Protectores Domestici

**drillmaster** · April 28, 2016, 01:23 AM

Hey guys.

Ive noticed the Protectores are only available as a starting generals unit and they are not an option after a while. Comes and the Magister Militum being the only ones. How does this work?
They are super powerful though. Would it be possible to have them as a 0-2 choise for all your empire and not only as bodyguards?

Also is there any evidence of them fighting on foot? I only know they were the emperors elite household guards and they were attached to different officials and generals satff.

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**geala** · April 29, 2016, 02:34 AM

I never played as Rome, so I cannot speak from ingame experience. How are the guards for Comes and Magister Militum different? There were a lot of comites as high ranking officers but only a few magistri militi as chief commanders, so it seems a bit funny that you could chose between the two of them.

Concerning the protectores as usual for the late antiquity much is rather clowdy. There were seemingly a lot of different domestici and protectores, named not consequently, for several officials in existence but hardly as fighting units. The protectores domestici as a generals guard unit should be in my opinion available only for the emperor. I don't know wether this is possible in the game.

Being more a reservoir for agents for special tasks and staff officers than a constant fighting unit the protectores domestici were surely a very flexible bunch of high ranking soldiers, able to fight on horse and foot. There is information about material payment in form of horse fodder for protectores but some also guarded sometimes an important flag on foot. There are a cavalry and an infantry guard unit listed in the Notitia Dignitatum, with a Comes Domesticorum Equitum and a Comes Domesticorum Peditum as commanders. Wether they really existed as figthing units and were the same as the imperial protectores domestici (it seems so) or part of it or different and what was earlier and later, who knows for sure? What is clear that there was at one time also a Comes Domesticorum as officer and he was ranked under the magistri militi but above most other comites.

**drillmaster** · April 29, 2016, 04:53 AM

Yeah i usually use the Magister Militum for one.or two armies max. Mainly palatina and scholae armies. I agree though that the Protectores should be only available to the Emperor. I need to get my hands on the Notitia Dignitatum it seems.

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**zombieflanders** · April 29, 2016, 06:12 AM

Originally Posted by drillmaster

Yeah i usually use the Magister Militum for one.or two armies max. Mainly palatina and scholae armies. I agree though that the Protectores should be only available to the Emperor. I need to get my hands on the Notitia Dignitatum it seems.

There were two units each in both the ERE and the WRE, but they weren't necessarily assigned just to the emperor. I've read elsewhere that they totaled ~500 men, so perhaps limiting them to either 3 general units of 160-170 men each or 2 general units of 200+ each would work?

**geala** · May 01, 2016, 12:50 PM

Depends what you mean when you speak of the protectores and/or domestici. There were several (mostly civilian) officials called domestici and some had seemingly protectores. But the protectores domestici are usually associated with the (an) imperial guard. If not it would be hard to explain why the Comes Domesticorum was such a high military rank.

As to numbers there are a lot of guesses and scientifically honest estimates but the cruel reality is in my opinion that we know not much for sure. Had the legions 1000 soldiers or 500? Or more or less? Had the vexillationes (mostly cavalry) 500 or 250? How much was an auxilia palatina? So how much were the Domestici Equites or Domestici Pedites of the west and east? Nobody knows. When we get numbers of units they are very different and widespread. Ammianus mentions at some place that 500 men were seperated from a regiment, so it seems to have been bigger. Or does he refer to a brigaded pair of regiments? Some actual numbers are given for some units in daily reports, sometimes referring to just 140 men or less. Some people friendly to the 4th and 5th century estimate units of infantry at 1000 and cavalry of 500 and the total army of perhaps over 600.000. I always question myself where this huge army had hidden itself all the years when there were raids and attacks against the empire, but ok.

**drillmaster** · May 05, 2016, 06:54 AM

I know what you mean. Theres very few solid information about this era.

As a side note. How does their recruitment work in game? Ive noticed all generals start with them but later on you only get them when a general is replaced because of death. Am i missing something?

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**Elianus** · May 08, 2016, 01:45 AM

They are not that good though. Start a battle between them and the Lombard general's unit (the footsoldiers) and see what happens. The Romans have some much better units but it does make some sense. They were not really a unit that participated often in campaigns. Could be wrong though. Now that I mentioned it, that Lombard unit is super cheap and yet, insanely strong. Balance issue, perhaps?