Terrible problem with PO

**Quintillius** · April 23, 2016, 09:43 AM

Hey guys. Firstly I want to thank for for delivering such a beautiful mod, wait I mean a correction of Rome II. Now we finally have decent faces and troops. The only feature I don't like is the 4 turns a year system. It makes movement very slow and building something very long.

But that's not my biggest complaint. I have started a campaign with Rome and it is turn 139 now. I am having great troubles with public order. There is no single way to get it higher than 0. The outer regions are stable, but the rest of the provinces have a minimal PO change of -5 per turn. I do not have any army in the settlements, I have multiple governors working and champions and lvl III temples everywhere... Now my core province of Rome has rebelled and slaves are sacking Rome. I just press alt+F4 in such cases. I really consider this PO problem a bug. I can't lower taxes (it's low currently), because I need to feed my family. The funny thing is that this is a recent issue. I got PO of 100 before...

Please help me with this. I don't want this micro-managing of PO.

Here are some screenshots:
http://imgur.com/a/MWriQ

Just a second question: does anyone know good ways to get some decent financial balance during early campaign. I barely could afford one full army stack while other factions do have minimal 2. Only trade seems to be helpful, but factions aren't really willing to sign trading contracts. Only trading with my enemy Carthage (+900 denarii p/t) helps me to get out of deficit. Disbanding armies and creating new ones for problematic provinces is too costly for me. Instead I need to move em all to the corner of the empire, but that's taking too long with this 4y/t.

**Ivan_Moscavich** · April 23, 2016, 10:01 AM

Build time actually hasn't been changed from vanilla as far as I'm aware. It is set at 2 turns per year build speed.

**TFCAliarcy** · April 23, 2016, 10:12 AM

PO solution: Build the Gladiator and fountains (+6 public order and +4 Roman culture) stuff and don't get slaves without the trained slaves building and when you do build it to level four, then make slave markets in every city, playing as Baktria and can get maybe a +150% modifier with maybe -3 public order from slaves.
Trade solution: Build a ship to go around the eastern Mediterranean and get trade agreements with a slight bribe.
Army Solution, mix some low level troops in with your armies as low levels such as Rorarii and Italian Levies are very cheap. I will post a guide as a army comp for a good Roman army and the way to use it best.
Also you might not want to get the highest tier buildings in this mod, they cause much more public order than is needed and tend to be obsolete because of that. In adition you have a severe public order penalty in Tarraco which is the result of not building temples, I use shrine of Jupiter and Shrine of the garden thingy as they give a good amount of public order and influence. And if you have money left over you can get a general and 2 levy units and put them into patrol to get at least +4 public order,

**Quintillius** · April 23, 2016, 10:43 AM

Some of the ideas are really nice, thanks TFC. Sending ships to eastern lands is really helpful indeed. Though I would not advice at all to make armies of rorarii/levies. Building gladiator school is expensive though. I saw a possibility in Massillia for 5000+ denarii.
But it's really a shame that advanced settlements add PO penalties. Development of cities didn't cause squalor, huge populations in small cities did in fact.

**TFCAliarcy** · April 23, 2016, 11:55 AM

Your welcome, also you can still build fountains, they are better than gladiator schools as they give 6 public order and 4 Roman influence and with 2 building slots from those two you can make +12 public order and +4 roman influence for just the construction moneyI also made the guide detailing army composition b. It is here http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...2#post14944682
Generally the development of provinces goes like this, you make them stable so you can make money buildings in them, then you use the money you have to make the money buildings and you can then make loads of stable money. I do agree that the higher up buildings cause to much public disorder and cost to much food but sometimes I upgrade them if they are provinces that I am using for money such as Italia, Magna Graecia, and Africa. Or if I want to AoR unit or faction wide bonus from said building, for example tier 3 wine or lead can give +2 faction wide public order, this is huge is you have a few of them for example if you are playing Carthage and take Italia then you can get +4 public order in each province at the cost of maybe 8 food. This allows other tier 3 buildings at pretty much free public order and they still give their boosts like Olives making increased agriculture or industry from timber.

**Quintillius** · April 23, 2016, 12:04 PM

Ah nice buildings. I guess it's bread & fountains then. I'll build them asap.

**Garbad** · April 23, 2016, 12:11 PM

In my capitals I always build:

Gladiator 2 +6
Sanitation 2 +6 +4 culture
Sanitation 2 +5 +2 culture
Sacred Grove 2 +4 +4 culture

That is enough to support a +4 capital building, +3 to all other main buildings, and lots of basic farms or basic industry as you prefer. That's the best combination imo.

**Quintillius** · April 23, 2016, 12:33 PM

Dat's a lot of public order buildings. Where do you get your income from?

**Garbad** · April 23, 2016, 01:16 PM

Most income comes from trade and the town center buildings. The other slots are food/PO. This produces a lot more stable income than other systems I've tried.

**Ac3s** · April 23, 2016, 01:58 PM

I suggest you download one of the submods.

Personally I'm using the "No PO Negative from Garrisoning Submod" and also the "DEI Faction + Unit Names restored [English]", I consider both of them essential to my game.

**gornoviceanu** · April 24, 2016, 03:00 AM

There are also +PO buildings to be found in minor settlements. Either a temple (for Romans the Nymph chain has highest PO) or the garrison building will you +PO if you are having a hard time.

Also, the squalor is not because of developing cities, it is because of the filth and/or poverty these buildings create. A brickmaker would add pollution and lots of ill treated slaves to the city. A large market would be a center for beggars, thieves etc.

I do agree that some buildings have negative PO for no reason, like the wine merchant chain.

**tgoodenow** · April 25, 2016, 04:55 AM

You need better administration focused governors dude. General only stacks give you plus one public order ( unless the governor has negative traits in which case he needs to be replaced). He will gain experience from being garrisoned. A level four governor with capable bureaucrat, level three administratior, and the level three research one will give you like +13 public order, +9 tax rate, +9 or 12% research rate. Having two governors in a province will keep your best cities under control and pumping out cash. Make sure to also take advantage of equipping your governors with the admin auxiliary and you can increase research, cultural conversion (really helpful in ancient empires Submod), or more public order. Always make sure to buy the cheapest upkeep per turn general unless he will be part of your defense as well.

As far as for buildings I always do the following:
1) No fisheries, always ports
2) Main capital always gets industry early on. Build barracks or temples only in minor cities. Minor cities are always food/food or food/temple or food/barracks. When in dire situations food wise, always remember level 3 deli > level 3 farm
3) Only temples I build are the highest public order buildings.
4) Always make sure main cities are prioritized. 40% bonus helps a lot.
5) most importantly: prioritize cost benefit at beginning to grow the fastest. Even if you are a one province minor, 9/10 it is better to build at the beginning than rush an army (only exception I know of is Macedonia in ancient empires). A level one industry will build faster, costs less, and will recoup the costs of itself faster than a tier two port. So from a games and decision perspective, a person should always build an industry before a tier 2 port. Approach all provinces in this manner and you will get the most benefit from them

Use edicts to make building cheaper

**gastovski** · April 25, 2016, 05:07 AM

Probably enemy using agents to reduce public order. Recruit governors/veterans for each region as much as you can but don't put them in the army, just make them govern region.