Marian Reform not triggered at turn 660 - why?

[jim600]

I`m now at Turn 662 and the Marian reform has not triggered - Why?

I realise that the trigger (farm builds ) for a turn 600 reforms does not work. but thought that it automatically triggered at turn 600 in any case.


Can anyone suggest reasons why it hasn`t triggered for me, and offer solutions to make the trigger occur ?


Thankyou

[bordinis]

It does not trigger when Rome AI gets there in my lusitani campaign turn 700 rome AI does not have marian units.. so you will need to wait until it is updated i guess.

[romanius24]

Its the opposite. The last trigger doesnt work but the one that requires a general and farms does. I am only 400 turns in but it has been confirmed to work, you just need to build farms in greece too.

[jim600]

Thanks Romanius24.

Never heard of these requirements though,

Perhaps you could be more explicit and tell me which farm levels i need and where in Greece I need to build them

Many Thanks

[Anubis88]

@jim600

You need latifundiae in 3 regions in Greece. I think it's Ambrakia, Pella and Thermon. If you are by this time you should have them already. The next you need a S/C/V Popularis general with at least 3 command and at least 3 influence that is consule or proconsul. Once those triggers are met he will be a reformator and the reform will trigger. This has been fixed with the new upcoming release

[julc]

@jim600

You need latifundiae in 3 regions in Greece. I think it's Ambrakia, Pella and Thermon. If you are by this time you should have them already. The next you need a S/C/V Popularis general with at least 3 command and at least 3 influence that is consule or proconsul. Once those triggers are met he will be a reformator and the reform will trigger. This has been fixed with the new upcoming release

what are the full requiements for marian reform?

[QuintusSertorius]

The turn 660 fallback has a typo in it, so will never trigger. The region numbering in the player-triggered version has old references, which is why you end up with places in Greece.

[jim600]

Didn`t anybody test this before release??

To think that people went to such lenghts to to add this feature and it doesn`t work, Why isn`t this explained in th Marian reform thread???????? I mean its been a month from main release.

[Anubis88]

Didn`t anybody test this before release??

To think that people went to such lenghts to to add this feature and it doesn`t work, Why isn`t this explained in th Marian reform thread???????? I mean its been a month from main release.

Unfortunately it hasn't been tested. There was a lot of effort put into making the new release, and nobody had the time to play a game 660 turns to see if it works. And i agree we should've made a statement about it, unfortunetely it wasn't realized until it was too late.

We are trying to prevent this happening in the future by having a new team of testers working with us and checking all of these details. Still like i said the reform does work with the reformator trigger. If you've reached that point in the campaign you surely have some candidate FM's to make this happen.

[Rad]

So you're saying that one can potentially stop the Marian reforms from happening in this version? If that is so, it is too bad the Italic roster is incomplete. I love the Marians, but I love the Polybian army equally and I hate the hassle of replacing them. Hopefully, I'll be able to play soon.

[romanius24]

I am no modder but is it not possible to add all the reform code and simply make it trigger just 1-2 turns into the campaign?
That way you can see if the code works and then just change the turn number after confirming.

If something like this works, you can basically do faster tests that dont take 600 turns.

[Roma_Victrix]

I am no modder but is it not possible to add all the reform code and simply make it trigger just 1-2 turns into the campaign?
That way you can see if the code works and then just change the turn number after confirming.

If something like this works, you can basically do faster tests that dont take 600 turns.

Yep, that would be the obvious thing to do.

[Roma_Victrix]

Is v. 2.2 going to be released anytime soon? If not, could Quintus or someone in the EB II team please provide the code or even a downloadable updated "descr_campaign" file to replace the one we have now? With fixes for the typo and mistakes mentioned above regarding the Marian Reform event? I'm playing as Koinon Hellenon at the moment, but I'm eventually going to want to start a Romani campaign. I'd rather do so knowing full well that there won't be any hiccups.

[QuintusSertorius]

Here's the updated parts of the Roman script, including the updated unit refresh to counter the effect of the first reform zero-ing everything, a possible fix to the Carthaginian battle trigger for the Polybian reform, the correct region id's for the early Marian trigger and fixed typo on the Marian fallback.

; === Roman Reforms ===

    ;;  TO DO: Augustan reforms (Traits required)

    set_event_counter ecCamillanEra 1
    set_event_counter ecPolybianEra 0

    inc_recruit_pool region_040 1 roman cavalry equites camillan		;;; one-time refill of recruitment pool in Rome to offset its deplenishment by event counter reset
    inc_recruit_pool region_040 2 roman infantry hastati camillan
    inc_recruit_pool region_040 1 roman infantry principes camillan
    inc_recruit_pool region_040 1 roman infantry triarii camillan
    inc_recruit_pool region_040 2 roman infantry leves
    inc_recruit_pool region_038 1 italic cavalry sabellian   ;;; one-time refill of Arretium to offset deplenishment
    inc_recruit_pool region_038 1 italic infantry etruscan
    inc_recruit_pool region_038 1 italic infantry samnites spearmen
    inc_recruit_pool region_038 1 roman infantry leves
    inc_recruit_pool region_041 1 italic cavalry sabellian   ;;; one-time refill of Arpi to offset deplenishment
    inc_recruit_pool region_041 1 italic infantry samnites spearmen
    inc_recruit_pool region_041 1 roman infantry leves
    inc_recruit_pool region_042 1 italic cavalry sabellian   ;;; one-time refill of Capua to offset deplenishment
    inc_recruit_pool region_042 1 italic infantry samnites spearmen
    inc_recruit_pool region_042 1 roman infantry leves
	inc_recruit_pool region_042 1 hellenistic cavalry hippakontistai
	inc_recruit_pool region_042 1 hellenistic infantry hoplitai haploi
	inc_recruit_pool region_042 1 hellenistic infantry akontistai
    inc_recruit_pool region_044 1 italic infantry samnites spearmen  ;;; one-time refill of Taras recruitment pool to offset deplenishment by event counter reset above

    declare_counter cisalpine_battles
    declare_counter carthage_battles
    declare_counter marian_possible
    declare_counter augustan_possible

    monitor_event PostBattle FactionType f_rome		;;; Check large battles in Cisalpine - not necessarily victorious ones
        and IsRegionOneOf 88 87 75 76 96 77 95		;;; Felsina 88, Segesta 87, Medilanon 75, Patavium 76, Massalia 96, Segestica 77, Dalminion 95 (in this order)
        and I_BattleEnemyArmyNumberOfUnits > 10 	;;; Include only large battles

        if I_EventCounter ecCamillanEra < 0
            inc_counter cisalpine_battles 1
        end_if

        if I_EventCounter ecPolybianEra > 0			;;; Terminate monitor once reforms happened
            terminate_monitor
        end_if
    end_monitor

    monitor_event PostBattle FactionType f_rome		;;; Check large battles against Carthage - not necessarily victorious ones
        and GeneralFoughtFaction f_carthage
        and not I_ConflictType Naval				;;; Exclude naval battles - reforms are about line infantry only
        and I_BattleEnemyArmyNumberOfUnits > 10 	;;; Include only large battles

        if I_EventCounter ecCamillanEra < 0
            inc_counter carthage_battles 1
        end_if

        if I_EventCounter ecPolybianEra > 0			;;; Terminate monitor once reforms happened
            terminate_monitor
        end_if
    end_monitor

    monitor_event FactionTurnStart FactionType f_rome
        if 	I_TurnNumber > 100							;;; to prevent the reforms happening almost off-the-bat
            and I_CompareCounter cisalpine_battles > 3
            and I_CompareCounter carthage_battles > 4
            set_event_counter ecCamillanEra 0
            set_event_counter ecPolybianEra 1
            historic_event HE_POLYBIAN_REFORM factions { f_rome, }
            terminate_monitor
        end_if

        if I_TurnNumber > 120
            and I_SettlementOwner sett_035 = f_rome		;;; Segesta
            and I_SettlementOwner sett_036 = f_rome		;;; Patava
            and I_SettlementOwner sett_037 = f_rome		;;; Felsina
            and I_SettlementOwner sett_047 = f_rome		;;; Syrakousai
            and I_SettlementOwner sett_046 = f_rome		;;; Messana
            and I_SettlementOwner sett_045 = f_rome		;;; Lilibeo
            set_event_counter ecCamillanEra 0
            set_event_counter ecPolybianEra 1
            historic_event HE_POLYBIAN_REFORM factions { f_rome, }
            terminate_monitor
        end_if

        if I_IsFactionAIControlled f_rome					;;; automatic reforms for AI Rome
            and I_TurnNumber > 200
            and I_EventCounter ecCamillanEra > 0
            set_event_counter ecCamillanEra 0
            set_event_counter ecPolybianEra 1
            terminate_monitor
        end_if

        if 	not I_IsFactionAIControlled f_rome						;;; fall-back automatic reforms for player-controlled Rome
            and I_TurnNumber > 248
            and I_EventCounter ecCamillanEra > 0
            set_event_counter ecCamillanEra 0
            set_event_counter ecPolybianEra 1
            historic_event HE_POLYBIAN_REFORM factions { f_rome, }
            terminate_monitor
        end_if
    end_monitor

    ;
    ;  Check conditions for the Marian reform
    ;
    monitor_event PreFactionTurnStart FactionType f_rome
        and	I_TurnNumber > 500								;;; 147 BC - earliest possible date
        set_counter marian_possible 0					;;; reset counter every turn

        if I_EventCounter ecMarianEra > 0					;;; terminate monitor once no longer needed
            terminate_monitor
        end_if

        if I_TurnNumber > 660								;;; If there is 107 BC when Marian reforms happened IRL...
            and I_EventCounter ecPolybianEra > 0 					;;; ...and reforms had not happened already...
            set_event_counter ecPolybianEra 0				;;; ...trigger the reforms as fall-back for AI and unlucky player.
            set_event_counter ecMarianEra 1
            historic_event HE_MARIAN_REFORM factions { f_rome, }
            terminate_monitor
        end_if
    end_monitor

    monitor_event SettlementTurnStart FactionType f_rome
        and	I_TurnNumber > 500								;;; 147 BC - earliest possible date
        and IsRegionOneOf 99 97 112 124 128 131 140 		;;; Etruria 99, Umbria 97, Latium 112, Apulia 124, Campania 128, Kalabria 131, Brettia 140 - count only those in Italy
        and	SettlementBuildingExists > farms_six 			;;; count Latifundiae and land reforms as sources of social tension and dispossession leading to reform
        if I_EventCounter ecPolybianEra > 0
            inc_counter marian_possible 1
        end_if

        if I_CompareCounter marian_possible > 5
            set_event_counter ecMarianPossible 1		;;; Once the social/agricultural development reaches the threshold switch-on EDCT condition...
            terminate_monitor							;;; ... and terminate monitor
        end_if
    end_monitor

    monitor_event CharacterTurnStart FactionType f_rome
        and Trait Reformator > 1							;;; First level enabled by ecMarianPossible, second one by being a consul.
        set_event_counter ecPolybianEra 0
        set_event_counter ecMarianEra 1
        historic_event HE_MARIAN_REFORM   ; might as well let the world know about the reform
        terminate_monitor
    end_monitor

[Roma_Victrix]

Thanks, Quintus! You're very prompt as usual.

[QuintusSertorius]

In fairness all I had to do was copy and paste it out of the script, which I always have open anyway.

[bordinis]

Off topic- why i can't change the late germanic cavalry and infantry secondary weapons- they must have swords right? alt or shift does not help..

[QuintusSertorius]

Off topic- why i can't change the late germanic cavalry and infantry secondary weapons- they must have swords right? alt or shift does not help..

No, they don't have secondary weapons.

[bordinis]

No, they don't have secondary weapons.

Hmm perhaps a misleading unit information about them having swords as nobles.. aw well. Do the armour piercing units deal full damage to the units? like say clubmen to any armored roman unit? What is exactly "bonus versus cavalry" -->some spearmen do have it , some not and what is "fighting bonus in deserts" and what "expert in hiding in woods" actually do?

Did EB team fixed the celtic retainer and boioi retainer defence stat issue misleading on their unit info?

[Nimor]

The abilities shown on the unit cards are generally a bit wonky. Though they're pulled right out of the EDU the engine has a tendency for rather inconsistend depiction of those values. If you wan't to know for sure, open up the export_desc_units in the data folder of EBII and search for the unit of your interest. There is something in the works that may help out here, though.

AP halves the armour stat of the target when it comes to damage.
Bonus versus cavalry is a variable that ranges from 2-12 bonus attack against cav.