[Staff Referral] ElvenKind (1 point - Disruptive Posting) [FURTHER ACTION]

[Lord William]

Post: Ukraine and Russia Developments, Thread 3
User: ElvenKind
Infraction: disruptive posting
Points: 1

Administrative Note:

Repetitively asking for sources

Message to User:

Hi ElvenKind,

Once again your post requests a source for a point which has been extensively sourced and debated earlier in the thread. Your post lacks any substantive response to those sources or prior discussion, and has derailed the discussion that was going on in the thread. In future please make a substantive contribution to the debate or don't post in this thread at all.

You are receiving an infraction for this because a number of thread warnings have been issued about this sort of behavior, and you have recently received a note for a similar post in this thread.

Russian invasion ? As in Russia invaded Ukraine? Source please. And no, Crimea does not count.

Regards,
DBH

Original Post:

what i'm reading right now is somebody blaming the US for the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

Russian invasion ? As in Russia invaded Ukraine? Source please. And no, Crimea does not count.

[Lord William]

Regarding this alleged Russian invasion, people obviously don`t know what an invasion is, and what does it look like, and, it is not a correct term that is used for alegged transfer of few weapons and units from Russia. Neither does NATO, US nor EU claim that Russia invaded Ukraine, not even in the case of Crimea, cause they already had units stationed there due to an agreement with the legitimate, violently overthrown government and President, a President who called them to provide assistance. And Crimeans held a successful referendum on reunion with Russia. I had posted many sources myself as well, which in my opinion give legitimacy to Crimean reunification, and disregard/debunk so called invasion on Ukraine by Russia.

If people called it territory infiltration, raid or guerilla warfare, I wouldn`t give a rats ass for their claims cause that is a correct, more suitable term for presence of Russians and Eastern Ukrainian separatist units. If Russia invaded Ukraine, we would notice that and it would be shown all over the world in all news.

Regarding the note I had received previous to this warning, the same thing occurred regarding sources, where I asked for a source on a claim that Russia shot down MH17 plane. No one ever provided that source in any of two previous threads, but the Moderation claims that sources which were posted previously do provide enough material to reasonably claim that Russia shot down that plane. When I ask anyone to show those sources, all I get is silence................................. Why are you silent if you have a proof on your claim? Neither does NATO, US or EU claim what you people here on TWC claim. And when someone confronts you to post a proof, you run away. Stand and fight is my motto.

With this I conclude my defence,

Cheers, EK

[mishkin]

Shouldnt we wait for the result of the appeal?

[Lord William]

both are separate, and both are looked at differently. you shouldn't be basing your judgements off appeals or moderation points, they are merely good guides.

[mishkin]

This is a staff referral. If the appeal is granted, moderation (staff) was wrong, and ElvenKind shouldnt be here. Cant we just wait?
------------------------------------
A usually friendly and nice citizen obfuscated in a mudpit discussion. Nothing serious. Further action and censure just to let him know that that should not happen.

[Lord William]

Whether staff is right or wrong is irrelevant, you have to decided if his conducted was unbecoming of a citizen

[PikeStance]

Procedural questions should be discussed in the chat thread. May I suggest these posts be move there and leave this thread for discussion of this case.

[PikeStance]

Things to consider

• The nature of the offense: {Moderator's instruction | Disruptive}
• Is the citizen a regular infractor of the rule or these specific rules?
• Is the action unbecoming a citizen?
• Is this simply an overly emotional response to a heated discussion or does it seem the citizen will repeat the offense in the future?

Elvenkind seems highly motivated to argue his point of view to anyone who will listen. This includes the actual issue and the issue surrounding the infraction.
Generally, a poster that isn't on the fringes of breaking the ToS would not be considered at risk of breaking it in the future. However, I get a different feeling from ElvinKind. He seems like he will continue to break the rules here if it contradict his current belief system. I think over the top appeals and an argumentative disposition is something you expect from non- citizens. A citizen should hold staff member with higher regards. Regardless of the outcome of his case, I feel that he as not conducted himself in a manner that if we were to DISMISS that he would suddenly become a model citizen. (unless he avoids this particular topic). The point of FURTHER ACTIONS is act as a deterrent towards recurrent behavior. I feel in this case, I am incline to vote for FURTHER ACTION unless his defense specifically addresses my concerns.

Side note: I do not believe his actions would warrant anything more severe than a CENSURE.

[mishkin]

Voted further action.

[PikeStance]

Ok, I somehow missed the defense. I also vote for FURTHER ACTION

[Iskar]

Further Action poll here.