Conquer Anywhere (Regional Occupation Removal) and Diplomatic Options

[Dresden]

I never said this would be balanced Believe it or not, I like the vanilla system. But, this was a highly requested mod so I did my best to get it properly working and available with options.

[tgoodenow]

I never said this would be balanced Believe it or not, I like the vanilla system. But, this was a highly requested mod so I did my best to get it properly working and available with options.

Don't get me wrong, I appreciate the mod 100%. Im sure someone will eventually use this mod in an overhaul mod so I thought you should know.

Vanilla system seems illogical to me. If I could install loyal dwarven rulers while playing as humans I would like it but making at least half the map unconquerable isn't very fitting to the total war theme.

[sunman]

Hi Dresden

I see you have a lot of "versions" of the mod and I came to an idea for a "new version" (that will solve the bug with Norse regions).
Is it technically possible to make a mod that will allow to conquer any region only if it is Razed before this - For example if playing with human you can conquer dwarf city but first have to raze it to the ground (maybe this will "fix" the issue with "unbreakable building from other cultures")

Thanks

[Dresden]

The Norse regions should work fine, other than the sparring fields which will be fixed when they update the game to allow us to mod vanilla tables. I have to remove the downgrade entry for them.

Otherwise all the other regions work fine now, you should be able to build and use any settlement.

[Grayser]

Have to say I am very impressed with how this mod turned out, tried one playthrough with and one without.

I was expecting both the campaign map and battle map visuals to stay the same but I was suprised (happily) when a little Vampire town appeared outside of Zhufbar when the AI took it, not only that but seeing Vampire walls in a Dwarf Karak was also awesome. Got to say really impressed by the visuals and how seamless you and the people you worked with have made it.

Besides the known issue with sparring fields I also ran into Castle Drakenhof not converting when I took it as the Dwarfs, and those are just tiny things. Overall a great mod and exceptional work.

[Dresden]

The special capitals should work now, they don't convert but they should be useable.

Update All Versions
- Fixed vampire ruins not converting properly. May not fix a currently bugged building but will for future conquests.

Update Chaos Version
- Fixed Kholek Suneater's trigger to use the new buildings.
- Changed some upper tier building times to better match the rest of the game's entries.
- Fixed some follower and tech effects that weren't properly being applied.
- Added edicts.

[irisheagle]

Hey Dresden, this may be way outside the scope of this mod, but I'd lvoe to see something aking to "Conquer Anywhere, But You May Not Want To".

By this I mean there would be various penalties to conquering "incorrect" settlements, such as perhaps not being able to build up as much, or perhaps more simply, conquering removes most upgraded buildings and has a permanent public order and growth penalty, as your race has issues adapting to an unfamiliar environment. Something that would make your "wrong" settlements feel more like outposts and the frontier than a normal city.

[BesoC]

The idea itself is great and logical - why some, say, dwarf kingdom can not conquer human or greenskin settlement? However, in current state, this mod is very imbalanced. I'll second to irisheagle- would be great to be able to conquer any type of settlement, but taking different faction's one should have significant penalties. For instance:

1. Lower income / more expensive building
2. public order should be hard to keep positive - more likely to revolt
3. limited recruiting, also units should be less experienced then ones from 'native' settlements
4. Units native to conquered settlement should give negative bonus to army's morale on battlefield - just like in Heroes of Might and Magic. Also, they should be more likely to break and run away
5. Governors of conquered settlements should have low loyalty
6. Enemy heroes, especially of the same faction as conquered settlement, should have significantly higher chance to succeed.
7. Penalties can be somewhat lower between 'good' or 'bad' races. For instance - conquering human town gives less penalties for dwarf and more for vampire

etc, etc...
By all means, thank you for the mod, if you ever have time and intention to release it with penalties, it would be perfect

[alQamar]

using this mod and it is really great, still I feel that diplomacy is not meaningful enough, simply because race penalties. Is there anything you can do about this Dresden? I am playing a coop campaign (my friend as greenskins, me as dwarves) and diplomacy is near to impossible for me even with other dwarve tribes, I don't even have one trading route since my only AI ally got smashed.

[Dresden]

For trading routes you have to have a route from your capital to theirs either by land or sea, it can be annoying.

To the above listed ideas, those are very interesting and I am sure would be a way to implement the mod to help with the overpowered nature of it. I personally don't plan to take this mod much further than it currently is, simply because I don't have the time to do that and keep everything updated and work on my other projects. But, if someone else ends up wanting to make a more complex version of this mod they would be able to do what you described. It would probably require all new building chains for every culture for every other culture's chains. It would be a lot of work.

[SPARTAN VI]

Hey Dresden. Does your mod make any changes to building icons? I have one person on the Steam workshop who reported compatibility issues with my Building Progression mod, but I can't imagine why this specific mod would conflict.

Basically my building icons mod only works if he disables your mod. My mod only touches the UI/building culture variants table, and very specifically only the Dwarf buildings.

(edit)

I suppose it's plausible that you modified the UI / Building_cultures_variant table (if I remembered the name correctly) to ensure the icon art is consistent with a race that otherwise would not have been able to conquer (and build) in such settlements.

Unfortunately, if that is truly the case, then the mods would have to be merged. Of course, both mods can't work together if they append the same table and its entities. If you, Dresden, would like to implement my iconography in your mod, feel free to do so. If not, no harm. Thanks for your time.

[Keyser]

I was playing the game just now and thinking about how CA implemented this conquest mecanics i thought that it didn't work as it should, lore wise, in the game.

I can understand CA logic with human being unable to settle in the high mountains fortress where the dwarfs live and the orks dwell, or dwarven reluctance to occupy lowlands.

But, lorewise, imo, there are still issues with the occupation. Theorically orcs shouldn't be able to just "occupy" a dwarven hold, they should destroy it, then being able to "colonize it", same for dwarves reconquering lost karaks. They should firts destroy the orcish settlement, then not just occupy it, but "recolonize" it (IE at a cost in money and manpower).

I think it would be more lorefriendly and logical if races could only occupy city of other races after they recolonize the area (IE after they first raze them). And even then, not all factions should be able to occupy the others.

I see no problems with orcs occupying humans settlements in theory (although gameplay wise that might be a problem because of the lack of reciprocity, i don't see humans settling in the "normals" orkish strongholds or lands).

Would it be possible without being too much of a hassle ? I moded a few things in Rome 2 for my convenience, but i can't say i feel confident while modding lol.

It's a bit similar to this query, but more specific.

Hi Dresden

I see you have a lot of "versions" of the mod and I came to an idea for a "new version" (that will solve the bug with Norse regions).
Is it technically possible to make a mod that will allow to conquer any region only if it is Razed before this - For example if playing with human you can conquer dwarf city but first have to raze it to the ground (maybe this will "fix" the issue with "unbreakable building from other cultures")

Thanks

[wphmd]

I second (or third, I guess) this.

[wphmd]

The idea itself is great and logical - why some, say, dwarf kingdom can not conquer human or greenskin settlement? However, in current state, this mod is very imbalanced. I'll second to irisheagle- would be great to be able to conquer any type of settlement, but taking different faction's one should have significant penalties. For instance:

1. Lower income / more expensive building
2. public order should be hard to keep positive - more likely to revolt
3. limited recruiting, also units should be less experienced then ones from 'native' settlements
4. Units native to conquered settlement should give negative bonus to army's morale on battlefield - just like in Heroes of Might and Magic. Also, they should be more likely to break and run away
5. Governors of conquered settlements should have low loyalty
6. Enemy heroes, especially of the same faction as conquered settlement, should have significantly higher chance to succeed.
7. Penalties can be somewhat lower between 'good' or 'bad' races. For instance - conquering human town gives less penalties for dwarf and more for vampire

etc, etc...
By all means, thank you for the mod, if you ever have time and intention to release it with penalties, it would be perfect

I second (or third, I guess) this. Looking for a conquer anywhere mod that allows any faction to settle anywhere, but makes it of questionable value such that doing so for a specific settlement might make sense, but doing it large scale would be very difficult and unwieldy.

[Dresden]

Hey Dresden. Does your mod make any changes to building icons? I have one person on the Steam workshop who reported compatibility issues with my Building Progression mod, but I can't imagine why this specific mod would conflict.

Basically my building icons mod only works if he disables your mod. My mod only touches the UI/building culture variants table, and very specifically only the Dwarf buildings.

(edit)

I suppose it's plausible that you modified the UI / Building_cultures_variant table (if I remembered the name correctly) to ensure the icon art is consistent with a race that otherwise would not have been able to conquer (and build) in such settlements.

Unfortunately, if that is truly the case, then the mods would have to be merged. Of course, both mods can't work together if they append the same table and its entities. If you, Dresden, would like to implement my iconography in your mod, feel free to do so. If not, no harm. Thanks for your time.

I am using the building cultural variants table and since PFM has it a mess with the columns, I did it in the kit. So, I probably have the whole table in there (with a modified table fragment name).

The parts of that table I need are to do with the special capital buildings like altdorf, etc. I have to open them up to the other cultures. I am not sure if you are changing those, maybe black crag and karaz a karak? I can look into modifying my tables to remove some of the vanilla elements. In theory you can also rename your table fragments to be above mine alphabetically, that used to work in Rome 2 (not sure if it does here).

Actually, thinking about it now, I may be able to just use the parts I need and leave the vanilla completely alone if I go about it right. I will check into it for the next update.

[MrIndigo]

Just had an interesting experience with your mod:
So I'm playing VC Legendary (doing some weird stuff for the lolz, moved all my armies across the Empire to the east for fun>) , and on turn 58, Kislev wiped out Varg and now holds 16 settlements. I guess my future Chaos invasions are gonna be a bit of a disappointment.

http://s33.postimg.org/5mxfndz4f/20160606222654_1.jpg

[Franz Von G]

Thanks for the great mod, it almost solved the main issue I have with the Empire in TWW. Problem is, it seems I cannot vassalize another imperial faction if not as a result of war. They are eager to confederate (disappearing from the map) but they don't want to be my vassal. Is there a way to make it easier (same as confederate) for the Empire?

Before someone asks, I like having armies with different colours and not under my control, it's also more in lore than annexing everything under Reikland

[SPARTAN VI]

The parts of that table I need are to do with the special capital buildings like altdorf, etc. I have to open them up to the other cultures. I am not sure if you are changing those, maybe black crag and karaz a karak? I can look into modifying my tables to remove some of the vanilla elements. In theory you can also rename your table fragments to be above mine alphabetically, that used to work in Rome 2 (not sure if it does here).

Ah! That's what I thought. I am changing the art for places like Altdorf, Black Crag, and Karaz a Karak, so their art reflects the occupying culture that are able to occupy such regions in the vanilla game. The only thing I'm changing is the art path for the individual fragments/records. I could rename my table fragments, but since I'm using the vast majority of them in that table, I'm not sure if there's an easy way to modify the names of the 100-ish records I'm modifying. If it's easier for you to leave the unaltered vanilla elements out of Conquer Anywhere, it should resolve the compatibility issues. Again, thanks for your time Dresden!

[Dresden]

Thanks for the great mod, it almost solved the main issue I have with the Empire in TWW. Problem is, it seems I cannot vassalize another imperial faction if not as a result of war. They are eager to confederate (disappearing from the map) but they don't want to be my vassal. Is there a way to make it easier (same as confederate) for the Empire?

Before someone asks, I like having armies with different colours and not under my control, it's also more in lore than annexing everything under Reikland

Its should be possible in the various diplomatic variables tables.

Ah! That's what I thought. I am changing the art for places like Altdorf, Black Crag, and Karaz a Karak, so their art reflects the occupying culture that are able to occupy such regions in the vanilla game. The only thing I'm changing is the art path for the individual fragments/records. I could rename my table fragments, but since I'm using the vast majority of them in that table, I'm not sure if there's an easy way to modify the names of the 100-ish records I'm modifying. If it's easier for you to leave the unaltered vanilla elements out of Conquer Anywhere, it should resolve the compatibility issues. Again, thanks for your time Dresden!

I appreciate you alerting me to the issue. I want to make this mod as compatible as possible with other mods.

[Dresden]

Updated the conquer anywhere mods to make them more compatible with other mods. Hopefully this helps with the building icons issue.