Proposal: Successor "Auxiliaries"

[The Iron Chancellor]

Hey.

What does the team think of making some Hellenistic/Successor units function in a similar way to Roman auxiliaries? By this, I was thinking of units such as Hellenic Cataphracts.

For example: If the player, as the Antigonidai Epeiros or Ptolemaioi, conquered Syria or Mesopotamia, wouldn't it stand to reason that the Macedonians would train and equip a unit akin to the Baktrian/Seleukidai Cataphracts by virtue of their new territory bringing them into contact with a people (Parthians) who also make use of such a unit?

To do this, I'd propose a shared corps of units (I.e Hellenic Cataphracts, Silver Shields) that become unlocked by other successors when certain conditions are met - but not necessarily through scripts or anything that complicated.

What do you guys think?

Posted from my phone.

[KAM 2150]

To be honest, there was no such thing as hellenic cataphracts, Seleucid cataphracts were just Iranians fighting in Parthian fashion after campaign of Antiochus III in the east, but cataphract like units were there before Parthians. So even if you play as Egypt you actually can already recruit Cataphracts if you hold AOR provinces that allow you to field them.

[Smiling Hetairoi]

To be honest, there was no such thing as hellenic cataphracts, Seleucid cataphracts were just Iranians fighting in Parthian fashion after campaign of Antiochus III in the east, but cataphract like units were there before Parthians. So even if you play as Egypt you actually can already recruit Cataphracts if you hold AOR provinces that allow you to field them.

Do you have any sources for this? As far as I know the Seleukids only recruited the Median nobles to serve in the Agema.

[Augustusng]

Well, I don't think those units (Cataphracts, Silver Shields) are a good example, since the successor factions have their own versions of units like that already, for the most part (if not cataphracts, then armored companions or something similar, and Royal Thorax Swords). Silver Shields especially are something like a trademark Seleucid unit - it would be weird seeing those recruited by other factions. It's not a bad idea, I'm just not sure which units it would be good for.

[Maetharin]

I wouldn´t actually say auxilliaries, but I could imagine certain historical core units to be taken over with their old troop designation.
Like Katoikoi or Kleruchoi, since Macedonians were regarded as the most important source of manpower it was often easier to simply take over the already functioning system of one´s rival.
A concrete example would be the taking over of some Seleucid Katoikiai by Pergamum after Magnesia.

[Tyso3]

AOR units are essentially auxiliaries, the problem is your seeing Roman auxiliaries a staple for all other nations, which simply was not the case.

[The Iron Chancellor]

Kam and Augustusng: True enough on the subject of Hellenic Cataphracts and Silver Shields. Perhaps something like the Antiochean Citizen Cavalry? But then, it would probably make more sense to have them as simple AOR for all which would not be a great idea.

Maetharin: That's actually a better idea.

Tyso3: I used the term Auxiliaries in the thread title to communicate a similar equivalent system in brief, but by no means was I suggesting a copy/paste Hellenistic version of the Roman system.

[Tyso3]

I am not saying that you did, Simply that the auxiliary system for the Romans was unique Both because of the size of their empire at key points in history and there own belief in their superior abilities over lesser peoples. The Persian empire armies for example were a lot more varied due to incorporating a lot of cultures into their forces.

[ThatWhichThinks]

The Roman auxiliary system was just an evolution of the widespread practices of pretty much every nation at the time, namely the practice of hiring mercenaries to supplement one's core fighting force, either for numbers or tactical flexibility. The only reason we have a special word and mechanics for the Romans is because they did it for a long time and eventually made a standard, well-organized system for it. But, you look at the early days of Rome and their Socii or Italic allies were essentially mercenaries, just like Phillip's allied Agrianes who fought for gold.

I think a lot of the army diversity you desire can be gained by hiring mercenaries.

[Ivan_Moscavich]

Well the socii and italic allies were less mercenaries and more... treaty troops. Though it was lucrative for them because they had an even share of the campaign booty, while only putting in a fraction of the troops Rome did.