Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

[PointOfViewGun]

basics, if I claim "basics claimed X in this thread" how do you suppose I can prove that?

[Sint]

Misconception #6: Punishment for Apostasy in Islam is death
When it comes to an apostate in Islam, the Qur’an Sura 2:256 is very clear which states that “there is to be no coercion in matters of religion .The Qur'an makes no mention of Forcefully Converting or Reconverting anyone, on the contrary it says:
"Say, "This is the truth from your Lord": Let him who will, believe, and let him who will, reject it" (18:28)

Liar:Quran (4:89) - "They wish that you should reject faith as they reject faith, and then you would be equal; therefore take not to yourselves friends of them, until they emigrate in the way of God; then, if they turn their backs, take them, and slay them wherever you find them; take not to yourselves any one of them as friend or helper."
Quran (9:11-12) - "But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-due, then are they your brethren in religion. We detail Our revelations for a people who have knowledge. And if they break their pledges after their treaty (hath been made with you) and assail your religion, then fight the heads of disbelief - Lo! they have no binding oaths - in order that they may desist."

Misconception #9: Sharia Law is archaic and cruel
Sharia law or Islamic law is about protecting the innocent and upholding Islamic values. This includes prayer, charity and fasting (to remember those in the world who don’t have enough to eat) during the holy month of Ramadan. Sharia Law is not about extreme punishments for minor offenses. Where the confusion lies is that the penalties for offenses during the early Islamic period (during Muhammad’s life and sooner thereafter) seemed cruel however the Islamic laws of this period were leaps and bounds above pre-Islamic Arabia. Pre-Islamic Arabia was tribal and vindictive. There were no formal laws or rules. The tribes were male dominated. Women, with a few rare exceptions, had no rights and were viewed as sex objects only. For the smallest reasons, young girls were buried alive. There were no formal governments whatsoever. Flogging for minor offenses in the early Islamic period might seem harsh but in pre-Islamic Arabia, certain death would come as a consequence. In modern times, extremists believe applying the early archaic Islamic laws are appropriate however humanity has significantly advanced through education in the modern era. We have gained a greater understanding of mental illness, And, most importantly, we have reached a greater comprehension in the use of contemporary rehabilitation protocols and therefore have gained a higher success rate. In short, there is no need for such harsh punishments to rehabilitate a person.

And yet the sharia is still archaic and brutal and does still demand harsh punishments....

Just for fun:

[Cyrene]

Liar:Quran (4:89) - "They wish that you should reject faith as they reject faith, and then you would be equal; therefore take not to yourselves friends of them, until they emigrate in the way of God; then, if they turn their backs, take them, and slay them wherever you find them; take not to yourselves any one of them as friend or helper."

And..that serves you how exactly? if your enemies keep raiding your lands and breaking your treaties you have to fight them, perhaps you have an alternative approach?

one has to understand something before using it, you clearly failed to do this, quoting a verse that demanded Emigration to a city (Medina) as "proof" for forced conversion and killing apostates.

Quran (9:11-12) - "But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-due, then are they your brethren in religion. We detail Our revelations for a people who have knowledge. And if they break their pledges after their treaty (hath been made with you) and assail your religion, then fight the heads of disbelief - Lo! they have no binding oaths - in order that they may desist."

thank you for proving my point, so you do agree after all, that the way to deal with those who constantly break treaties is fighting them.

and to further prove my point, this is what comes after what you quoted, which funnily enough you left out:

"Will ye not fight people who violated their oaths, plotted to expel the Messenger, and took the aggressive by being the first to assault you? Do ye fear them? Nay, it is Allah Whom ye should more justly fear, if ye believe!" (9:13)

now, i still don't understand why one would put himself in such situations, is your knowledge on this matter that simple? why bother then?

[THE HIGHLANDER]

woo hooo, i got a bit of an answer,, thank goodness, i will doff my cap dear basics, something is better than nothing as they say,
dont believe you though when you say you would kill for your country but not for your god, but suppose that is only my opinion, ps is killing not a sin ?
and the muslim killing a muslim is hardly new now is it, bit like them protestant christians in the 17th century america burning them poor women, allegedly witches, no catholics there to my knowledge?
anyway my point was he was killed for saying he was a prophet,and muhammed was not the last prophet, nothing to do with who was on his xmas list,
more of a shrewd business man i would say with the xmas card thing,or maybe the majority of his customers were christains per chance ,or maybe he was just a decent human being doing something that would make other people happy and make them realise that not all muslims are homicidal maniacs, i have personally had lots of gifts from muslims but never a xmas card, me likes that have jewish friends too but never a xmas card
what you cant seem to understand is i regard all religions as the same ,muslim, jew, christian, there is no difference really, apart for who you support for the top job, which seems strange as you all worship the same god

anyway something has always bothered me about your man jesus, being a god or a god after he died or when he arose or whatever ,
you would say he new he was going to be sacrificed for your sins, he new what was waiting for him on that fateful terrible day, well for him anyway, poor soul, he new this all his days on earth 33 years give or take and im sure he prepared himself as best as one demigod could in that situation, does not bear thinking about poor man,

anyway why did he not have his own tomb ? he is god after all, thats not a big ask for universe builders now is it,
he knew he was going to need one did he not, why commandeer someone else,s property, tomb,, at the last minutes or days,,
that is theft when you think about it logically, im sure the man who gave him his tomb albeit for 3 days or so, must have thought ,wait a minute your the son of god, you knew what was going to happen so why did you not get your own tomb?
this man jesus could raise the dead ,but is incapable of arranging some funeral details, like well in advance dohh
he sounds like a bit of a taker if you ask me,,all that time on earth and he did not have the foresight to sort his own tomb out,surely his father could have sorted him something out from above high,,
but no, he makes off with someone else,s property, thats theft in my book, which i do believe is a sin, in all religions,,?
and his ma mary , now i know god was the first fellow, so to speak, in there, whether it was a spirit or a member, she was still up the duff by god ie she must have had a swollen belly, yes, she did have a natural birth, did she not
she was betrothed to joseph before god got in there , although ill grant you she could have been a virgin ,joseph might have been a bit slow that way,, thats okay we all have our foibles,,lol
but was god not commiting a sin by having it off with her in some form or other, she was engaged,,was she not,which was as good as married in them days,
anyway bottom line is jesus nor yahweh, seem squeaky clean , which i was led to believe was quite important for a christian god ,,
please enlighten me ,, i wait with bated breath,, think of it like this i want to choose a religion, jewish, muslim or christian,, baptists for your sake
im torn between them all ,, jesus was a jew and by definition yahweh was a jew,, seeing they were his chosen people ,,and he did all kinds of bad stuff for them on a regular basis,he did not mind them commiting heinous crimes
matter of fact he encouraged it,, says so in your bible, old and new testament, anyway heres your chance go on, persuade me,,

[basics]

THE HIGHLANDER,

Well if one reads carefully what the second commandment says which I now give in part, " Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven images......" why? Because God knew how the mind of man works ever since the fall. He is quite capable of conjuring up almost anything in his mind's eye so the second commandment zeroes in on that. Ever since the fall man declared that he had the power of choice to believe whatever he wanted and so up until the flood the world was full of violence and ever since the violence has increased as the populations have increased. It was however after the flood that we find religions of all sorts and natures coming into fruition just as God said in his commandment and funnily enough all of them were based on the " seed " that God promised at the fall. That " seed " was and still is Jesus Christ and not as their minds saw it. So God had Moses write down how and why we came to be so that the tribes He chose would carry that message in time to all the world.

So, from before the worlds were made Jesus the Son of God was ordained to be the Lamb of God sacrificed before the foundations of the world. All the prophets showed what He would be like as well as what would happen to Him but man whether Jew or Gentile for the most had their own ideas on that, not what the prophets were saying. So, when the advent of His union came with the seed of Mary, her body had been prepared by the Holy Ghost to accept the union of God with her seed so that no stain of sin might percolate her reproductive system thus making sure that He would be sinless even from birth. It is called overshadowing in the Scriptures. Joseph was told of this in a dream and being a Godly man he accepted it. After Jesus' birth Mary and Joseph had other children who in time would come to reaslise who their brother actually was but not for some time later.

So, He came into the world as a humble and poor lad to work in His earthly father's business of carpentry yet even then He could amaze the religious leaders of the day by His understanding of what they had in writing in most cases better than them. They were all waiting for a military type after the manner of David with the expectation that He would throw out the Romans and bring back the Empire and many still do expect that even to this day yet not just the Romans but all Gentiles. The result was that this leadership connived to have Him killed because people were starting to believe on Him and they couldn't have that. Little did they see or know that Him dying at their hands was His destiny if sin was to be eradicated from off all them that He died for. And so it was that after three days in the grave He arose, was seen by hundreds and now sits at God's right hand only awaiting His return to bring all things to a conclusion. Therefore the choice is yours to either believe or disbelieve. There is no-one under heaven or earth that promises you eternal life for there is no-one alive or dead capable of keeping that promise but the Lord Jesus Christ.

[Creepcruncher]

So, what's the difference between ISIS destroying 'false idols' in Syria, and Muhammed destroying the 'false idols' in Mecca? Point #10 claims that Islam does not force people to become Muslim, meanwhile Muhammed smashed the non-Muslim idols?

I also take issue with point #3, regarding forcing females to have sex.

Quran 2:223 states: "Your wives are as a tilth upon you, so approach your tilth when or how ye will.." So basically do what you want with your wife. Open to interpretation, yes, and it essentially makes your wife a slave. Slavery is therefore acceptable?

Bukhari 72:715 details how a woman who has been beaten, and Aisha claims that "I have not seen any woman suffering as much as the believing women. Look, her skin is greener than her clothes!"

So, this woman has been beaten until she is covered in bruises.

Muhammed then forces her to go back to her husband, who is obviously abusing and beating her, as well as cheating on her with another wife. The man's wife has no rights, and is little more than a slave for him. A slave female with no rights.

Quran 4:24 and Quran 33:50 also details that a man can take sex slaves outside of marriage.

Tabari IX:113: "Allah permits you to shut them in separate rooms and beat them, but not severely. If they abstain, they have the right to food and clothing."

So, basically, if your wife doesn't want sex, you can punch her about as long as you don't cause permanent injury. You still have to feed her and give her clothes, however.. a rather small catch considering that beating her senseless because she didn't give consent is justified.

Again, your wife is reduced to a female slave with almost no rights aside from keeping her alive with the bare minimum.

Bukhari 62:81: "The stipulations most entitled to be abided by are those with which you are given the right to enjoy the (women's) private parts."

Again, an excuse to sexually assault your wife, even if she doesn't give consent, making her a slave.


I can get more if anyone wants.

[Cyrene]

So, what's the difference between ISIS destroying 'false idols' in Syria, and Muhammed destroying the 'false idols' in Mecca? Point #10 claims that Islam does not force people to become Muslim, meanwhile Muhammed smashed the non-Muslim idols?.

i'll tell you the difference, first of all, Muhammad did not destroy the idols of Mecca, but the idols inside the kaaba, why? for one, it symbolized the triumph of Medina over Mecca, in a sense that their gods could not protect themselves, and two, this was to show that the Kaaba was "returned" to a Monotheistic house of Worship, as it's building in the first place was attributed to Abraham and his son; certainly his problem was not with "false idols", as the same Pagans he fought with continued to practice their religion, even carrying their idols in the battlefield (to preform a ceremony ) shortly before the battle of Hunayn, which they were fighting alongside the muslims.

if you want to know the difference between the Early Muslim followers of Muhammad - whom ISIS claims to follow literally, then i will simply say: the Palace of Assurbanipal, the ancient sites in Nimrud, Nineveh, Palmyra and Mosul were under their control by 650 CE, why did they not destroy them? what is funny also is that one of the ISIS members promised to demolish the Kaaba because "it was worshipped alongside Allah" , while the muslims preformed the Hajj several times during Muhammad's life time but he neither demolished it nor threatened to do so; i could go on, there is clearly a difference, at least on this issue.

Quran 2:223 states: "Your wives are as a tilth upon you, so approach your tilth when or how ye will.." So basically do what you want with your wife. Open to interpretation, yes, and it essentially makes your wife a slave. Slavery is therefore acceptable?

actually you got that verse wrong, i've no clue where you found "when" because i certainly don't see it in my Arabic Quran, there is only one word used: "Anna" which means "from any direction", this was supposed to address the question of weather having sex with your wife in a certain position would result in a deformed baby, as was brought up by one of the pagans living in Medina, so the answer was no you could go with any position, this verse also insists on Foreplay as an important part of the relationship.

Bukhari 72:715 details how a woman who has been beaten, and Aisha claims that "I have not seen any woman suffering as much as the believing women. Look, her skin is greener than her clothes!"

So, this woman has been beaten until she is covered in bruises.

Muhammed then forces her to go back to her husband, who is obviously abusing and beating her, as well as cheating on her with another wife. The man's wife has no rights, and is little more than a slave for him. A slave female with no rights.

No, you missed the whole point, the Quran addressed this incident in 4:128, and the judgment was that he will no longer beat or oppress her. this is called the Rifa'ah Incident involving three converts from the Banu Qurayza, a man named Rifa'ah divorced his wife thrice (thus not being able to remarry her again until she marries another person) when she married another person and eventually had disputes with him, she accused him of being sterile, and threatened to take the issue to Muhammad, to which her husband violently beat her (being barren is a shameful thing to Men of Arabia) , then she went to Aisha (Muhammad's wife) and complained, when Muhammad summoned the two, her husband brought his two sons from his previous wife as proof that he could produce children, after inquiring Muhammad acknowledged them as the husband's sons, and allowed te wife to get back to her first husband on the condition that she has intercourse with her current husband.

however, what we base ourselves on regarding this incident and other subjects and what Muhammad thought was how someone should treat his wife, is what's in the Quran, the Hadiths are known to be be quite imaginative and/or unreliable.

Quran 4:24 and Quran 33:50 also details that a man can take sex slaves outside of marriage.

this is a biased statement to begin with but i'll move to the point, this is 4:24:

"Also prohibited are women already married, except those whom your right hands possess: Thus hath Allah ordained Prohibitions against you: Except for these, all others are lawful, provided ye seek them in marriage with gifts from your property,- desiring chastity, not lust, seeing that ye derive benefit from them, give them their dowers as prescribed; after a dower is prescribed, agree Mutually to vary it, there is no sin on you, and Allah is All-knowing, All-wise"

this basically goes against both your assumptions, if she agrees to marry then it's not "outside of marriage" , if she agrees to have intercourse it's not called Sex Slavery, it's at worst called Legal Prostitution.

and 33:50 :

"We have made lawful to thee thy wives to whom thou hast paid their dowers; and those whom thy right hand possesses out of what Allah bestowed on thee"

this doesn't prove your statement either, no mention of taking slaves at all, 47:4 does however address taking slaves, and it demands their release, either through ransom or not, thus taking slaves is not allowed, Slavery as a practice however predates Islam, and it has made a set of rules that would end slavery if they were ever followed, one might expect that to be as easy as outright abolition and then it's over, but see how Islam struggled with Intoxicants first, and then you'll get the idea.

Tabari IX:113: "Allah permits you to shut them in separate rooms and beat them, but not severely. If they abstain, they have the right to food and clothing."

So, basically, if your wife doesn't want sex, you can punch her about as long as you don't cause permanent injury. You still have to feed her and give her clothes, however.. a rather small catch considering that beating her senseless because she didn't give consent is justified

did you believe that if you quote Tabari then you're automatically correct?

Again, your wife is reduced to a female slave with almost no rights aside from keeping her alive with the bare minimum.

Bukhari 62:81: "The stipulations most entitled to be abided by are those with which you are given the right to enjoy the (women's) private parts."

Again, an excuse to sexually assault your wife, even if she doesn't give consent, making her a slave.

again you insert words in the original text, stop doing that, the original text of the hadith:

أَحَقُّ مَا أَوْفَيْتُمْ مِنَ الشُّرُوطِ أَنْ تُوفُوا بِهِ مَا اسْتَحْلَلْتُمْ بِهِ الْفُرُوجَ

"The stipulations most entitled to be abided by are those with which you are given the right to use each others' private parts"

It's the marriage contract, which gives a husband and wife that right, your attempt at making this somehow related to forcing a wife to have sex is frankly hilarious and pathetic.

I can get more if anyone wants.

well then you are free to do so, just make sure your statements have credibility and not fall flat on their faces.

[fd7s]

since you guys are all answering questions, why is my partner not allowed to marry me? (shes muslim) and why can she be killed for converting from islam?

[basics]

since you guys are all answering questions, why is my partner not allowed to marry me? (shes muslim) and why can she be killed for converting from islam?

fd7s,

That's two good questions that only a Muslim can answer. In the Old Testament Jews were told not to marry outside of their religion but as I understand it they were to be cast outside away from the tribes but not necessarily to be killed. If they wanted back in then they had to cast off their non Jewish partners. Islam is another kettle of fish because as always it goes to the extreme. Having said that I do have a friend who is Christian with a Muslim wife and that alone has affected his relationship with his family and church in that neither follow their own belief except privately. So far they have managed the situation.

[PointOfViewGun]

Setekh,

When the Shah ruled Iran woman could dress as they liked. How do they dress now? Watch Turkey as it becomes more Islamic because that's what's going to happen there. My best man's wife was the most beautiful woman I ever laid eyes on and she dressed just like any normal woman then. I dread to think of the pressure she is under now that Turkey is becoming fundamental. Oh and I forgot to say that my Iranian female friend also dressed as we do. It's funny that in the UK most if not all Muslim females are totally covered or will be soon if their menfolk get their way.

That doesn't address what I said in any way.

since you guys are all answering questions, why is my partner not allowed to marry me? (shes muslim) and why can she be killed for converting from islam?

Mostly cultural reasons. There is no punishment in Quran for apostasy, but over the centuries of mistrust and lack of self-confidence pushed people to adapt the position of "if you're not with us completely, you're against us." Quran similarly doesn't forbid marriage between Muslims and non-Muslims in general. Only marriage to pagans is forbidden, and that verse, if you put in context, is about a time when Muslims were fighting pagans. In practice, however, people allow Muslim men to marry non-Muslim women, but most wouldn't allow Muslim women to marry Muslim men. The reason for that is the centuries old acceptance of male dominance over the life of the kids. The opposite take is true for Judaism for example.

[squirel]

since you guys are all answering questions, why is my partner not allowed to marry me? (shes muslim) and why can she be killed for converting from islam?

Ask your partner why it matters If you are a muslim or not, since she already have a non marriage relationship with you?

It reminds me about all arabs who around but can't marry.

Skickat från min Nexus 6 via Tapatalk

[THE HIGHLANDER]

because they are nutters with their own agendas,, gods and religion is merely a tool for them to use to abuse and control others, love for another human being is as close as you will get too god on this here planet,
love will conquer all,eventually, i live in hope,,

ps dont be getting love and lust mixed up and you will be fine, no matter their creed or colour,
we are human beings first, long before we are muslims christians or jews for that matter
just remember that,, you are born a human being,, it really aint until sometime later, that you are indoctrinated into a specific religion whether it is 1 second after birth or 1 year after birth . etc etc etc
you are, and always will be, a human being first and foremost,, so go for it peeps you are only here once so make the most of it, and there is nothing stronger on this planet than the love for another human being,
if god of which ever flavour gave us these feelings for each other,, which man on earth has the right to try and take it away because of his religious dogma,,
they are men living their lives by the rules written down by stone age and iron age men,, no one in a modern world would take advice from a dinosaur now would they,,

religion is a barbaric state of mind, set up by savages to control other savages
love for another human being is inherent in us even before birth ,, while still in the womb,
religion is quite happy to use the grief and tragedy of losing a loved one to kill others and further its own agenda no matter their creed
but yet they wish you to have their permission to do the most natural thing to all human beings,, to love another no matter their creed
,, work it out bud is it your life or some stone age nutjobs life
love long and prosper
if worst comes to worst get out of that barbaric country

[fd7s]

thanks basics, setekh and highlander for the answers and clearing it up and btw highlander the barbaric country i live in is Australia :p

[basics]

Setekh,

You know perfectly well what the fundamentalists of Islam are trying to create and if it came about tomorrow then you'ld better photograph your women folk today because tomorrow you won't be seeing them anymore.

[PointOfViewGun]

Setekh,

You know perfectly well what the fundamentalists of Islam are trying to create and if it came about tomorrow then you'ld better photograph your women folk today because tomorrow you won't be seeing them anymore.

Again, doesn't address my posts the slightest. I wonder though. Why you insist on preaching hatred?

[Fardin]

Fardin,

You won't kill me but you'll insist on someone else doing it for you. Is that what you are saying? So, what is the original version of Christianity? What's artificial about having your sin taken away before you die since a sinner at death cannot enter heaven?

Here's something else you might have a stab at answering. Supposing a billion Muslims have died and are now in paradise with their virgins, does that mean that in Paradise there will now be 73 billion Muslims? Oh and you call Christianity where only a few in each generation get to heaven according to Jesus Christ just artificial?

No, I'll insist on the proof of the prophet being like what you said as Setekh is doing now so you'll find no way but deflecting in every subject, look at many other guys came and stated their opinions with some being copied invalid or misunderstood Hadiths or verses from the Anti-Islam websites and we've answered to them and if you look at your posts again you've not even done that so...

Why are you trying to mix up something irrelevant with your claims? You can simply say that you were wrong and you can apologize if you had the courage , insisting on the invalid arguments and claims is really shameful and pathetic. Don't take these as an offense, I'm telling you these as a brother to brother advice because I'm feeling that you have a small place for truth in your heart but you're ruining this opinion of mine about yourself with your illogical and deflecting posts.I've said this multiple time before: Don't let your previous knowledge forbid you from knowing more, Keep your mind open for everything.

No, All of the Muslims won't go to heaven, only a minority will go to the paradise directly as for all of the mankind.The dead must wait until the judgement day to go to paradise or not so there is no paradise now for any of the dead.

Jesus Christ is not artificial, One of the five main principles of Islam is to believe in the previous prophets and we know Jesus as one the five greatest prophets of all time.Jesus's teaching are distorted by the priests through the centuries and The Christianity in nowadays has significant differences with the firsthand religion of the Jesus, You asked what is the original version of Christianity, the answer is: it is Islam the most perfect religion for mankind,If you look fair to the Roman and Greek Gods and stories you can see quite obvious relationships between them and your beliefs, Jesus is just like the Hercules and became a god after a while but with the small difference that Jesus was a god's man and Hercules was a warrior,The Roman priests have changed it to earn the peoples and the kings acceptance towards Christianity so they created trinity.

[basics]

No, I'll insist on the proof of the prophet being like what you said as Setekh is doing now so you'll find no way but deflecting in every subject, look at many other guys came and stated their opinions with some being copied invalid or misunderstood Hadiths or verses from the Anti-Islam websites and we've answered to them and if you look at your posts again you've not even done that so...

Why are you trying to mix up something irrelevant with your claims? You can simply say that you were wrong and you can apologize if you had the courage , insisting on the invalid arguments and claims is really shameful and pathetic. Don't take these as an offense, I'm telling you these as a brother to brother advice because I'm feeling that you have a small place for truth in your heart but you're ruining this opinion of mine about yourself with your illogical and deflecting posts.I've said this multiple time before: Don't let your previous knowledge forbid you from knowing more, Keep your mind open for everything.

No, All of the Muslims won't go to heaven, only a minority will go to the paradise directly as for all of the mankind.The dead must wait until the judgement day to go to paradise or not so there is no paradise now for any of the dead.

Jesus Christ is not artificial, One of the five main principles of Islam is to believe in the previous prophets and we know Jesus as one the five greatest prophets of all time.Jesus's teaching are distorted by the priests through the centuries and The Christianity in nowadays has significant differences with the firsthand religion of the Jesus, You asked what is the original version of Christianity, the answer is: it is Islam the most perfect religion for mankind,If you look fair to the Roman and Greek Gods and stories you can see quite obvious relationships between them and your beliefs, Jesus is just like the Hercules and became a god after a while but with the small difference that Jesus was a god's man and Hercules was a warrior,The Roman priests have changed it to earn the peoples and the kings acceptance towards Christianity so they created trinity.

Fardin,

I'll keep this short. 82 disciples were sent out by Jesus to preach the kingdom of God, to forgive sin, to heal and to convert all in accordance with what had been written by the prophets and autheticated by God Himself at the fall of man in the garden of Eden. There is no contradiction in all of these writings, no not even after His crucifixion and rising from the dead as some of these men who knew Him and followed Him also did miraculous things after He went back into heaven to take up His place at the right hand of the Father. Every generation ever since has seen the conversion of peoples just on the basis of these wonderful events and will continue to see them right up until the eve of judgement day. There are no misconceptions there as you acknowledge to be about Islam.

[Fardin]

Fardin,

I'll keep this short. 82 disciples were sent out by Jesus to preach the kingdom of God, to forgive sin, to heal and to convert all in accordance with what had been written by the prophets and autheticated by God Himself at the fall of man in the garden of Eden. There is no contradiction in all of these writings, no not even after His crucifixion and rising from the dead as some of these men who knew Him and followed Him also did miraculous things after He went back into heaven to take up His place at the right hand of the Father. Every generation ever since has seen the conversion of peoples just on the basis of these wonderful events and will continue to see them right up until the eve of judgement day. There are no misconceptions there as you acknowledge to be about Islam.

You are limiting the God in your limited imaginations and thoughts with some scenarios like "Son of God" , "Father" and God begetting Jesus, As I said before the Adam had no father so he is the son of God too.
You think that the father is a retired god(maybe he is too old or creating the universe has exhausted him) and Jesus is a reserve god and the holy spirit is the busiest god so it is very obvious that this kind of beliefs is artificial, this explains why the most of the Europeans and Americans have became apostate and against religion,the most simple example is my brother DaVinci, he has only researched in Christianity as a monotheist and Abrahamic religion and he has opposed all of the religions because he has found this lack of philosophy and logic in Christianity but the bad part is he never approached Islam in the right way, if he would have done that maybe he had some different opinions about the religion and the god now but Alas!
Jesus was sent by God to guide the people to monotheism and the way of the lord but sadly his teaching turned like this, you are exactly repeating the words of the pagans but with the small difference that you think that Jesus is the son of god and they think that idols are the daughters of god, You all think that they share some power alongside the god but you are wrong and this is the part that makes Christianity and Paganism both vulnerable in the philosophical and logical approaches because you are reducing the god's position to a human's level so your core beliefs are fake and artificial.

[basics]

Fardin,

I fault you there immediately because God, Father, Son and Holy Spirit has no beginning or end. Jesus the Son of God created Adam from the contents of the soil so there is no comparison between the two. It is Islam that is limiting God by refusing to accept that Jesus Christ is its Creator by rejecting the very first words put into writing by God. " In the beginning Elohim, plural, created the heaven and the earth." " Let us make man in our image" the " us " and " our " being tossed aside why? The only person to want singularly to rule the world and be worshipped was/is Satan and that is what you want everyone as well as him, to believe. Now as for the Pagans, it was Mohammed who said that God had daughters in line with Pagan belief never Jesus Christ.

So, since the Father is a blinding Spirit upon Whom no man might look upon and live, Who was it that walked and talked with Adam in the garden, Who was it that walked and talked with Abraham, Who was it that wrestled with Jacob? That Person was not a son of God, but the Son of God, the Lord Jesus Christ, our Creator. Now how does a Muslim get mercy if his heart is set on that course, the course of believing Satan who knows exactly Who the Lord Jesus Christ is but doesn't want anyone else to know and be saved? How is his black heart changed to appease the wrath of God? Why was it during Jesus' ministry that the devils dwelling in humans knew Whom He was and yet you don't? Ask yourself why it is that even Muslims are being brought to Jesus through love and nothing else? His people don't live under sharia law and don't need to because love, His love conquers all. Think about it.

[Fardin]

Let's do a flash back because I want to smash your religion by your golden sentences and show you how a philosophical mind works.Read every sentence of mine very carefully.

I fault you there immediately because God, Father, Son and Holy Spirit has no beginning or end.

Firstly , Thank you for mentioning to this important point, as far as I know, a son has a beginning or in the other words he is younger than his father, so if the father has no beginning then his son has a beginning , every son has a beginning and every father also has a beginning, let me explain it more; The god you call father has begotten a son so it means the gods are all begotten from someone else(in the other words it is possible to be like this), you've attributed the god with begetting that is completely a human behavior or to be exact an animal behavior so you are bringing the god under a big question: Which kind of god needs to have a son? After all a god must be perfect so why does he even need to have a son or something like Holy spirit to share some power with them?

Jesus the Son of God created Adam from the contents of the soil so there is no comparison between the two.

Again another question to god, Why should he allow someone else to be a creator instead of himself? Maybe the Father is not able to do that or he wants his son to have some fun? If the god didn't create the Adam(or human kind) so he is not perfect and he is not a god so for the Jesus,He didn't create the universe so he is not a perfect god, we can only call him a half god, A half god doesn't seem perfect so he is not a god.

Now as for the Pagans, it was Mohammed who said that God had daughters in line with Pagan belief never Jesus Christ.

I'm still waiting for the Hadith, I won't allow you to accuse our prophet once more without any basic or proof.If you want me to continue this discussion you must bring that Hadith.It's very shameful to say something just on the air and leave it be, Choose your words carefully next time.

since the Father is a blinding Spirit upon Whom no man might look upon and live

Now you are saying no one is capable to look upon god and live, We have the same opinion in Islam, But if you look at this subject more you can see the Father has an attribute that the Jesus doesn't have that so Jesus is not a perfect and he is not a god.

Who was it that walked and talked with Adam in the garden,Who was it that walked and talked with Abraham

Another human behavior from a so-called god, Why does he need to walk and talk? He can be in every place without walking, he can say anything without talking,he can persuade anyone without doing anything.

Who was it that wrestled with Jacob?

Again another human behavior from a god, Why does he need to do wrestling with a petty creature? Why should he to bring his high character this low to wrestle with humans?
It's like a child who is playing with his toys, Do you worship a child?
I was a wrestler when I was a teenager and also I have many friends who were wrestler but I don't worship any of them and the more confusing thing is no body is worshiping me!

Think about it.

I did! I hope you'll do the same.

Well Saudi Arabia, Iran, Lybia, Iraq have enough oil money to feed and supply any terrorist outfit with munitions which greedy Western companies are only too willing to sell them,

OK, I accept, Then you are saying that your governments are very poor or we are richer than you?
The second thing you should notice to is: Iran is in sanction, So no western weapons from Iran, Libya is poorer than to be considered as a sponsor,also Iraq so it remains only between western countries and their beloved allies: SA , Qatar , UAE , Jordan and Israel.

but if they knew that these weapons would reach the terrorist perhaps they wouldn't. Of course that would be a very longshot which would only really discovered once the deal had been done and delivered.

If they look at the people who they are selling weapons to and the terrorists,They'll see many likenesses, for example SA; Same belief with the terrorists(Wahhabism), same look and faces, same treat of women, same wildness, same race, same punishments(cutting head and hands) and so on, It's not a long shot at all! Maybe they are blind or... What do you think?

You still haven't answered why all these conflicts by far are about Islam v the rest?

Just look at this! Who is talking about responding? Don't you think that you should give an answer to me about your previous assertions?
But even with considering all of these,I'll answer: First of all, your question is wrong,This is the way you want to see, Which conflicts? If you mean Syria and Iraq conflicts,it is like this: Iran,Russia, A petty man called Assad with a petty half country called Syria with some coward soldiers Vs Filthy Arab countries,USA,West,and some American/Israeli puppets called terrorists or ISIS.
And now about Afghanistan: Iran, Russia, A bunch of mercenaries called Taliban Vs USA , Nato, A bunch of mercenaries called also Taliban
About Africa: Some savage and hungry people with no culture and religion, Some opportunists who want to divide and loot like USA companies Vs Everything! Sudan is a very good example. The most interesting part is that the government of Nigeria attacks and does a massacre from Shias(not the Sunnies) and because the people who got killed were Muslim and specially Shia, No country including UN says nothing about this massacre.
Now Europe: Some American/Israeli puppets called terrorists or ISIS Vs Innocent people.

Now the most important part for you is that your governments with media want to erase their names from this conflicts and enter the name of Muslims and Islam instead of those mercenaries and terrorists, For what purpose? It's very simple; To entertain some people like you who know nothing of politics and like drama and action movies,

Western intelligence knows that Iran sponsors terrorism. America claims that it is the main sponsor of terrorism.

I offered you proofs and pictures about my claims,Can you do the same?

Concerning women when did God ever say that a woman had to be covered from head to foot so that no-one could see her? Indeed when did He ever say that they had to be circumcised or beaten at the hands of man?

Misconception #5: Hijab is Oppressive
To observe the hijab, Muslim Men and women are required to modestly cover their body with clothes that do not reveal their figure in front of non-closely related peopl. However, hijab is not just about outer appearances; it is also about noble speech, modesty, and dignified conduct.
Although there are many benefits of the hijab, the key reason Muslim women observe hijab is because it is a command from Allah (God), and He knows what is best for His creation.
The hijab empowers a woman by emphasising her inner spiritual beauty, rather than her superficial appearance. It gives women the freedom to be active members of society, while maintaining their modesty.
The hijab does not symbolize suppression, oppression or silence. Rather, it is a guard against degrading remarks, unwanted advances and unfair discrimination. So the next time you see a Muslim woman, know that she covers her physical appearance, not her mind or intellect.
It is the same case like nuns and monks, Islam does not reserve Modesty to Clerics only, but to all Muslims, Parents are required to teach their kids about Modesty, but they are not allowed to force them to do anything against their Will once they are mature.

When the god said circumcise the women? Where did you get this?
Also for beating,We are not allowed to oppress the women,Imam Ali said: "If the eyes of a woman cries over a man who oppressed her, the angels will curse him with every step he walks".

That's just three that I know personally and who don't have to waken up each day wondering what fault would be found in them. Oh, and just out of curiosity what does a Muslim women get to do in paradise assuming that some might get there. Do they just stand and watch as their menfolk take up all their time servicing their virgins?

Yeah!I know, It was so dramatic but I forgot the movie's name, Can you please remind me?

Women have their benefits too, God told us in Qur'an the men and women are equal so why should he differently reward them?

A law, any law, shows only that to whom it oversees, is not capable of staying within it and so if it is perfect why do Muslims need mercy to get into paradise? I mean Moses' law came from God and yet none but Jesus Christ could ever keep it but as He was/is our sacrifice, our mercy, through Him we get to heaven. So how does a Muslim get past Sharia to get into heaven since none can ever keep it, no not even all the imams in the history of the world.

lol!
You completely showed that you know nothing!
Sharia shows the true way of life, shows the way of mercy, shows the way of the paradise,We will be judged by Sharia and we will be rewarded or punished by Sharia,Imam Ali is the scale of Sharia because he lived by the Sharia so the other 11 Imams,We will be compared with Imam Ali, The closer we are to his attributes the better reward we will earn.

Here is another question: What do know about Imams? Who do you call Imam? You think they are just some clerics?
Did you study the link I sent you about Imam Ali?