Tech Tree

[Cyclone Jack]

I'm looking to heavily modify the Greenskins Tech Tree, since the trees are faction based and do not seem to have sub-faction capabilities. The plan is to shuffle the current tree down to 5 rows, then duplicate it for the Crooked Moon Goblins and have the second tree require the Crooked Moon Workshop. So the top tree would work for the Greenskins, and the bottom tree would work for the Goblins. However, when I try adding this in, both trees still require the Greenskin Workshop; even though I have modified both technologies and technology_required_building_levels_junctions to point to the Goblin building.

I'm thinking part of the issue may be with technology_category_modules. I'm not entirely sure how this table works. For example:

grn_mil.....12.....wh_main_bundle_dummy.....10
grn_mil......3.....wh_main_bundle_dummy......1
grn_mil......6.....wh_main_bundle_dummy......4
grn_mil......9.....wh_main_bundle_dummy......7

I'm not sure what the 2nd and 4th columns are for. The Stunties have two similar entries, but their numbers are smaller.

The other issue I have is once I add in the second tree and tie them to the Crooked Moon Workshop, the game crashes if I go into the Settlement screen. If I go into the Tech Tree, both trees are still pointing to the Greenskins Workshop, and both Tinker Crews are available to be researched, even though I have not build a Workshop. I have added entries to the following tables:

technology_node_sets
technology_category_modules
technologies
technology_nodes
start_pos_technologies
technology_node_links
technology_required_building_levels_junctions
unit_required_technology_junctions
effects
effect_bonus_value_ids_unit_sets
effect_bonus_value_basic_junction
technology_effects_junction

Anyone with advice who has messed with the Tech Trees would be highly appreciative.

[Cataph]

You can actually set the tech tree as faction-specific in tech_node_sets and build it in freedom after that. The only seriously buggy thing I have encountered is the tech_category thingy in that table, you'll have to fiddle with it if you see the tech tree mirrored or stuff like that (you'll know if it happens).

Or you can setup single faction-specific tech nodes, but that'd increase the turns required to research everything and I'm not sure it's good for those poor gobbos.

[Cyclone Jack]

Yeah, the problem is that I've been setting the Crooked Moon up as a sub-culture instead of a full-fledged culture, since I really didn't want to have to deal with everything else that entailed. But it looks like with the Tech Tree, I'm somewhat forced to make a new faction. I was hoping I could have two tech branches, similar to how the Dwarves and Counts are set up, but have the different branches attached to a different building.

[Cataph]

No no no, I don't think anything like that is necessary. Try tinkering more with the node_sets table, that alone should set you up.


Example of what I did for TEB. After much trial and error.

teb_tech	no culture	wh_main_sc_teb_teb	rom_roman_mil_top	255	182	47
emp_civ	wh_main_emp_empire	no subculture	rom_roman_mil_top	255	182	47

rom_roman_mil_top (technology_category) is important because any other combination would have mirrored the tech trees. Somehow. Dunno how, but it works for both so I'm fine with it. But I didn't even touch the category_modules table itself.

The worse that can happen is that you have to "rebuild" the original grn_test greenskin tree (or part of it), should be fine using the same nodes, and then setting it up in node_sets like the dwarf tech trees.

Hope that makes sense and that I didn't misunderstand something.

[Cyclone Jack]

You are a genius, and I am blind for not seeing that! That saved me quite a bit of work.

Yeah, I've got the duplication thing, but the Greenskins and Crooked Moon are different trees now. Once I get the dupe thing fixed, and re-arrange the Greenskins tree back to what it was before, and I can start on making a new tree for the Goblins.

[Cyclone Jack]

Everything is going great on the Tech Tree front, but there are four upgrades that I'd like to do, but I'm not sure if they are doable, as I don't see an entry for anything like this in campaign_bonus_value_ids_unit_sets:

Add or Increase Splash Damage - I'm guessing this isn't possible, as the only area increase I have seen is the morale radius given to lords and heroes.
Increase Poison Potency - I can see how to enable it, but not how to increase the debuff. Would I maybe use effect_bonus_value_special_ability_phase_record_junctions to add an add'l poison?
Increase Unit Cap - I can see an increase to Agent unit cat, but not sure if that will work with a regular unit cap. I have a special unit capped at 1, and was hoping to bump that to 2 via tech tree.
Add Cause Fear - I'd like to add the Fear attribute to a unit. I see this applied to a Banner, but not to a unit.

[Cataph]

Add or Increase Splash Damage - splash_attack_power_mod_add in effects bonus value ids etc etc.
Increase Poison Potency - what you can do is copy the poison contact effect (all of it, special ability and so on) and make a stronger one. Then maybe enable that one and disable the old one? That might get complicated but I think it can be done.
Increase Unit Cap - definitely works, I'm using that a lot. Works from buildings anyway, should work with techs too.
Add Cause Fear - the only problem is a scope one. I tried doing it with ImmunePsy from a tech and it ended up applying it either on characters or the entire army or that kind of stuff. Couldn't find a unit_set restriction for that.

[Cyclone Jack]

I'm trying to get a Tech upgrade to increase the Unit Size of some infantry troops. Here is what I have:

effects
wh_main_effect_gob_tech_unit_size - general_ability.png - Unit size: %+n% increased Infantry unit size - 101 - general_ability.png - battle - TRUE

effect_bonus_value_ids_unit_sets
wh_main_effect_gob_tech_unit_size - melee_attack_mod - gob_infantry_goblin

technology_effects_junction
tech_gob_main_2_4 - wh_main_effect_gob_tech_unit_size - 15 - faction_to_force_own_unseen

unit_sets
gob_infantry_goblin

unit_set_to_unit_junctions
gob_infantry_goblin - wh_main_gob_inf_goblin_spearmen - - - - FALSE

There is one other effect that seems to increase unit size: wh_main_effect_battle_creatures_of_the_night_unit_size. However, that seems to be a Skill that is applied via general_to_force_own. One researched, unit size is not increased either in the campaign unit cards or in battle.

Any assistance would be welcome. Thanks!

EDIT: I'm guessing it is the melee_attack_mod entry in effect_bonus_value_ids_unit_sets, since unit size technically is not a melee stat. I'm just using that because that is what was used by wh_main_effect_battle_creatures_of_the_night_unit_size.

EDIT 2: Dyslexia strikes again! The effect is not on wh_main_effect_battle_creatures_of_the_night_unit_size, but on wh_main_effect_character_mod_unit_size, which is a bodyguard thing from campaign_bonus_value_ids_basic, which is something for Grimgor's Immotulz. Its looking like unit size isn't something to be adjusted via tech tree, from what I can tell.

[Cataph]

I think the size effect is a leftover from previous attempts at making the immortulz. Since they are now a simple starpossed banner, that stuff is not in use anymore. My bet is that that stuff doesn't really work.
Everything that can work on a particular unit (and thus unit_set) is shown in that value id blahblah table. If size isn't in there or in the related enum table, and from what I remember it's not, chances are you can't do that. Just like you can't add a unit attribute to a particular set of units.

[Larynja]

As Cataph said, there is no bonus value id for unit size. In general if you want to mod an effect, ignore it's name. What it does is only depending on the bonus value. So bonus value melee_attack_mod gives more melee attack.
However there is a workaround that you can use. You could make a copy of your unit with a bigger unit size and make it available through a unit upgrade linked to a technology. The file is: technology_unit_upgrades. It is not used for Warhammer atm, but it should work regardless, I guess.

Just like you can't add a unit attribute to a particular set of units.

I don't quite understand what you mean by that. Sure you can add attributes to which ever units you want.

[Cyclone Jack]

However there is a workaround that you can use. You could make a copy of your unit with a bigger unit size and make it available through a unit upgrade linked to a technology. The file is: technology_unit_upgrades. It is not used for Warhammer atm, but it should work regardless, I guess.

Hmm, I'll have to look into this tonight.

[Cataph]

The technology unit reform shouldn't work yet because there's no button to activate it. The table itself works but AFAIK you have no means to actually use it in-game.

About the attributes: I meant as a technology/lord effect. As far as I know after a few tests, it's characters, entire army or nothing, basically limited by the effect scope, not by a unit_set. I'd love to be proved mistaken though, because it'd be a cool thing to know.

[Cyclone Jack]

With The King and the Warlord I had to redesign a large portion of my mod. I'm almost back up to where I was, with a few additions. However, I'm having an odd issue with the Tech Tree. I have created a new building chain, disabled the default one for Crooked Moon, and added a new entry in technology_node_sets. The tree looks fine, but whenever I open a settlement, or attempt to hover over the Military Support list when adding a new building, the game crashes. I also set the start_pos_technologies to the starting node(s).

In testing, this seems to happen due to the added node set. If I leave it the default, the buildings load. Once I add it, the game crashes. I have even tried it with a single node. If I keep the node set and remove the workshop and squig superchains from the slot template for that settlement, then there are no issues. The only thing I can think of is that the squig building has a unit with a tech requirement, which is why that building is also having issues. The game also has issues if I add in a new building chain and disable the default chain, and I'm not sure why that is causing an issue.

The only difference between now and before the DLC, is that I was using the subculture in the technology_node_sets, and now I am using the faction. I'm guessing there is a small detail I am missing somewhere when it comes to adding a new node set for a faction?

[Cyclone Jack]

I figured it out. It was unit_required_technology_junctions. Previously, I had duplicated all of the units so I didn't affect anything Greenskins related. This time I kept the original units and just added my new units and modified the originals where needed. As such, the original units were pointing to a technology set that was not assigned to that faction. To test it, I just deleted the units from the unit_required_technology_junctions table. Now I get to figure out how to add them back in while not crashing the game, and preferably without duplicating the units.

EDIT: This was easier than I would had thought. You just add your new technology_nodes and have them point to the original technologies.