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  1. #21
    AntonioHundangir's Avatar Tiro
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    Yes. Often they had the protection by local land holders or usurpers (from tetrico to bonoso all searched the alliance of bagaudae. Often they was exploited by local "establishment".). Both in ic2 and in julian s campaign i have many troybles for these bands in gaul. In my sai campaign i detached 1 vexillatio of illyrian cavalry and 1 of scutarii, more a couple of fleet sailors more some numera of auxilia indigeni, and vigiles cohorts for extinguish their revolt especially in lugdunense area these damned brigands raud the streets and affect my incoming. And i m forced to employ forces that need around colonia against gernans. No pity. Enemies of rome should be destroyed withoyt pity. (yes the bagaudae arent properly enemies. Are citizen that revolted because rome havent defended they against taxmen, and barbarians. But thats a problem of the ministers without ball of milan. Not mine. I cant allow to use mercy. With both brigands and barbarians. In ic2 and sai is full of these bands in gaul. Maked bigger by deserters, especially border troops or auxiliary troops and by batbarians bands. Indeed. After defeated franks and alemanni, i passed rhine and destroyed their villages forcing to surrender. Maked franks foederati. And build a serie of forts and watch tower over rhine, in their land, for have under control tgese tribes. I build also a chain of watch towers and forts in gaul, for have under control people. For avoid reforming of these bands. Also in conquestus britanniae thete are. I thibk a bagaudae faction would be destroyed soon. Better improve these revel brigand bands for simulate their revolt.
    "regina caeli, sive tu Ceres,
    alma frugum parens originalis,
    quae, repertu laetata filiae,
    vetustatae glandis ferino remoto pabulo,
    miti commostrato cibo nunc,
    eleusiniam gleba percolis." - prayer to Kerres (Cerere, Benevolentissima Mater)

    "Respice post te. Hominem te memento. Memento mori.". (look behind you, remember you're a man. Remember you must die.)

  2. #22
    Diocle's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: - General Discussion -

    Quote Originally Posted by AntonioHundangir View Post
    Yes. Often they had the protection by local land holders or usurpers (from tetrico to bonoso all searched the alliance of bagaudae. Often they was exploited by local "establishment".). Both in ic2 and in julian s campaign i have many troybles for these bands in gaul. In my sai campaign i detached 1 vexillatio of illyrian cavalry and 1 of scutarii, more a couple of fleet sailors more some numera of auxilia indigeni, and vigiles cohorts for extinguish their revolt especially in lugdunense area these damned brigands raud the streets and affect my incoming. And i m forced to employ forces that need around colonia against gernans. No pity. Enemies of rome should be destroyed withoyt pity. (yes the bagaudae arent properly enemies. Are citizen that revolted because rome havent defended they against taxmen, and barbarians. But thats a problem of the ministers without ball of milan. Not mine. I cant allow to use mercy. With both brigands and barbarians. In ic2 and sai is full of these bands in gaul. Maked bigger by deserters, especially border troops or auxiliary troops and by batbarians bands. Indeed. After defeated franks and alemanni, i passed rhine and destroyed their villages forcing to surrender. Maked franks foederati. And build a serie of forts and watch tower over rhine, in their land, for have under control tgese tribes. I build also a chain of watch towers and forts in gaul, for have under control people. For avoid reforming of these bands. Also in conquestus britanniae thete are. I thibk a bagaudae faction would be destroyed soon. Better improve these revel brigand bands for simulate their revolt.
    Being Italian have you read Guido Cervo's trilogy about the XXII Primigenia at Mogontiacum during the late III century?

    .. Bagaudae palys a relevant role in his books, and those bandits are depicted in great detail, I find their description pretty realistic.

  3. #23
    AntonioHundangir's Avatar Tiro
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    Yes ofc i read. But i havent read the 2nd. I lost a piece. No pdf. (i download books often.). Kick off alemanni from agri decumantes. Extinguish farmers revolts. Build a continuos chain of forts and watch towers. From rhine to gades. Gaul is my kingdom and not even gallienus (ic2) or constantius (sai) can conquer it. If i decide, i pass rhine conquer germany, and create s romsn rumo state of mine there. Ahaha
    "regina caeli, sive tu Ceres,
    alma frugum parens originalis,
    quae, repertu laetata filiae,
    vetustatae glandis ferino remoto pabulo,
    miti commostrato cibo nunc,
    eleusiniam gleba percolis." - prayer to Kerres (Cerere, Benevolentissima Mater)

    "Respice post te. Hominem te memento. Memento mori.". (look behind you, remember you're a man. Remember you must die.)

  4. #24
    AntonioHundangir's Avatar Tiro
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    Default Re: - General Discussion -

    And the christians too. Many bagaudae are christians. I ll force they to offer to the fathers gods. Ahaha also if for usurp the power in gaul i should kill metronio stabiano
    "regina caeli, sive tu Ceres,
    alma frugum parens originalis,
    quae, repertu laetata filiae,
    vetustatae glandis ferino remoto pabulo,
    miti commostrato cibo nunc,
    eleusiniam gleba percolis." - prayer to Kerres (Cerere, Benevolentissima Mater)

    "Respice post te. Hominem te memento. Memento mori.". (look behind you, remember you're a man. Remember you must die.)

  5. #25
    AntonioHundangir's Avatar Tiro
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    Default Re: - General Discussion -

    Diocle: about bagaudae "mafia", often in late empire, irenarchs, and local town vigiles commanders, when prepared some blit Against the boss of these gangs, entered in some rich senator or land holder villae, during dinner time where these rich people eat with these boss, arresting they too. The friendships and the local powers that sometime cover with their hand bagaudae was impressing. Often while they complain of loots etc of these brigands, they cooperated with they for gain. Just like christians riches that in tunisi gain money on christian slaves captured by muslim pirates. And viceversa. Over all cultural claims and heritage (sure survived in 2 century of roman rule. Time ago i posted something on paebinsula italica 2 thrrad about oscan heritage. Language, traditions, etc in modern italy, in abruzzo, molise, irpinia, saying that our dialect, il frentano between lanciano (anxanum) histonium (vasto. My home town) and larino (home of frentanian cavalry. In the samnite league) is an oscan base, mixed with latib, and some romance especislly in probubciation, heritage of norman lords that ruled here. Half of our words, like "tragno" are oscan one. And several frentani traditions. Mixed samnite and christian religious rituald survive, like the "ndoccie" (another samnite word. Mean torch) beside that we continue to call our self frentani, sanniti, irpini, between abruzzi and molisr. And the oscan heritage is very felt by the people that live inside in the mountains. If after 2500 years the oscan heritage is so alive here, ofc celtic one was in roman gaul. Some united with romans. And mixed . Others like the redneck farmers of the countryside when pressed by taxmen, joined criminal bands , bevause bagaudae was also assassins, sexual offenders, looters, etc not only desperate farmers, and start to loot the ville. (these celtic farmers, ignorant, etc was so much diverse by our sheepers that do the transhumance here with pratices of samnite origin? That also if havent study, also if are ignorant sheepers, all of them know of wars against romans, and are do proud of their samnite heritage?). Btw look the post on pi2 thread about that story of "frentania" . What i m trying to say is that often your cultural identity etx survive into centuries. Ofc also in the bagaudae survived celtic one. Also if wasnt a national uprising for indipendence but something of more gloomy.
    Last edited by AntonioHundangir; November 23, 2016 at 07:38 PM.
    "regina caeli, sive tu Ceres,
    alma frugum parens originalis,
    quae, repertu laetata filiae,
    vetustatae glandis ferino remoto pabulo,
    miti commostrato cibo nunc,
    eleusiniam gleba percolis." - prayer to Kerres (Cerere, Benevolentissima Mater)

    "Respice post te. Hominem te memento. Memento mori.". (look behind you, remember you're a man. Remember you must die.)

  6. #26
    Diocle's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: - General Discussion -

    Quote Originally Posted by AntonioHundangir View Post
    Diocle: about bagaudae "mafia", often in late empire, irenarchs, and local town vigiles commanders, when prepared some blit Against the boss of these gangs, entered in some rich senator or land holder villae, during dinner time where these rich people eat with these boss, arresting they too. The friendships and the local powers that sometime cover with their hand bagaudae was impressing. Often while they complain of loots etc of these brigands, they cooperated with they for gain. Just like christians riches that in tunisi gain money on christian slaves captured by muslim pirates. And viceversa. Over all cultural claims and heritage (sure survived in 2 century of roman rule. Time ago i posted something on paebinsula italica 2 thrrad about oscan heritage. Language, traditions, etc in modern italy, in abruzzo, molise, irpinia, saying that our dialect, il frentano between lanciano (anxanum) histonium (vasto. My home town) and larino (home of frentanian cavalry. In the samnite league) is an oscan base, mixed with latib, and some romance especislly in probubciation, heritage of norman lords that ruled here. Half of our words, like "tragno" are oscan one. And several frentani traditions. Mixed samnite and christian religious rituald survive, like the "ndoccie" (another samnite word. Mean torch) beside that we continue to call our self frentani, sanniti, irpini, between abruzzi and molisr. And the oscan heritage is very felt by the people that live inside in the mountains. If after 2500 years the oscan heritage is so alive here, ofc celtic one was in roman gaul. Some united with romans. And mixed . Others like the redneck farmers of the countryside when pressed by taxmen, joined criminal bands , bevause bagaudae was also assassins, sexual offenders, looters, etc not only desperate farmers, and start to loot the ville. (these celtic farmers, ignorant, etc was so much diverse by our sheepers that do the transhumance here with pratices of samnite origin? That also if havent study, also if are ignorant sheepers, all of them know of wars against romans, and are do proud of their samnite heritage?). Btw look the post on pi2 thread about that story of "frentania" . What i m trying to say is that often your cultural identity etx survive into centuries. Ofc also in the bagaudae survived celtic one. Also if wasnt a national uprising for indipendence but something of more gloomy.
    Agreed. Thanks for this post, it makes me feel the need of visiting your ancient lands, it's incredible how ancient are the italian roots, Rome is a veil covering ancient bones. Think that in Milan the word "bagutti" (bandits or thugs or fools) is still existing and it comes from the late latin (of Celtic origin?) "bagaude". There is even a Literature Prize in MIlan named "Premio Bagutta", .. it's also very important.

    History is sculpted in traditions, languages and cultural landscapes of the people inhabiting the territories; they are not clothes you can change as you like, identity is not an Alt-Right word, identity means being men and woman feeling that the land on which you live is part of your physical existence as human beings, we don't own the land, it's the land owning us. Probably this is why I can't hate too much the bagadae, all in all they were people trying to survive on the land in which they were born, many of them were Gallo Roman peasants, many were Roman veterans or colonists, they were the people of Gaul, the land in which they were the bones of their ancestors, and if the state can't provide you safety, you do the job by yourself just to survive. Bagaudae were people who had lost all but their identity, and let me being just a bit Romantic: identity in this case rhymes with dignity.

  7. #27
    AntonioHundangir's Avatar Tiro
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    Roots hardly die. Another thing that highlanders of samnium remind is the social war where socii maked coins with the write "viteliu" (another oscan word. Mean italy. And in local dialect "l talie'" , the i and the e are mute. Viteliu, vitalie, L Talie,) btw I discovered 3 pretorians graves, in the museum of my town, some veteran one, like "gaius hosidius veterano",between 1-3 centurirs ad, and a legate of pannonia during antoninus pius period. All these men often had local economic activities here, especially masons, (was a common industry on the coast in adriatic) , there s also a neptune mosaic in the thermae, with a name of a roman noble woman, that sad "i ordered that material from egypt". Ahaha and, think that the cementary, with his trees, is in the sane location where a shrine to hades was. Near another of athena/diomede (the cult of diomede is common here). And, where there was the grave of one veteran, now there is a christian chapel. These sacred places, cementary, churchd, etc sre on the same places of 2000 years ago, like if people have a "genetic memory". I read some bishop of 6 century complained because in gaul, during day people go to church, during night make celtic rituals. The roots.hardly die..not even in the anglo saxon england celtic roots are completely cut. Or in punic north africa where normal people and local.nobles continued to have punic languages and cultures for centurirs until arabian conquest. Beside that they was much roman too.tunisia, lybia, algeria, was part of the latin world. Like hannibal could be considered also an hellenistic general, not only a punic one. Well well we re off topic. Not good.
    Last edited by AntonioHundangir; November 24, 2016 at 06:00 AM.
    "regina caeli, sive tu Ceres,
    alma frugum parens originalis,
    quae, repertu laetata filiae,
    vetustatae glandis ferino remoto pabulo,
    miti commostrato cibo nunc,
    eleusiniam gleba percolis." - prayer to Kerres (Cerere, Benevolentissima Mater)

    "Respice post te. Hominem te memento. Memento mori.". (look behind you, remember you're a man. Remember you must die.)

  8. #28
    AntonioHundangir's Avatar Tiro
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    Astetion instead is a byzantine (like my girlfriend. Eritrean and ortodox so.saint constantine the great she say. Poor woman. ). A varangian. Xd asterion what do you think for a mod about early dark age, from justinian era to charle magne invasion of italy? With exarchs, lombards, odtrogoths, etc slavs, avars etc? i m working yet on a silent hunter 4 mod, rapidi ed invisibili. An italian campaign,(ww2), its a submarine simulator. (in honour of my grandpa, awarded submariner in ww2.). Sometime i m a skippet. Sometime a roman general it depend. Ahaha now i m playing with gallic empire. For test german behave. Seems that if they survive first turns, they can expand. Alamannu are the worse. If you reconquer agri decumantes and kill a couple of genetals they collapse. Besides jokes, i have really a problem of public orders for christians. (and for bagaudae too. There are bands of robbers called so in the mod). If in 1 city there is 1% of christians, the othet people, 99% start to revolt. Giving problems with publix order. Especially near avaricum and in ludgunense. I have garrisoned here an entire legion with some centuria of veteran auxiliarirs of aquitania. Auxiliary srchers. And cavalry. Scutarii and promoti. (i use this army like manouvring mass. The comitatus. A mobile cavalry army. Because the legios of treviri, colonia, etc still garrisoned. They cant go out in mass for battle franks and alemanni. Too few. They, the batavi, aquitani, dtill garrison, so germans cant assault this cities,.and my stationary legions make guerrilla actions for disturb germans. That cant beat me because i never accept big field battles. My.tactic. prefer a guerriglia approach. Sieges and disturbing actions. Like belisarius in italy. So, in spite that i have garrisoned in avaricum a full stack army, the legio with murmillo helmets, more all the auxiliary personel, and the mobile field army of cavalry, promoti,.scutario, sarmati, i still have public orders problems. And not only,.tetricus the commander seems to be not a good governor. With him people are much rebellious. But also without him, the people give unrest for the christians. Donno why. Just if there are few christians, 1% tjat make the rest of people to revolt. Some suggest? Usually i dont build churches. But if i dare with gallic empire. I cause a revolution.(i dont like not even mithraism and sol invictud. Too similar to christians. Save soul cults. Prefer misteric cults like demeter and persefone one. But in late empire mods rarely there are temples for the classic cults. Often there are only mithras, sun, and churchs. But what i like isnt important. I care public order. I cam.build also st peter square if that make quiet the people. But seems that polytheist people cause problems when christians are in city. Why? And do you have some suggest?)
    Last edited by AntonioHundangir; November 24, 2016 at 07:34 PM.
    "regina caeli, sive tu Ceres,
    alma frugum parens originalis,
    quae, repertu laetata filiae,
    vetustatae glandis ferino remoto pabulo,
    miti commostrato cibo nunc,
    eleusiniam gleba percolis." - prayer to Kerres (Cerere, Benevolentissima Mater)

    "Respice post te. Hominem te memento. Memento mori.". (look behind you, remember you're a man. Remember you must die.)

  9. #29

    Default Re: - General Discussion -

    AntonioHundangir! Unfortunately, I left the project "IC2". The latest build did Salot Sar. What changed there - I don't know! Salot Sfh makes a mod on the topic of late antiquity. Ask a question to him!
    p.s. I am also Orthodox. I think of Constantine - the great statesman. He saved the Eastern part of Rome. And the civilized world.

  10. #30

    Default Re: - General Discussion -

    I congratulate all with Coming New Year!

  11. #31
    Diocle's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: - General Discussion -

    Happy New Year to you too, Master Asterion blessed by the Gods!

  12. #32

    Default Re: - General Discussion -

    Hello friends! I need help! Need information: how many bases of the Roman fleet was in the 3rd century? Where they were located? It is necessary for the binding units! Thank all!

  13. #33
    tomySVK's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: - General Discussion -

    Praetorian fleets

    Two main roman fleets were based in Italy - Classis Ravennas based in Ravenna and Classic Misenensis based in Misenum.

    Provincial fleets

    Classis Alexandrina - Alexandria
    Classis Britannica - main base in Dubris (Dover)
    Classis Mauretanica - Caesarea Mauretaniae
    Classis Pontica - Trapezus
    Classis Syriaca - Seleukeia Pieria

    River Fleets

    Classis Germanica - near Colonia Agrippinensis (in 3rd century), this fleet also operated in North sea
    Classis Moesica - Noviodunum
    Classis Pannonica - Taurunum

    I will search for more info.

  14. #34
    Gäiten's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: - General Discussion -

    A good map:
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    Invasio Barbarorum: Ruina Roma Development Leader - Art made by Joar -Visit my Deviantart: http://gaiiten.deviantart.com/

  15. #35

    Default Re: - General Discussion -

    tomySVK, Gäiten thanks for the info! I did the Marines. I want to bind them to the recruiting stations of the Roman fleets.

  16. #36
    Sertorio's Avatar Domesticus
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    Default Re: - General Discussion -

    Nice units Asterion. Guessing that two of the units are using leather cuirasses, i thing they should also have pteruges hanging from waist and shoulder. But that's just an opinion. They all look very good. Unfortunately it seams i cannot rep before i rep some one else...
    Texture works by Sertorio, banner courtesy of Joar

    My AAR for VGRII-AQUILAE

  17. #37
    Diocle's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: - General Discussion -

    Quote Originally Posted by asterion2005 View Post
    tomySVK, Gäiten thanks for the info! I did the Marines. I want to bind them to the recruiting stations of the Roman fleets.
    + REP!

    Wonderful units, great leather cuirasses, wonderful shields, fantastic helmets, I like very much the pseudo-Attic of the last man on the right! Wonderful tunics, AS ALWAYS, GREAT ARTISTS = GREAT MOD!

  18. #38

    Default Re: - General Discussion -

    I would like to hear opinions about that based on what the game to do the mod? Rome-Total War, Barbarian Invasion or Alexander?

  19. #39
    Gäiten's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: - General Discussion -

    If you want Hordes, choose BI.
    If you want a more clever in-game AI, choose Alex.

    Invasio Barbarorum: Ruina Roma Development Leader - Art made by Joar -Visit my Deviantart: http://gaiiten.deviantart.com/

  20. #40
    tomySVK's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: - General Discussion -

    Amazing units asterion

    Quote Originally Posted by Gäiten View Post
    If you want Hordes, choose BI.
    If you want a more clever in-game AI, choose Alex.
    I agree. Also great map Gaiten, thanks for posting it. I just recieved book on Roman Navy.

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