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  1. #1

    Default Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    In the name of Allah the most Gracious the most Merciful

    Islam is one of the world’s largest religions yet it is also one of the most misunderstood. For various reasons – be they political, economic, biased media or fear of the “other” – mistruths and misconceptions have been spread about Islam. The key to understanding Islam and Muslims is to resist stereotypes and examine each situation according to Islamic teachings and authentic sources.

    Misconception #1: Allah is exclusively the God of Islam
    Allāh الله ‎is simply the Arabic word for “The God.” This is the God of Abraham. Christians and Jews speaking Arabic would say Allah for God. The God of Abraham Primarily includes Jews, Christians, and Muslims. The spiritual lineage for Jews and Christians comes under Isaac and for Muslims under Ismael. Both are the sons of Abraham. This is profoundly misunderstood by non-Muslims and Muslims alike.
    The Arabic word "Allah" , the Hebrew "Elohim" and Aramaic "Elaha\Alaha" are the respective renderings of the Semitic word for God.

    Misconception #2: Jihad is an offensive Holy War

    Jihad جهاد in Arabic does not mean “holy war" or even "war" .It means “to strive, to apply oneself, to struggle, to persevere.” Jihad can be personal or it can be a personal struggle of a Muslim to avoid sin or community of persons struggling against oppression. In essence, it means to become closer to God in lifestyle and community. This type of struggle (jihad) is to ensure that a peaceful and equitable community continues to exist. Defensive means are acceptable to safeguard the community however offensive aggression is strictly prohibited (see 2:190 and other verses of the Qur'an). The Arabic word for fighting is qital and harb means war. Jihad in any form is mentioned 28 times in the Qur’an and qital/harb (fighting/war) are mentioned 94 times in the Qur’an. Some sources claim jihad is mentioned as much as 164 times, but this is incorrect. Combining fighting, war, struggle and similar connotations may equate to 164 (in the Qur’an) but all of these are not representative of jihad. Extremist leaders and Islamophobes, each on opposite sides of the spectrum, have changed, edited or misinterpreted the Qur’an to suit their needs.

    Misconception #3: Slavery is acceptable and slave females have no rights

    Two Qualities Commandments in the Qur'an Silently abolish Slavery: 1) 47:4 of the Qur'an commands that Prisoners of War shall either be Ransomed or Released, this ensures there is no enslavement, 2)The Qur’an surah (90:13) states that those freeing a slave (whenever feasible) are blessed people in the eyes of God. Further, three Qur’an surahs (4:36), (9:60), (24:58) urge kindness to slaves. With regards to female slaves, it is quite clear: surah (4:24) states “and also prohibited to you are all married women except those your right hands possess. This is the decree of God upon you. And lawful to you are all others i.e. slave girls beyond these, provided that you seek them in marriage with gifts from your property, desiring chastity, not unlawful sexual intercourse. So for whatever you enjoy of marriage from them, give them their due compensation as an obligation. And there is no blame upon you for what you mutually agree to beyond the obligation.” Surah (24:33) states “make a contract with them if you know there is within them goodness and give them from the wealth of God which He has given you. And do not compel your slave girls to prostitution.” ISIS has changed and/or misinterpreted such verses to endorse rape.
    As a religious Muslim, I’ve read the Qur’an numerous times. Yet I have been studying in more detail the various interpretations of the verses containing whom your right hand possesses (slave girls). What I find is that prostitution is forbidden and there is no direct reference to allowing frivolous sexual relations (certainly not rape) with slave girls.

    Misconception
    #4: The Qur'an is Just another History or Poetry Book

    The Quran is the divine literal word of God Almighty, revealed to Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), through the angel Gabriel. It is a criterion for the truth, containing guidance for humanity to live by. The Quran cites lessons from preceding generations and the history of the Prophets in order that we may learn from their experiences. It further teaches us about ourselves and our Creator, as well as the purpose of our existence which is to acknowledge God, worshipping Him alone.
    God did not create humans to simply wander aimlessly. The test of one’s faith is in using one’s intellect, free will and reasoning abilities to contemplate and recognize God’s signs – one of the greatest signs being The Quran.
    The Quran contains within it many miracles, so that we can have no doubt about its authenticity. The best way to discover what the Quran is actually about, is to read it for yourself.(I'll send the miracles soon)

    Misconception #5:
    Hijab is Oppressive

    To observe the hijab, Muslim Men and women are required to modestly cover their body with clothes that do not reveal their figure in front of non-closely related peopl. However, hijab is not just about outer appearances; it is also about noble speech, modesty, and dignified conduct.
    Although there are many benefits of the hijab, the key reason Muslim women observe hijab is because it is a command from Allah (God), and He knows what is best for His creation.
    The hijab empowers a woman by emphasising her inner spiritual beauty, rather than her superficial appearance. It gives women the freedom to be active members of society, while maintaining their modesty.
    The hijab does not symbolize suppression, oppression or silence. Rather, it is a guard against degrading remarks, unwanted advances and unfair discrimination. So the next time you see a Muslim woman, know that she covers her physical appearance, not her mind or intellect.
    It is the same case like nuns and monks, Islam does not reserve Modesty to Clerics only, but to all Muslims, Parents are required to teach their kids about Modesty, but they are not allowed to force them to do anything against their Will once they are mature.

    Misconception #6: Punishment for Apostasy in Islam is death

    When it comes to an apostate in Islam, the Qur’an Sura 2:256 is very clear which states that “there is to be no coercion in matters of religion .The Qur'an makes no mention of Forcefully Converting or Reconverting anyone, on the contrary it says:
    "Say, "This is the truth from your Lord": Let him who will, believe, and let him who will, reject it" (18:28)

    Misconception #7: ISIS members are Muslims
    Isis members blatantly ignore the Qur’an, as an example, surah (49:13) says, “O Mankind. We created you from a single pair of a male and a female and made you into nations and tribes that you may know each other. Verily the most honored of you in the sight of God is the most righteous of you.” Islam mandates the collaboration with persons of different faiths, cultures and races. Yet Isis and other extremist groups take verses of the Qur’an out of context to allow killing innocent people. Ignoring the solid Quranic dictate in surah (5:32) which says, “If anyone kills an innocent person, it is as if he kills all mankind while if anyone saves a life it is as if he saves the lives of all mankind.” And surah (2:256) says “There shall be no compulsion in religion.” The leaders of Isis, with their warped agenda recruit young men who are desperate, improvised, and poor. They lack meaning and direction in life and have little or no knowledge of the religion that claim to represent. The leaders slightly change and/or deliberately misinterpret the verses in the Qur’an and pass this information off to the new unwary young members of Isis.
    An example of this are the Isis terrorists Yusuf Sarwar and Mohammed Ahmed, just before pleading guilty to terrorism, they bought ‘Islam for Dummies’ on Amazon. Religious illiteracy, without a doubt plays a huge part in extremism (not just Islam but in all major religions). An article from the statesman noted that, “far from being religious zealots, a large number of those involved in terrorism do not practice their faith regularly. Many lack religious literacy and could be regarded as religious novices.” Further, the analysts concluded that “a well-established religious identity actually protects against violent radicalization.”

    Misconception #8:
    Jesus is not present in Islam

    Jesus is a revered prophet and messiah in Islam. The Islamic tradition believes Jesus will return as messiah and defeat the anti-Christ. This eschatological view is similar in Christianity. Muslims also believe in the resurrection (not exactly) as do Christians with the difference being that Jesus did not die on the cross. Unlike Christians, Muslims do not however believe Jesus is divine and son of God.

    Misconception #9: Sharia Law is archaic and cruel

    Sharia law or Islamic law is about protecting the innocent and upholding Islamic values. This includes prayer, charity and fasting (to remember those in the world who don’t have enough to eat) during the holy month of Ramadan. Sharia Law is not about extreme punishments for minor offenses. Where the confusion lies is that the penalties for offenses during the early Islamic period (during Muhammad’s life and sooner thereafter) seemed cruel however the Islamic laws of this period were leaps and bounds above pre-Islamic Arabia. Pre-Islamic Arabia was tribal and vindictive. There were no formal laws or rules. The tribes were male dominated. Women, with a few rare exceptions, had no rights and were viewed as sex objects only. For the smallest reasons, young girls were buried alive. There were no formal governments whatsoever. Flogging for minor offenses in the early Islamic period might seem harsh but in pre-Islamic Arabia, certain death would come as a consequence. In modern times, extremists believe applying the early archaic Islamic laws are appropriate however humanity has significantly advanced through education in the modern era. We have gained a greater understanding of mental illness, And, most importantly, we have reached a greater comprehension in the use of contemporary rehabilitation protocols and therefore have gained a higher success rate. In short, there is no need for such harsh punishments to rehabilitate a person.

    Misconception #10: Islam Forces People to Become Muslim

    God says, “Let there be no compulsion in religion. Truth has been made clear from error.” Quran 2:256
    Although it is a duty on Muslims to convey and share the beautiful message of Islam to others, no one can be compelled to accept Islam. To accept Islam, a person must sincerely and voluntarily believe and obey God, so, by definition, no one can (or should) be forced to accept Islam.
    Consider the following:

    • Indonesia has the largest Muslim population yet no battles were fought to bring Islam there. It has spread there mainly through Trade.
    • There are around 14 million Arab Coptic Christians that have been living in the heart of Arab World (Arabian region) for generations.
    • Although fighting oppression and promoting justice are valid reasons for waging jihad, forcing people to accept Islam is not one of them.


    • Muslims ruled Spain for around 800 years yet never coerced people to convert or Egypt became a Muslim Majority in the 14th Century while it has been under Islamic rule since the 7th Century


    Misconception #11:
    Islam Permits Forced Marriages

    Arranged marriages are cultural practices which are predominant in certain countries throughout the world. Although not restricted to Muslims, forced marriages have become incorrectly associated with Islam.
    In Islam, both males and females have the right to choose or reject their potential spouse, and a marriage is considered null and void if a woman’s genuine approval is not granted prior to the marriage.



    Based on Paul F.McNamara 's text. Changes , rewrites and additions by Cyrene , bigdaddy1204 and me .
    Special thanks to my dear brothers Abdülmecid and Zarmehr for guidance and advices.
    Thanks to the author of Islamic pamphlets.
    More misconceptions (this one depends on you) and answers will be added soon…


    Conclusion:
    "Now, I would like you to ask yourself why the old policy of spreading “phobia” and hatred has targeted Islam and Muslims with an unprecedented intensity. Why does the power structure in the world want Islamic thought to be marginalized and remain latent? What concepts and values in Islam disturb the programs of the super powers and what interests are safeguarded in the shadow of distorting the image of Islam? Hence, my first request is: Study and research the incentives behind this widespread tarnishing of the image of Islam.
    My second request is that in reaction to the flood of prejudgments and disinformation campaigns, try to gain a direct and firsthand knowledge of this religion. The right logic requires that you understand the nature and essence of what they are frightening you about and want you to keep away from.
    I don’t insist that you accept my reading or any other reading of Islam. What I want to say is: Don’t allow this dynamic and effective reality in today’s world to be introduced to you through resentments and prejudices. Don’t allow them to hypocritically introduce their own recruited terrorists as representatives of Islam.
    Receive knowledge of Islam from its primary and original sources. Gain information about Islam through the Qur’an and the life of its great Prophet. I would like to ask you whether you have directly read the Qur’an of the Muslims. Have you studied the teachings of the Prophet of Islam and his humane, ethical doctrines? Have you ever received the message of Islam from any sources other than the media?
    Have you ever asked yourself how and on the basis of which values has Islam established the greatest scientific and intellectual civilization of the world and raised the most distinguished scientists and intellectuals throughout several centuries?
    I would like you not to allow the derogatory and offensive image-buildings to create an emotional gulf between you and the reality, taking away the possibility of an impartial judgment from you. Today, the communication media have removed the geographical borders. Hence, don’t allow them to besiege you within fabricated and mental borders.
    Although no one can individually fill the created gaps, each one of you can construct a bridge of thought and fairness over the gaps to illuminate yourself and your surrounding environment. While this preplanned challenge between Islam and you, the youth, is undesirable, it can raise new questions in your curious and inquiring minds. Attempts to find answers to these questions will provide you with an appropriate opportunity to discover new truths.

    Therefore, don’t miss the opportunity to gain proper, correct and unbiased understanding of Islam so that hopefully, due to your sense of responsibility toward the truth, future generations would write the history of this current interaction between Islam and the West with a clearer conscience and lesser resentment." some parts of Seyyed Ali Khamenei's letter to the youth of the west (with some edits by me).



    If you had any question about Islam or its branches (Shia , Sunni or …) and Islamic politics, We'll answer gladly.

    Last edited by Fardin; July 29, 2016 at 04:46 AM.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    There is a religion forum...

  3. #3
    DaVinci's Avatar TW Modder 2005-2016
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    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    Quote Originally Posted by Roboute Guilliman View Post
    There is a religion forum...
    The theme is highly political, thus well placed here.

    ---

    To the OP and theme:

    I'm personally everything else than a fan of religious belief, as i find a lot in it very problematic. No one can convince me of any kind of religion. And yes, i investigated a lot of different religions.
    Islam is a cultural development locally justified at the time as it came up, and there it was even a kind of progress to the older religions - that's my short answer to it.
    And if still today held up as belief and life guide for people, then it needs a lot of modernisation provided by the muslims themselves, this the more due to the just existing globalisation.
    And one tipp still to proper muslim people, just my opinion: Publicly distance yourself from any kind of religious extremism and fundamentalism or the pieceful will and goal will fail. Get away with all existing medieval traditions that are contained and make it a big voice of love, piece and freedom, publicly. Demand this from your Imans and ban every fundamental Imams.

    What deserves a high degree of respect and attention though, by all means, is the trial of spanning bridges between different folks and cultures, so thanks for this thread.
    Last edited by DaVinci; July 28, 2016 at 10:08 PM.
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    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    Does Islam require obedience to its laws in preference to the laws (for example) of Spain? That is to say, if a Muslim living in Spain is faced with a situation where Spanish law and Islamic law dictate he do different things, which should he or she do?
    Jatte lambastes Calico Rat

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    Cyrene's Avatar Vicarius
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    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    Islamic law is only implemented in an Islamic country, if you are referring to commandments on the individual level like fasting etc, then i don't see how these could clash with state laws.

    but in general, Muslims are expected to fulfill and uphold treaties/deals/pacts made between themselves and non-muslims (be that on state level or individual) , if a muslim is a citizen of spain, he is under a treaty made between himself and the state, he is to either live in it and uphold it's laws or immigrate to another country where he/she has no issues.

    historically, the Islamic Politico-Geographic division of the world was that places where muslims are allowed to live freely were classified as Diyar al-Amn (Lands of Safety) however, places where a muslim will find it difficult to live were called Diyar al-Kufr (Lands of Disbelief) or even Diyar al-Harb (Lands of War, which meant that Islamic relations with this land were automatically Hostile and therefore travelling to them was not allowed)
    Last edited by Cyrene; July 28, 2016 at 09:39 PM.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    Dear brother Davinci
    I can persuade you there is a God and Islam is from him but not in this forum and not by chatting like this, you should feel the atmosphere and feel the Islam with your heart.
    Islam is the religion of peace and clement, you should remember Islam is Islam whether a Muslim is extremist or moderate, If we put Islamic obligations away then we are not Muslim anymore just like those terrorists.Love and peace are the basis of Islam.
    If you really want to know how a real Muslim rules or acts then you should study Imam Ali's letter to the provincial(Egypt's) governor,Malik Ashtar.You should notice that Imam Ali was a doer man not only a good talking person(unlike western governors), We discovered real Islam in his actions and words , He is the walking Qur'an.
    And then tell me you still believe we must put him away?

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    In the name of Allah the clement the merciful
    Be it known to you, O, Malik, that I am sending you as Governor to a country which in the past has experienced both just and unjust rule. Men will scrutinize your actions with a searching eye, even as you used to scrutinize the actions of those before you, and speak of you even as you did speak of them. The fact is that the public speak well of only those who do good. It is they who furnish the proof of your actions. Hence the richest treasure that you may covet would be the treasure of good deeds. Keep your desires under control and deny yourself that which you have been prohibited from, for, by such abstinence alone, you will be able to distinguish between what is good to them and what is not.
    Develop in your heart the feeling of love for your people and let it be the source of kindliness and blessing to them. Do not behave with them like a barbarian, and do not appropriate to yourself that which belongs to them.
    Remember that the citizens of the state are of two categories. They are either your brethren in religion or your brethren in kind. They are subject to infirmities and liable to commit mistakes. Some indeed do commit mistakes. But forgive them even as you would like God to forgive you. Bear in mind that you are placed over them, even as I am placed over you. And then there is God even above him who has given you the position of a Governor in order that you may look after those under you and to be sufficient unto them. And you will be judged by what you do for them.
    Do not set yourself against God, for neither do you possess the strength to shield yourself against His displeasure, nor can you place yourself outside the pale of His mercy and forgiveness. Do not feel sorry over any act of forgiveness, nor rejoice over any punishment that you may mete out to any one. Do not rouse yourself to anger, for no good will come out of it.
    Do not say: "I am your overlord and dictator, and that you should, therefore, bow to my commands", as that will corrupt your heart, weaken your faith in religion and create disorder in the state. Should you be elated by power, ever feel in your mind the slightest symptoms of pride and arrogance, then look at the power and majesty of the Divine governance of the Universe over which you have absolutely no control. It will restore the sense of balance to your wayward intelligence and give you the sense of calmness and affability. Beware! Never put yourself against the majesty and grandeur of God and never imitate His omnipotence; for God has brought low every rebel of God and every tyrant of man.
    Let your mind respect through your actions the rights of God and the rights of man, and likewise, persuade your companions and relations to do likewise. For, otherwise, you will be doing injustice to yourself and injustice to humanity. Thus both man and God will turn unto your enemies. There is no hearing anywhere for one who makes an enemy of God himself. He will be regarded as one at war with God until he feels contrition and seeks forgiveness. Nothing deprives man of divine blessings or excites divine wrath against him more easily than cruelty. Hence it is, that God listens to the voice of the oppressed and waylays the oppressor.
    The Common Man
    Maintain justice in administration and impose it on your own self and seek the consent of the people, for, the discontent of the masses sterilizes the contentment of the privileged few and the discontent of the few looses itself in the contentment of the many. Remember the privileged few will not rally round you in moments of difficulty: they will try to side-track justice, they will ask for more than what they deserve and will show no gratitude for favors done to them. They will feel restive in the face of trials and will offer no regret for their shortcomings. It is the common man who is the strength of the State and Religion. It is he who fights the enemy. So live in close contact with the masses and be mindful of their welfare.
    Keep at a distance him who peers into the weaknesses of others. After all, the masses are not free from weaknesses. It is the duty of the ruler to shield them. Do not bring to light that which is hidden, but try to remove those weaknesses which have been brought to light. God is watchful of everything that is hidden from you, and He alone will deal with it. To the best of your ability cover the weaknesses of the public, and God will cover the weaknesses in you which you are anxious to keep away from their eye. Unloose the tangle of mutual hatred between the public and the administration and remove all those causes which may give rise to strained relations between them. Protect yourself from every such act as may not be quite correct for you. Do not make haste in seeking confirmation of tale-telling, for, the tale-teller is a deceitful person appearing in the garb of a friend.
    The Counselors
    Never take counsel of a miser, for he will vitiate your magnanimity and frighten you of poverty. Do not take counsel of a coward also, for, he will cheat you of your resolves. Do not take counsel of the greedy too: for he will instill greed in you and turn you into a tyrant. Miserliness, cowardice and greed deprive man of his trust in God.
    The worst of counselors is he who has served as a counselor to unjust rulers and shared their crimes. So, never let men who have been companions of tyrants or shared their crimes be your counselors. You can get better men than these, men gifted with intelligence and foresight, but unpolluted by sin, men who have never aided a tyrant in his tyranny or a criminal in his crime. Such men will never be a burden on you. On the other hand, they will be a source of help and strength to you at all times. They will be friends to you and strangers to your enemies. Choose such men alone for companionship both in privacy and in the public. Even among these, show preference to them who have a habitual regard for truth however trying to you at times their truth may prove to be, and who offer you no encouragement in the display of tendencies which God does not like his friends to develop.
    Keep close to you the upright, and the God fearing, and make clear to them that they are never to flatter you and never to give you credit for any good that you may not have done: for, the tolerance of flattery and unhealthy praise stimulates pride in man makes him arrogant.
    Do not treat the good and the bad alike. That will deter the good from doing good, and encourage the bad in their bad pursuits. Recompense every one according one"s deserts. Remember that mutual trust and good will between the ruler and the ruled are bred only through benevolence, justice and service. So, cultivate good-will amongst the people; for their good-will alone will save you from troubles. Your benevolence to them will be repaid by their trust in you, and your ill-treatment by their ill-will.
    Do not disregard the noble traditions set by our forbearers which have promoted harmony and progress among the people; and do not initiate anything which might minimize their usefulness. The men who had established these noble traditions have had their reward; but responsibility will be yours if they are disturbed. Try always to learn something from the experience of the learned and the wise, and frequently consult them in state matters so that you might maintain the peace and good-will which your predecessors had established in the land.
    The Different Classes of People
    Remember that the people are composed of different classes. The progress of one is dependent on the progress of every other; and none can afford to be independent of the other. We have the Army formed of the soldiers of God, we have our civil officers and their establishments, our judiciary, our revenue collectors and our public relation officers. The general public itself consists of Muslims and Zimmis and among them of merchants and craftsmen, the unemployed and the indigent. God has prescribed for them their several rights, duties and obligations. They are all defined and preserved in the Book of God and in the traditions of his Prophet.
    The army, by the grace of God, is like a fortress to the people and lends dignity to the state. It upholds the prestige of the Faith and maintains the peace of the country. Without it the state cannot stand. In its turn, it cannot stand without the support of the state. Our soldiers have proved strong before the enemy because of the privilege God has given them to fight for Him; but they have their material needs to fulfil and have therefore to depend upon the income provided for them from the state revenue. The military and civil population who pay revenue, both need the co-operation of others -the judiciary, civil officers and their establishment. The Qazi administers civil and criminal law; the civil officers collect revenue and attend to civil administration with the assistance of their establishment. And then there are the tradesmen and the merchants who add to the revenue of the state. It is they who run the markets and are in a better position than others to discharge social obligations. And then there is the class of the poor and the needy, whose maintenance is an obligation on the other classes. God has given appropriate opportunity of service to one and all; and then there are the rights of all these classes over the administration which the administrator has to meet with an eye on the good of the entire population, a duty which he cannot fulfill properly unless he takes personal interest in its execution and seeks help from God. Indeed it is obligatory on him to impose this duty on himself and to bear with patience the inconveniences and difficulties incidental to his task.
    The Army
    Be particularly mindful of the welfare of those in the army who in your opinion, are staunchly faithful to their God and Prophet and loyal to their chief, and who in the hour of passion can restrain themselves and listen coolly to sensible remonstrance, and who can succor the weak and smite the strong, whom violent provocation will not throw into violent temper and who will not falter at any stage.
    Keep yourself in close contact with the families of established reputation and integrity with a glorious past, and draw to yourself men brave and upright in character, generous and benevolent in disposition; for such are the salt of society.
    Care for them with the tenderness with which you care for your children, and do not talk before them of any good that you might have done to them, nor disregard any expression of affection which they show in return; for, such conduct inspires loyalty, devotion and goodwill. Attend to every little of their wants not resting content with what general help that you might have given to them, for sometimes, timely attention to a little want of theirs brings them immense relief. Surely these people will not forget you in your own hour of need.
    It behooves you to select for your Commander-in-chief one who imposes on himself as a duty, the task of rendering help to his men, and who can excel in kindness every other officer who has to attend to the needs of the men under him, and look after their families when they are away from their homes; so much so, that the entire army should feel united in their joys and in their sorrows. The unity of purpose will give them added strength against the enemy. Continue to maintain a kindly attitude towards them so that they might feel attached to you. The fact is that the real happiness of the administrators and their most pleasant comfort lies in establishing justice in the state and maintaining affectionate relations with the people. Their sincerity of feeling is expressed in the love and regard they show to you, on which alone depends the safety of the administrators.
    Your advices to the army will be of no avail, unless and until you show affection to both men and officers, in order that they might not regard the Government as an oppressive burden or contribute to its downfall.
    Continue to satisfy their needs and praise them over and over again for what services they have rendered. Such an attitude, God willing will inspire the brave to braver actions and induce the timid to deeds of bravery.
    Try to enter into the feelings of others and do not foist the mistake of one over another and do not grudge dispensing appropriate rewards. See to it you do not show favors to one who has done nothing but merely counts on his family position; and do not withhold proper rewards from one who has done great deeds simply because he holds a low position in life.
    The Real Guidance
    Turn to God and to His prophet for guidance whenever you feel uncertain as to what you have to do. There is the commandment of God delivered to those people who He wishes to guide aright: "O people of the Faith! Obey God and obey His prophet and those from among you who hold authority over you. And refer to God and His prophet whenever there is difference of opinion among you. To turn to God is in reality to consult the Book of God; and to turn to the prophet is t follow his universally accepted traditions.
    Chief Judge
    Select for your chief judge one from the people who is by far the best among them -one who is not obsessed with domestic worries, one who cannot be intimidated, one who does not err to often, one who does not turn back from a right path once he finds it, one who is not self-centered or avaricious, one who will not decide before knowing full facts, one who will weigh wit care every attendant doubt and pronounce a clear verdict after taking everything into full consideration, one who will not grow restive over the arguments of advocates and who will examine with patience every new disclosure of fact and who will be strictly impartial in his decision, one who flattery cannot mislead or one who does not exult over his position. But it is not easy to find such men.
    Once you have selected the right man for the office, pay him handsomely enough, to let him live in comfort and in keeping with his position, enough to keep him above temptations. Give him a position in your court so high none can even dream of coveting it and so high that neither back-biting nor intrigue can touch him.
    Subordinate Judiciary
    Beware! The utmost carefulness is to be exercised in his selection: for it is this high office which adventurous self-seekers aspire to secure and exploit in their selfish interests. After the selection of your chief judge, give careful consideration to the selection of other officers. Confirm them in their appointments after approved apprenticeship and probation. Never select men for responsible posts either out of any regard for personal connections or under any influence, for, that might lead to injustice and corruption.
    Of these select for higher posts men of experience, men firm in faith and belonging to good families. Such men will not fall an easy prey to temptations and will discharge their duties with an eye on the abiding good of others. Increase their salaries to give them a contented life. A contented living is a help to self-purification. They will not feel the urge to tax the earnings of their subordinates for their own upkeep. They will then have no excuse either to go against your instructions or misappropriate state funds. Keep to watch over them without their knowledge, loyal and upright men. Perchance they may develop true honesty and true concern for the public welfare. But whenever any of them is accused of dishonesty and the guilt is confirmed by the report of your secret service, then regard this as a sufficient to convict him. Let the punishment be corporal and let that be dealt in the public at an appointed place of degradation.
    Revenue Administration
    Great care is to be exercised in revenue administration, to ensure the prosperity of those who pay the revenue to the state; for it is on their prosperity depends the prosperity of others, particularly the prosperity of the masses. Indeed, the state exists on its revenue. You should regard the proper upkeep of the land in cultivation as of greater importance than the collection of revenue, for revenue cannot be derived except by making the land productive. He who demands revenue without helping the cultivator to improve his land, inflicts unmerited hardship on the cultivator and ruins the State. The rule of such a person does not last long. If the cultivators ask for reduction of their land cess for having suffered from epidemics or drought or excess of rains or the barrenness of the soil or floods damaging to their barrenness of the soil or foods damaging to their crops, then, reduce the cess accordingly, so that their condition might improve. Do not mind the loss of revenue on that account for that will return to you one day manifold in the hour of greater prosperity of the land and enable you to improve the condition of your towns and to raise the prestige of your state. You will be the object of universal praise. The people will believe in your sense of justice. The confidence which they will place in you in consequence will prove your strength, as they will be found ready to share your burdens.
    You may settle down on the land any number of people, but discontent will overtake them if the land is not improved. The cause of the cultivator"s ruin is the rulers who are bent feverishly on accumulating wealth at all costs, out of the fear that their rule might not last long. Such are the people who do not learn from examples or precedents.
    Clerical Establishment
    Keep an eye on your establishment and your scribes; and select the best among them for your confidential correspondence such among these as possess high character and deserve your full confidence, men who may not exploit their privileged position to go against you and who may not grow neglectful of their duties and who in the drafting of treaties may not succumb to external temptation and harm your interests, or fail to render you proper assistance and to save you from trouble, and who in carrying out their duties can realize their serious responsibilities, for he who does not realize his own responsibilities can hardly appraise the reprehensibilities of others. Do not select men for such work merely on the strength of your first impressions of your affection or good faith; for as a matter of fact; the pretensions of a good many who are really devoid of honesty and good breeding may cheat even the intelligence of rulers. Selection should be made after due probation which should be the test of righteousness. In making direct appointments from people, see to it that those selected possess influence with the people and who enjoy the reputation of being honest; for such selection is agreeable to God and the ruler. For every department of administration, let there be a head, whom no trying task might cause worry and no pressure of work annoy.
    And remember that every weakness of any one among your establishment and scribe which you may overlook will be written down against you in your scroll of deeds.

    Trade and Industry
    Adopt useful schemes placed before those engaged in trade and industry and help them with wise counsels. Some of them live in towns, and some move from place to place with their wares and tools and earn their living by manual labor. Trade and Industry are sources of profit to the State. While the general public is not inclined to bear the strain, those engaged in these professions take the trouble to collect commodities from far and near, from land and from across the sea, and from mountains and forests and naturally derive benefits.
    It is this class of peace loving people from whom no disturbance need be feared. They love peace and order; indeed they are incapable of creating disorder. Visit every part of the country and establish personal contact with this class, and inquire into their condition. But bear in mind that a good many of them are intensely greedy and are inured to bad dealings. They hoard grain and try to sell it at a high price; and this is most harmful to the public. It is a blot on the name of the ruler not to fight this evil. Prevent them from hoarding; for the Prophet of God -Peace be upon him - had prohibited it. And see to it that trade is carried on with the utmost ease, that the scales are evenly held and that prices are so fixed that neither the seller nor the buyer is put to a loss. And if inspite of your warning, should anyone go against your commands and commit the crime of hoarding, then deal him appropriately with severe punishment.
    The Poor
    Beware! Fear God when dealing with the problem of the poor who have non to patronize, who are forlorn, indigent and helpless and are greatly torn in mind -victims of the vicissitudes of Time. Among them there are some who do not question their lot in life not withstanding their misery, do not go about abegging. For God"s sake, safeguard their rights; for on you rests the responsibility of protection. Assign for their uplift a portion of the state exchequer (Baitul-mal), wherever they may be, whether close at hand or far away from you. The rights of the two should be equal in your eye. Do not let any preoccupation slip them from your mind; for no excuse whatsoever for the disregard of their rights will be acceptable to God. Do not treat their interests as of less importance than your own, and never keep them outside the purview of your important considerations, and mark the persons who look down upon them and of whose conditions they keep you in ignorance.
    Select from among your officers such men as are meek and God fearing who can keep you properly informed of the condition of the poor. Make such provision for these poor people as shall not oblige you to offer an excuse before God on the Day of Judgment; for, it is this section of the people more than any other which deserves benevolent treatment. Seek your reward from God by giving to each of them what is due to him and enjoin on yourself as a sacred duty the task of meting the needs of such aged among them as have no independent means of livelihood and are averse to seek alms. And it is the discharge of this duty that usually proves very trying for ruler, but is very welcome to societies which are gifted with foresight. It is only such societies or nations who truly carry out with equanimity their covenant with God to discharge their duty to the poor.
    Open Conferences
    Meet the oppressed and the lowly periodically in an open conference and, conscious of the divine presence there, have a heart-to-heart talk with them, and let none from your armed guard or civil officers or members of the police or the Intelligence Department be by your side, so that the representatives of the poor might state their grievances fearlessly and without reserve. For I have the Prophet of God saying that no nation or society will occupy a high position in which the strong do not discharge their duty to the weak. Bear with composure any strong language which they may use, and do not get annoyed if they cannot state their case lucidly, even so, God will open you his door of blessings and rewards. Whatever you can give to them, give it ungrudgingly, and whatever you cannot afford to give, make that clear to them in utmost sincerity.
    There are certain things which call for prompt action. Accept the recommendations made by your officers for the redress of the grievances of the clerical staff. See to it that petitions or applications that are submitted for your consideration are brought to your notice the very day they are submitted, however much your officers might try to intercede them. Dispose off the day"s work that very day, for the coming day will bring with it its own tasks.
    Communion with God
    And do not forget to set apart the best of your time for communion with God, although every moment of yours is for Him only, provided it is spend sincerely in the service of your people. The special time that you give to prayer in the strict religious sense is to be devoted to the performances of the prescribed daily prayers. Keep yourself engaged in these prayers both in the day and in the night, and to gain perfect communion, do not as far as possible, let your prayers grow tiresome. And when you lead in congregational prayer, do not let your prayer be so lengthy as to cause discomfort to the congregation or raise in them the feeling of dislike for it or liquidate its effect: for in the congregation there may be invalids and also those who have to attend pressing affairs of their own.
    When I had asked of the Prophet of God on receiving an order to proceed to Yaman, how I should lead the people there in prayer, he said -perform your prayers even as the weakest among you would do; and set an example of consideration to the faithful.
    Aloofness not desirable
    Alongside of the observance of all that I have said above bear one thing in mind. Never for any length of time keep yourself aloof from the people, for to do so is to keep oneself ignorant of their affairs. It develops in the ruler a wrong perspective and renders him unable to distinguish between what is important and what is not, between right and wrong, and between truth and falsehood. The ruler is after all human; and he cannot form a correct view of anything which is out of sight. There is no distinctive sign attached to truth which may enable one to distinguish between the different varieties of truth and falsehood. The fact is that you must be one of two things. Either you are just or unjust. If you are just, then you will not keep yourself away from the people, but will listen to them and meet their requirements. On the other hand, it you are unjust, the people themselves will keep way from you. What virtue is there in your keeping aloof? At all events aloofness is not desirable especially when it is your duty to attend to the needs of the people. Complaints of oppression by your officers or petitions for justice should not prove irksome to you.
    Make this clear to yourself that those immediately about and around you will like to exploit their position to covet what belongs to others and commit acts of injustice. Suppress such a tendency in them. Make a rule of your conduct never to give even a small piece of land to any of your relations. That will prevent them from causing harm to the interests of others and save you from courting the disapprobation of God and Man.
    Deal justice squarely regardless of the fact whether one is a relation or not. If any of your relations or companions violates the law, mete out the punishment prescribed by law however painful it might be to you personally; for it will be all to the good of the State. If at any time people suspect, that you have been unjust to them in any respect disclose your mind to them and remove their suspicions. In this way, your mind will get attuned to the sense of justice and people will begin to love you. It will also fulfill your wish that you should enjoy their confidence.
    Peace and Treaties
    Bear in mind that you do not throw away the offer of peace which your enemy may himself make. Accept it, for, that will please God. Peace is a source of comfort to the army; it reduces your worries and promotes order in the State. But Beware! Be on your guard when the peace is signed; for, certain types of enemies propose terms of peace just to lull you into a sense of security only to attack you again when you are off your guard. So you should exercise the utmost vigilance on your part, and place no undue faith in their protestations. But, if under the peace treaty you have accepted any obligations, discharge those obligations scrupulously. It is a trust and must be faithfully upheld and whenever you have promised anything, keep it with all the strength that you command, for whatever differences of opinion might exist on other matters, there is nothing so noble as the fulfillment of a promise. This is recognized even among non-Muslims, for they know the dire consequences which follow from the breaking of covenants. So never make excuses in discharging your responsibilities and never break a promise, nor cheat your enemy. For, breach of promise is an act against God, and none except the positively wicked acts against God
    Indeed divine promises are a blessing spread over all mankind. The promise of God is a refuge sought after even by the most powerful on earth; for there is no risk of being cheated. So, do not make any promise from which you may afterwards offer excuses to retract; nor do you go back upon what you have confirmed to abide by; nor do you break it, however galling it may at first prove to be. For, it is far better to wait in patience for wholesome results to follow than to break it out of any apprehensions.
    Beware! Abstain from shedding blood without a valid cause. There is nothing more harmful than this which brings about one"s ruin. The blood that is willfully shed shortens the life of a state. On the Day of Judgment it is this crime for which one will have to answer first. So, beware! Do not wish to build the strength of your state on blood; for, it is this blood which ultimately weakens the state and passes it on to other hands. Before me and my God no excuse for willful killing can be entertained.
    Murder is a crime which is punishable by death. If on any accord the corporal punishment dealt by the state for any lesser crime results in the death of the guilty, let not the prestige of the stage stand in any way of the deceased relations claiming blood money.
    Last Instructions
    Do not make haste to do a thing before its time, nor put it off when the right moment arrives. Do not insist on doing a wrong thing, nor show slackness in rectifying a wrong thing. Perform everything in its proper time, and let everything occupy its proper place. When the people as a whole agree upon a thing, do not impose your own view on them and do not neglect to discharge the responsibility that rests on you in consequence. For, the eyes of the people will be on you and you are answerable for whatever you do to them. The slightest dereliction of duty will bring its own retribution. Keep your anger under control and keep your hands and tongue in check whenever you fall into anger, try to restrain yourself or else you will simply increase your worries.
    It is imperative on you to study carefully the principles which have inspired just and good rulers who have gone before you. Give close thought to the example of our prophet (peace be upon him), his traditions, and the commandments of the Book of God and whatever you might have assimilated from my own way of dealing with things. Endeavor to the best of your ability to carry out the instructions which I have given you here and which you have solemnly undertaken to follow. By means of this order, I enjoin on you not to succumb to the prompting of your own heart or to turn away from the discharge of duties entrusted to you.
    I seek the refuge of the might of the Almighty and of His limitless sphere of blessings, and invite you to pray with me that He may give us together the grace willingly to surrender our will to His will, and to enable us to acquit ourselves before Him and His creation; so that mankind might cherish our memory and our work survive. I seek of God the culmination of his blessings and pray that He may grant you and me His grace and the honor of martyrdom in His cause. Verily, we have to return to Him. I invoke His blessings on the Prophet of God and his pure progeny.

    Last edited by Fardin; July 29, 2016 at 03:20 PM.
    "A full heart has room for everything and an empty heart has room for nothing"
    Antonio Porchia

    Clearing up misconceptions about Islam
    Clearing up misconceptions about Iran


  7. #7

    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    Oh dear Mishkin
    My purpose is defending, not any offensive attack.can you find a single word that I've said we will start the war? You mean we don't have the right to defend ourselves?
    When someone is threatening me with war , I should hug him and say thank you for your kind words and peaceful thoughts?
    you should notice who started threatening,Me or your American friend? why you didn't say anything to him as a pacifist person.I am very doubtful your judging is neutral.


    Last edited by Fardin; July 29, 2016 at 02:52 PM.
    "A full heart has room for everything and an empty heart has room for nothing"
    Antonio Porchia

    Clearing up misconceptions about Islam
    Clearing up misconceptions about Iran


  8. #8
    mishkin's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    Quote Originally Posted by Fardin View Post
    you should notice who started threatening,
    You acknowledge to have threatened. Fine. You have positioned yourself as "a representative of Islam". Do you realize the responsibility that entails? Do you really want people to judge Islam based on your words and your actions?

    As far as I know (and I know almost nothing about islam) there are many interpretations or ways of seeing Islam within the Muslim community itself. Maybe you should note about what kind of Islam (dont say "the true islam", please) you are talking about.
    Last edited by mishkin; July 29, 2016 at 07:31 AM.

  9. #9
    Roma_Victrix's Avatar Call me Ishmael
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    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    Hi Fardin!

    Allow me to address some of your points that I think I can add to or elaborate further.

    Misconception #2: Jihad is an offensive Holy War
    Jihad جهاد in Arabic does not mean “holy war" or even "war" .It means “to strive, to apply oneself, to struggle, to persevere.” Jihad can be personal or it can be a personal struggle of a Muslim to avoid sin or community of persons struggling against oppression. In essence, it means to become closer to God in lifestyle and community. This type of struggle (jihad) is to ensure that a peaceful and equitable community continues to exist. Defensive means are acceptable to safeguard the community however offensive aggression is strictly prohibited (see 2:190 and other verses of the Qur'an). The Arabic word for fighting is qital and harb means war. Jihad in any form is mentioned 28 times in the Qur’an and qital/harb (fighting/war) are mentioned 94 times in the Qur’an. Some sources claim jihad is mentioned as much as 164 times, but this is incorrect. Combining fighting, war, struggle and similar connotations may equate to 164 (in the Qur’an) but all of these are not representative of jihad. Extremist leaders and Islamophobes, each on opposite sides of the spectrum, have changed, edited or misinterpreted the Qur’an to suit their needs.
    Our comfortable modern lifestyles have really dulled our understanding of the pre-modern world, which was a very violent and cut-throat one. That can be applied as much to Western Christendom as it can be to the Orthodox Christian, Islamic (Shia, Sunni, etc.), Hindu, Buddhist/Taoist regions of the world, to say nothing of the pre-Columbian warrior cultures of the Aztecs and Mayans in Central America. You're probably right about jihad in a historical context, since it could mean anything from warfare to missionary work or even helping the poor with alms (one of the pillars of Islam). However, the Islamic world still had a concept of holy war and expanding the Islamic world as an act that the divine creator Allah sanctioned and approved. Warriors and generals who fulfilled this militaristic role were granted the titles of ghazi (Arabic: غازى‎‎, ġāzī). For instance, Timur the Lame (r. 1370 - 1405 AD), the Turko-Mongol ruler of the Timurid Empire, after sacking cities in Persia and northern India, was notorious for sacking Muslim majority cities like Baghdad, Aleppo and Damascus (killing many Muslims in the process) in his war against the Ottomans. Yet he was only given the title of ghazi for sacking Christian Smyrna in Anatolia, seat of the Crusader Knights Hospitallers, and beheading many of the inhabitants.

    Mind you, Christian armies of the medieval period didn't behave much better, especially when the Crusaders took Antioch and Jerusalem during the First Crusade. Sacking cities and beheading captives also makes no sense in a modern context, which is why ISIS seems so shocking to the modern world, like something ripped right out of the pages of a historical text. To be honest, though, ISIS is far worse considering how medieval Islamic sultanates were ironically far more tolerant of religious minority groups that they conquered. For instance, the Assyrian Christian peoples have lived in Syria and northern Iraq since ancient times, yet it is only now that their people are being driven out of the region by the puritanical pyschopaths of ISIS. Assyrian ruins, Christian churches and Shia Islamic shrines that have existed in the area for centuries are only now being blown to smitherines due to the Wahhabi interpretation of Sunni Islam adopted from our dear and trustworthy friends the Saudis.

    Misconception #3: Slavery is acceptable and slave females have no rights
    Two Qualities Commandments in the Qur'an Silently abolish Slavery: 1) 47:4 of the Qur'an commands that Prisoners of War shall either be Ransomed or Released, this ensures there is no enslavement, 2)The Qur’an surah (90:13) states that those freeing a slave (whenever feasible) are blessed people in the eyes of God. Further, three Qur’an surahs (4:36), (9:60), (24:58) urge kindness to slaves. With regards to female slaves, it is quite clear: surah (4:24) states “and also prohibited to you are all married women except those your right hands possess. This is the decree of God upon you. And lawful to you are all others i.e. slave girls beyond these, provided that you seek them in marriage with gifts from your property, desiring chastity, not unlawful sexual intercourse. So for whatever you enjoy of marriage from them, give them their due compensation as an obligation. And there is no blame upon you for what you mutually agree to beyond the obligation.” Surah (24:33) states “make a contract with them if you know there is within them goodness and give them from the wealth of God which He has given you. And do not compel your slave girls to prostitution.” ISIS has changed and/or misinterpreted such verses to endorse rape.
    As a religious Muslim, I’ve read the Qur’an numerous times. Yet I have been studying in more detail the various interpretations of the verses containing whom your right hand possesses (slave girls). What I find is that prostitution is forbidden and there is no direct reference to allowing frivolous sexual relations (certainly not rape) with slave girls.
    Slavery as an institution predated Christianity and Islam by many centuries and can be traced back to the earliest civilizations. If Christianity or Islam had never taken root in the world, it's probably a safe bet to assume slavery would have continued regardless. When the Roman world largely converted from Greco-Roman paganism to Christianity during the 4th century AD, slavery was somewhat diminished (since Christians could no longer enslave each other) yet it continued in practice. It was even sanctioned due to several passages in the Old Testament of the Bible that seemingly favored slavery. Although medieval Europe was far more focused on serfdom and slavery was largely absent, these biblical passages were used to justify slavery in places like the Southern United States well into the 19th century (before and during the American Civil War). Brazil had slaves as late as 1888 when it was finally abolished there (the last Western country and one in the Americas to do so). The same can be said for the Islamic world, which maintained slaves and the practice of slavery throughout its entire existence up until very recent times. Saudi Arabia didn't fully abandon slavery (officially) until the 1960s, although several Muslim majority countries had long since abandoned the practice by then. To be honest the passages in the Quran can be interpreted either way, just as the passages in the Bible can be interpreted as pro-slavery or anti-slavery.

    Misconception #10: Islam Forces People to Become Muslim
    God says, “Let there be no compulsion in religion. Truth has been made clear from error.” Quran 2:256
    Although it is a duty on Muslims to convey and share the beautiful message of Islam to others, no one can be compelled to accept Islam. To accept Islam, a person must sincerely and voluntarily believe and obey God, so, by definition, no one can (or should) be forced to accept Islam.
    Consider the following:
    To be honest, this has been handled differently by different Islamic regimes throughout history. Again, you're never going to find 100% consensus on this issue when applying it to the medieval period in particular. For instance, the Ottomans never forced anyone to become Muslims, as far as I'm aware, but put economic and social pressures or persuasions for people to become Muslims. For instance with their janissary corps. People weren't forced to become Muslims, but many Orthodox Greek Christians in Anatolia converted to Sunni Islam since it was deemed to bump up their status and social standing in society, to be part of the in-group and not outsiders.

    Then we have examples like the Almohads of al-Andalus (Spain), who maintained a rather schizophrenic policy for people of dhimmi status (i.e. People of the Book, that is Christians and Jews) thanks to the hostile nature of incessant warfare against the Christian powers of Castile and Portugal on the Iberian peninsula. Ironically, Jews and Christians in the Almohad territories of North Africa lived decently enough and were permitted to worship freely. However, in their Spanish holdings, the Almohads abolished the dhimmi status for Christians and Jews, forcing them to either flee those territories, convert to Islam, or die by the sword. It's obvious why this happened, considering how these groups weren't viewed as trustworthy or could even collaborate with their Christian Spanish enemies in Castile. It's not like the Castilians were much better. They were also very purist when it came to Catholicism. When they reclaimed Spanish territories in the 13th, 14th, and finally 15th centuries they also expelled many Muslims and had those who stuck around convert to Christianity as the Moriscos (likewise, Jews who converted to Christianity were called Conversos). Some Muslims were also made into slaves for the Castilians, just as Muslims had enslaved some Christians before.

    In the modern world these policies seem outrageous considering our now cosmopolitan, multicultural and multi-faith societies, but in medieval and early modern times these practices were almost the norm. Warfare breeds hate, suspicion, and intolerance, and since warfare isn't common at all in the Western world anymore, these feelings have largely evaporated.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    Quote Originally Posted by mishkin View Post
    You acknowledge to have threatened. Fine. You have positioned yourself as "a representative of Islam". Do you realize the responsibility that entails? Do you really want people to judge Islam based on your words and your actions?
    I have positioned myself as a representative of Iranians not Islam, the only thing that could be understood from my words is: we don't fear anyone but God.

    As far as I know (and I know almost nothing about islam) there are many interpretations or ways of seeing Islam within the Muslim community itself. Maybe you should note about what kind of Islam (dont say "the true islam", please) you are talking about.
    the true Islam is God's and Prophets orders.
    Of course you can find Islam in Islamic society but not exactly.
    these are the blogs of tourists who have traveled to Iran,I suggest you to read them:
    http://www.goatsontheroad.com/irania...ce-people-say/
    http://www.travelgeekery.com/iran-an...#axzz4DPeGTKA2
    https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...fNpRzXze42hY9A
    http://en.rocketnews24.com/2012/09/2...eign-tourists/

    Quote Originally Posted by Roma_Victrix View Post
    Hi Fardin!
    Allow me to address some of your points that I think I can add to or elaborate further.
    Hello dear brother
    Why I'm feeling like a jealous person or something now? I think I want to rip your throat
    well done
    Last edited by Fardin; July 29, 2016 at 10:45 AM.
    "A full heart has room for everything and an empty heart has room for nothing"
    Antonio Porchia

    Clearing up misconceptions about Islam
    Clearing up misconceptions about Iran


  11. #11
    zarmehr's Avatar Foederatus
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    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    Quote Originally Posted by Roma_Victrix View Post
    Allow me to address some of your points that I think I can add to or elaborate further.
    I like your vision man.May god guide us all.But as far as i know most of slave masters in Europe and Islamic world were jew.
    Last edited by zarmehr; July 29, 2016 at 11:38 AM.
    أَيْنَ بَقِيَّةُ اللَّهِ الَّتِي لا تَخْلُو مِنَ الْعِتْرَةِ الْهَادِيَةِ ؟
    Where is the left by Allah
    that is always represented by individuals from the guiding (Prophetic) offspring?
    Nudba Supplication

  12. #12

    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    I moved the thread to Ethos, Mores et Monastica as I think the topic better suits that forum than the political academy.
    Please keep personal references out of the debate.


    Quote Originally Posted by zarmehr View Post
    I like your vision man.May god guide us all.But as far as i know most of slave masters in Europe and Islamic world were jew.
    You better find a credible source for such a claim, better than "as far as I know". Let's say given the spread of slavery in the Islamic world (or globally) vs. the spread of Judaism this is very unlikely.
    "Sebaceans once had a god called Djancaz-Bru. Six worlds prayed to her. They built her temples, conquered planets. And yet one day she rose up and destroyed all six worlds. And when the last warrior was dying, he said, 'We gave you everything, why did you destroy us?' And she looked down upon him and she whispered, 'Because I can.' "
    Mangalore Design

  13. #13
    DaVinci's Avatar TW Modder 2005-2016
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    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    Quote Originally Posted by Fardin View Post
    Dear brother Davinci
    I can persuade you there is a God and Islam is from him but not in this forum and not by chatting like this, you should feel the atmosphere and feel the Islam with your heart.
    Islam is the religion of peace and clement, you should remember Islam is Islam whether a Muslim is extremist or moderate, If we put Islamic obligations away then we are not Muslim anymore just like those terrorists.Love and peace are the basis of Islam.
    If you really want to know how a real Muslim rules or acts then you should study Imam Ali's letter to the provincial(Egypt's) governor,Malik Ashtar.You should notice that Imam Ali was a doer man not only a good talking person(unlike western governors), We discovered real Islam in his actions and words , He is the walking Qur'an.
    And then tell me you still believe we must put him away?


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    In the name of Allah the clement the merciful
    Be it known to you, O, Malik, that I am sending you as Governor to a country which in the past has experienced both just and unjust rule. Men will scrutinize your actions with a searching eye, even as you used to scrutinize the actions of those before you, and speak of you even as you did speak of them. The fact is that the public speak well of only those who do good. It is they who furnish the proof of your actions. Hence the richest treasure that you may covet would be the treasure of good deeds. Keep your desires under control and deny yourself that which you have been prohibited from, for, by such abstinence alone, you will be able to distinguish between what is good to them and what is not.
    Develop in your heart the feeling of love for your people and let it be the source of kindliness and blessing to them. Do not behave with them like a barbarian, and do not appropriate to yourself that which belongs to them.
    Remember that the citizens of the state are of two categories. They are either your brethren in religion or your brethren in kind. They are subject to infirmities and liable to commit mistakes. Some indeed do commit mistakes. But forgive them even as you would like God to forgive you. Bear in mind that you are placed over them, even as I am placed over you. And then there is God even above him who has given you the position of a Governor in order that you may look after those under you and to be sufficient unto them. And you will be judged by what you do for them.
    Do not set yourself against God, for neither do you possess the strength to shield yourself against His displeasure, nor can you place yourself outside the pale of His mercy and forgiveness. Do not feel sorry over any act of forgiveness, nor rejoice over any punishment that you may mete out to any one. Do not rouse yourself to anger, for no good will come out of it.
    Do not say: "I am your overlord and dictator, and that you should, therefore, bow to my commands", as that will corrupt your heart, weaken your faith in religion and create disorder in the state. Should you be elated by power, ever feel in your mind the slightest symptoms of pride and arrogance, then look at the power and majesty of the Divine governance of the Universe over which you have absolutely no control. It will restore the sense of balance to your wayward intelligence and give you the sense of calmness and affability. Beware! Never put yourself against the majesty and grandeur of God and never imitate His omnipotence; for God has brought low every rebel of God and every tyrant of man.
    Let your mind respect through your actions the rights of God and the rights of man, and likewise, persuade your companions and relations to do likewise. For, otherwise, you will be doing injustice to yourself and injustice to humanity. Thus both man and God will turn unto your enemies. There is no hearing anywhere for one who makes an enemy of God himself. He will be regarded as one at war with God until he feels contrition and seeks forgiveness. Nothing deprives man of divine blessings or excites divine wrath against him more easily than cruelty. Hence it is, that God listens to the voice of the oppressed and waylays the oppressor.
    The Common Man
    Maintain justice in administration and impose it on your own self and seek the consent of the people, for, the discontent of the masses sterilizes the contentment of the privileged few and the discontent of the few looses itself in the contentment of the many. Remember the privileged few will not rally round you in moments of difficulty: they will try to side-track justice, they will ask for more than what they deserve and will show no gratitude for favors done to them. They will feel restive in the face of trials and will offer no regret for their shortcomings. It is the common man who is the strength of the State and Religion. It is he who fights the enemy. So live in close contact with the masses and be mindful of their welfare.
    Keep at a distance him who peers into the weaknesses of others. After all, the masses are not free from weaknesses. It is the duty of the ruler to shield them. Do not bring to light that which is hidden, but try to remove those weaknesses which have been brought to light. God is watchful of everything that is hidden from you, and He alone will deal with it. To the best of your ability cover the weaknesses of the public, and God will cover the weaknesses in you which you are anxious to keep away from their eye. Unloose the tangle of mutual hatred between the public and the administration and remove all those causes which may give rise to strained relations between them. Protect yourself from every such act as may not be quite correct for you. Do not make haste in seeking confirmation of tale-telling, for, the tale-teller is a deceitful person appearing in the garb of a friend.
    The Counselors
    Never take counsel of a miser, for he will vitiate your magnanimity and frighten you of poverty. Do not take counsel of a coward also, for, he will cheat you of your resolves. Do not take counsel of the greedy too: for he will instill greed in you and turn you into a tyrant. Miserliness, cowardice and greed deprive man of his trust in God.
    The worst of counselors is he who has served as a counselor to unjust rulers and shared their crimes. So, never let men who have been companions of tyrants or shared their crimes be your counselors. You can get better men than these, men gifted with intelligence and foresight, but unpolluted by sin, men who have never aided a tyrant in his tyranny or a criminal in his crime. Such men will never be a burden on you. On the other hand, they will be a source of help and strength to you at all times. They will be friends to you and strangers to your enemies. Choose such men alone for companionship both in privacy and in the public. Even among these, show preference to them who have a habitual regard for truth however trying to you at times their truth may prove to be, and who offer you no encouragement in the display of tendencies which God does not like his friends to develop.
    Keep close to you the upright, and the God fearing, and make clear to them that they are never to flatter you and never to give you credit for any good that you may not have done: for, the tolerance of flattery and unhealthy praise stimulates pride in man makes him arrogant.
    Do not treat the good and the bad alike. That will deter the good from doing good, and encourage the bad in their bad pursuits. Recompense every one according one"s deserts. Remember that mutual trust and good will between the ruler and the ruled are bred only through benevolence, justice and service. So, cultivate good-will amongst the people; for their good-will alone will save you from troubles. Your benevolence to them will be repaid by their trust in you, and your ill-treatment by their ill-will.
    Do not disregard the noble traditions set by our forbearers which have promoted harmony and progress among the people; and do not initiate anything which might minimize their usefulness. The men who had established these noble traditions have had their reward; but responsibility will be yours if they are disturbed. Try always to learn something from the experience of the learned and the wise, and frequently consult them in state matters so that you might maintain the peace and good-will which your predecessors had established in the land.
    The Different Classes of People
    Remember that the people are composed of different classes. The progress of one is dependent on the progress of every other; and none can afford to be independent of the other. We have the Army formed of the soldiers of God, we have our civil officers and their establishments, our judiciary, our revenue collectors and our public relation officers. The general public itself consists of Muslims and Zimmis and among them of merchants and craftsmen, the unemployed and the indigent. God has prescribed for them their several rights, duties and obligations. They are all defined and preserved in the Book of God and in the traditions of his Prophet.
    The army, by the grace of God, is like a fortress to the people and lends dignity to the state. It upholds the prestige of the Faith and maintains the peace of the country. Without it the state cannot stand. In its turn, it cannot stand without the support of the state. Our soldiers have proved strong before the enemy because of the privilege God has given them to fight for Him; but they have their material needs to fulfil and have therefore to depend upon the income provided for them from the state revenue. The military and civil population who pay revenue, both need the co-operation of others -the judiciary, civil officers and their establishment. The Qazi administers civil and criminal law; the civil officers collect revenue and attend to civil administration with the assistance of their establishment. And then there are the tradesmen and the merchants who add to the revenue of the state. It is they who run the markets and are in a better position than others to discharge social obligations. And then there is the class of the poor and the needy, whose maintenance is an obligation on the other classes. God has given appropriate opportunity of service to one and all; and then there are the rights of all these classes over the administration which the administrator has to meet with an eye on the good of the entire population, a duty which he cannot fulfill properly unless he takes personal interest in its execution and seeks help from God. Indeed it is obligatory on him to impose this duty on himself and to bear with patience the inconveniences and difficulties incidental to his task.
    The Army
    Be particularly mindful of the welfare of those in the army who in your opinion, are staunchly faithful to their God and Prophet and loyal to their chief, and who in the hour of passion can restrain themselves and listen coolly to sensible remonstrance, and who can succor the weak and smite the strong, whom violent provocation will not throw into violent temper and who will not falter at any stage.
    Keep yourself in close contact with the families of established reputation and integrity with a glorious past, and draw to yourself men brave and upright in character, generous and benevolent in disposition; for such are the salt of society.
    Care for them with the tenderness with which you care for your children, and do not talk before them of any good that you might have done to them, nor disregard any expression of affection which they show in return; for, such conduct inspires loyalty, devotion and goodwill. Attend to every little of their wants not resting content with what general help that you might have given to them, for sometimes, timely attention to a little want of theirs brings them immense relief. Surely these people will not forget you in your own hour of need.
    It behooves you to select for your Commander-in-chief one who imposes on himself as a duty, the task of rendering help to his men, and who can excel in kindness every other officer who has to attend to the needs of the men under him, and look after their families when they are away from their homes; so much so, that the entire army should feel united in their joys and in their sorrows. The unity of purpose will give them added strength against the enemy. Continue to maintain a kindly attitude towards them so that they might feel attached to you. The fact is that the real happiness of the administrators and their most pleasant comfort lies in establishing justice in the state and maintaining affectionate relations with the people. Their sincerity of feeling is expressed in the love and regard they show to you, on which alone depends the safety of the administrators.
    Your advices to the army will be of no avail, unless and until you show affection to both men and officers, in order that they might not regard the Government as an oppressive burden or contribute to its downfall.
    Continue to satisfy their needs and praise them over and over again for what services they have rendered. Such an attitude, God willing will inspire the brave to braver actions and induce the timid to deeds of bravery.
    Try to enter into the feelings of others and do not foist the mistake of one over another and do not grudge dispensing appropriate rewards. See to it you do not show favors to one who has done nothing but merely counts on his family position; and do not withhold proper rewards from one who has done great deeds simply because he holds a low position in life.
    The Real Guidance
    Turn to God and to His prophet for guidance whenever you feel uncertain as to what you have to do. There is the commandment of God delivered to those people who He wishes to guide aright: "O people of the Faith! Obey God and obey His prophet and those from among you who hold authority over you. And refer to God and His prophet whenever there is difference of opinion among you. To turn to God is in reality to consult the Book of God; and to turn to the prophet is t follow his universally accepted traditions.
    Chief Judge
    Select for your chief judge one from the people who is by far the best among them -one who is not obsessed with domestic worries, one who cannot be intimidated, one who does not err to often, one who does not turn back from a right path once he finds it, one who is not self-centered or avaricious, one who will not decide before knowing full facts, one who will weigh wit care every attendant doubt and pronounce a clear verdict after taking everything into full consideration, one who will not grow restive over the arguments of advocates and who will examine with patience every new disclosure of fact and who will be strictly impartial in his decision, one who flattery cannot mislead or one who does not exult over his position. But it is not easy to find such men.
    Once you have selected the right man for the office, pay him handsomely enough, to let him live in comfort and in keeping with his position, enough to keep him above temptations. Give him a position in your court so high none can even dream of coveting it and so high that neither back-biting nor intrigue can touch him.
    Subordinate Judiciary
    Beware! The utmost carefulness is to be exercised in his selection: for it is this high office which adventurous self-seekers aspire to secure and exploit in their selfish interests. After the selection of your chief judge, give careful consideration to the selection of other officers. Confirm them in their appointments after approved apprenticeship and probation. Never select men for responsible posts either out of any regard for personal connections or under any influence, for, that might lead to injustice and corruption.
    Of these select for higher posts men of experience, men firm in faith and belonging to good families. Such men will not fall an easy prey to temptations and will discharge their duties with an eye on the abiding good of others. Increase their salaries to give them a contented life. A contented living is a help to self-purification. They will not feel the urge to tax the earnings of their subordinates for their own upkeep. They will then have no excuse either to go against your instructions or misappropriate state funds. Keep to watch over them without their knowledge, loyal and upright men. Perchance they may develop true honesty and true concern for the public welfare. But whenever any of them is accused of dishonesty and the guilt is confirmed by the report of your secret service, then regard this as a sufficient to convict him. Let the punishment be corporal and let that be dealt in the public at an appointed place of degradation.
    Revenue Administration
    Great care is to be exercised in revenue administration, to ensure the prosperity of those who pay the revenue to the state; for it is on their prosperity depends the prosperity of others, particularly the prosperity of the masses. Indeed, the state exists on its revenue. You should regard the proper upkeep of the land in cultivation as of greater importance than the collection of revenue, for revenue cannot be derived except by making the land productive. He who demands revenue without helping the cultivator to improve his land, inflicts unmerited hardship on the cultivator and ruins the State. The rule of such a person does not last long. If the cultivators ask for reduction of their land cess for having suffered from epidemics or drought or excess of rains or the barrenness of the soil or floods damaging to their barrenness of the soil or foods damaging to their crops, then, reduce the cess accordingly, so that their condition might improve. Do not mind the loss of revenue on that account for that will return to you one day manifold in the hour of greater prosperity of the land and enable you to improve the condition of your towns and to raise the prestige of your state. You will be the object of universal praise. The people will believe in your sense of justice. The confidence which they will place in you in consequence will prove your strength, as they will be found ready to share your burdens.
    You may settle down on the land any number of people, but discontent will overtake them if the land is not improved. The cause of the cultivator"s ruin is the rulers who are bent feverishly on accumulating wealth at all costs, out of the fear that their rule might not last long. Such are the people who do not learn from examples or precedents.
    Clerical Establishment
    Keep an eye on your establishment and your scribes; and select the best among them for your confidential correspondence such among these as possess high character and deserve your full confidence, men who may not exploit their privileged position to go against you and who may not grow neglectful of their duties and who in the drafting of treaties may not succumb to external temptation and harm your interests, or fail to render you proper assistance and to save you from trouble, and who in carrying out their duties can realize their serious responsibilities, for he who does not realize his own responsibilities can hardly appraise the reprehensibilities of others. Do not select men for such work merely on the strength of your first impressions of your affection or good faith; for as a matter of fact; the pretensions of a good many who are really devoid of honesty and good breeding may cheat even the intelligence of rulers. Selection should be made after due probation which should be the test of righteousness. In making direct appointments from people, see to it that those selected possess influence with the people and who enjoy the reputation of being honest; for such selection is agreeable to God and the ruler. For every department of administration, let there be a head, whom no trying task might cause worry and no pressure of work annoy.
    And remember that every weakness of any one among your establishment and scribe which you may overlook will be written down against you in your scroll of deeds.

    Trade and Industry
    Adopt useful schemes placed before those engaged in trade and industry and help them with wise counsels. Some of them live in towns, and some move from place to place with their wares and tools and earn their living by manual labor. Trade and Industry are sources of profit to the State. While the general public is not inclined to bear the strain, those engaged in these professions take the trouble to collect commodities from far and near, from land and from across the sea, and from mountains and forests and naturally derive benefits.
    It is this class of peace loving people from whom no disturbance need be feared. They love peace and order; indeed they are incapable of creating disorder. Visit every part of the country and establish personal contact with this class, and inquire into their condition. But bear in mind that a good many of them are intensely greedy and are inured to bad dealings. They hoard grain and try to sell it at a high price; and this is most harmful to the public. It is a blot on the name of the ruler not to fight this evil. Prevent them from hoarding; for the Prophet of God -Peace be upon him - had prohibited it. And see to it that trade is carried on with the utmost ease, that the scales are evenly held and that prices are so fixed that neither the seller nor the buyer is put to a loss. And if inspite of your warning, should anyone go against your commands and commit the crime of hoarding, then deal him appropriately with severe punishment.
    The Poor
    Beware! Fear God when dealing with the problem of the poor who have non to patronize, who are forlorn, indigent and helpless and are greatly torn in mind -victims of the vicissitudes of Time. Among them there are some who do not question their lot in life not withstanding their misery, do not go about abegging. For God"s sake, safeguard their rights; for on you rests the responsibility of protection. Assign for their uplift a portion of the state exchequer (Baitul-mal), wherever they may be, whether close at hand or far away from you. The rights of the two should be equal in your eye. Do not let any preoccupation slip them from your mind; for no excuse whatsoever for the disregard of their rights will be acceptable to God. Do not treat their interests as of less importance than your own, and never keep them outside the purview of your important considerations, and mark the persons who look down upon them and of whose conditions they keep you in ignorance.
    Select from among your officers such men as are meek and God fearing who can keep you properly informed of the condition of the poor. Make such provision for these poor people as shall not oblige you to offer an excuse before God on the Day of Judgment; for, it is this section of the people more than any other which deserves benevolent treatment. Seek your reward from God by giving to each of them what is due to him and enjoin on yourself as a sacred duty the task of meting the needs of such aged among them as have no independent means of livelihood and are averse to seek alms. And it is the discharge of this duty that usually proves very trying for ruler, but is very welcome to societies which are gifted with foresight. It is only such societies or nations who truly carry out with equanimity their covenant with God to discharge their duty to the poor.
    Open Conferences
    Meet the oppressed and the lowly periodically in an open conference and, conscious of the divine presence there, have a heart-to-heart talk with them, and let none from your armed guard or civil officers or members of the police or the Intelligence Department be by your side, so that the representatives of the poor might state their grievances fearlessly and without reserve. For I have the Prophet of God saying that no nation or society will occupy a high position in which the strong do not discharge their duty to the weak. Bear with composure any strong language which they may use, and do not get annoyed if they cannot state their case lucidly, even so, God will open you his door of blessings and rewards. Whatever you can give to them, give it ungrudgingly, and whatever you cannot afford to give, make that clear to them in utmost sincerity.
    There are certain things which call for prompt action. Accept the recommendations made by your officers for the redress of the grievances of the clerical staff. See to it that petitions or applications that are submitted for your consideration are brought to your notice the very day they are submitted, however much your officers might try to intercede them. Dispose off the day"s work that very day, for the coming day will bring with it its own tasks.
    Communion with God
    And do not forget to set apart the best of your time for communion with God, although every moment of yours is for Him only, provided it is spend sincerely in the service of your people. The special time that you give to prayer in the strict religious sense is to be devoted to the performances of the prescribed daily prayers. Keep yourself engaged in these prayers both in the day and in the night, and to gain perfect communion, do not as far as possible, let your prayers grow tiresome. And when you lead in congregational prayer, do not let your prayer be so lengthy as to cause discomfort to the congregation or raise in them the feeling of dislike for it or liquidate its effect: for in the congregation there may be invalids and also those who have to attend pressing affairs of their own.
    When I had asked of the Prophet of God on receiving an order to proceed to Yaman, how I should lead the people there in prayer, he said -perform your prayers even as the weakest among you would do; and set an example of consideration to the faithful.
    Aloofness not desirable
    Alongside of the observance of all that I have said above bear one thing in mind. Never for any length of time keep yourself aloof from the people, for to do so is to keep oneself ignorant of their affairs. It develops in the ruler a wrong perspective and renders him unable to distinguish between what is important and what is not, between right and wrong, and between truth and falsehood. The ruler is after all human; and he cannot form a correct view of anything which is out of sight. There is no distinctive sign attached to truth which may enable one to distinguish between the different varieties of truth and falsehood. The fact is that you must be one of two things. Either you are just or unjust. If you are just, then you will not keep yourself away from the people, but will listen to them and meet their requirements. On the other hand, it you are unjust, the people themselves will keep way from you. What virtue is there in your keeping aloof? At all events aloofness is not desirable especially when it is your duty to attend to the needs of the people. Complaints of oppression by your officers or petitions for justice should not prove irksome to you.
    Make this clear to yourself that those immediately about and around you will like to exploit their position to covet what belongs to others and commit acts of injustice. Suppress such a tendency in them. Make a rule of your conduct never to give even a small piece of land to any of your relations. That will prevent them from causing harm to the interests of others and save you from courting the disapprobation of God and Man.
    Deal justice squarely regardless of the fact whether one is a relation or not. If any of your relations or companions violates the law, mete out the punishment prescribed by law however painful it might be to you personally; for it will be all to the good of the State. If at any time people suspect, that you have been unjust to them in any respect disclose your mind to them and remove their suspicions. In this way, your mind will get attuned to the sense of justice and people will begin to love you. It will also fulfill your wish that you should enjoy their confidence.
    Peace and Treaties
    Bear in mind that you do not throw away the offer of peace which your enemy may himself make. Accept it, for, that will please God. Peace is a source of comfort to the army; it reduces your worries and promotes order in the State. But Beware! Be on your guard when the peace is signed; for, certain types of enemies propose terms of peace just to lull you into a sense of security only to attack you again when you are off your guard. So you should exercise the utmost vigilance on your part, and place no undue faith in their protestations. But, if under the peace treaty you have accepted any obligations, discharge those obligations scrupulously. It is a trust and must be faithfully upheld and whenever you have promised anything, keep it with all the strength that you command, for whatever differences of opinion might exist on other matters, there is nothing so noble as the fulfillment of a promise. This is recognized even among non-Muslims, for they know the dire consequences which follow from the breaking of covenants. So never make excuses in discharging your responsibilities and never break a promise, nor cheat your enemy. For, breach of promise is an act against God, and none except the positively wicked acts against God
    Indeed divine promises are a blessing spread over all mankind. The promise of God is a refuge sought after even by the most powerful on earth; for there is no risk of being cheated. So, do not make any promise from which you may afterwards offer excuses to retract; nor do you go back upon what you have confirmed to abide by; nor do you break it, however galling it may at first prove to be. For, it is far better to wait in patience for wholesome results to follow than to break it out of any apprehensions.
    Beware! Abstain from shedding blood without a valid cause. There is nothing more harmful than this which brings about one"s ruin. The blood that is willfully shed shortens the life of a state. On the Day of Judgment it is this crime for which one will have to answer first. So, beware! Do not wish to build the strength of your state on blood; for, it is this blood which ultimately weakens the state and passes it on to other hands. Before me and my God no excuse for willful killing can be entertained.
    Murder is a crime which is punishable by death. If on any accord the corporal punishment dealt by the state for any lesser crime results in the death of the guilty, let not the prestige of the stage stand in any way of the deceased relations claiming blood money.
    Last Instructions
    Do not make haste to do a thing before its time, nor put it off when the right moment arrives. Do not insist on doing a wrong thing, nor show slackness in rectifying a wrong thing. Perform everything in its proper time, and let everything occupy its proper place. When the people as a whole agree upon a thing, do not impose your own view on them and do not neglect to discharge the responsibility that rests on you in consequence. For, the eyes of the people will be on you and you are answerable for whatever you do to them. The slightest dereliction of duty will bring its own retribution. Keep your anger under control and keep your hands and tongue in check whenever you fall into anger, try to restrain yourself or else you will simply increase your worries.
    It is imperative on you to study carefully the principles which have inspired just and good rulers who have gone before you. Give close thought to the example of our prophet (peace be upon him), his traditions, and the commandments of the Book of God and whatever you might have assimilated from my own way of dealing with things. Endeavor to the best of your ability to carry out the instructions which I have given you here and which you have solemnly undertaken to follow. By means of this order, I enjoin on you not to succumb to the prompting of your own heart or to turn away from the discharge of duties entrusted to you.
    I seek the refuge of the might of the Almighty and of His limitless sphere of blessings, and invite you to pray with me that He may give us together the grace willingly to surrender our will to His will, and to enable us to acquit ourselves before Him and His creation; so that mankind might cherish our memory and our work survive. I seek of God the culmination of his blessings and pray that He may grant you and me His grace and the honor of martyrdom in His cause. Verily, we have to return to Him. I invoke His blessings on the Prophet of God and his pure progeny.

    No chance. In the same manner as other religions have no chance on me, other than that they are subject of studies.

    Bold part: The same kind of express, one can find by christian or jewish believers, which kinda try to missionate. There is not much of a unique behaviour.

    My mentioned recommendations stand, just to find a much higher degree of acceptance, in non-muslim societies is meant.

    If you wanna try to understand how or why that is so, start to study european history from on circa 15th century - Renaissance ... Enlightment, btw. where Arab/Muslim culture has a good portion of participation and relevant triggers.

    Go further to find out why that at the time high standard of oriental progress stopped in the Muslim world, and for example secularism isn't a realised thing there (for many Muslims, not all must be said).
    Last edited by Tiberios; July 30, 2016 at 05:37 AM. Reason: Comments about moderation are off topic. Please take it to the commentary thread.
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  14. #14

    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    Quote Originally Posted by DaVinci View Post
    Bold part: The same kind of express, one can find by christian or jewish believers, which kinda try to missionate. There is not much of a unique behaviour.
    Bold part: I doubt it, missionating has been verboten in Judaism for almost 2,000 years.
    Last edited by Tiberios; July 30, 2016 at 05:38 AM. Reason: Continuity
    Quote Originally Posted by Enros View Post
    You don't seem to be familiar with how the burden of proof works in when discussing social justice. It's not like science where it lies on the one making the claim. If someone claims to be oppressed, they don't have to prove it.


  15. #15
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    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    Quote Originally Posted by Mangalore View Post
    You better find a credible source for such a claim, better than "as far as I know". Let's say given the spread of slavery in the Islamic world (or globally) vs. the spread of Judaism this is very unlikely.
    Do you want to say that most slave owners were not Jew in the Medieval age and the Age of Imperialism?You want to tell me that most of slave masters in islamic world were Muslim?Of cource i dont deny that many people in Europe and the Islamic world were engaged in the slave trade.Do you use historical books written by zionist capitalists?I suggest you read the history of the Jews in the Gaon period.(I am not an anti-Semitic).It is a little hard to translate the sources to ENG but as soon as i can i will post.
    Last edited by zarmehr; July 30, 2016 at 04:21 PM.
    أَيْنَ بَقِيَّةُ اللَّهِ الَّتِي لا تَخْلُو مِنَ الْعِتْرَةِ الْهَادِيَةِ ؟
    Where is the left by Allah
    that is always represented by individuals from the guiding (Prophetic) offspring?
    Nudba Supplication

  16. #16

    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    Quote Originally Posted by zarmehr View Post
    Do you want to say that most slave owners were not Jew in the Medieval age and the Age of Imperialism?You want to tell me that most of slave masters in islamic world were Muslim?Of cource i dont deny that many people in Europe and the Islamic world were engaged in the slave trade.Do you use historical books written by zionist capitalists?I suggest you read the history of the Jews in the Gaon period.(I am not an anti-Semitic).It is a little hard to translate the sources to ENG but as soon as i can i will post.
    I asked for a simple credible source.

    Your claim is questionable simply based on demographics, the spread of slavery (both by the Christian Europeans and the Islamic World... as well as the rest of Asia and Africa) and the usual social position of Jewish communities in the various host countries during their Diaspora. Also, a small historic period will hardly help you with that claim given the generality.

    I also do not have to read up anything, you have to find a source. The above facts simply make your claim not one to accept without very hard evidence.


    edit: Btw, who is deciding what historical books written by zionist capitalists are?
    Last edited by Mangalore; July 30, 2016 at 05:57 PM.
    "Sebaceans once had a god called Djancaz-Bru. Six worlds prayed to her. They built her temples, conquered planets. And yet one day she rose up and destroyed all six worlds. And when the last warrior was dying, he said, 'We gave you everything, why did you destroy us?' And she looked down upon him and she whispered, 'Because I can.' "
    Mangalore Design

  17. #17
    mishkin's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    Quote Originally Posted by zarmehr View Post
    But as far as i know most of slave masters in Europe and Islamic world were jew.
    On what basis are you saying this? As far as I know slave owners were simply those who could afford them.

  18. #18
    mishkin's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    Quote Originally Posted by Fardin View Post
    I have positioned myself as a representative of Iranians not Islam, the only thing that could be understood from my words is: we don't fear anyone but God.
    This is a thread about Islam. (Title of the thread: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam).

    Of course you can find Islam in Islamic society but not exactly.
    Dont understand what you have said here, could you explain? There is only one form of Islam? Your view of Islam is the correct one?

    My most sincere congratulations to the Iranian department responsible for the country's image abroad. Not a single criticism or a negative aspect of the country. Perharps there is a IRI Friendship Association? I mean like the Korean (North-Korean, the good Korea) Friendship Association.
    Last edited by mishkin; July 29, 2016 at 11:21 AM.

  19. #19

    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    Quote Originally Posted by mishkin View Post
    This is a thread about Islam. (Title of the thread: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam).
    I stated those in a thread named "Discussion and Debate Community Thread". I spoke as an Iranian not as a representative of Islam!he threatened Iran and I responded as an Iranian.
    I'm too inferior to be the representative of Islam.
    Dont understand what you have said here, could you explain? There is only one form of Islam? Your view of Islam is the correct one?
    There is only one form of Islam.Shia and Sunni are similar in many aspects, just some differences don't make Islam divided.


    My most sincere congratulations to the Iranian department responsible for the country's image abroad. Not a single criticism or a negative aspect of the country. Perhaps there is a IRI Friendship Association? I mean like the Korean (North-Korean, the good Korea) Friendship Association.
    There aren't any departments or associations for this purpose. Iranians as muslim people believe in that the guests are blessings from god and we'll treat our guests as our family members or even better.
    I sent you those links because Iranians are a good example of Islamic society and you can find Islamic behaviors here.
    The city(Karaj) where I live is renowned for the most skilled drivers and the angriest people among Iranians, that's the reason why I couldn't control myself in that thread.
    "A full heart has room for everything and an empty heart has room for nothing"
    Antonio Porchia

    Clearing up misconceptions about Islam
    Clearing up misconceptions about Iran


  20. #20

    Default Re: Clearing Up Misconceptions about Islam

    Mind you, isn't Iran a country where religion and state are linked together?

    You know, it being an Islamic Republic, rather than a sectarian state where the country is ruled by the people alone, rather than a religion.

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