that Roman General 06 - which uses a Roman Gladiator skin - doesn't have his big Gladiator arms clipping through the other character's objects (tunic, armour etc), and that Roman General 01 uses those pauldrons(?) from Aurelian as well.
    Last edited by Benjin; March 31, 2018 at 08:36 AM.
    3D ARTIST (MODELS/TEXTURES), ANIMATOR, RIGGER

  16. #16
    ♔Greek Strategos♔'s Avatar BEARDED MODERATION
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    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    Quote Originally Posted by TheJackinati275 View Post
    Now we need a few more beards...

    Gotta have beardiversity, afterall!
    @pawelrut Could take my beard as a base model.

  17. #17

    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    Sorry for the late reply, but it's Esther so I don’t have a lot of spare time, friends and family need some love too.

    Quote Originally Posted by servent9 View Post
    what a fabulous mod you made! anyway this mod will be compatible with save-game? and there will be more variant option for hellenic generals too??
    Should be save game compatible.

    I was planning on doing Carthage and Seleucid next, coz those are the 3 factions I play the most. But Benjin is also planning on making other factions so I think it’s a good idea for us to cooperate, no point in doing the same thing. But I will have to ask him, we see. If I do decide to make other faction I will need someone to do the research. Providing pictures, source material, some historical speculations of what could be. I try to make this fit DeI so this should be as historically correct it can be.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dresden View Post
    Yep looks great. Would be cool to combine the idea with Benjin's concept he is working on where generals age and change based on the season. In the campaign character arts table you can change their look based on that I think.
    What Benjin is doing is just amazing. I will have to make some thinking of what to do next. I like all of his ideas, I like them a lot. But it’s going take a lots of time to implement it all to 90 new generals.
    What do the rest of you think? You guys want me to finish those 90 generals and release them and then start implementing Benjin ideas? Or should I start over a bit, start making the changes now?

    Here the link to Benjin mod for those how don’t know what I’m talking about:
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...-Acclimatising

    Quote Originally Posted by Jake Armitage View Post
    Lately I'm working on some script to give more immersion to campaigns, giving various gameplay aspects.
    Pity no one triggers yet. But I'll manage somehow.
    Can’t wait to see what you making Jake.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jake Armitage View Post
    Btw, how can you play with so many generals? Are you able to maintain balance?
    About Rome, just for sharing some preferences, here is how I imagine (and play) politics and power partition in my roman campaigns:
    I have dubbed the army amount so I have 36 legions on the highest imperium level, so it’s not that many. I do however have a lot of politicians, I RP the elections, political and military appointments. I use my Surface Pro on the side when I play, with spreadsheets and all. + an app on my phone for dice rolls, I’m not a barbarian after all. For full disclosure I also have 40 units in my armies and usually 12TPY and a lot of personal tweaks.

    Quote Originally Posted by seleukos99 View Post
    A neatly presented, beautiful piece of work! Congratulations @pawelrut!

    It is indeed quite amusing to see some of those Roman nobles with much darker skin complexion, but I understand the necessity here.
    Thank you.
    I probably will make the skin tone lighter now, implanting the aging idea from Benjin.

    Quote Originally Posted by Benjin View Post
    Nice work! I like the amount of head variety there (mixture of texture swapping + new heads from Attila's) - now you'll have less chance of the same appearance spawning twice.
    Thank you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Benjin View Post
    One question - have you separated the Roman Gladiator + Attila heads from their original hands / feet / bodies to fit with the vanilla Roman body? If so, that's impressive and is what I was about to do for my own mod. I noticed that Roman General 06 - which uses a Roman Gladiator skin - doesn't have his big Gladiator arms clipping through the other character's objects (tunic, armour etc),
    Actually the CA was kind and give us a lot of models that only have heads and arms. For the Roman General 06 I used the barb_cine_headhands_bearded_skinbb06_shape6.rigid_model_v2 as a base.
    Rigging the head and arms take a lot of work, so that something I try to avoid if I can, it’s an art form of it’s on.
    I'm quite impressed that you did it for the young Caesar, and the one in the previews is of you father I believe. Kudos.
    I wish my son did something like that for me. Most of the other mod I have seen, that use custom head, just riggd the head like a helmet. So making all the animations work, amazing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Benjin View Post
    and that Roman General 01 uses those pauldrons(?) from Aurelian as well.
    Yes he does, good eye.

    Quote Originally Posted by Greek strategos View Post
    @pawelrut Could take my beard as a base model.
    Your beard will be the biggest of them all. One beard to rule them all.

  18. #18

    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    I would say coordinate with Benjin, work together and bring it as a master overhaul for generals. Not just for Rome but the whole factions and release betas every time a faction is finished so you keep thei nterest of the community alive.

  19. #19
    ♔Greek Strategos♔'s Avatar BEARDED MODERATION
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    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    Quote Originally Posted by Tenerife_Boy View Post
    I would say coordinate with Benjin, work together and bring it as a master overhaul for generals. Not just for Rome but the whole factions and release betas every time a faction is finished so you keep thei nterest of the community alive.
    I would very much like to see that. If it suits both of them of course.

  20. #20
    RaggaBaby's Avatar Laetus
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    Default Re: [submod] More generals for Rome [wip]

    This is AWESOOOME!!

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