Akaian League misnomer

[jo the greek]

Ok sometimes i follow sme videos of your mod in youtube . At some time a turkissh friend of mine sends me a video with Akaian league. Whaaaat Akaian league who da uses the name Akaian ..........
Now i see another video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoN0nfDRkEs

and the narrator says Akaian League Athen Corinth Sparta . Sparta was not important anymore and etc....

I just want to die with your lack of info and creativity. Why you did not put a batman hoplite nation instead.

[Petellius]

Why is this our fault if people report our mod incorrectly? We know what is correct.

[jo the greek]

How its even corretct to use the term Akaian . Why Athens is even in Akaian League Why sparta is also when actually Sparta was allied with aetolians and on war with them,


I understand gameplay necessities like Rome not having their allies but it too much .....

[Causeless]

I'm not a big fan of that video. It's rather stupid especially as he scrolls around showing off the map and seems to think that the AE team has completely re-done the campaign map (making it "reminiscent of Warhammer" according to him)... You can pretty much fly around in normal Attila with some minor graphical mods and it almost identical to this video other than cities.

Not to try to reduce praise for AE, as the team have done a huge amount, but it's a pity to see praise being completely ignorantly given to the parts that haven't even changed...

Anyways, Sparta didn't become part of the league until several years after the start date of the game. However, as I understand it the lack of detail of Greece in Attila's grand campaign map means it's a necessary evil to represent them as being part of it at the start date in 202 BC.

Otherwise I'm not sure why it's "Akaian", that's somewhat confusing... is it not the Achaean league?

[jo the greek]

I'm not a big fan of that video. It's rather stupid especially as he scrolls around showing off the map and seems to think that the AE team has completely re-done the campaign map (making it "reminiscent of Warhammer" according to him)... You can pretty much fly around in normal Attila with some minor graphical mods and it almost identical to this video other than cities.

Not to try to reduce praise for AE, as the team have done a huge amount, but it's a pity to see praise being completely ignorantly given to the parts that haven't even changed...

Anyways, Sparta didn't become part of the league until several years after the start date of the game. However, as I understand it the lack of detail of Greece in Attila's grand campaign map means it's a necessary evil to represent them as being part of it at the start date in 202 BC.

Otherwise I'm not sure why it's "Akaian", that's somewhat confusing... is it not the Achaean league?

Its not the first or the last of inaccurancies that i saw Akaian such a word does not exist .
Also one very bad thing that i saw the kingdom of Kush to have elephants and egyptian like units too much creativity there.

But seriously i do not know the limitation of the map

for example they could add sparta with having crete also this would gave a nice small war for the acheans apart with Aetolia and Macedonia.

The war wit Navis was the last great stand of Sparta do some research on it

[Willhelm123]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achaean_League

It's this you fools, we may add some Spartan units to the roster at a later date.

[Causeless]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achaean_League

It's this you fools, we may add some Spartan units to the roster at a later date.

I think that was obvious?

I'm merely wondering why it is named "Akaian" in-game instead of "Achaean".

[Visarion]

Because in English the would say a "ch frum chuck" ean I presume... they would slaughter the name...


Anyway...

General Mod Overview by HfromHellas... oh pardon me... I mean HforHellenes... ahmmm nooo how was it!???? Oh yesss.... HforHavooooccc!!!!

https://youtu.be/WoN0nfDRkEs

Achean League: Sicyon (original capital) Megalopolis (added by Philopeomen after he came from Crete with his mercenary units and conquered Sparta) Argos Sparta Athens Corinth Elis


Still Sparta was not fully pacified so could be added if the fans want it so much... but with a Macedonian look... even if they were stubborn and refused to fight as phalangites most of the time, dressing and fighting as traditional hoplites, when fighting as phalangites were superbly good, veterans and the best men reaching the front lines in any direction, not needing screening troops, a phalangites corps so versatile that was never caught offguard. It was thus less vulnerable to flank or rear attacks. And they did that fast too. So if they were guided by a powerful leader they could rise once more or choose the hoplite style yet again and sink in the unknown as it happened against Philopeomen who supported Megalopolis and it's Macedonian style trained troops. Megalopolis was backed by Macedon too in the past who also provided military techniques in exchange for a ambivalent support. Megalopolitans provided troops to the Macedonians for their aid constantly afterwards and Macedon used it's influence to conclude the peace diplomatically when it could and as many times as it had to. Sparta attacked Megalopolis and even burned their city to the ground that was rebuilt later with help from the Macedonians as a counterweight against Sparta. Some of the citizens of Megalopolis fled and resettled in Boetia while others joined the homeland of Alexander the Great. Sparta wanted to be the sole ruler of the Peloponnese and fought savagely against any contenter to their role of Hegemons, facing the Megalopolitans many times. Periokoi were unsatisfied by the fact that Helots were also trained as phalangites even if deployed in another corps and the fact that in the army were also received Metoikoi and they were loosing thus influence and properties. Their selfishness and arrogance was their doom. Spartans were simply too few and refused to accept the innovations of the era. They were reluctant to change. They never used the THUREOS shield like other Hellenistic factions did. While the other Greeks were reforming part of their PHALANGITES to fight as Thureophoroi and Thorakitai they barely accepted the PELTE shield required to fight in the phalanx formation and that after many disputes and assassination of the first who proposed a severe reform of the army. After Spartans finaly seemed to adopt the phalanx, instead of fighting in the new style when a battle arose, they appeared as hoplites on the battlefield. Only after decades of convincing them that the hoplites were obsolete Spartans finally accepted the change. Sparta was a anachronistic faction and the last representants of the Classical Age, the Age of the Hoplites, another ERA that refused to DIE. They and another city near Boetia that was certain they can face the Romans fighting as HOPLITES but luckily the Athenians intervened. Makes me think of the young French knights and Nicopolis of the Middle Ages. That arrogance! Even if the Spartan education and harsh reforms and elite military training were reintroduced it was too few, too late. The fact that Spartan laws gave no rights to come back to the Metoikoi, the exiled ones having great influence in the Hellenistic world often tried to take Sparta by force as was the case of Pyrrhus of Epirus who used the call of a Spartan pretendent to the throne as a pretext to invade. Philopeomen simply replaced the Spartan law with the Achean one and cancelled their IDENTITY as Spartans and gave them a new identity, the identity of members of a League with rights and obligations similar to every other citizen of Peloponnese and Attica, a sort of democracy, where citizens were equal. That cancelled the self imposed superiority of the Spartans. The system did not work as the members expected though and the Union had to use mercenaries to defend their territory and even so, failed to give aid against the Aetolians to the remote Akarnanians and Eleians who started rebuilding their old armies and hired mercenaries only for them and their home cities. For this reason the Corinthians too started building a innovative army on their own that will prove vital against the Roman invasion and only their lack of cavalry will not permit them to face the invaders and drive them out of the country.

Niki i Thanatos!
I Tan i Epi Tas!!

Fortis Cadere Cedere Non Potest!


Ek Tis Koneos Mou Anagenomai!!

If the team decides to add Sparta of Navis they could be presented as a reformed faction of freed slaves, new citizens and tiranical measures of the self imposed lider. The army should be comprised of Slaves, Freed Slaves and New Citizens of the Foreigners, people living outside Sparta and coming from various places without being granted citizenship in the past, Phalangites mostly as the reluctant nobles were exiled and their wealth confiscated, their lands given to their former slaves, now equal citizens. The former slaves also received the estates, house and wife of the exiled ones. The measures were drastic and it was trully a all or nothing, come home with this shield or upon it technique, in the spirit of the old Spartans I presume.

No thureophoroi, no thorakitai, no classical hoplite, no more, the stubborn supporters of the old age were tortured and sent in exile. That was the solution Nabis found but as assassins get assassined you can figure out the result of his tiranical ways.

Supporters willingly or by force:

Argos that in the past intervened for one of the cities of Crete involved in the Cretan Civil War alongside Sparta. For the other sided Athens, Pergamon

Messene

Elis even if it sided with the Aetolians and later even joined the Achaeans

Crete

Aetolia but they were his doom as they betrayed them for the Romans

Athens indeed was weak, their Epilektoi were a more ceremonial unit, they themselves using diplomacy instead of conflict and even intervened for others to the Romans, Boetians for instance. They could not save their former colony however, Corinth but later it was rebuilt and became even more important and wealthy than Sicyon

Indeed Sparta could be given to Aetolia at start but what is 10 years!? So it can be given to Achaia! By force if it must be done, the violent receives violence sais Philopeomen


Ok guys thats it... over and out

Metoikoi was used for both the foreigners who crowded outside the city, merchants, craftsmen and for the ones that lost their citizenship for debt or other illegal activities or not favoured by the townsfolk or if they were exiled. Correct me if I'm wrong please!

Still adding some specific reformed units of the local powers would suffice... or the former local powers I may add... Sparta Corinth Elis... but Sparta is Sparta and if even after 3000 years it still has so passionate supporters they did a terrific job...

I too want the 300 and the 400 of Elis... who sais they did not exist anymore? But who sais they did!?

Edited

I said that Aetolians later pillaged elis and arkadia but in fact it was patras and some other cities from their vecinity, part of Achea... my bad...

[Causeless]

Nice, great read!

Very informative.

Because in English the would say a "ch frum chuck" ean I presume... they would slaughter the name...

That makes sense.

If it's for a closer pronunciation it's a little inconsistent however. The culture is listed as "Makedonian" while the faction is listed as "Macedon" in the video, for example.

[Draewn]

For reference, as a random mostly-monolingual American English (mid-to-upper Hudson area) native, if you asked me to pronounce that word and I wasn't specifically trying to figure how it would sound in its point of origin, I'd read that "uh-CHAY-an", so I can definitely get behind amendments to the traditional transliterations to get people in the right ballpark.

[Petellius]

Personally I had assumed it was the greek and not latinised spelling. Also like I said on YouTube Havoc got the Sparta thing wrong, not us, we are aware of the history and tbf he's a guy who is just shows off our mod to help us out and he did that whole video without any help so he managed to do pretty good. Most YouTubers are far worse trust me, at least he doesnt assume Julius Caesar was the first emperor.

[Visarion]

I personally like about Havoc that he admits mistakes and constantly asks viwers to correct him and even thanks them in advance for doing that and as a moderator he's pretty good, he makes you feel that you are watching a documentary.

[hforhavoc]

HELLLo everybody, this IS Havoc

First off. I've already commented in the video comments but I wanna clarify it here.

Yes. I made a mistake. I wrongfully clumped factions into a league. I will admit it 100% and not try to excuse it. And the devs for the mod have clarified about the whole Achaean/Akaian League spelling thingy. That's on them not me

HOWEVER. Instead of going crazy, calling people retards, and causing unnecessary draaaama. Please just clarify it in the comments in a nice way. I don't claim to know everything about every faction. I'm not a linguist. I don't have PhDs and doctorates in history. I WILL get things wrong, I WILL say things wrong. So correct me in a constructive way. Show me the light and I WILL follow it. But don't be an ass, please.

That's all.

Oh and thanks for everyone's who's watched. I'm glad my video is putting some spotlight on the mod.

This is Havoc......and I'm outta here. PEACE

[hforhavoc]

AND P.S.

It appears that Creative Assembly also follows the Akaian spelling...just saying.

http://www.honga.net/totalwar/rome2/...=pel_akaian&i=

[Tenerife_Boy]

Well, enough for this thread, someone close it please.

[ABH2]

Just want to add that the AE team appreciates the work Havoc has done. His videos are helping to showcase things we haven't had the time to do ourselves. The criticisms people throw out there are over the top and ridiculous. There's a lot of content in this mod. A lot of things that get done and I don't mind explaining our interpretations of history or game decisions to anyone. But when you come in and are needlessly hostile, please, just stay away. These people are volunteers and it's more frustrating when the person in question doesn't really know what they are talking about.

And then I don't think people appreciate just how much work has to be done for an overhaul like this when it comes to units. How much research. And then how much detail work there is on top of it.

It appears that Creative Assembly also follows the Akaian spelling...just saying.

Yes, that is where the spelling came from. It was a copy and paste job. There are things within the text files that still need cleaning up and standardization so that we are using the same sort of naming conventions consistently.