Visible stats on unit cards?

[MaverickBlack]

Compared to vanilla, the unit stats that are displayed on the unit cards are somewhat different. Is it possible to get additional stats, in particular unit speed, as a displayed stat? There are a few other stats that would be nice to have, like whether or not they have javelins.

Also, what does weapon deadliness do? I only ever see it as 0 or 1, which makes "weapon deadliness" seem like a waste of space on the unit card. Could it be replaced as a unit ability like "cold resistance" or at least given a tool tip that provides a little more information about what the value means.

[Dresden]

There are limitations as to what specific stats can be displayed if I remember correctly. It has been awhile since I messed around in those tables. I am pretty sure attributes like cold resistance or weapon type may not be choices. I could be wrong, as I said it has been awhile.

Weapon deadliness is limited now to a low number of units. We could remove it I suppose and find possibly some other things to display. Some are not displayed because they are either misleading or don't have the impact they seem.

[Augustusng]

Well, cold resistance should already be displayed as a unit ability on the card (in the same place as abilities like parthian shot, formation attack, etc).

I think one useful thing to display could be shield missile block chance, if there's room anyway. I think this possible to display in Attila, but I'm not sure about Rome 2.

[MaverickBlack]

What does weapon deadliness do mechanically? It is hard to compare a unit with better stats but without weapon deadliness to a similar unit with weapon deadliness.

[KAM 2150]

Weapon deadliness is damage that ignores armour. So if unit has 300 armour and attacking unit has 30 regular damage and 1 weapon deadliness, then even if this regular damage will be blocked, weapon deadliness will always be applied. It makes Roman units fight better in prolonged combat and in some instances even win even if overal their stats are a bit weaker.

[MaverickBlack]

Weapon deadliness is damage that ignores armour. So if unit has 300 armour and attacking unit has 30 regular damage and 1 weapon deadliness, then even if this regular damage will be blocked, weapon deadliness will always be applied. It makes Roman units fight better in prolonged combat and in some instances even win even if overal their stats are a bit weaker.

So If I'm reading this correctly, weapon deadliness is the same as armor piercing weapon damage from Vanilla, but it only occurs in values of 0 or 1? If that's the case the tool tip really needs to be updated. The tool tip makes it seem like a modifier that increases combat efficiency in close quarters (which I guess it does in a way). If it is just a component of weapon damage, is there a reason it isn't combined like in vanilla?

I think one useful thing to display could be shield missile block chance, if there's room anyway. I think this possible to display in Attila, but I'm not sure about Rome 2.

This is one that I forgot but totally agree with. I usually just look at the shield contribution to melee defense, but I don't know if that is accurate.

[KAM 2150]

Because that way it is visible. Previously much more weapons had it displayed, now Romans have it and certain general skills also increase it, which would not be visible otherwise. It does exacty that, increases unit efficiency in close quarters.

[MaverickBlack]

Because that way it is visible. Previously much more weapons had it displayed, now Romans have it and certain general skills also increase it, which would not be visible otherwise. It does exacty that, increases unit efficiency in close quarters.

This increases unit efficiency against armored opponents, but there is no benefit in fighting Naked Warriors or otherwise unarmored foes.

Overall, having it named Weapon Deadliness is misleading and somewhat confusing, since all weapons are deadly to some degree. A gladius is somehow deadly and a falx is not? I thought that it might reduce enemy block chance or something similar. To me, armor piercing capability would make more sense integrated with Weapon Damage like it is done in Vanilla or renamed to Armor Piercing or something similar.

What general skills increase it?

[KAM 2150]

Nope, you are wrong, it helps against ANY unit. It is simply damage that is always applied on succesful attack, no mater how large or small the armour value is. If it would be integrated, players would not be aware that it even exists as it would not be shown until you hover over it. For example battle rythm increase it.

[MaverickBlack]

Nope, you are wrong, it helps against ANY unit. It is simply damage that is always applied on succesful attack, no mater how large or small the armour value is.

Then I am very confused. Which of the below is correct:

A. A unit with 17 weapon damage and 1 deadliness is equivalent to a unit with 18 weapon damage when fighting an unarmored opponent, but is better when fighting an armored foe

or

B. A unit with 17 weapon damage and 1 deadliness is always better than a unit with 18 weapon damage.

or

C. A unit with 17 weapon damage and 1 deadliness is equivalent to a unit with 17 weapon damage when fighting an unarmored opponent, but is better when fighting an armored foe.

If it would be integrated, players would not be aware that it even exists as it would not be shown until you hover over it.

This is an admirable aim, but it the tooltip is so vague that while I was aware that it existed, I did not have any idea what it was doing until I asked today (and I still don't know if I understand or not) after over 400 turns of play. In vanilla I was able to understand armor piercing even though it requires a mouse over. As a whole DeI does a great job of being intuitive and well documented, but I was treating deadliness as an entirely unique stat as opposed to a special type of weapon damage. And there is a reason to believe that: Melee defense consists of multiple components, with both shield defense and base defense, yet it is kept as 1 stat on the unit card. Each component of melee defense can change, resulting in an overall change in melee defense.

[Ivan_Moscavich]

Then I am very confused. Which of the below is correct:

A. A unit with 17 weapon damage and 1 deadliness is equivalent to a unit with 18 weapon damage when fighting an unarmored opponent, but is better when fighting an armored foe

or

B. A unit with 17 weapon damage and 1 deadliness is always better than a unit with 18 weapon damage.

or

C. A unit with 17 weapon damage and 1 deadliness is equivalent to a unit with 17 weapon damage when fighting an unarmored opponent, but is better when fighting an armored foe.

.

None of the above. It has nothing to do with armor at all as kam already said.

Think of it like this.

Unit with 17 weapon damage and 1 weapon deadliness rolls and attack against target. Attack misses or is blocked. The attack still does 1 damage.

If the attack hits and is unblocked, it does the 17.

All it does is guarantee the damage that weapon deadliness is marked at under any situation. It does not add or subtract from the units max damage.

[Lord Dakier]

I always wondered about a Total War with no unit stats at all. It is kind of immersion breaking comparing one unit to another.

The only problem is the short descriptions as highly detailed descriptions would be required so we would have an understanding of certain shields being more effective than others for example.

[KAM 2150]

Well, Shogun 1 and Medieval 1 had that system.

[KAM 2150]

Well, it adds to it ;D It just gives you the minimum value of damage on successful attack, so if unit has base 17 attack, if you add 1 deadliness to it, it means that instead of 0-17 damage, weapon will deal 1-18 damage.