compostion of Roman Armies

**mato1091** · February 20, 2016, 05:30 AM

Hello,
first I would to appraise this great mod and its developers, both EB I and EB II are greatest modification which I played

I'm currenty playing semi-historical Romani campaign, year is 150 BC and I own Italy, Cisalpine Gaul, Iberian coast form Emporium to Gades, Baleares, Corsica, Sardinia, Sicily, Illyria, Macedon, Greece and I'm currently fighting Carthago in North Africa

I have used consular armies composed from: (I was inspired from old Quintus Roman guide for EB I, great guide)

2 Roman legions represented by:

2 Velites
2 Hastati
2 Principes
1 Triarii
1 Equites

2 Allied legions represented by:

2 Allied skirmishers (iberian, celtic, illyrian, helenic, lybian - depends on where army fights at the moment)
4 Allied infantry (2 polybian allied infantry from Italy, 2 infantry from locals (again iberian, celtic, illyrian, helenic or lybian)
1 Pedites extraordinary
1 Equites Sabelli
1 Local Cavalry (Iberian, Gallic or Boii, Ilyrian, Thesalian , Numidian)

Thats total 17 units, 3 slots are reserved for consul or proconsul general with imperium and for 2 military tribunes or questors (if available) one for each roman legion acting as legion commander and also as cavalry commanders and this army fights in Roman chessboard formation.

That is quite strong army, but this army figths independent in enemy territory and often fight against 2 or 3 enemy stacks at once.

Soon I hit marian reforms and I'm thinking how to represent roman legion with marian cohorts. If numbers stay same, one legion can be represented by 3 or 4 cohorts but I dont know how to add evocati,antesignani and first cohort to this legion to be properly represented. I know actually real legion composed from 10 cohorts, which 1st was double strength and consists from best men and on the right wing but this legion will be too strong in the game and one commander (consul) can only command one legion but I want to represent that one commander can command even 4 legions as in Polybian or Camillian times.

Any ideas? Thanks in advance

**romanius24** · February 20, 2016, 08:22 AM

I have tried different army builds but i am beginning to dislike the large armies. A marian legion made of 10 cohorts just doesnt work. Its so powerful that just the pilum volley can win the battle.

This is the type of army i use now but keep in mind that i dont really care about historical accuracy that much:

2 skirmishers (allied or native)
2 hastati
1 principes (in some cases 2 and no Pedites)
1 Pedites
1 triarii
1 cavalry unit

This represents 1 legion and it lets me add more local auxilliaries to the stack. Because of the reduced size i can also merge 2 legions into a consular army in special cases.(only one max, lead by FL or a pro/consul)

One thing i love doing with pre marian armies is to use light troops only legions. For example instead of a combo of hastati, principes and triarii i like to have legion made of just hastati which are the fresh levied armies and over time i will replace some units with veteran principes and triarii. Its just really fun to do and useful when you dont have enough money.

It really adds to the roleplay fun and sometimes its great to see one of those rookie legions get crushed which makes it necessary for a better legion to be sent in.

For Marian legions i use a similar build now:

5 reformata cohorts
1 evocati cohort (this represents my 1st cohort)
2 auxilliary units (usually spears)
1 cavalry unit

I tried using the proper 1st cohort unit but it doesnt work. You can only train/retrain it in Rome every 12 turns or so which means its not really viable. Most legions end up not having a 1st cohort legion for most of the game.
It would be better if it was available everywhere and make it more expensive perhaps.

**Anubis88** · February 20, 2016, 08:50 AM

I've been working on a historical army composition guidline that will be released for the made factions with 2.2. And yes, Camillian and Polybian Roman army suggestions are in there

**adun12345** · February 20, 2016, 05:01 PM

I saw the preview for that on Twitter! I'm super-excited - that's a really cool project.

**cowrecked** · February 20, 2016, 07:07 PM

I cant wait! I've been using Quintus's guide for EB1 as my inspiration as well, it would be awesome to see an update (and for other factions)

**wermez** · February 21, 2016, 03:19 AM

4-legion pre-marian army without allied troops:

1 general
2 velites
4 hastati
4 principes
2 triarii
2 equites

Remaining 5 slots I fill with
4 allied/mercenary infantry + 1 cavalry (Gaul and Spain)
3 mercenary infantry + 2 cavalry (Africa)
3 allied infantry + 3 cavalry - 1 equites (Italy)
1 cretan archers + 2 hoplite style infantry + 2 cavalry (Greece)
2 cretan archers + 2 light mercenary infantry + 2 cavalry - 1 equites (Asia)

**QuintusSertorius** · February 21, 2016, 12:35 PM

If it's without allied troops (or less than 50% allies) then it isn't a terribly authentic Roman army.

**~~excubitor~~** · February 21, 2016, 01:23 PM

well i usually go for 1 legion plus 1 allied legion per stack,that way i can keep track later of the detachments i sent from each legion.

**QuintusSertorius** · February 21, 2016, 02:29 PM

More to the point, a pre-Marian army is never composed of 4 Roman legions. It's either a praetorian army of one legion and one ala of socii, or a consular army of two legions and two alae of socii.

If both consuls were together, then they'd have 4 legions and 4 alae.

**wermez** · February 21, 2016, 02:49 PM

I do not really pay much attention much to historical authenticity, except hastati=principes>triarii>equites thing. I dont really want to wait 30. b.c. to conquer Egypt, or Gauls in 52. b.c. but I would like to try to use 50% allies in my next romani campaign.

QS, what do you think about the battle of Arausio? There were more od 4 roman legions in that campaign for each consul.

One question: is it historical to have another computer controlled allied army in battle (for example another roman consular, or made only of african/hellenic units?)